Casino raided and shut down by Gardai

sdtipp@gmail.co

sdtipp@gmail.co wrote: »

hopefully some1 from atlantis casino can use this info in their fight to remain open.its just a disgrace what has happened.i hear what ur saying paso but it should be raid 1 raid all or none at all.yes the donoghmore is old but its not smelly or dingy.in fact its quite clean with a live in caretaker.it also has a regular cleaner and it makes a small profit yearly.the front room has a library and seating area with what looks like a 50 inch plasma tv.the bar is clean and it serves a nice pint if u can put up with the hob nob banter these folk spew out.:]

For inquiries you can email the owner at sdtipp@gmail.com :rolleyes:

tipp86

Heard a rumour newstalk are running something about this on there morning show at 9am tomorrow.

iPoker

tipp86 wrote: »

but its illegal to defraud someone knowingly via gambling (i.e. fixing a race) or allow under 18's to gamble.

I thought so - i assumed all gambling under 18's is illegal, so surprised to see kids openly gambling at certain tracks

mcaul

iPoker wrote: »

tipp86 wrote: »

but its illegal to defraud someone knowingly via gambling (i.e. fixing a race) or allow under 18's to gamble.

I thought so - i assumed all gambling under 18's is illegal, so surprised to see kids openly gambling at certain tracks

Ah but a small side rule allows gambling by all ages on course.

tipp86

Dont know where ye got that quote from me in the last two posts care to explain i poker

Atlantis Casino

Just to let all people know that showed an interest in this case that the atlantis casino Clonmel was brought to court and won its case 2 weeks ago

Icarus152

Atlantis Casino wrote: »

Just to let all people know that showed an interest in this case that the atlantis casino Clonmel was brought to court and won its case 2 weeks ago

May I ask what the charge was against the casino?

oleras

A quick google...

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/0424/1224245293961.html

A CASINO club in Clonmel, Co Tipperary, says it has no plans to reopen even though a charge of unlawful gaming against it was dismissed in the local District Court.

Judge David Anderson ruled on Tuesday that there was insufficient evidence to prove a charge of unlawful gaming against the Atlantis Casino Club under the 1956 Gaming and Lotteries Act.

The case against the club was widely seen as a test of the State’s laws on gambling. Casinos are illegal under the 1956 Act but this has not stopped up to 50 casinos operating as private members’ clubs opening up around the State in recent years.

However, Paul Lucey, operator of the Atlantis Casino Club, said a Garda raid on the club in May 2008 had effectively put him out of business and he did not think the backers would want to reopen it.

Mr Lucey expressed relief that the case was over and called for legislation to reform the gambling laws.

“We ran a professional show,” Mr Lucey said, “we paid our taxes and all our staff were on the books. Like others in this sector, we want legislation to clarify the situation.”

The Atlantis was shut in May 2008 after an early morning raid by seven gardaí, who seized the roulette wheel, safe and gambling chips.

The Gaming and Leisure Association of Ireland, which represents 12 casino clubs, said the verdict showed that existing legislation on gambling was not working.

“This outcome appears to show that the authorities don’t have the power to close down clubs, and it doesn’t give us the clarity we need on the law,” said David Hickson of the association. “It’s not serving anybody well at the moment.”

Minister for Justice Dermot Ahern has declared his intention to press ahead with legislation to legalise casino clubs despite the failure of efforts to achieve cross-party consensus on the issue.

The legislation is expected to be included in a new anti-money laundering Bill to be published within weeks.

Mr Ahern is also expected to start consultations shortly about reform of the entire gambling sector, including betting shops and the horseracing and greyhound industries.

RoundTower

hopefully the guards get done for this, but they'll probably just get a rap on the knuckles. Or perhaps even a wink from the judge -- if he doesn't like the idea of gambling clubs but knows they are legal, maybe he'll allow the guards to continue behaving like they make the laws.

carfax

Best of luck in whatever you go into next Paul.

Stephen Mc Lean.

RoundTower

RoundTower wrote: »

hopefully the guards get done for this, but they'll probably just get a rap on the knuckles. Or perhaps even a wink from the judge -- if he doesn't like the idea of gambling clubs but knows they are legal, maybe he'll allow the guards to continue behaving like they make the laws.

Done for what exactly?

fatguy

RoundTower wrote: »

hopefully the guards get done for this, but they'll probably just get a rap on the knuckles. Or perhaps even a wink from the judge -- if he doesn't like the idea of gambling clubs but knows they are legal, maybe he'll allow the guards to continue behaving like they make the laws.

I would be stunned if this raid was not ordered by the minister. The Gardai never proactively test legislation.

Ollieboy

Deleted User wrote: »

Done for what exactly?

I'm sure they can sue for damages which then comes out off the tax payers purse. If they put them out of buiness with no legal reason or right and tarnish there name, they will have a case to answer.

RoundTower

Deleted User wrote: »

Done for what exactly?

done for closing down a legal business, confiscating equipment legally being used by the business, depriving the owner of his legal livelihood for a year, etc.

@fatguy - I wasn't suggesting the guards were testing the legislation, just that someone had wanted the business closed down for personal reasons. I could be thinking about the wrong club though.

fatguy

@fatguy - I wasn't suggesting the guards were testing the legislation, just that someone had wanted the business closed down for personal reasons. I could be thinking about the wrong club though.

Oh. There's more to this story than meets the eye then?

premiercounty

possibly had something to do with the club being across the road from the clonmel cop shop ??

Atlantis Casino

The case and charge was directly related to the 1956 gaming and lotteries act.


All decent clubs within the country are looking for legislation to protect them and customers, so as to provide a gaming experience that can be enjoyed within a club safely and controled.

In this case ( clonmel ) the people that really suffered were the employees another 12 people out of work..

stevire

Atlantis Casino wrote: »

The case and charge was directly related to the 1956 gaming and lotteries act.


All decent clubs within the country are looking for legislation to protect them and customers, so as to provide a gaming experience that can be enjoyed within a club safely and controled.

In this case ( clonmel ) the people that really suffered were the employees another 12 people out of work..

Am I right in saying ye won the case though?

From another thread:

Atlantis Casino wrote: »

We had a club in Clonmel that was shut down and went to court, the case was won last week by atlantis casino in clonmel district court.

Macspower

stevire wrote: »

Am I right in saying ye won the case though?

From another thread:

yes I think they won the case... but the club has been closed pending the court case..

cuterob

stevire wrote: »

Am I right in saying ye won the case though?

backers wont get behind again after it has been closed down with so much hassle etc

tipp86

Not really room for 2 clubs in clonmel anyway.

lillou

tipp86 wrote: »

Not really room for 2 clubs in clonmel anyway.

Maybe but it should be up to the paying punter to decide which survives through normal competition, not the gardaí

karpov33

Not room for two clubs outside dublin

fatguy

Where is this "outside Dublin"? I've heard of it a few times. Sounds rubbish.

Atlantis Casino

stevire wrote: »

Am I right in saying ye won the case though?

From another thread:

Correct, the case was won after the 3rd day in court and a special sitting of Clonmel court.

Unfortunatly it was a lot of hassle for the backers involved, We still have the lease on the premises and now the decision is to be made on weather to reopen, as the club was doing well and finding its feet when it was closed down.

Jayminator

Ollieboy wrote: »

I'm sure they can sue for damages which then comes out off the tax payers purse. If they put them out of buiness with no legal reason or right and tarnish there name, they will have a case to answer.

No they wont Ollie. They are entitled to raid anywhere if they suspect illegal activities are going on regardless of the consequences of putting anybody out of business. The garda will have no case to answer here at all.

Jayminator

RoundTower wrote: »

done for closing down a legal business, confiscating equipment legally being used by the business, depriving the owner of his legal livelihood for a year, etc..

Seriously doubt this will ever happen. Ya dont need to be drunk when stopped for random breathe tests if I can use that example.

Rakeline

The way there run here like a house of a couple of mates with no real strict laws in place there could be quite alot that are regular money laundering going on. If i was that way inclined id look at that as an easy option to make clean money.

Donkathon

Rakeline wrote: »

The way there run here like a house of a couple of mates with no real strict laws in place there could be quite alot that are regular money laundering going on. If i was that way inclined id look at that as an easy option to make clean money.

+ the fact that ireland has no gambling tax save the average john gilligan a fortune