Hardware Discussion Thread

Serephucus

About 4.5Kg with charger. Wasn't bad to be honest. It was a heavy laptop, but in a backpack, it's fine.

nesf

Fluffy88 wrote: »

I absolutely love my XPS 17, everything about it is class.
It's got 6+ hours of battery life, when doing stuff like browsing the net or watching movies.
When I turn to gaming I have a GPU that was turned off thanks to nVidia Optimus that can run Skyrim at Ultra settings on 1600x900(shadows turned down to medium).
Huge trackpad comparable to a Mac.
A lovely keyboard that is very comfortable and nice to use.
What I find to be a very stylish design that I find very attractive(in a laptop kinda way).
Very good build quality, with nice aluminum finish.
I can't think of anything a Macbook has over my XPS.

I don't mean to say Mac's aren't good. I do like some of the stuff they have. Like the larger multi-touch trackpad was originally conceived by Apple which I am very thankful for, and the island style keyboards are nice to use. Apple generally is very inventive and brings out new fancy technology that's cool. But you have to admit they are way over priced (especially since their OS is a glorified Linux distro :P). They are like the Merc of cars, but why would I waste all that money on a Merc when I can get a Passat for half the price and use all that money I saved to buy a new computer or something else that's more useful.

Well it's a question of high end versus mid range laptops. That's a valid argument but it isn't really like with like. Everything you mentioned is on a Macbook, graphics switching, large touchpad (large enough imho), long battery life etc. Things you get, better connectivity (Firewire, Thunderbolt, Card reader etc), better sound quality (might not matter to you), generally higher quality screens than what I've seen on Dell laptops, also 1680 x 1050 @ 15" (possibly Alienwares match Macbooks here), fall proof hard drives, better rated battery life, unibody aluminium case not just aluminium finish (i.e. better heatsink etc) and so on. It's small touches for the most part but that's what you get with the high end laptops, they're all about little details like low noise headphone out ports with enough current to drive higher end headphones. Not something you'll find on an XPS because, well, it's not a mainstream feature.

And a glorified Linux OS? :P


If you want to argue high end versus mid end, no question you get better value out of mid end laptops same as you get better value out of mid range graphics cards for the most part. Doesn't mean that one should go mid end though. Same as driving a Merc is a lot more pleasurable than a Passat and if you have the money, hey why not?

Edit: The other main thing is that Macs, like other high end laptops tend to hold onto their resale value well. Reselling mid range laptops normally incurs a very steep loss on the other hand.

ShadowHearth

lads, lets dont start MAC vs PC here . i like you all too much, and i really dont want to go and headhunt all of mac you lads!

nesf

ShadowHearth wrote: »

lads, lets dont start MAC vs PC here . i like you all too much, and i really dont want to go and headhunt all of mac you lads!

It's more high end vs mid range laptops than Mac vs PC really. The arguments against the Mac could be made against the better Samsung and Sony laptops too.

nesf

nesf wrote: »

It's more high end vs mid range laptops than Mac vs PC really. The arguments against the Mac could be made against the better Samsung and Sony laptops too.

Actually, to expand on this, the high end vs mid end argument comes down to whether you're happy to wait for a feature to pass down or not. Stuff that was high end 4 or 5 years ago like graphics switching is pretty common now in reasonably priced gear. Things today like Thunderbolt (you'll see it in Sony and Samsung laptops in 2012 I think) where one port can serve half a dozen functions will make its way down too. Just a question if you want cutting edge aspects or not. It's very similar with cars, with things like ABS braking systems and similar.

All a matter of whether you're addicted to tech and the bleeding edge or not.

Fluffy88

Serephucus wrote: »

RE: battery life, is that 6 hours with the 9 or 6-cell battery? Wifi, brightness, etc.?

Just curious. I've seen Dell's figures, but haven't found any concrete user-experience numbers.

I haven't done any proper checks or anything like that. But when the battery was at I think 90~% Windows reported 6 hours 24 mins battery remaining. I will attempt to do a few tests on it over the next few days but Skyrim seems to eat every free moment I get and I don't know will I be able to do 6 straight hours of web browsing :P
That was on a 9-cell battery with Wifi on and screen brightness was at it's normal rate. Can't comment on if it was full brightness as I can't remember but it wasn't turned down, it was at my normal use setting.

nesf wrote: »

Well it's a question of high end versus mid range laptops. That's a valid argument but it isn't really like with like. Everything you mentioned is on a Macbook, graphics switching, .....
....
Edit: The other main thing is that Macs, like other high end laptops tend to hold onto their resale value well. Reselling mid range laptops normally incurs a very steep loss on the other hand.

I suppose it is a high end vs mid range and I guess I prefer to fall in the mid range since it is the place to get best value for money and I am mane :P Hence my opinions on the situation. My laptop is only a mid range laptop I suppose, albeit the high end of the mid range.

A few comments on what you said. When I was shopping for a new laptop one requirement I initially had was a 16:10 aspect ratio screen. Unfortunately that went out the window quite fast as their was almost no laptops with that aspect ratio available. So if Mac offer that then again I have to give that to them. 16:9 is such a silly aspect ratio, I hate the mainstream for forcing it upon me!!
As regards sound. The XPS 17 comes with JBL speakers and even though I might not even know who JBL are, they are claimed to be some of the best speakers ever put in a laptop and I have to agree. The sound out of this system is AMAZING!!! Bass is so good and when you turn it up it can fill a room. I wouldn't be an audiophile by any means but I do enjoy music and I like to hear it fully and clearly so that I can appreciate it properly and the sound from the XPS definitely does that for me.

If I had the money to buy a Merc I would get an Aston Martin instead!
Metaphor would imply something along the line of what Serep posted earlier.

nesf

Fluffy88 wrote: »

A few comments on what you said. When I was shopping for a new laptop one requirement I initially had was a 16:10 aspect ratio screen. Unfortunately that went out the window quite fast as their was almost no laptops with that aspect ratio available. So if Mac offer that then again I have to give that to them. 16:9 is such a silly aspect ratio, I hate the mainstream for forcing it upon me!!
As regards sound. The XPS 17 comes with JBL speakers and even though I might not even know who JBL are, they are claimed to be some of the best speakers ever put in a laptop and I have to agree. The sound out of this system is AMAZING!!! Bass is so good and when you turn it up it can fill a room. I wouldn't be an audiophile by any means but I do enjoy music and I like to hear it fully and clearly so that I can appreciate it properly and the sound from the XPS definitely does that for me.

If I had the money to buy a Merc I would get an Aston Martin instead!
Metaphor would imply something along the line of what Serep posted earlier.

Yeah, I wasn't talking about laptop speakers but sound out of the headphone port, I hate every laptop speaker I've heard. Just too many compromises have to be made to fit a speaker into a laptop for me.

16:10 is available but you need to pay extra for it. Worth it imho, it's just a better resolution than 16:9 to be looking at.


All down to value for money though, and yeah if I was on a reasonably tight budget I wouldn't get (or save for) a MacBook Pro and wouldn't advise other people in the same position to either. However a MacBook Air, or one of the Ultrabooks coming out from PC manufacturers next year would be something I'd take a serious look at. My wife has a MBA and dear God it's lovely for everything that isn't gaming. For a grand for general non-gaming stuff it's reasonably priced for a high end machine. One of the PC makers should equal it in 2012 and I'd be sorely tempted if I needed an ultraportable (though, I don't in all honesty).

Fluffy88

nesf wrote: »

Yeah, I wasn't talking about laptop speakers but sound out of the headphone port, I hate every laptop speaker I've heard. Just too many compromises have to be made to fit a speaker into a laptop for me.

I know your into your audio so I can't really tell you whether or not the XPS could live up to what your used to but it's pretty damn good audio. I use headphones most of the time when gaming or watching tv shows/movies and the audio is still great through my little Sennheiser HD 205-II.

nesf wrote: »

16:10 is available but you need to pay extra for it. Worth it imho, it's just a better resolution than 16:9 to be looking at.

I completely agree.
Unfortunately the price for 16:10 is quite a steep one.

nesf wrote: »

All down to value for money though, and yeah if I was on a reasonably tight budget I wouldn't get (or save for) a MacBook Pro and wouldn't advise other people in the same position to either. However a MacBook Air, or one of the Ultrabooks coming out from PC manufacturers next year would be something I'd take a serious look at. My wife has a MBA and dear God it's lovely for everything that isn't gaming. For a grand for general non-gaming stuff it's reasonably priced for a high end machine. One of the PC makers should equal it in 2012 and I'd be sorely tempted if I needed an ultraportable (though, I don't in all honesty).

For a normal everyday use laptop I think 1k is a tad bit expensive. We are obviously coming from two very different view points here. My brother got a laptop for normal everyday use with i3-2330M for €406 which would be the price point I would be looking at for a "normal" laptop. Like I said earlier I paid a grand for my XPS which can play the newest games at high settings and would make short work of video encoding.

nesf

Fluffy88 wrote: »

I know your into your audio so I can't really tell you whether or not the XPS could live up to what your used to but it's pretty damn good audio. I use headphones most of the time when gaming or watching tv shows/movies and the audio is still great through my little Sennheiser HD 205-II.

I'm sure they're very good for laptop speakers. I've just been spoiled by good headphones for the past 18 months and find it hard to go back to what I used to be used to for music.

Fluffy88 wrote: »

For a normal everyday use laptop I think 1k is a tad bit expensive. We are obviously coming from two very different view points here. My brother got a laptop for normal everyday use with i3-2330M for €406 which would be the price point I would be looking at for a "normal" laptop. Like I said earlier I paid a grand for my XPS which can play the newest games at high settings and would make short work of video encoding.

Yeah, completely different viewpoints and budgets, both perfectly valid imho. The 128GB SSD drive in the MBA would make up quite a lot of the price of your brother's laptop for instance before even considering anything else! I advise people to go with Dell when they want a cheap laptop that just works. If they are a tech lover that wants bells and whistles then at minimum it'd be XPS if not something the like the better Samsungs that I'd recommend if they're willing to spend the money and like their shiny things.

I suppose what I'm saying is choice is good, we need cheap Dells, good XPS laptops and shiny but overpriced Macs and Samsung laptops to cater for all needs and tastes. It'd be a much poorer world if we all were stuck within the same envelope with budget users having to pay for things they didn't need and power users not able to buy the functions they wanted.

Edit: It's the same as with graphics cards. I mean except for people on high resolutions, does anyone actually need the HD 6990 or 580 GTX? They're overpriced compared to the likes of the 6870 in terms of performance per Euro but none of us really complain because we know they're not meant to be good value cards but cards for people willing to pay over the odds for performance. None of us would recommend someone on a tight budget to not buy a PC and save up until they could afford a 580. Etc.

Trevor451

Intel...

deconduo

My girlfriend recently got a Zenbook and its really really nice. Obviously not something you'd get for gaming, but as an ultrabook its pretty awesome.

-1.3KG, weighs practically nothing. Lighter than a macbook air even.
-128GB SSD + i5-2557M, so its pretty speedy. Not the fastest CPU, but it more than enough for what she needs.
-She gets about 9-10 hours battery life with general use; Internet, Word, Excel etc.
-About 6-8 hours watching videos.
-Screen is very nice, audio is decent as well.
-Didn't come with any bloatware like most laptops do.
-Runs Morrowind and Portal on decent settings, so she's happy with it :pac:

Her only complaint so far is that the keyboard is quite stiff. While most of the keys have loosened up with use, there's still a couple that don't register when typing normally.

It cost her $1000 (about €780) but unfortunately most places here are charging a lot more as usual. Still, its something to think about if you know someone visiting the US soon. Its small and light, so pretty easy to fit in a suitcase

nesf

deconduo wrote: »

My girlfriend recently got a Zenbook and its really really nice. Obviously not something you'd get for gaming, but as an ultrabook its pretty awesome.

-1.3KG, weighs practically nothing. Lighter than a macbook air even.
-128GB SSD + i5-2557M, so its pretty speedy. Not the fastest CPU, but it more than enough for what she needs.
-She gets about 9-10 hours battery life with general use; Internet, Word, Excel etc.
-About 6-8 hours watching videos.
-Screen is very nice, audio is decent as well.
-Didn't come with any bloatware like most laptops do.
-Runs Morrowind and Portal on decent settings, so she's happy with it :pac:

Her only complaint so far is that the keyboard is quite stiff. While most of the keys have loosened up with use, there's still a couple that don't register when typing normally.

It cost her $1000 (about €780) but unfortunately most places here are charging a lot more as usual. Still, its something to think about if you know someone visiting the US soon. Its small and light, so pretty easy to fit in a suitcase

Oooh, shiny! Competition is good, can't wait to see Ultrabooks in 2 or 3 years. Keyboard trouble is annoying though.

Ryan451

Hey guys, just got my H80 Cooler and am about to install it. I was wondering would it be ok to use Acryllic Thinner or Rubbing Alcohol to clean my CPU. Thanks in advance.

Serephucus

Rubbing alcohol will work fine.

ShadowHearth

Serephucus wrote: »

Rubbing alcohol will work fine.

VODKA IT IS THEN!

Ryan451

ShadowHearth wrote: »

VODKA IT IS THEN!

Is vodka ok to use?

Fluffy88

nesf wrote: »

Yeah, completely different viewpoints and budgets, both perfectly valid imho.

I only wish I was looking at this from your side of the fence

Ryan451

I bought a PCB and Flux Cleaner in Maplins today and was just wondering whether or not this is suitable for cleaning a CPU guys, wouldn't want to risk using it without confirmation, thanks.

Brian

Just use alcohol.

ShadowHearth

Baza210 wrote: »

Just use alcohol.

non flavored vodka! pew pew pew!

i bet boys at maplin didnt even had a clue, what poor fella was looking for.

Ryan451

ShadowHearth wrote: »

non flavored vodka! pew pew pew!

i bet boys at maplin didnt even had a clue, what poor fella was looking for.

So the PCB Cleaner is useless?

Monotype

The PCB cleaner is probably ok to use. It's most likely based on some sort of alcohol with a low boiling point and if it's good enough for a circuit board, then it's probably good enough for the back of a CPU. Try it on a piece of metal first. See if it evaporates cleanly. You wouldn't want to use it if it left some oil based residue or something.

In the future, you might want to look out for something that's specifically designed for the job:
http://www.arcticsilver.com/arcticlean.htm

deejer

Speaking of Maplin i was in there the other day looking for a can of compressed air. Tried there and Peats but what they had was too small or too dear. Im not paying Eur22 for a can of air.

They are about Eur15 on ebay too so I am wondering if anyone knows of somewhere else they can be got for cheaper. Wouldnt mind buying a few if I got them for the right price. Find them really handy when cleaning out older PCs and them hard to reach places;)

ShadowHearth

deejer wrote: »

Speaking of Maplin i was in there the other day looking for a can of compressed air. Tried there and Peats but what they had was too small or too dear. Im not paying Eur22 for a can of air.

They are about Eur15 on ebay too so I am wondering if anyone knows of somewhere else they can be got for cheaper. Wouldnt mind buying a few if I got them for the right price. Find them really handy when cleaning out older PCs and them hard to reach places;)

i will add to this:

this august i walked in and asked if they have some GPUs. i was shown display with nvidia 8600 the best of the lot... okay... i asked if you got something more powerfull like 6870? he checked catalog and with enthusiasm replied: "SURE! here you go 580eu, but you will have to wait a bit, because we dont have it in stock!". i asked why is it 580eu, as my misses will bring me one from austria for 170eu from brick and mortar shop! answer: well, thats just our prices...

a month ago:

i went in to maplins for usb wireless adapter and some wireless keyboard+mouse. i found microsoft set for 50 quid and cheapest adapter for 30eu. went in to soundstore and got same microsoft set for 29.99eu and adapter for 19.99eu...

had to buy one sata cable as i robbed from old pc - 10.00eu... ****...

Serephucus

I know the office supplies store in Maynooth has a couple of them every now and then. €6 I think. Maybe look in places like Reids in town?

deejer

ShadowHearth wrote: »

i went in to maplins for usb wireless adapter and some wireless keyboard+mouse. i found microsoft set for 50 quid and cheapest adapter for 30eu. went in to soundstore and got same microsoft set for 29.99eu and adapter for 19.99eu...

had to buy one sata cable as i robbed from old pc - 10.00eu... ****...

I dont want to get started on them! Its always a last resort.

Serephucus wrote: »

I know the office supplies store in Maynooth has a couple of them every now and then. €6 I think. Maybe look in places like Reids in town?

Edit: Picked up 4 here for 25euro so not too bad

Ya thanks hadnt thought of a place like that.

Brian

deejer wrote: »

Speaking of Maplin i was in there the other day looking for a can of compressed air. Tried there and Peats but what they had was too small or too dear. Im not paying Eur22 for a can of air.

They are about Eur15 on ebay too so I am wondering if anyone knows of somewhere else they can be got for cheaper. Wouldnt mind buying a few if I got them for the right price. Find them really handy when cleaning out older PCs and them hard to reach places;)

I got two cans of compressed air in Peats for €8

Fluffy88

Serephucus wrote: »

RE: battery life, is that 6 hours with the 9 or 6-cell battery? Wifi, brightness, etc.?

Just curious. I've seen Dell's figures, but haven't found any concrete user-experience numbers.

So I have done a bit of a battery test with the laptop now.
Yesterday from a 100% charge I started to watch this playlist on youtube. I put the quality up to 1080 and watched it in full screen mode. I switched the battery profile to Windows default "Power saving" but turned up the screen brightness to half as it was too low on the default setting.

I didn't watch the last video so that was a total of 2:40 streaming a 1080 video. I had to go for a bit in the middle so there was a shutdown in there somewhere too. So including that playlist the laptop was on for about 3:30 yesterday, the rest of the time was just web browsing. That left the battery at 39% as I switched it off last night.

Today I switched it on and it showed 22% battery remaining. From my Event Viewer is seems someone switched on the laptop earlier today while I was at work. And from the event logs it seems the laptop was only on for 20 around mins so my brother must of had a short go at Skyrim on battery power or something to do that much damage :P
Anyway I then got a further 1:30 on it tonight just general web browsing.

So that's a total of about 5 hours battery life.
I'm used to a 30 min battery life so it's a pretty good battery to me :P
HWMonitor reports a designed capacity of 93240mWh which mine is still rated at.

Serephucus

That's cool, thanks very much for keeping track.

My GF is looking at getting one for college, and we weren't sure if it would get through a full day, but from the looks of things it should be fine. What's it like noise-wise? I'd assume at idle it's basically silent, load levels?

Serephucus

That's cool, thanks very much for keeping track.

My GF is looking at getting one for college, and we weren't sure if it would get through a full day, but from the looks of things it should be fine. What's it like noise-wise? I'd assume at idle it's basically silent, load levels?