My next door neighbour has BB but I dont

SkepticOne

It would be great if everyone was entitled to an unencumbered full copper pair back to the exchange. A lot more people would have broadband. Unfortunately, that is not the case.

You may be able to persuade or cajole an Eircom technician to install a proper line however or it may be that the only way to provide you with a line that meets the proper standard is by removing the splitter. Or you may be able to shame Eircom into providing a proper line by threatening to embarrass them in the local media.

I would probably go with sharing the broadband with the neighbour over a wireless router.

I would be wary of people who say you are entitled to this or that but when challenged fail to come up with evidence.

St0n3d

SkepticOne wrote: »

It would be great if everyone was entitled to an unencumbered full copper pair back to the exchange. A lot more people would have broadband. Unfortunately, that is not the case.

You may be able to persuade or cajole an Eircom technician to install a proper line however or it may be that the only way to provide you with a line that meets the proper standard is by removing the splitter. Or you may be able to shame Eircom into providing a proper line by threatening to embarrass them in the local media.

I would probably go with sharing the broadband with the neighbour over a wireless router.

I would be wary of people who say you are entitled to this or that but when challenged fail to come up with evidence.

indeed an easier route.

My apolgies for "failing to come up with evidance". I have gave you links to the people you need to talk with to get exactly what you need. Excuse my ignorance when i say I've more important things to worry about than proving myself to Boards.ie members.

I'll help and advise as much i can, but criticise me and Il put you into the dont listen to category.

gnomic babbling, How dare you, what grounds have you to accuse such? my lack of enthusiasm in replying to your needy replys about the actual stated regulations. get a life.

Its sheer ignorance on your behalf. I need not explain why or where I got these "rules", but only to use them to get exactly what the customer needs and without bringing it to a SMC.

St0n3d

I've had quite enough of this messing around.

The bottom fact is:

There "are" Legal issues when a wholesaler, Company, whatever you want to call it, claims that their is nothing that they can do when clearly you are paying to have a service which is not being provided.

Immediatly I can sense thousands of Boards members shouting off in theirs heads " wheres the proof of this"..

Need there be proof in a miracle? Do you question how and why it happened? Or just gratful it happened? ... "Oh now look hes trying to compare Eircom to Miracles" "Hes lost his mind"

How can i possibly bring it down to a level in which everyone will agree and understand?

Confidence? Perception? Stating the facts?

Maybe. but why question something that works and has proved to work for many people in this same situation and worse. Maybe you call bluff now.. Maybe their isnt a whole legality in relation to the fact his line is split in two . to my knowledge it isnt stated in a regulation "ALL HOUSES MUST HAVE THEIR OWN LINE"

At this stage i give up...

What i suggest you do, seen as I'm not going to waste time here arguing.


1. RING EIRCOM

2. PLACE AN ORDER FOR A SECOND LINE

3. GET THE ENGINEER OUT WHO HAS NO CHOICE BUT TO REMOVE THE SPLIT TO SUPPORT THE EXTRA LINE

4. WAIT 10 days. DO A LINE TEST.

5. If it fails, pm me here and Il arrange a router to be posted to you. Eircom will have no choice but to enable everything their side.

6. CONNECT THE ROUTER, CHECK YOUR LINE STATS. ENJOY BROADBAND.


best of luck!

SkepticOne

St0n3d wrote: »

My apolgies for "failing to come up with evidance". I have gave you links to the people you need to talk with to get exactly what you need. Excuse my ignorance when i say I've more important things to worry about than proving myself to Boards.ie members.

No need to apologise. I think you are mistaken about about what Eircom are legally obliged to provide to the user but I stand to be corrected should you wish to provide a pointer to the relevant legislation. I would be happily surprised if you were correct.

Sponge Bob

I think he means ' order a second line ' and/or ' believe in miracles and in the second coming ' but why was he babbling about the Communications Act 2007 .

Let me repeat the simplw question, no babbling please and do not mention miracles !

sponge bob wrote:

St0n3d which bit of that communications act entitles you to precisely what ????

St0n3d

Yep. Simple solution, Order a second line, for isdn or whatever, the new line should pass seen as the split is gone. cancel the old line. Tranfer the number if you must.


To anyone looking for the actual legal info, i refered to the commisions act as those are the type of people who stated to me before what rights i had regarding telecoms.

I cant and wont be able to link you to the "actual" facts, however some simple searching on google or Boards will provide all the facts about telecom regulation and what third parties are involved.

My refering to miracle is the same aspect of a broadband active line failing the line tests. it shouldn't, might have, wont have, has. Its all jabber, noone is actually going to sit down read through 1000 pages of a legislation, UNLESS. A particular section applys to him.

What your asking me is to provide that point. In which i cannot at this moment . However, without loosing all hope in me, try the method stated above and I'm sure you avail results.

best regards

bealtine

St0n3d wrote: »

I cant and wont be able to link you to the "actual" facts, however some simple searching on google or Boards will provide all the facts about telecom regulation and what third parties are involved.

My refering to miracle is the same aspect of a broadband active line failing the line tests. it shouldn't, might have, wont have, has. Its all jabber, noone is actually going to sit down read through 1000 pages of a legislation, UNLESS. A particular section applys to him.

What your asking me is to provide that point. In which i cannot at this moment . However, without loosing all hope in me, try the method stated above and I'm sure you avail results.

Lets examine the facts as we know them.
His line speed is:
"Dial-up at the moment i get, (depending on the pc im using) 22-35kbps."

This is something Comreg can enforce.
I wonder, idly, if they could even be bothered.
(Lets not confuse things here, there are excellent people in Comreg, however none
of the consumer line people fit into this category)


Everything else , legal pretenses,consumer rights etc are nonsense.
You have no rights, Comreg sold you out.

SkepticOne

St0n3d wrote: »

My refering to miracle is the same aspect of a broadband active line failing the line tests. it shouldn't, might have, wont have, has. Its all jabber, noone is actually going to sit down read through 1000 pages of a legislation, UNLESS. A particular section applys to him.

Have you tried using the various search tools. You don't need to read every page of every piece of legislation produced in the country.

St0n3d

Honestly? I haven't....

I admire your exaggeration but how could reading the telecoms reg's be comparable to ever leg in the country?

I don't see the need for me to re read such things as i have accumilated every piece of info I needed to pursue Eircom, Utv and Comreg.

I also believe the full whack is somewhere online and contains over 100 pages , otherwise a simple call to a local solictor to get such needed info.

ned14

St0n3d wrote: »

Yep. Simple solution, Order a second line, for isdn or whatever, the new line should pass seen as the split is gone. cancel the old line. Tranfer the number if you must.


best regards

Thing is, I already have a second line in the house, and thats used exclusively for internet (not isdn, thats just like paying someone to burn your money). The internet bill is colossol in this house, me using it for at least 4 hours a day when im housebound (half of that of course waiting for stuff to load).

That also fails the line test. But I assume if we have 2 lines, the splitter has been removed?

Any ideas? Thanks for the replys so far.

What do you think about getting onto comreg. Eircom have been a dead end as far as im concerned, and im not an easily persuaded person on the phone. I've been onto helplines at work enough times to know not to listen to any sh1te they talk.

zugvogel

ned14 wrote: »

Thing is, I already have a second line in the house, and thats used exclusively for internet (not isdn, thats just like paying someone to burn your money). The internet bill is colossol in this house, me using it for at least 4 hours a day when im housebound (half of that of course waiting for stuff to load).

That also fails the line test. But I assume if we have 2 lines, the splitter has been removed?

Any ideas? Thanks for the replys so far.

Ned14 what was the second line ordered for? Telephone service? Maybe to provide that second line Eircom split your original unsplit line? That would rule out broadband for either of these lines.I think you need to find out exactly what the state of play with your lines are!

Zug

bealtine

ned14 wrote: »

Thing is, I already have a second line in the house, and thats used exclusively for internet (not isdn, thats just like paying someone to burn your money). The internet bill is colossol in this house, me using it for at least 4 hours a day when im housebound (half of that of course waiting for stuff to load).

I'm sure St0n3d will be along anytime soon to advise you on your legal standing
and of course what to do next.

kaizersoze

bealtine wrote: »

I'm sure St0n3d will be along anytime soon to advise you on your legal standing
and of course what to do next.

*snigger*

SkepticOne

ned14 wrote: »

Thing is, I already have a second line in the house, and thats used exclusively for internet (not isdn, thats just like paying someone to burn your money). The internet bill is colossol in this house, me using it for at least 4 hours a day when im housebound (half of that of course waiting for stuff to load).

That also fails the line test. But I assume if we have 2 lines, the splitter has been removed?

Any ideas? Thanks for the replys so far.

May I ask how much your internet bill is?

ned14

Its topping €80/month sometimes.

Is there any way of finding out if my line has a splitter in it bar getting a tech to tell me?

watty

Use a CPS that has free calls in evening 1hr at a time.
use a geographic (01, 021, 061 etc) number to dial internet (189x are still charged).
Worked for me on Talk Talk. Used ancient Limerick eircom POP number. Call charge dropped by €35 a month from typical €45 a month + rental.

paulm17781

zugvogel wrote: »

Ned14 what was the second line ordered for? Telephone service? Maybe to provide that second line Eircom split your original unsplit line? That would rule out broadband for either of these lines.I think you need to find out exactly what the state of play with your lines are!

I was going to say the same. I would pester Eircom for this information. If your neighbour can get BB and you can't, you're two lines could very well be the reason.

SkepticOne

ned14 wrote: »

Its topping €80/month sometimes.

Is there any way of finding out if my line has a splitter in it bar getting a tech to tell me?

Maybe switch to one of the prepaid packages like utvinternet's 180 hours for €24.95. http://u.tv/utvipxlx/index.asp?loc=ie .

hugsr4free

Your line could be a carrier line, meaning your line does not come directly from the exchange 1901 sould be able to clear this up for you. I could check your land land number if you want to pm me

St0n3d

Alola!

Cheers for the snarky comments. I've just discharged myself after a 4 hour surgery in Tallaght hospital, only to come back on and check how tings are going....

Seen as you DO have a second line, it is possible they have split the normal 4 pair. But, this isnt really where the split is?

Everyhome has twin copper cables, you only use 1 pair for phone and broadband. the other two wires, are useless unless you have a "Ring" or "spur" wire?

If you open up your main socket how many cables are connected?

St0n3d

Oh and...

Ps: my average monthly bill for broadband tops 150 euro.

Bi monthly usually above 310 Euro .

Without a telephone connected...

ned14

Only 1 set of each are connected (a blue and an orange from each) with the other cables bundled up in a knot.

St0n3d

Ok great.

Now may i ask , go to the main socket in the house, is there just one wire (2 pair) coming in? Is that then split to your second line no?

in your case there are two wires coming in from the main telegraph pole/ Comms ? to support your two lines?

What was the purpose of this second line? business line etc?

Did you try a line test before the second line was installed? Or was it the reason you got the second line to get Broadband?

cgarvey

St0n3d banned for 1 week for WUMming, giving inaccurate and misleading advice and failing to clarify on request.

cgarvey

2 points that need clarification for the uninitiated reading this thread:
1) eircom are under no legal obligation to provide anyone, anywhere, broadband.
2) eircom do not guarantee any new line installation to be broadband capable. There is anecdotal evidence that if you ask the operator to note (on account/file/works order) that the line is needed for BB, you stand a good chance. However there are also cases of those getting their own (non-capable) line split.

cgarvey

Off-topic mod discussion moved to this thread in Feedback, where it belongs.

ned14

The phoneline isnt split at the main socket, but followed it to the attic where it splits into the 2 phone numbers.

The main socket only has 1 pair of wires connected.

Second line was installed 7 or 8 years ago in the infancy days of eircom 'i-Stream' specifically for accessing the internet and not to interfere with calls on the main telephone line.

cgarvey

ned14 wrote: »

(not isdn, thats just like paying someone to burn your money)

I could be reading you wrong, but ISDN is actually marginally cheaper for a vastly more reliable dialup connection. ISDN line rental (which gives you 2 lines / 2 numbers) is cheaper than 2 analogue lines.

Dialup/call charges are the same, but your dialup connection will be VASTLY superiror to any analogue line dialup connection (64Kbps as against ~40-48Kbps on a good regular analogue line, or 10-19Kbps if you're on a poor/remote line). It connects in 3-5 seconds, versus 10-20 seconds dialup (so already a call charge saving), disconnects almost never, and gives a constant data rate. You can also use dual channel ISDN dialup (2x64Kbps) to double your speed (but you pay the price of 2 calls then). Just wanted to clarify that, in case you didn't know.

ned14 wrote: »

That also fails the line test. But I assume if we have 2 lines, the splitter has been removed?

Not a safe assumption (especially given the age of your line from your other post). If anything, they probably split your original line to give you your second line!

A rule of thumb to figure out if you're on a split line is to check the dialup speeds. If you get ~20Kbps on a line that has very good or perfect voice quality, you are probably on a split line. If you get that speed on a poor / crackly line it could just be the line is crap. If you get 38-40Kbps you're like on a non-split line. Rules of thumb only, not 100% reliable.

ned14 wrote: »

Any ideas?

It depends on how much effort (time on the phone and money!) you're willing to put in. Anecdotal stories suggest that if you order ISDN you'll get a non-splt line, while more suggest if you order a new line and ask that it be noted that it's for DSL the engineer will try to give you a proper non-split line. I think the best advice is to try and talk to a local (eircom) engineer if you can find one, and ask him. Treat him as him doing a favour for you by talking to you, and he won't guarantee anything but it's worth a shot. If you do order a new line you might be liable for installation charges even if you can't get DSL at the end of it all. Both ISDN (which won't work with most splitters, so a good chance you'll get a non-split line that will turn out to be compatible if your neighbours is) and regular analogue phone lines come with "free installation" every now and then if you're prepared to wait. To some the cost of an ISDN install (and then order DSL) is miniscule compare to the necessity of BB. Your milage may vary.

ned14 wrote: »

What do you think about getting onto comreg.

They won't help you, I'm afraid. They are only there to regulate. As eircom have done nothing wrong, ComReg won't be of any use.

keithclancy

Jaysus ... I had to lookup what Wumming was .. thought it was some form of bizarre sexual act :P

MajorMax

SkepticOne wrote: »

No need to apologise. I think you are mistaken about about what Eircom are legally obliged to provide to the user but I stand to be corrected should you wish to provide a pointer to the relevant legislation. I would be happily surprised if you were correct.

OK I work for Eircom and I can tell you that Eircom ARE NOT legally required to supply broadband to anyone at any time this is a popular misconception, it is a product that we cannot guarantee, unlike telephony service which we are REQUIRED as the universal service providers to supply to anyone in the country which includes a minimum of 26.6 kps dial up service.

If there is a splitter on the line which is a result of previous government interference in our network then the only solution is to install a new line at the cost of 121.93 Euro including VAT and even after this there is no guarantee of Broadband.