Irish gov determined to bulldoze Top Ten ancient discovery

TetsuoHashimoto

This one is for you Archeology people

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/WO0801/S00001.htm

The Lismullin national monument, discovered in March 2007 in the pathway of the M3 motorway at Tara, has been awarded a place in the Top Ten Most Important Archaeological Discoveries of 2007, in the Jan/Feb issue of Archaeology magazine, a publication of the Archaeological Institute of America.

TaraWatch will celebrate this, as well as the inclusion of Tara in the 2008 List of 100 Most Endangered Sites by the World Monuments Fund, by engaging in a sponsored walk along the pathway of the disused Navan to Dublin railway line on New Years Day, to highlight the alternatives that are still available.

Other important sites in the Top Ten Discoveries 2007 are the Solar Observatory at Chankillo, Peru; Urbanization at Tell Brak, Syria; Homo habilis & Homo erectus remains in Kenya and new discoveries at Greater Angkor, Cambodia.

The Lismullin entry, written by Jarrett A. Lobell states:

"Early last year, archaeologists working on the route of a controversial highway near the village of Lismullin, Ireland, stumbled across a vast Iron Age ceremonial enclosure, or henge, surrounded by two concentric walls. The 2,000-year-old site is just over a mile from the Hill of Tara, traditional seat of the ancient Irish kings and site of St. Patrick's conversion of the Irish to Christianity in the fifth century A.D. The discovery of the massive henge, measuring more than 260 feet in diameter, confirms the long-held belief that the area around the hill contains a rich complex of monuments.

"The extraordinary amount of archaeological remains on the Hill of Tara--burial mounds, religious enclosures, stone structures, and rock art dating from the third millennium b.c. to the twelfth century A.D.--makes it Ireland's most spiritually and archaeologically significant site. Construction of the new M3 highway, meant to ease traffic congestion around Dublin, threatens not only the Hill of Tara's timeless quality, but also newly discovered archaeological sites in the surrounding valley.

"Although archaeologists and concerned Irish politicians are rallying support worldwide for the protection of the Hill of Tara, the iconic site remains in great peril. At press time, the European Commission had initiated legal action against the Irish government over the M3, charging Ireland with failing to protect its own heritage.

Vincent Salafia of TaraWatch said:

"2007 has been a very successful year for the Tara campaign, with Tara being recognised as being one of the world's 100 most endangered sites, and now Lismullin making it into the top ten most important discoveries in 2007.

"Numerous important Irish celebrities have also voiced their opposition to the M3, including Bono, Gabriel Byrne, Jonathan Rhys Myers, Paddy Moloney, Seamus Heaney and Louis le Brocquy."

"We have also been vindicated by the litigation initiated by the European Commission, which argues that Dick Roche should have required a new Environmental Impact Assessment before making the decision to demolish the Lismullin national monument.

"Sadly, Minister Gormley has refused to comply with the demands of the European Commission, and has not conducted a new Environmental Impact Assessment, before allowing the national monument to be handed over to the construction company.

"There is still a small window of time for the Minister to take action, before the works become irreversible. Hopefully, the designation of Lismullin in this Top Ten will trigger a re-examination of the issue by the Minister.

Dub13

Not many 'Archeology people' here in After Hours.

galwayrush

Dub13 wrote: »

Not many 'Archeology people' here in After Hours.

Well, not ones who will give serious answers anyways.:D

Tipsy Mac

Most people want the road built, less people don't, the road gets built, end of.

Dudess

Dub13 wrote: »

Not many 'Archeology people' here in After Hours.

Plenty of people dig holes for themselves here though.

leninbenjamin

Tipsy Mac wrote: »

Most people want the road built, less people don't, the road gets built, end of.

funnily enough I've yet to meet someone who actually wants that road to go ahead. it's very much a regional viewpoint.

Wertz

Bwaahaha....so Gormley will be the one who gets the blame for all this and will go down as the villain? You have to hand it to FF; they're brilliant.

The Lismullin Tribunal 2031

Counsel: So Mr Gormley, can you explain to us exactly why you decided to build a road through the very throne of the high kings of tara back in early 2008?

Gormley: Um ahh....um.....but it wasn't me it was Seamus Brennan...oh oh and Cullen, he was the one who...

Counsel; Oh come come mr Gormley, do you really expect us to believe that those two gombeens really managed to pull the wool over the nation's eyes? I put it to you that it was you and only you who held the final decision on this tragic course of events.

Tribunal Judge: Well it pains me to be the first Irish judge in almost 80 years to be handing down a sentence such as this, but I'm afraid I'm left with little choice...

*gallows are rolled out*

Guy:Incognito

leninbenjamin wrote: »

funnily enough I've yet to meet someone who actually wants that road to go ahead..

I do.

Dyr

theres always been irish people who were happy to sell their heiritage down the swanny for their own gain.

Dyr

Stekelly wrote: »

I do.

you also feel some team from liverpool are sig worthy. So what side of the mersey did you grow up on la' our kid?

Guy:Incognito

Or theres people who dotn care about the same things others do.

Manic Moran

Well, it's the ancient Celts' fault for not bothering to take advance planning for the country's infrastructure needs into account, isn't it? The should have built Tara somewhere else, but no, they didn't...

I think there's a difference between an achaeological site, and an archeological item. If the primary value of the site comes from the artefacts found there, I don't think there should be a permanent ban on modern construction as the artefacts can be catalogued, collected, moved, and still reveal whatever secrets they hold. If the value of the site is integral to its location and cannot be moved, such as an old fort or henge, then that's a slightly different issue, but that doesn't mean to say that all construction in the region should grind to a halt. Stonehenge and woodhenge, for example, are both living in relative comfort with main roads very close.

NTM

Sundy

Tipsy Mac wrote: »

Most people want the road built, less people don't, the road gets built, end of.

Its called a Democracy

Guy:Incognito

Bambi wrote: »

you also feel some team from liverpool are sig worthy. So what side of the mersey did you grow up on la' our kid?

The side where people are free doas they please and partake/support in whatever sport they like (irrespective of how evilor British it may be)

Dyr

Stekelly wrote: »

The side where people are free doas they please and partake/support in whatever sport they like (irrespective of how evilor British it may be)

i'll take that as a "nowhere near it but i grew up watching jamie rednapp on de telly"

people are free to do what they like. Like the few scousers i know who piss themselves laughing at dubs trying to pass themselves off as kopites

Mr. CooL ICE

"Numerous important Irish celebrities have also voiced their opposition to the M3, including Bono, Gabriel Byrne, Jonathan Rhys Myers, Paddy Moloney, Seamus Heaney and Louis le Brocquy."

These boyos will be doing wheelies in the bandwagon until they get a bit of oul' publicity.


Either they bulldoze the whole thing and get a load of heat from it, or they make a massive skew around it and get a load of heat for building a crap motorway. They will never win.

Guy:Incognito

Bambi wrote: »

i'll take that as a "nowhere near it but i grew up watching jamie rednapp on de telly"

Nope before that and before there was live matches all the time.

Dyr

Ah great so ye'd know what a plazzy is then

Sam Vimes

Tipsy Mac wrote: »

Most people want the road built, less people don't, the road gets built, end of.

nobody doesn't want the road built ffs, they want it moved a few hundred metres so it doesn't go over one of the top ten ancient discoveries of 2007. i'm sick of people claiming that the protesters don't want the road built when it says right there in the article that they're marching down one of the alternative routes they're suggesting

daveharnett

Commander Vimes wrote: »

i'm sick of people claiming that the protesters don't want the road built when it says right there in the article that they're marching down one of the alternative routes they're suggesting

The problem as i see it is that the planning process is so useless that any deviation from the original plan will result in (another) ridiculous delay.

The protesters need to point out that it would have been much quicker and cheaper to make the change than go through the court cases, appeals and pay the inevitable EU fines.

Gotta hand it to FF on this one. They are brilliant at making scapegoats of their partners. Do i remember correctly that the permission for this was signed the day before Gormley took office?

phasers

I don't see whats wrong with moving the road a bit

it gets built and Tara is saved
everybody wins, everybody shuts the fcuk up

phasers

phasers wrote: »

I don't see whats wrong with moving the road a bit

€.

Instant Karma

Bambi wrote: »

theres always been irish people who were happy to sell their heiritage down the swanny for their own gain.

How sadly true.

Marksie

Sundy wrote: »

Its called a Democracy

This wwould be the same FF democracy which had a referendum a few years back but the results went against them. So they had another til they got the right democratic answer? i.e the one they wanted?

Setun

If they do build the road, get fined etc, where does the money to pay the fines come from?

Slow Motion

daveharnett wrote: »

Gotta hand it to FF on this one. They are brilliant at making scapegoats of their partners. Do i remember correctly that the permission for this was signed the day before Gormley took office?

Correct, about one of the most cynical moves it's ever been my displeasure to witness in Irish politics, among many, many, many............others!

Degsy

How many people know what site thier house previously occupied?If the hippies were suddenly told,"right,get out of your houses,we reckon there's stoneage stuff underneath" would they be happy to hand the keys over?

Sleepy

Daddio wrote: »

If they do build the road, get fined etc, where does the money to pay the fines come from?

An exhorbitant toll á la the M50 perhaps?

cornbb

Degsy wrote: »

How many people know what site thier house previously occupied?If the hippies were suddenly told,"right,get out of your houses,we reckon there's stoneage stuff underneath" would they be happy to hand the keys over?

Its not like they're digging up a road thats already been built. Hardly a fair analogy.

Yes, we need better roads. We also need to protect what little bits of historical artifacts are left of our past. The government is such a collection of half-baked f*ckups they can't get either requirement right, let alone getting both done at the same time. Nobody is going to look back on the M3 in awe in 10, 100 or 10,000 years time.

L1011

leninbenjamin wrote: »

funnily enough I've yet to meet someone who actually wants that road to go ahead. it's very much a regional viewpoint.

I live very close to the N3, I travel on it very frequently. I want the motorway built.

Oddly enough I've found its a regional viewpoint too - only those in regions not affected by the road (such as Galway, oddly enough) are wringing their hands over it.

WindSock

Can I, as in ordinary layperson me, go and visit this site before it is destroyed?