Christians should not celebrate Halloween.

Zombrex

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

I would be aware of his tactics

How do you not know that Satan in fact wants kids to sit at home being miserable on Halloween, ending up being resentful towards Christianity for dictating that they cannot go Tricker-Treating, eventually leading them away from the calling of Jesus and eternal damnation.

Its a bit like the clamp down on civil liberties after 9-11. The US government was rattling on about how we have to do this to protect US citizens from terrorists, when in fact Bin Laden is probably sitting in his cave with a bit smile on his face as hundreds of Americans are arrested without charge or access to lawyers, foreign citizens are abducted and "renditioned" to countries that torture, pointless wars are started that flare up terrorism recruitment etc etc.

Now I'm not saying that Halloween is the same as Iraq.

But the phrase "Be careful that you don't destroy what you claim to protect" does spring to mind. Satan is the great lie. He isn't obvious. He isn't out in the open. He is not going to make a holiday about himself. But he may manipulate Christian fear around an already established holiday so that he turns Christians against the enjoyment and innocence of a holiday like Halloween. Halloween is ultimately a community holiday, a holiday about the community around you. That certainly sounds like something Satan would want to turn Christians away from, turn them away from the community around them, to isolate them.

He will trick you into doing his bidding.

Run_to_da_hills

bluewolf wrote: »

Could you show me some quotes when you have a chance? It's not something I think I've seen discussed on the forum and I find it odd

Some of Satans characteristics and tactics.

Has the power of death until both he and death are destroyed during the establishment of God’s everlasting kingdom on earth (1 Corinthians 15:24-26, "And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever" Revelation 20:10,14

Able to supernaturally move people "And he brought him to Jerusalem, and set him on a pinnacle of the temple, and said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down from hence" (Luke 4:9)

Project temptation into the mind "And supper being ended, the devil having now put into the heart of Judas Iscariot, to betray him" (John 13:2).

Strong deception powers to deceive individuals "In whom the god of this world (Satan) hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them".(2 Corinthians 4:4)

Deceive nations "And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season" (Revelation 20:3).

Can transform himself into an angel of light "And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light" (2 Corinthians 11:14)

Can travel back and forth on earth and also to heaven (also shows he is not omnipresent) "Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour" 1 Peter 5:8 Also "And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it" .Job 1:6-7,

Satans power and rule are limited "And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him". (Revelation 12:9)

Not omnipresent "And when the devil had ended all the temptation, he departed from him for a season" Luke 4:13

Dave!

Scofflaw wrote: »

Definitely no Biblical authority for trolls.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Is it not one of the commandments? Thou shalt not feed the trolls?

Michael G

This is a bloody nuisance. Neighbours' children whom I don't know knocking at my front door looking for money, and idiots letting off fireworks.

I do not have the knowledge to advise Protestants, but Catholics should go to Mass on the Feast of All Saints and also, if they can, on the Feast of All Souls the following day. Catholics can also get a plenary indulgence for the Souls in Purgatory by visiting a cemetery each day between November 1 and November 8 and praying for them. (Indulgences are among the things the rest of you threw away when you perversely went your own way 500 years ago, but you can still come back .)

JimiTime

Wicknight wrote: »

I think that was his point. Halloween is nothing but a bit of fun. Just because its not in the Bible doesn't mean its automatically evil. No one "worships" a bad Frankenstein costume.

Why would i expect you to know, or actually respect your opinion on matters of godliness? I'm not trying to be offensive, but i wouldn't expect you to get my point.

Football is a "pagan ritual" (it was invented by the Romans). If you partake in it are you worshiping Satan?

Football is a game. its not a ritual designed to honour a false god:rolleyes: oh, never mind.

JimiTime

Son Goku wrote: »

Is it? Halloween is not some etheral abstract force that exists behind the day. It is the day and what people do on it. The point is, it is not celebrated as a pagan festival, there is nothing pagan about it. What is actually pagan about it if no pagan Gods are worshipped and the kids aren't pagans?

Firstly, God was precise about ritual in biblical times. Ritual was important. He commanded his followers to partake in certain ritual. He told his people not to indulge in the practices of the nations, this would include their rituals honouring false gods. TBH, I don't expect a non-christian to understand this. To love god and know what pleases and displeases. I can't in good concience just go with the status quo, of 'sure its only a bit of craic'. I don't see it so innocent.

If we avoid things because of what they used to be in the past, then you'll have to avoid a lot of things.

OK, as a christian, what other things would i have to avoid? Remember, its not things that were invented by pagans, but rituals that glorify Gods. so football and that is not relevant. just in case like wicknight, you don't grasp it.

Zombrex

JimiTime wrote: »

Why would i expect you to know, or actually respect your opinion on matters of godliness? I'm not trying to be offensive, but i wouldn't expect you to get my point.

It isn't my opinion on matters of godliness, it was BC. I was simply attempting to clarify.

TBH I think you just don't understand Halloween very well.

JimiTime wrote: »

Football is a game. its not a ritual designed to honour a false god:rolleyes: oh, never mind.

Neither is Halloween, even when it was a pagan festival (now it is just a bit of fun).

Again, as I said in my original post, the main issue here is people not understand what Halloween is.

Zombrex

JimiTime wrote: »

OK, as a christian, what other things would i have to avoid?

Well the days of the week for a start, since they are named after Pagan gods

In fact the early Christians had great problem using the names of the week that we use, and turned to a numerical system that later influenced the names of the week in languages such as Portuguese.

And before you say "That is ridiculous, just because I call the day Tuesday doesn't mean I'm glorifying Thor or Mars" that would be the point that a lot of Christians would use with relation to Halloween, that just because they are having fun at Halloween doesn't mean they are worshiping Pagan rituals or gods.

Dizzyblonde

I'm a Christian and I wouldn't say I 'celebrate' Hallowe'en - but I always dressed my children up and brought them from house to house - for the fun of it and nothing else!!
They were delighted to be out in the dark, and getting treats from all the neighbours. It was a fun thing to do.
For Christians who do 'celebrate' it, isn't the clue in the name?? Hallowe'en - as I was taught by the Sisters of the Society of St. Vincent de Paul, is the Eve of the Feast of All Saints which is the 1st of November. As with most Christian Feasts, it got muddled with a pagan celebration and ended up on the same day.
As far as Satan and his evil works are concerned, I'd be more worried about the gurriers drinking and causing mayhem - but they do that all the time.

Owen

I think RTDH sees most things as evil, and misguided, but there are those who think that Hallowe'en is actually quite the spiritual event. It bonds communities together in the spirit of giving, and sharing, and of course, bestowing happiness upon children.

Rev Hellfire

Perhaps rather than not participating in the Halloween activities, those people opposed to it should not darken their windows and not answser the door, but rather use this as a opportunity to witness for their faith?

Don't some people use this as an opportunity to say give out pamphlets such as chick tracks and other pamplets with and/or in place of candy. I would imagine that those who feel strongly about the possibility of Satan's influence in this event are beholden to just not avoid it but to actively attempt to confront it ?

Zombrex

Rev Hellfire wrote: »

Don't some people use this as an opportunity to say give out pamphlets such as chick tracks and other pamplets with and/or in place of candy.

I just like to say I love Jack Chick

hairyheretic

Wicknight wrote: »

And before you say "That is ridiculous, just because I call the day Tuesday doesn't mean I'm glorifying Thor or Mars" that would be the point that a lot of Christians would use with relation to Halloween, that just because they are having fun at Halloween doesn't mean they are worshiping Pagan rituals or gods.

Tuesday is Tyr (Tiw in the Anglo-Saxon version)
Thor got Thursday

Wicknight wrote: »

I just like to say I love Jack Chick

I know, they're hilarious. The 'Dark Dungeons' one has been leaving roleplayers in stitches for years now.

faceman

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Christians should not partake at all in these festivals. Satan desires to keep people from the truth. The devil knows that people will not accept him as he is in true color. So the devil has to deceive people by presenting a lie, wrapped in a truth. If a criminal makes counterfeit money, he does not use a crayon. Rather, he uses the best equipment he can afford to make the counterfeit money look as genuine as possible. He has to or no one would accept his fake money. In the same way, Satan has to make his filthy lies and heresy look like it's really the truth, likewise he tries to make all these ancient pagan holidays appear to be "Christian holidays".

im sorry but thats the greatest load of codswollop i have ever read. The bible was written in 70AD. Its now 2007. Christians have abandoned all that nonsense.

I dont know about your family, but at halloween in mine, we dont turn the crucifixes upside down, play with a Ouija board and listening to led zepplin backwards.

Son Goku wrote: »

Maybe it's a day of evil and paganism,..............

......or it's a day when kids dress up, eat some sweets, watch fireworks and have fun with their friends.


Seriously lads, it used to be a pagan day, now it's just a holiday for kids.

Son Goku sums it up best.

Run_to_da_hill, since you are on the pagan buzz. I presume you dont erect a christmas tree and directions at christmas in your house? The tree is a very pagan tradition.

bonkey

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Samhain, Lord of the Dead.

Could you supply references to where you got this from?

Outside of a Gostbusters cartoon episode, I've never seen an allegation that Samhain was "Lord of the Dead" or indeed a "Lord" of any description....so I'm genuinely interested.

Zombrex

hairyheretic wrote: »

Tuesday is Tyr (Tiw in the Anglo-Saxon version)
Thor got Thursday

You mean I've been worshiping the wrong pagan god! :eek:

man that ain't good, those guys get mighty pissed off ...

Zombrex

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

The night before the new year, they celebrated the festival of Samhain, Lord of the Dead.

Er, as bonkey asked, where are you getting that from?

Samhain is derived from the Old Irish samfuin, which literally means "summers sunset", "sam" meaning summer and "fuin" meaning sunset or simply end.

The festival of Samhain was a celebration at the end of the summer session. I've never heard of it referring to the name of a god, not least a god of death.

hairyheretic

Wicknight wrote: »

You mean I've been worshiping the wrong pagan god! :eek:

Nah, just getting the days mixed up is all. They're both part of the one pantheon.

Wicknight wrote: »

man that ain't good, those guys get mighty pissed off ...

Not that I've noticed. Buy them a pint next time you're in the pub and it'll all be good.

Scofflaw

Wicknight wrote: »

I just like to say I love Jack Chick

I hadn't seen that one before! It's special, but then all of Chick's tracts are.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Son Goku

JimiTime wrote: »

Firstly, ....... I don't see it so innocent.

Okay, maybe this is something which might be difficult for you to get across. Do you think a certain pagan god is currently being worshipped on Halloween?
Above you said:
He told his people not to indulge in the practices of the nations, this would include their rituals honouring false gods.
This makes sense. However if no gods are worshipped on Halloween, what makes it bad? Currently all it is is a day of celebration that has its date in common with an old festival, that wasn't even about worshipping gods, but mainly celebrated the end of the harvest.

In fact a more direct question. Of all the things that are done on Halloween
Pumpkins, brambrack, dunking for apples, fireworks, going door to door e.t.c.
The only things of pagan origin are the bonfire and the dressing up. If people didn't dress up and didn't have bonfires, would it be okay?

JimiTime wrote: »

OK, as a christian, what other things would i have to avoid? Remember, its not things that were invented by pagans, but rituals that glorify Gods. so football and that is not relevant. just in case like wicknight, you don't grasp it.

Which god did Halloween glorify?

coffee_cake

Rev Hellfir wrote:

Don't some people use this as an opportunity to say give out pamphlets such as chick tracks and other pamplets with and/or in place of candy.

lol.
That one's brilliant
Maybe that's where rtdh got his "samhain = lord of death" rubbish

BrianCalgary

Wicknight wrote: »

Er, as bonkey asked, where are you getting that from?

Samhain is derived from the Old Irish samfuin, which literally means "summers sunset", "sam" meaning summer and "fuin" meaning sunset or simply end.

The festival of Samhain was a celebration at the end of the summer session. I've never heard of it referring to the name of a god, not least a god of death.

Thanks for that wicknight.

I think the problem comes about because of the style of celebration by pagan communities around samhian. It then became a time to seek protection form the pagan gods.

And that is th ewhole point that I am trying to make. If you wish to focus on pagan gods and participate in pagan worship on this day, then you are going against God.

If however you can somehow Christ centre it, then that is good because Christ is the centre.

Then there is option three which is let the kids get dressed up, go out with their friends and get free candy from kindly neighbours.

As kids we used to walk around with UNICEF boxes while trick-or-treating and a lot of money has been raised over the years for UNICEF. Positive to me.

Owen

BrianCalgary wrote: »

As kids we used to walk around with UNICEF boxes while trick-or-treating and a lot of money has been raised over the years for UNICEF. Positive to me.

Now THERE's a good idea! I'm a UNICEF supporter also, and I think this would be a great idea if kids got some sweets door to door, but they also raised money for less fortunate kids too.

Asiaprod

BrianCalgary wrote: »

Then there is option three which is let the kids get dressed up, go out with their friends and get free candy from kindly neighbours.

My position, let the kids be kids.

Run_to_da_hills

ned78 wrote: »

I think RTDH sees most things as evil, and misguided, but there are those who think that Hallowe'en is actually quite the spiritual event. It bonds communities together in the spirit of giving, and sharing, and of course, bestowing happiness upon children.

Many churches and Christian homes organise alternateive kids partys than sending their kids out for trick or treat on Halloween, organising games and fancy dress but leaving out the skulls, devil and witch costumes.

JimiTime

Son Goku wrote: »

Okay, maybe this is something which might be difficult for you to get across. Do you think a certain pagan god is currently being worshipped on Halloween?

In most quarters, no. Just like X-mas and Easter. However, Christians are indulging in Pagan rites, just not calling it a pagan rite. If Ireland was pagan still, and X-mas was still called Saturnalia. Would you see any issue with a christian indulging in all the ritual, just rebranding it? I do.

Above you said:
He told his people not to indulge in the practices of the nations, this would include their rituals honouring false gods.
This makes sense. However if no gods are worshipped on Halloween, what makes it bad?

Its a pagan ritual to honour the dead. If in the middle of August a trditional kids day was planed where they were dressed up and went around lookin for sweets, no bother. But its not. Pagans may be a very small minority, but we are sharing 'their' ritual. What about Christians celebrating Ramadan? or Eid? Just because you don't believe in it, does not mean that taking part in it is not wrong.

Currently all it is is a day of celebration that has its date in common with an old festival, that wasn't even about worshipping gods, but mainly celebrated the end of the harvest.

The Origin of Halloween
While there are many versions of the origins and old customs of Halloween, some remain consistent by all accounts. Different cultures view Holloween somewhat differently but traditional Halloween practices remain the same.
Halloween culture can be traced back to the Druids, a Celtic culture in Ireland, Britain and Northern Europe. Roots lay in the feast of Samhain, which was annually on October 31st to honor the dead.
Samhain signifies "summers end" or November. Samhain was a harvest festival with huge sacred bonfires, marking the end of the Celtic year and beginning of a new one. Many of the practices involved in this celebration were fed on superstition.
The Celts believed the souls of the dead roamed the streets and villages at night. Since not all spirits were thought to be friendly, gifts and treats were left out to pacify the evil and ensure next years crops would be plentiful. This custom evolved into trick-or-treating.

In fact a more direct question. Of all the things that are done on Halloween
Pumpkins, brambrack, dunking for apples, fireworks, going door to door e.t.c.
The only things of pagan origin are the bonfire and the dressing up. If people didn't dress up and didn't have bonfires, would it be okay?
Which god did Halloween glorify?

It was occult, not a god. Dead roaming the earth, evil spirits etc. Those activities you mentioned are all fine on their own. Its the context of which they are carried out.

TBH, i 'can' see your point, but I do think its a matter of concience. I don't think its unreasonable to feel that such practices are not very pleasing to God. Who calls himself 'A Jealous God'. Who has also shown his disdain for pagan practice. i'd never say one is doomed to hell and all that rhetoric, for doing it, but i would question it being practiced as a christian.

JimiTime

Wicknight wrote: »

Well the days of the week for a start, since they are named after Pagan gods

In fact the early Christians had great problem using the names of the week that we use, and turned to a numerical system that later influenced the names of the week in languages such as Portuguese.

And before you say "That is ridiculous, just because I call the day Tuesday doesn't mean I'm glorifying Thor or Mars" that would be the point that a lot of Christians would use with relation to Halloween, that just because they are having fun at Halloween doesn't mean they are worshiping Pagan rituals or gods.

If every 'Thors-Day' everyone painted lightening on their face and carried round a hammer, You'd have a point. While its unfortunate that all the days and months are named after false Gods thanks to our Pagan conquerers, they do not involve rituals dedicated to them. i would prefer if they went by other names, but if i was to invke such a thing, well, people would not know what I was talking about. As there is no ritual attached, i would see it as just part of the language.

Even the word 'unfortunate', which i have used above, has its rootings in the pagan belief in luck etc. However, it has become part of our language for expressing something lamentable.

coffee_cake

JimiTime wrote: »

I don't think its unreasonable to feel that such practices are not very pleasing to God. Who calls himself 'A Jealous God'.

He's omnipotent, why would he be so insecure
Personally if I made some toy soldiers and got jealous of them, I'd start to wonder...

*Page*

I dont celibrate Halloween... in my eyes its a christian holiday, I celibrate Samhain...

Stop stealing other Faiths Celibrations...


The word comes from medieval England's All Hallows' eve (Old Eng. hallow="saint"). However, many of these customs predate Christianity, going back to Celtic practices associated with Nov. 1, which was Samhain, the beginning of winter and the Celtic new year. Witches and other evil spirits were believed to roam the earth on this evening, playing tricks on human beings to mark the season of diminishing sunlight. Bonfires were lit, offerings were made of dainty foods and sweets, and people would disguise themselves as one of the roaming spirits, to avoid demonic persecution. Survivals of these early practices can be found in countries of Celtic influence today, such as the United States where children go from door to door in costumes demanding "trick or treat


The term Halloween (and its older rendering Hallowe'en) is shortened from All-hallow-even, as it is the evening of/before "All Hallows' Day", also known as "All Saints' Day". It was a day of religious festivities in various northern European Pagan traditions, until Popes Gregory III and Gregory IV moved the old Christian feast of All Saints' Day from May 13 to November 1. In the ninth century, the Church measured the day as starting at sunset, in accordance with the Florentine calendar. Although we now consider All Saints' (or Hallows') Day to occur one day after Halloween, the two holidays were, at that time, celebrated on the same day. Liturgically, the Church traditionally celebrated that day as the Vigil of All Saints, and, until 1970, a day of fasting as well. Like other vigils, it was celebrated on the previous day if it fell on a Sunday, although secular celebrations of the holiday remained on the 31st. The Vigil was suppressed in 1955, but was later restored in the post-Vatican II calendar.

Zombrex

JimiTime wrote: »

If every 'Thors-Day' everyone painted lightening on their face and carried round a hammer, You'd have a point.

So glorifying a pagan god is what you decide is glorifying a pagan god?

How convenient :rolleyes:

JimiTime wrote: »

While its unfortunate that all the days and months are named after false Gods thanks to our Pagan conquerers, they do not involve rituals dedicated to them.

Neither does Halloween, but you don't mind saying that it is evil. People who go out trick or treating aren't glorying pagan gods (that isn't even supposed to be what the festivial was about), any more than you are when you say "Tuesday"

You don't really believe that it is "Tyn's day", any more than the kids believe in witches and ghosts.