Planning issues - post them here MOD WARNING post #1

Villain

Not sure if its of any use but here is my site map which got planning on .75 acre actually I think that drawing map be .8

plasto

do i need ppm for a self contained one bedroom home at the back of my garden? It will be less than 40spm and is only one story high. i live in a three bed semi-detached house in a built up area (houses all around me).

sydthebeat

yes.

the 40 sq m exemption only applies to domestic garages / sheds.

plus, its highly unlikely you will get permission for such a development unless there is a well established percedent in the immediate area, which i doubt.

plasto

Thanks syd,

the bloke behind me built one about three years ago.....not sure if he got planning for it. what if it was a granny flat? whats the difference between it being a shed or a house, do i need permission for the building or for someone to live in the building?

muffler

plasto wrote: »

Thanks syd,

the bloke behind me built one about three years ago.....not sure if he got planning for it. what if it was a granny flat? whats the difference between it being a shed or a house, do i need permission for the building or for someone to live in the building?

Sydthebeat has summed it up nicely. You do need permission for that proposal.

I dont think you need to be a rocket scientist to work out the difference between a shed and a house. A granny flat is still a house (self contained apartment or whatever you want to call it) at the end of the day.

Your neigbour may or may not have permission for his development. Without knowing the area and the circumstances its unfair to comment but its not usually allowed. And even if he had permission it would not necessarily mean that you would get permission for the same proposal but it would be a help though.

plasto

muffler wrote: »

Sydthebeat has summed it up nicely. You do need permission for that proposal.

I dont think you need to be a rocket scientist to work out the difference between a shed and a house. A granny flat is still a house (self contained apartment or whatever you want to call it) at the end of the day.

Your neigbour may or may not have permission for his development. Without knowing the area and the circumstances its unfair to comment but its not usually allowed. And even if he had permission it would not necessarily mean that you would get permission for the same proposal but it would be a help though.

Thanks for your advice. I had visions of collecting a healthy rent every month.

Ah well, there's one born everyday.......back to the drawing board!!!:rolleyes:

muffler

plasto wrote: »

Thanks for your advice. I had visions of collecting a healthy rent every month.

Ah well, there's one born everyday.......back to the drawing board!!!:rolleyes:

You could always go to your local planning dept. and have a look through their map register (or online if its available) and identify other planning applications in the immediate area and see if any were for self contained units/houses. If there were a couple granted for proposals similar to yours there would be, as has been pointed out, an established precedent which could be helpful.

Dont give up without exploring all options first.

DJKAV

hello need help please i`m buying an old cottage with four bedrooms on 1acre but i need to gut it and also build an extention and get the roof re done . i haven`t a clue where to start and if i want to build another two three rooms can i ? or do i have to live in it first ... i`m new to this ... help please ..

basically what i want to do is build at the back of the cottage and extend it but i don`t know how much i can build or how high?

kind regards ..
p.

sydthebeat

basically you can extend to the rear of the cottage with 40sq m of an extension assuming the cottage hasnt been extended since 1964.
Simplifying matters, you cant go above the existing ridge and you should maintain the existing eaves level as well, which is easily done. 40 sq m is approx 420 sq ft which is a large area (15 x 28 etc).... you need to figure out what accommodation you want to end up with (or need!!) in order to determine how much of an extension is required.

On a job like this you really should engage a professional for advice. You should get the structure surveyed and measured, and get different options on extending. A simple T shaped or L shaped extension is usually most economical and easiest build, but other options are open depending on your budget etc.
The most important thing is to have a clear, concise, pre-determined brief ready for the professional when you meet them.

muffler

DJKAV wrote: »

hello need help please i`m buying an old cottage with four bedrooms on 1acre but i need to gut it and also build an extention and get the roof re done . i haven`t a clue where to start and if i want to build another two three rooms can i ? or do i have to live in it first ... i`m new to this ... help please ..

basically what i want to do is build at the back of the cottage and extend it but i don`t know how much i can build or how high?

kind regards ..
p.

This leaflet will help. You may also need to check with the local planning office to make sure the cottage isnt a listed building or located in a designated special area of conservation etc.

As advised get a bit of professional advice locally.

niamh1975

Hi,

My husband and I are currently applying for PP in Co. Donegal. We have been advised that the NRA are objecting as our site is on a national road where the maximum permitted speed limit applies and that basicaly we will be bringing more traffic onto an already busy road. My entire extended family live here, parents, siblings, aunts & uncles etc. Can we use this as an arguement? Our children attend the local national school for the area also. The NRA have stated that they will appeal to An Bord Pleanala if the decision goes in our favour. Anyone have any ideas?

muffler

niamh1975 wrote: »

Hi,

My husband and I are currently applying for PP in Co. Donegal. We have been advised that the NRA are objecting as our site is on a national road where the maximum permitted speed limit applies and that basicaly we will be bringing more traffic onto an already busy road. My entire extended family live here, parents, siblings, aunts & uncles etc. Can we use this as an arguement? Our children attend the local national school for the area also. The NRA have stated that they will appeal to An Bord Pleanala if the decision goes in our favour. Anyone have any ideas?

Unless your family have a farm and which has no other access on to a regional or county road you wont get planning and that is subject to achieving the necessary vision lines. The NRA will most likely appeal a favourable decision but its down to individual cases.

The councils own development plan prevents them from granting permission other than in the circumstances mentioned above.

niamh1975

Ok thanks Muffler, looks like we are onto a loser here. Back to the drawing board...

muffler

niamh1975 wrote: »

Ok thanks Muffler, looks like we are onto a loser here. Back to the drawing board...

Dont give up without a fight though.

ballivor cobber

I heard recently that if you build without applying for planning permission and the building survives for seven years without complaints that retention should be automatically approved. Does anyone know about this?

smashey

ballivor cobber wrote: »

I heard recently that if you build without applying for planning permission and the building survives for seven years without complaints that retention should be automatically approved. Does anyone know about this?

I have deleted your other post as once is usually enough.

Why do you want clarification on this?

Jimbo

muffler wrote: »

You could always go to your local planning dept. and have a look through their map register (or online if its available) and identify other planning applications in the immediate area and see if any were for self contained units/houses. If there were a couple granted for proposals similar to yours there would be, as has been pointed out, an established precedent which could be helpful.

Dont give up without exploring all options first.

It would also need to be at least 45 sq/m (for one bed) according to new guidelines for apartments: DOE Apartment Design Standards << on last page

Mellor

jimbo78 wrote: »

It would also need to be at least 45 sq/m (for one bed) according to new guidelines for apartments: DOE Apartment Design Standards << on last page

The above refers only to apartments. The minimum area for houses are lightly different. They are available online, the full list is more comprehensive.
Single story houses have a lower limit that similar apartments, two story houses are above the appartment limit. Its minor, be its good idea to have complete info up incase it matters to someone.

creme egg

Hi all,
This is very much pie in the sky at the moment but...
We are strongly thinking of buying a site close to Dunlavin. Some of our family live there (2 brothers) one only built there recently.
We want to buy the site before we start the planning application, as we will get it cheaper than going down the subject to planning route

From reading this thread I gather I might as well stand on Grafton street and give the money away, rather than have any hope of being granted planning permission. Is there any advise anyone would have, or anything we can do that might make our case stronger?

I am thinking we will be refused outright as we are not from the area, so not Local Needs.
Thanks creme egg

smashey

creme egg wrote: »

I am thinking we will be refused outright as we are not from the area, so not Local Needs.
Thanks creme egg

Are you going to work in the area?

creme egg

well I think when the time comes, I will probably be looking after my brothers children (who will live a few minutes away from me). My Husband will be working in another county.

smashey

You have to show roots in an area. Exceptions can be made for somebody moving for work.

Villain

Buying a site without planning is very risky if you get refused planning and can't sell it to someone else who will get planning its worth about €20,000 an acre!

sydthebeat

no proper solicior would allow a client to purchase a site without planning, unless they were specifically purchasing agricultural land. Most transactions and made 'subject to planning approval'.

i would advise the poster to read the rural housing guidelines, read the appropriate sections of the county development plan, get as much information as possible together to support the housing need and have a preplanning meeting with the area planner, put all cards on the table and draw an answer out of him / her as to compliance with housing need requirements.

creme egg

Thanks for the advise all. I will have a much better look into this now.

muffler

sydthebeat wrote: »

no proper solicior would allow a client to purchase a site without planning, unless they were specifically purchasing agricultural land. Most transactions and made 'subject to planning approval'.

i would advise the poster to read the rural housing guidelines, read the appropriate sections of the county development plan, get as much information as possible together to support the housing need and have a preplanning meeting with the area planner, put all cards on the table and draw an answer out of him / her as to compliance with housing need requirements.

Saves me the bother of typing all that. Thats it summed up.

ballivor cobber

smashey wrote: »

I have deleted your other post as once is usually enough.

Why do you want clarification on this?

My cousin in Co Clare has built a small house in a remote spot 8 years ago and they didn't apply for planning at the time and have not had any problems from neighbours etc so far, but are thinking of moving on and are thinking of applying for retention.

Villain

Rentention is very expensive now compared to years ago

sydthebeat

ballivor cobber wrote: »

My cousin in Co Clare has built a small house in a remote spot 8 years ago and they didn't apply for planning at the time and have not had any problems from neighbours etc so far, but are thinking of moving on and are thinking of applying for retention.

they could very easily be in a legal quagmire here.

In order to sell purchasers solicitors will require certificate of compliance with planning permission. Since none exists, retention is required. There is a real chance retention may be refused, but since the dwelling has existed in excess of 7 years it cannot be requested to be taken down...(i am certainly open to be corrected on this).....
Therefore, no planning, no cert, no sale..........

ballivor cobber

Mellor wrote: »

You are right on the 7 year issue, but I don't think its a case that they just can't be asked to take it down, rather that they will receive retention automatically.
It should be too hard to find the exact wording of it, the statute of limitations of retention/planning

Do you mean that they will be safe from demolition threats AND they can automatically get retention?