The uselessness of the gardai

kwalsh000

humanji wrote:

I like the way you cleverly ignored his question.

I noticed this too Humanji...so \m/_(>_<)_\m/ what are you doing to help solve all these problems? Go dare i say it.....join the force or reserves if you are that concerned about the problems. Oh and what about a solution to all these problems you keep bringing up..or do you just want to stir up a garda bashing thread. Its all well and good saying this and that about them but if you dont have anything useful to add..smilies dont count as answers.

Oh and yes there are good and bad Gardai, some bad because they are pr*cks and some bad because they just cant cope with the job and loose interest. Then again there are a hell of alot of good and great Gardai and you dont see every one of them, just the regular unit mainly. So unless you have some inside knowledge into the workings of specialist units in the Gardai you can not say all Gardai do is go after the small time.

But lets for the sake of argument say that they focused on big time criminals and stopped checkpoints for drink drivers etc and the drink drinking related accidents went up then everyone would be up in arms about it. Simple fact it..with the number of people they have they are doing the best they could, granted they could stand to be better but until the numbers rise it will stay a hard job. Its not the Gardai's fault society is messed up so go blame someone else.

Cuddlesworth

Bambi wrote:

really, and is that theory backed up by anything other than assumption? I'm from ballymun and i can't say i ever saw a garda car, fire brigade or ambulance being stoned. Saw a maria nearly hit with a tin of emulsion but that was it. The reason that they dont show up because the higher ranks in the gardai have different standards of what is an acceptable level of anti social behaviour in an area. Ballymun gardai station is only an outpost of santry with a small number of gardai for a large population. Some of 'em are decent types struggling against the odds and some of 'em are complete **** in my experience.

I know this is a bit off topic, but where in hell do you live in Ballymun? I worked on 4 different sites in Ballymun over 1 and a half years, 1 year ago I quit.

I saw

-Mothers and Fathers beating their kids to a pulp in the street

-Bottles thrown at passing cars, police riot vans hit with bricks from the flats(that were half empty at that stage), fire brigade truck sitting outside a estate for 15 minutes while waiting for a police backup. Bottles & stones thrown at me while I worked.

-Stolen car nearly knocking me over, then crashing into one of my walls(that my lads built), 2 drunk wasters getting out walking 40 feet away to their mates and sitting down without a bother after a hour long rampage of rallying and crashing into lamposts etc. Not a single resident had anything to say. I pointed the **** out and had them both arrested. They got out the same day as they were underage.

-Constant car thefts & car breakin's & car vandilism during the middle of the day in plain sight.

-Youths keeping a collection of Stolen motorbikes in the bottom of the flats/gardens to rally around drunk with during the late afternoon(most dont get up till 2 or 3).

This was me working 9-5(9-3 on Friday after the first week, boss felt it was safer). Now 98% of the people I met were lovely, and I got on great with them. But please don't lie and say you have never seen anything anti-social going on, because you must have blinders on or you are so dis-enchated with society that you don't see it as wrong.

The gardai take their time in Ballymun because the same people are doing the same things and they must have gotten really disillusioned a long time ago. On the other hand a crime in foxrock will mean thats its a pro theif or a stupid one, either way its in the gardais interest to find them.

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

kwalsh000 wrote:

so \m/_(>_<)_\m/ what are you doing to help solve all these problems? Go dare i say it.....join the force or reserves if you are that concerned about the problems.

do you really think the problems in the force can be cleaned up by one individual joining the reserves... Oh My God. that comment is more deluded that the people who think the guards cant be improved upon.

the problems have to be fix from the top down,

kwalsh000

I never said one person can fix all the problems did i? I just said if you are that concerned then do something dont be posting on an internet forum. If everyone thought ''one person wont make a difference by joining'' then there wud be alot less in the force now. Or maybe even target the kids while they are young to prevent them gorwing up with the wrong attidude and being anti social..and one or a few people can help in that way. My point is..stop blaming the Gardai for everything thats wrong with society and get off your high horse in relation to putting them down when you do not know what their job entails. Blame the government if you want, but dont blame the regular Gardai out there doing their job

event

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

RTE or most newspapers would carry those news stories every week.

no, i want them to be shown here

if you try and make a point like that, you should be able to back them up with links

where are they?

kwalsh000

Also u have yet to offer any seful solution \m/_(>_<)_\m/..just constant disagreement and use to smilies trying to make your comments seem smart

_Kaiser_

event wrote:

can you give us links on that?

Ah.. the resort of an internet poster who'd prefer to bury his/her head in the sand than face the facts that there is a problem. :rolleyes:

But ok.. Google the events in Donegal, or the May Day riots, or the recent alleged child abuse stories involving a probationer Garda, or just the countless stories reported by other Boards users all over this site (I suppose we're all lying/have grudges, right?)

Read what I said.. I didn't say ALL Gardai are corrupt, egotistical and incompetent, but there IS a significant element that DO fit this description, and pretending otherwise won't solve anything.

event

Kaiser2000 wrote:

Ah.. the resort of an internet poster who'd prefer to bury his/her head in the sand than face the facts that there is a problem. :rolleyes:

But ok.. Google the events in Donegal, or the May Day riots, or the recent alleged child abuse stories involving a probationer Garda, or just the countless stories reported by other Boards users all over this site (I suppose we're all lying/have grudges, right?)

Read what I said.. I didn't say ALL Gardai are corrupt, egotistical and incompetent, but there IS a significant element that DO fit this description, and pretending otherwise won't solve anything.

what you said was

'that has been proven on many occasions in recent times to be corrupt and incompetent.. it seems like they can't go a week without being embroiled in some new scandal or other'

you have given 3 cases, spanned over what, 3 years?

so they havent been embroiled in a scandal every week

im not sticking my head in the sand at all, i know they arent perfect

but to say a significant amount?

i dont think so

lennox1

Every job has employees who are not as effective as others and anyone who thinks the Gardai are worse than others are deluding themselves.In my opinion,the reason they are more crucified than others is because so many people have their own agenda when it comes to the Gardai.Having had many positive and yes,some negative experiences with the Gardai,I have found them on the whole to be more professional than some other professions which are not under the same level of scrutiny,and perhaps should be.Theirs is a very tough job and I for one support them.

_Kaiser_

Here's a recent story for you, event:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/0330/garda.html

He's apparently in charge of a Traffic Corps division as well according to this thread in Motors - gotta love the irony I suppose!!

Lets see you defend that one :rolleyes:

event

Kaiser2000 wrote:

Here's a recent story for you, event:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/0330/garda.html

He's apparently in charge of a Traffic Corps division as well according to this thread in Motors - gotta love the irony I suppose!!

Lets see you defend that one :rolleyes:

sorry, where did i say i defended them?

'that has been proven on many occasions in recent times to be corrupt and incompetent.. it seems like they can't go a week without being embroiled in some new scandal or other'

thats what you said, i said it was untrue

so you said it has been proven on many occasions to be corrupt and incompetent.

you have around 4 examples, over a few years.

so, about 6 gardai have been found guily of above(though only about 3 convicted) out of 12,265 members.

Oh yes, you showed me right up. Well done, you should have been a guard yourself

:rolleyes:

(see, i can do that little emoticon too)

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

event wrote:

no, i want them to be shown here

if you try and make a point like that, you should be able to back them up with links

where are they?

did ya read any of the papers over the weekend, watch the news?

Dyr

krazy_8s wrote:

I know this is a bit off topic, but where in hell do you live in Ballymun? I worked on 4 different sites in Ballymun over 1 and a half years, 1 year ago I quit.

I saw

-Mothers and Fathers beating their kids to a pulp in the street

-Bottles thrown at passing cars, police riot vans hit with bricks from the flats(that were half empty at that stage), fire brigade truck sitting outside a estate for 15 minutes while waiting for a police backup. Bottles & stones thrown at me while I worked.

-Stolen car nearly knocking me over, then crashing into one of my walls(that my lads built), 2 drunk wasters getting out walking 40 feet away to their mates and sitting down without a bother after a hour long rampage of rallying and crashing into lamposts etc. Not a single resident had anything to say. I pointed the **** out and had them both arrested. They got out the same day as they were underage.

-Constant car thefts & car breakin's & car vandilism during the middle of the day in plain sight.

-Youths keeping a collection of Stolen motorbikes in the bottom of the flats/gardens to rally around drunk with during the late afternoon(most dont get up till 2 or 3).

This was me working 9-5(9-3 on Friday after the first week, boss felt it was safer). Now 98% of the people I met were lovely, and I got on great with them. But please don't lie and say you have never seen anything anti-social going on, because you must have blinders on or you are so dis-enchated with society that you don't see it as wrong.

The gardai take their time in Ballymun because the same people are doing the same things and they must have gotten really disillusioned a long time ago. On the other hand a crime in foxrock will mean thats its a pro theif or a stupid one, either way its in the gardais interest to find them.

oh oh oh this ones for me! i've lived there all me life, grew up there during the eighties when things were proper hardcore. Never said anti social things dont happen I just said i never say a squad car being bricked. The gardai are one of the main reasons area's like that degenerate into f****ng kips, so its a bit rich of them to use that as an excuse to not do their jobs.

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

all very quite, in the face of the recent reports...

predictaball:D

event

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

did ya read any of the papers over the weekend, watch the news?

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

event wrote:

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

you would of been better off pretending not to have visited this thread today.:D

now we know you did, and are stuck for words....
to be fair, so would i be in your situation

humanji

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

you would of been better off pretending not to have visited this thread today.:D

now we know you did, and are stuck for words....
to be fair, so would i be in your situation

You mean just like the other thread that you stomped off in a huff over because you didn't get your way?

event

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

you would of been better off pretending not to have visited this thread today.:D

now we know you did, and are stuck for words....
to be fair, so would i be in your situation

sorry, i was just posting what you usually do

you wanna read my post directly above your one?

the one about 4 cases over the past few years?

that proves your point exactly, well done.

So we have a guard who drove while drunk, thus proving the uselessness of ALL 12,265 gardai?

my god, ill leave now then

i would heve been better off not coming into this thread?

i think you would have been better off never posting here

and the reason you'd be stuck for words, is that you come across as a 7 year old

kwalsh000

''\m/_(>_<)_\m/
all very quite, in the face of the recent reports...''

Well..if you look back, everyone replied..except you..it took you that long to come up with a simple reply like that.

So what about that superintendent, he was drink driving on his own time..does it prove all Gardai are useless in their job?? Nope it does not, it just proves he did something stupid in his own time.

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

kwalsh000 wrote:

''\m/_(>_<)_\m/

So what about that superintendent, he was drink driving on his own time..

oh i love the way you make it sound so innocent, poor ould fella. I almost feel sorry for him now.:D :rolleyes:

event

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

oh i love the way you make it sound so innocent, poor ould fella. I almost feel sorry for him now.:D :rolleyes:

seriously, could you at least write a reply?

you are beginning to look silly from your posts, you have nothing to say except

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

\m/_(>_<)_\m/

event wrote:

seriously, could you at least write a reply?

you are beginning to look silly from your posts, you have nothing to say except

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

try as you may, i will not get into a personal slagging match with you, that just shows the type of person you are,
the thread title is specific enough for even the slowest of people to understand.
its not about you or me... its about the 'The uselessness of the gardai'.

so if you don't have anything to say on topic...

source

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

try as you may, i will not get into a personal slagging match with you, that just shows the type of person you are,
the thread title is specific enough for even the slowest of people to understand.
its not about you or me... its about the 'The uselessness of the gardai'.

so if you don't have anything to say on topic...

I know i said i wasn't going to post here again, But I've been following this thread and i must say, \m/_(>_<)_\m/ you really don't get it do you??? event is not trying to draw you into a personal slagging match, event is looking for you to substantiate your claims with evidence, none of us who are speaking on the side of the gardaí have claimed that it is a perfect force, what we are saying is that the problem is not as widespread as you are making it out to be.

There are a few people who have sullied the name of the gardaí, some absolute embarrassments to the force, who should have never gotten through templemore, no wait, they should have never gotten into templemore, but they did, and when they thought they were above the law and decided to break it they were caught.

I reckon that this reflects very well on the force as a whole, and reflects very well on those gardaí who are just out to do a good job and protect the general public.

You do not want a decent discussion, you seem to want everyone to chime in and put the gardaí down, that is not a proper debate.

event

foinse wrote:

I know i said i wasn't going to post here again, But I've been following this thread and i must say, \m/_(>_<)_\m/ you really don't get it do you??? event is not trying to draw you into a personal slagging match, event is looking for you to substantiate your claims with evidence, none of us who are speaking on the side of the gardaí have claimed that it is a perfect force, what we are saying is that the problem is not as widespread as you are making it out to be.

thank you

\m/_(>_<)_\m/ wrote:

try as you may, i will not get into a personal slagging match with you, that just shows the type of person you are,
the thread title is specific enough for even the slowest of people to understand.
its not about you or me... its about the 'The uselessness of the gardai'.

so if you don't have anything to say on topic...

i am not trying to get into a slanging match, wouldnt lower myself to that level

and if you want to talk about

'The uselessness of the gardai', please do

but you havent, i dont think you have posted anything of any real note in this thread, its all petty comments and :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

im asking if you would like to contribute to the thread, if not, may as well go and lock it

source

event wrote:

but you havent, i dont think you have posted anything of any real note in this thread, its all petty comments and :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

im asking if you would like to contribute to the thread, if not, may as well go and lock it

I asked for this 56 posts ago, and we're still on the non substantiated claims of bad policing...i don't think this thread is going anywhere constructive, prob is just best for it to be locked.

and no \m/_(>_<)_\m/ it's not because we can't put up a decent argument it because you can't, and i for one am sick and tired of reading your poorly constructed and inflamatory posts.

_Kaiser_

Oh alright.. to all those who are asking for evidence, here's a post I made in another thread last year (page 3 onwards)...

Oh ok then... *WARNING: LONG RANT*

As anyone who caught the PrimeTime special on anti-social behaviour a few months back will have seen, my mam lives in Coolock and has been the victim of a sustained campaign of harassment and intimidation by local scumbags for the past 18 years!! Not ONCE has ANYONE ever been charged or even questioned about it!

The local cops are by and large WORSE than these scumbags.. why?

EXAMPLE 1:
Junkie scumbag next door kicks the front door in one morning. Cops are called. Yer one is screaming in her driveway at him: "yea I f*ckin did it!!". Garda response: "I don't want to go down the road of charging her!" - and he didn't.

EXAMPLE 2:
Another neighbour starts banging on the front door one night with just my mam in the house. Rings the local staton..no response. She rings me - I'm in Cavan at the time with no way home - and I ring them.. as usual there's no inspector availanle (despite a legal requirement that every station must have a inspector or higher at all times!).

I then ring the district station. Get a guy whose initally very helpful and promises to see what's happening. He put the phone down (not on hold - his mistake!) and I can hear him LAUGHING about it on the phone with the lads in Coolock. Then he comes back to me with an attitude. After shouting at this P*ick I get his inspector on the phone who promises to send a car.

45 minutes later a van turns up and goes to said scumbag's house (as he's gone in at this stage thankfully). His girlfrien answers the door and says "yea he's sorry - he's in bed now" (admission of guilt btw!). Cops arrive at our door and refuse to even take him in for question saying "we don't want to get him out of his bed!"


EXAMPLE 3:
Having had the front of the house pelted with stones for about 20 mins, a garda sargeant tells me on the phone he's noone in the area. As he says this, 2 of his officers turn up - sent by the crowd we were ringing about in the first place.
I ask them to wait while I talk to their sargeant. THey don't! I ask the sargeant what they wanted and he tells me he doesn't know. I offer to hold while he finds out... "I've no way of contacting them" he says.
"Right then" I reply "so you've Guards driving around with no radio or mobile??" "Uh yea.." is his answer... not just lies but STUPID lies!!


EXAMPLE 4:
When scumbag in example #1's car is stolen, a Garda car shows up at the door within 5 minutes and her car is back in an hour!! THEN 2 cars AND a van show up to make sure she's happy (and one of the Guards is caught on our surveilence camera making the smart-assed remark "sure maybe Norma (my mam) got it on tape!").
When this same scumbag clipped my wing mirror 2 months ago after tearing up the road, leaning on the horn, and FAILING TO STOP (hit and run btw), the local cops refused to charge her despite the whole incident being captured on camera and a copy of the tape and statement being presented by me. Why? There's no evidence to show anything happened. A inspector down there remarked to my mam that I'd "wasted an hour of his time on a incident that didn't happen" - thus calling me a liar!!

The Gardai in this backwater half-assed country (and I take no pleasure in saying that) are rotten to the core from top to bottom with no independent oversight or accountability. It's the EXCEPTION rather than the rule that you meet a decent one!

Btw.. if any mods wish to verify any of this feel free to PM me..
To everyone else, sorry for the rant but thanks for reading this far!

I'd be VERY interested to see people try to explain that one to me??

Chucky the tree

Kaiser2000 wrote:

Oh alright.. to all those who are asking for evidence, here's a post I made in another thread last year (page 3 onwards)...



I'd be VERY interested to see people try to explain that one to me??

Hows that evidence? Any gob****e can post any random ****e on a message board. Hardly evidence now is it.

_Kaiser_

Chucky the tree wrote:

Hows that evidence? Any gob****e can post any random ****e on a message board. Hardly evidence now is it.

By that logic nothing that anyone has posted on this thread (in support of the gardai or against) has any validity. :rolleyes:

I suppose I could say that all the supporters of the Gardai in this thread must be members of the force or have relatives/partners/friends that are, but that's not necessarily true either is it?

Given that this IS a message board, there's really no way to prove anything is there, which only leaves the option of taking people's postings in good faith... however, I assume the Gardai log all these calls (just as we do) so maybe you can ask them.

EDIT: However, as has already been said, there's more than enough "evidence" printed/shown in our media to highlight that there IS a problem in the force and burying your head in the sand while attacking people who try to highlight this isn't gonna solve that.

humanji

Kaiser2000 wrote:

Oh alright.. to all those who are asking for evidence, here's a post I made in another thread last year (page 3 onwards)...



I'd be VERY interested to see people try to explain that one to me??

Actually, from reading that it gives the impression that your family has pissed off the guards somehow and they just don't give a f#ck about you.

I've had problems with scumbags and when the gardaì are called they arrive soon enough and aren't assholes about it. Your sweeping generalisation that they're all crooked is a bit much. I honestly can't say whether or not your making all that up, but assuming you're not, does that small group of guards from one area speak for all 12k gardaì around the country?

Deliverance

Lets face it one or two bad familys in an area are able to make life hell for a huge number of people. The only option for individuals is to complain about the familys in question. This leads to an extraordinary amount of harassment on the individuals who do complain as the incentive is generally pushed onto the individual by law to deal with the situation, this is a national learned 'scumbag' way of intimidating people because they know that they can get away with it.

The Guardai are equipped to deal with blatant public situations. In fairness to them I dialled a 999 call one night when I saw a guy outside my window being beaten by a gang one person had a hammer, it looked like a personal issue but all the same I felt it better to call it in fast to prevent a possible death, I figured call it in fast to avoid a tradgedy.

The guards got their in 5-7 mins, 5 of them got out of the car to deal with the gang of 5 thugs (the caller asked how many were involved) and looked ready to rumble.
The gang and the fight was over in 4 mins and the drunken fool under attack staggered off injured after several folks came out of their homes to deal with the attack. I have to say the guards did a good job in getting there quick with the intention of directly dealing with the situation.

I think there is a problem in the force in that they are not given enough back up from as was mentioned earlier (from the top down). And it is in general not fair to say that the employed guards and reserves are useless. I find it hard to think that any person joining the guards does so with a view to doing nothing to try and make a difference, as in any job if the lower ranks don't get support from above then dissilussionment follows for many.

The problem that is happening in Ireland today isn't down to the guards in general it is the learned 'scumbags' who realise that they can get away with just about anything, and the weak politics which are more based on electoral votes by shoving money and tax breaks down our throats.

This country has a big problem in this sense, the 'ASBO's' are a weak way of dealing with it, we need something more radical to send out a message to the 'scumbags' to put them in check I can't see that happening anytime soon.

Maybe we should take money out of the social welfare sector which these people live off and put into law enforcement and health and proper issues, proper areas of worth. Maybe then the 'scumbags' who obviously have to much time on their hands, would have to get a job and consequently get a life which doesn't include robbing, stealing and intimidating good folks.

Ps I and friends of mine have had dealings with 'bad' guards but only in a way which we got involved based on abuse of principles and rights for eg a friend of mine witnessed a guard beating an individual with a torch and my friend uninvolved in the initial fracas intervened and voiced his opinion, he was attacked by the guard and beaten with the torch my friend defended himself by pushing the guard away and ended up in court on an assault charge.

My friend barely got off without a record by having to admit guilt and being wrong even though he was not. The term 'scumbag' which I use freely is applicable in all walks of life, some guards and a lot of people rich or poor by my definition fall under the same category by action.

So to summarize I think that the guards need more cash and resources and support, the wasters who sit about and have money to waste their lives through none employment should be given less so that they have to work to buy their nike and booze to teach them the worth of money, though I think there will inevitably some victims of this course of action, Nike and cheap lager will suffer more though, as will unfortunately some innocents, as is happening anyway.

I have gone on to much and will call it at that, hopefully I have expressed an opinion which is as unbiased as possible. Cheers.