Are they cities at all?

unkel

fricatus wrote:

Typical Dublin hyperbole and completely inaccurate.

Lucan is bigger than maybe three out of the 10 other cities on the island (or bigger than one of the other five in the Republic). In fairness to you, the media (particularly RTE and the Indo) play up Dublin's size vis-a-vis the rest of the country so much, that it's not surprising you wrote what you did.

For example: the figure of 2 million that's always trotted out for Dublin by the media, when the population of the entire city and county of Dublin at the last census was 1,187,176. They're literally inventing 812,824 people!

These are the facts though:


http://www.cso.ie/census/documents/census2006_volume_1_pop_classified_by_area.pdf

On page 23:

Lucan-Esker 20,776
Lucan Heights 5,673
Lucan-St. Helen's 6,823
TOTAL 33,272


Republic of Ireland:

http://beyond2020.cso.ie/Census/TableViewer/tableView.aspx?ReportId=1770

Cork 190,384
Limerick 90,757
Galway 72,729
Waterford 49,213
Kilkenny 22,179


It's harder to find figures on Northern Ireland, but the cities appear to have the following approximate populations:

Armagh: 14,000
Belfast: 277,459 (580,000 Greater Belfast)
Derry: 84,000 (90,000 Greater Derry)
Lisburn: 71,000
Newry: 27,000

Steady on now mate :eek:

Looks like you got your figures from the wrong table or maybe you did not add them up properly?

Clearly from the CSO census 2006 figures you quote, Lucan has 50k inhabitants. About the same as Limerick City but more than Waterford City and Kilkenny City

And I'm not talking greater Lucan either. Not a single person in Adamstown has been taken into account in those CSO figures

Linkeh

nesf

unkel wrote:

Steady on now mate :eek:

Looks like you got your figures from the wrong table or maybe you did not add them up properly?

Clearly from the CSO census 2006 figures you quote, Lucan has 50k inhabitants. About the same as Limerick City but more than Waterford City and Kilkenny City

And I'm not talking greater Lucan either. Not a single person in Adamstown has been taken into account in those CSO figures

Linkeh

Where did you get 50K from? (I'm ignorant of the geography of the area and don't know if there's more to Lucan than the 3 areas above, I assume there is). Though you're right, fricatus quoted the 2002 figures anyway. It's 37K or so from those three areas at a glance. Oh, and if Limerick has 90K people and Lucan 50K how are they roughly similar?

unkel

nesf wrote:

Where did you get 50K from?

Lucan 49,845

I just copied and pasted that. That enough?

Edit: Open up the PDF, or open it as html. Either way, you can clearly see the point

nesf

unkel wrote:

Lucan 49,845

I just copied and pasted that. That enough?

Am just curious rather than being argumentative, i.e. what area is in Lucan a la the electoral register versus the three areas listed in the census?

1huge1

This guy unkel clearly doesn't know what he is talking about because if he did he would know that 50k in Limerick is the population for the city limits which cover less than half the city while the population is close to 100k or 90k as posted by fricatus

and according to wiki lucan has 37,622 which is a fair bit of limerick,galway or even waterfords population

gurramok

Fricatus is 100% correct on the figures.

Lucan ELECTORAL area has 50k, just so happens it includes Lucan itself and surrounding areas miles up the road like Palmerstown.

Compare ELECTORAL area stats with the ones for towns and its blatantly obvious that the town stats are accurate and not the ELECTORAL area ones for a particular headcount of a town.

mike65

The official borough figures don't stand up to scutiny regarding population. If the true populations of Cork Limerick and Waterford were shown on a map with a red outline all would look quiet different I'm sure.

Mike.

Victor

gurramok wrote:

Lucan ELECTORAL area has 50k, just so happens it includes Lucan itself and surrounding areas miles up the road like Palmerstown.

That version of Lucan is contrived, by the same measure Brittas is part of Tallaght.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1998/en/si/0347.html

Lucan
The electoral divisions of:. Lucan-Esker, Lucan Heights, Lucan-St. Helens, Palmerston Village and Palmerston West and that part of the electoral division of Clondalkin-Moorfield situated east of a line drawn along the M50 Western Parkway.

unkel

gurramok wrote:

Lucan ELECTORAL area has 50k, just so happens it includes Lucan itself and surrounding areas miles up the road like Palmerstown

Ah right! Apologies for misinterpreting the figures / quoting from the wrong tables

gurramok

unkel wrote:

Ah right! Apologies for misinterpreting the figures / quoting from the wrong tables

Don't worry though, in a few years there will be 50k with Adamstown pulling 'em in plus other developments in general Lucan area.

Victor

Map of areas

ninty9er

Looking at the CSO figures the 1st thing that struck me is there were more women than men filling in census forms!! unusual since the females have a higher life expectancy.

anyhow back on track. Kilkenny, if memory serves correct, is a medieval city and as such an honourary city.

I would imagine that our smaller cities are just that becuase they are the largest urban areas outside of the prime. It can't be expected that you run a country on 1 city and a number of large regional towns!

Waterford City will be underestimated with the Kilkenny boundary and Limerick City is boxed in by County Limerick and south Clare.

Limerick City doesn't house the 10,000 students of UL the county does. Therefore all the Waterford people complaining that they're the only city without a university can shut up assured that Limerick is in the same boat. Even LIT only 20 mins walk from the Limerick City Centre hinges on the City/County Boundary

At the same time this country is severely underpopulated by international standards, but we seem happy with this and we seem as a nation to be averse to high-rise living. So one would have to wonder where all the extra people would go if we were to make "legitimate" our cities

Victor

ninty9er wrote:

Waterford City will be underestimated with the Kilkenny boundary and Limerick City is boxed in by County Limerick and south Clare.

Re-read the whole thread - there are two sets of figures, including and excluding suburbs.

Bards

ninty9er wrote:

Limerick City doesn't house the 10,000 students of UL the county does. Therefore all the Waterford people complaining that they're the only city without a university can shut up assured that Limerick is in the same boat. Even LIT only 20 mins walk from the Limerick City Centre hinges on the City/County Boundary

Oh my GOD, can you imagine you have to go into County Limerick to go to University.. Oh the shame, the shame of it

Waterford City or County or the whole of the bleedin' South East region does not have a university so please do not use this absurd argument for why the S>E should not have a university:mad: :mad:

darkman2

I believe Tallaght has a bigger population then Cork;)

The GDA - Greater Dublin area has over 2 million people living in it. 10 times that of Cork and its surroundings.

Bards

darkman2 wrote:

I believe Tallaght has a bigger population then Cork;)

The GDA - Greater Dublin area has over 2 million people living in it. 10 times that of Cork and its surroundings.

The GDA is nearer to 1.5M

don't believe everything you read in the press

if it was 2m...that would be over 50% of the pop of the Whole country... explain thatand very soon the press will have you believe that the GDA encompasses the whole Island bringing the pop. over 4m

Victor

darkman2 wrote:

I believe Tallaght has a bigger population then Cork;) The GDA - Greater Dublin area has over 2 million people living in it. 10 times that of Cork and its surroundings.

Stop trolling.

Bards, give over the inferiority complex.

nesf

darkman2 wrote:

The GDA - Greater Dublin area has over 2 million people living in it. 10 times that of Cork and its surroundings.

Untrue, but close enough. The thing is, it's not really a good thing to cram half the population of this country (speaking very roughly) into one relatively small corner of it.

Bards

Victor wrote:

Stop trolling.

Bards, give over the inferiority complex.

not an inferiority complex at all. just stating facts for if Waterford & the S.E do not stand up for injustice we will be walked all over, as has happened in the recent past..

please explain why the S.E region has the most unemployment for a region that is closest to Europe.

darkman2

Victor wrote:

Stop trolling.

So we should not state fact in order not to offend Corkonians:rolleyes: Why they would get offended about population is beyond me.

nesf

darkman2 wrote:

So we should not state fact in order not to offend Corkonians:rolleyes: Why they would get offended about population is beyond me.

If you got your facts correct before posting it might actually help with the stating the fact part of your posts.

Victor

darkman2 wrote:

So we should not state fact in order not to offend Corkonians:rolleyes: Why they would get offended about population is beyond me.

I am only offended by the apples and oranges comparison. Please compare like with like.

darkman2

Yes but population is very important in deciding where strategic infrastructure is placed and so is very relevant. Oranges and apples or not.

nesf

darkman2 wrote:

Yes but population is very important in deciding where strategic infrastructure is placed and so is very relevant. Oranges and apples or not.

Population is one factor out of many. I'm really failing to see your point here. Are you suggesting that Tallaght should have the same amount of services as Cork city along with the services that are already present in Dublin itself?

darkman2

nesf wrote:

Population is one factor out of many. I'm really failing to see your point here. Are you suggesting that Tallaght should have the same amount of services as Cork city along with the services that are already present in Dublin itself?

No but I dont think Cork is big enough to sustain tram lines for example. Or Galway or Limerick for that matter. They should concentrate on 'boring' but efficient bus based transport as its befitting cities of that size. Promising Cork and Galway a luas for example is absurd. They litterally dont have the density to support that. A few motorways too and thats it - sorted. Whether its a bad thing or not the East coast has to have priorty and I dont think we are in a posistion now to waste public money on needless projects.

nesf

darkman2 wrote:

No but I dont think Cork is big enough to sustain tram lines for example. Or Galway or Limerick for that matter. They should concentrate on 'boring' but efficient bus based transport as its befitting cities of that size. Promising Cork and Galway a luas for example is absurd. They litterally dont have the density to support that. A few motorways too and thats it - sorted. Whether its a bad thing or not the East coast has to have priorty and I dont think we are in a posistion now to waste public money on needless projects.

Why don't you think Cork could sustain a tram system or are you just guessing? Have there been studies done on how much population/traffic is needed to make a tram system work?

mike65

Too many hills The only line could go up and down the Carrigrohane Straight

Mike.

Cork had a tram system before, but theres probably not enough space in the city for one anymore.

nesf

mike65 wrote:

Too many hills The only line could go up and down the Carrigrohane Straight

Yeah finding a place to put it would be the really big challenge. One of the more idiotic proposals involved filling in one of the channels of the Lee. Apart from the historic and geographical significance of the "island" and the river itself, they didn't seem to appreciate the volume of water that goes through there which wouldn't be insignificant to reroute without causing flooding issues etc.

nesf

Deleted User wrote:

Cork had a tram system before, but theres probably not enough space in the city for one anymore.

Most of the original route is used pretty heavily for traffic nowadays iirc.