Rural Drink Driving

Gregor Samsa

hawker wrote:

It's actually quite amusing seeing all the urbanites having a moan because the ruralites are getting something.

I live in a rural area in the West.

hawker wrote:

Will it directly affect the tax you pay each week?

Tax has to come from somewhere, so either that or something else doesn't get funded.

hawker wrote:

Did the taxpayer not pay for your Luas which makes daily life easier for the Dubs?

It's more than paying for itself (and paying back the tax investment) through fare revenue.

hawker wrote:

Why shouldn't the taxpayer pay for something that will make daily life easier for the ruralite?

You mean "Why shouldn't the taxpayer pay for something that will make profits easier for the publicans?".

:rolleyes:

event

layke wrote:

I live in Dublin. Where's my free bus home after work that i'm paying for?

As for the pubs being the heart and soul of a village? Well imo using that argument makes you sound like a bunch of alcoholics who need help to stop drinking.

FFS if I have to be the designated driver every so often so should you!

BTW, im not from a rural area

tax doesnt always pay for what we want, ok?

DeepBlue

MadsL wrote:

A new scheme to help rural pubs hit by stricter drink driving laws could be introduced in the next few months. Rural Affairs Minister Eamon O'Cuiv has said the Government will be introducing the measure before the next general election.

Anyone else outraged?

So the Minister announces a scheme (no doubt inspired by Victor ) whereby there will be improved public transport in rural areas in the evening and nighttime and it warrants outrage?
I guess it depends how you look at it.

Some advantages of the scheme:

1. Gives rural drinkers another option to ensure they can travel home from the pub safely and without breaking any drink driving laws.
2. Because of 1. pedestrians and other road users are safer as it will lessen the number of drivers on the road who have taken drink (whether or not they are under or over the legal limit) and thus will improve road safety for those road users. This will mean that lives will be saved.
3. Improves the social life of the rural community as the rural pub is the focus of that social life for many.
4. Relieves isolation of some people in rural communities who may otherwise have few alternative options to socialise.
5. Will cost a modest amount of money.
6. Will help publicans thus helping businesses survive and safeguard jobs and livelihoods.

Some disadvantages of the scheme:

1. Will help publicans .
2. Will cost a modest amount of money .

ninty9er

hawker wrote:

It's actually quite amusing seeing all the urbanites having a moan because the ruralites are getting something.

Moaning about the taxpayers paying for this new scheme. Will it directly affect the tax you pay each week?

Yes, but one of my friends in particular is teetotal, he doesn't drive and lives 8 miles from the City in a very, very isolated part of a village. so that means on a saturday night out with us:

1. He has to ring his parents at 2:30am to come and collect him
2. He has to queue for 1.5 hours for a taxi and pay €25
3. one of us who does drive doesn't drink either and gives him a lift home.

All 3 have been done and will continue to be done. He doesn't complain, it's the way things are.

I can walk home from town pissed it'll take about 15 mins more than usual because of the conversation and drunken laid-back attitude, I'll also walk to work the following morning if I've been heavy at it.

hawker wrote:

Did the taxpayer not pay for your Luas which makes daily life easier for the Dubs? Why shouldn't the taxpayer pay for something that will make daily life easier for the ruralite?

Believe it or not there is life beyond the pale.

I live in Limerick, I don't have a LUAS. Taxi is my only option after 10:40pm on a Saturday. I live one mile from the city centre and it'll cost €6.50

Why should rural dwellers get free taxis when we urban dwellers have to pay for them.

MadsL wrote:

So go to the pub. Last time I checked it was not compulsory to drink alcohol in a pub.

I would rather see the money that this 'scheme' would cost being 'spent' on zero rating VAT on non-alcoholic drinks.

Ógra Fianna Fáil has been on at the senior party to do this for at least 3 years. If they don't listen to us, they're not going to listen to Joe Public, but we will continue to raise the issue at Ard-Fheiseanna and Conferences until it is done

cpoh1

This thread is just plain barking mad. There are some eejits on here who are actually condoning drink driving (XJR, maidhc). These same fellas are the ones on here who probably complain about lane hogging, not indicating etc. Twisted priorities or what!

I have a name for someone who cant go to a pub without having a drink, theyre called alcoholics and need help. There is no excuse for drink driving, EVER.

Its like everything in life, id love a second house and third car but dont have the money. Theses fellas would love to drive to the pub have half a dozen pints and drive home, well you just cant have that either. Deal with it. Like everything in life a sacrifice must be made, either get a lift, walk or drive and dont drink. If you dont like that then move to the city, move to south america or build a pub in your garage at home.

I have a doctor friend in an accident and emergency ward in Cork and suffice to say the amount of serious casualties streaming into him on a regular basis from drink driving cases is crazy. And theyre not all younge fellas either. The newspapers only ever talk about the fatalities, there are thousands getting seriously injured in this country because of drink related driving accidents.

dahamsta

There's plenty barking mad on both sides of the fence here. I doubt they realise it, but the "can ye not go to the pub and have a mineral" camp sound like puritan loonies.

lightening

dahamsta wrote:

but the "can ye not go to the pub and have a mineral" camp sound like puritan loonies.

That is what people do though... all the time. It may seem alien to you, but people in citys have to do this. A different person each time.

We have waited in taxi ranks for three hours.
We have walked six miles to get home.
We have had to drink cocacola all night, till two in the morning when being the designated driver.

This is the way it is, get used to it. I have family in the country and I have seen young fit men getting in to cars buckled drunk to drive a miserable two miles home in the middle of summer, thats just plain greedy and mean spirited. The funny thing was, they sneered at us for walking!

ninty9er

dahamsta wrote:

the "can ye not go to the pub and have a mineral" camp sound like puritan loonies.

Not really, I can go out to numerous pubs & a club on a night out and not drink because I'm driving, other nights I don't drive and would engage in what might be called abuse of the liver in the 1st degree

Seth Brundle

why is that?
If they are desperate to get to the pub but don't want to lose their licence, yet have no option but to drive then what would you suggest?

layke

hawker wrote:

It's actually quite amusing seeing all the urbanites having a moan because the ruralites are getting something.

Moaning about the taxpayers paying for this new scheme. Will it directly affect the tax you pay each week? Did the taxpayer not pay for your Luas which makes daily life easier for the Dubs? Why shouldn't the taxpayer pay for something that will make daily life easier for the ruralite?

Believe it or not there is life beyond the pale.

The Lúas is a necessity for relieving traffic congestion and in return makes money. We still have to pay for it and only runs till 12:30 I believe. We have a Nitelink bus that operates from 2, 3 and 4am to some areas in Dublin.

I would like to point that we still have to pay a fare to use these services where as yours is free.

I'm all for a public service (and quite happy about it) if you are willing to cough up for it. This is the very reason everyone is getting their knickers in a twist over the proposal.

event

lightening wrote:

That is what people do though... all the time. It may seem alien to you, but people in citys have to do this. A different person each time.

We have waited in taxi ranks for three hours.
We have walked six miles to get home.
We have had to drink cocacola all night, till two in the morning when being the designated driver.

This is the way it is, get used to it. I have family in the country and I have seen young fit men getting in to cars buckled drunk to drive a miserable two miles home in the middle of summer, thats just plain greedy and mean spirited. The funny thing was, they sneered at us for walking!

again, im not condoning drink driving, but people in teh city have other things to do

they can go to a cafe
go to the cinema
go to a library
go shopping
etc etc

people in the country do not have this

rubadub

gyppo wrote:

However, its all very well for our urbanites here to dismiss claims of subsidised booze cruises, having the choice of public transport/taxis/hackneys, etc..

Are rural dwellers not entitled to some basic form of public transport?
Do rural dwellers not contribute to the state funds in the same way as everyone else?

Taxis & hackneys are available where there is demand. Public transport is supplied to meet demand. I live in an urban area and cannot get a bus to many places I wish to go either, one service I did use had 2 buses per day. If it was economically viable to supply public transport I see no problem. Services get cancelled in urban areas but I do not hear many demanding free transport to unserviced areas. If taximen thought it was economically viable they would be available. The price of housing is based a lot on location and available amenitities.

Why is a standard 3 bed house so much more expensive in dublin than in the countryside? Many buy houses outside dublin thinking they are saving a fortune and then realise the extra costs and lack of conveniences they must suffer and end up with roughly the same actual cost of living/quality of life. You can't have your cake and eat it to, it goes both ways. Should the government be offering me money back on the additional cost of my house?

I was genuinely shocked at a news report on this, I switched on the news (think TV3) and they were interviewing people on the street. I seriously thought some pub or town had been overrun by scumbags or criminal gangs. People were saying "people are now scared to leave their homes", "People cannot visit the pub anymore out of utter fear". I couldnt believe it when I realised they were talking about drink driving. It was like "everything was fine before, we got slaughtered and drove home, now I live in fear of being caught breaking the law".

If providing transport was economically viable it should be done, as mentioned before there is nothing to stop the publican doing this himself or supplying transport. I remember many moons ago there were free buses going to the nightclub in leopardstown racecourse. Maybe they realise that their profits cannot support such a service, therefore they must face facts and see it is time to close shop. I am sure many businesses would love to have a free transport service provided for them which would raise their own profits. Fundamentally these publicans are selling drugs in drug dens, many choose not to drink the alcohol but the demanding of free transport is so people who willingly take drugs are not breaking the law on the way home. Are we to breathalyze passengers on the free transport and only let alcohol abusers on? In a way penalising people who engage in drug free activities? Should free transport be available to rural football teams who meet up socially yet do not drink, or do they have to start abusing drugs or claiming they do to get a free ride.

I regularly walk 3.5miles to some pubs, I always walk to my local which is over 1 mile away.

dahamsta

My point is not that people should drink and drive - only a fool would think that, obviously we have quite a few of them here - but that the people screaming for us all to go to the pub and drink minerals are so vehement and arrogant in their comments they sound like card-carrying puritans that think we'll all burn in hell for our hard-drinking ways.

Could the moderator not make an attempt to, you know, moderate? Why is the moderation in Motors always so woefully bad, for that matter? How many years are we here now and a rule against foglight rants has only just been implemented? Seriously, is it five? Seven?

Perhaps it's time I unsubscribed anyway, between the thou-shalt-not-anything puritans, the gullible Speed Kills idiots, the flat-cap Skoda drivers and the Bebo-posting morons, I'd say there isn't a normal driver left at this stage.

adam

md99

kbannon wrote:

As I said in a similar thread in commuting/transport, if I get a chance to go out I meed my friends on the other side of Dublin. My options to get home are:
* 2 busses (and the usual waits) assuming public transport is operating - trains & busses heading into the city tend to stop about 11:30!
* taxi (at a cost of about €40 or €50)
* drive myself (which means that I can't drink alcohol)
Realistically, option 3 is the only viable option and Im quite happy to do this. I drink Becks, Holsten or Erdinger N/A or else minerals or coffee.
My travel home is not subsidised! Why should I be treated differently.
Also as Im driving I can give friends a lift home if needed.
Answer me this, why can't rural dwellers get a taxi (if available), get a lift off a friend who is not drinking or just not drink and drive?

If taxis were available to these rural drinkers then there would be no debate over the issue.

Also might I add that many of us do not share in your willingness to stay sober on a night out!

rubadub

md99 wrote:

If taxis were available to these rural drinkers then there would be no debate over the issue.

Is there some law preventing taximen servicing these rural drinkers? Are they not free to choose where they operate or something? Do you know any taximen, have they ever told you why they do not serve rural drinkers?

Or do you think the government should somehow force people to work in particular areas even if it is not economically viable for them?

I bet there are less available local hairdressers in rural areas, should they be forced to open, or should there be free transport to and from them so Mary can catch up on the latest gossip, it is her only social outlet after all.

miju

md99 wrote:

If taxis were available to these rural drinkers then there would be no debate over the issue.

Also might I add that many of us do not share in your willingness to stay sober on a night out!

i do be down in ennis very regularly , i always get a taxi to a home i stay about 5 miles out of town , while all the locals who i've just been on the rip with have no bother tearing on off up the road towards Quin pissed out of their heads at well over 80kmh , so sorry no dice on this point

Seth Brundle

event wrote:

again, im not condoning drink driving, but people in teh city have other things to do

they can go to a cafe
go to the cinema
go to a library
go shopping
etc etc

people in the country do not have this

I really don't see how this argument has anything to do with drink driving!

dahamsta wrote:

but that the people screaming for us all to go to the pub and drink minerals are so vehement and arrogant in their comments they sound like card-carrying puritans that think we'll all burn in hell for our hard-drinking ways.

:rolleyes:

dahamsta wrote:

Could the moderator not make an attempt to, you know, moderate? Why is the moderation in Motors always so woefully bad, for that matter? How many years are we here now and a rule against foglight rants has only just been implemented? Seriously, is it five? Seven?

do you mean that this thread requires additional moderation just because you disagree over an issue?

md99 wrote:

Also might I add that many of us do not share in your willingness to stay sober on a night out!

I didn't say that I was willing to say sober - I said how it was the preferred choice over my other limited options. Anyhow, if having a good time requires you to become plastered then you have a problem!

Gran Hermano

Any concession/subsidy to rural people is blatant discrimination
against people in urban areas. Who subsidises my taxis home?
If I cant walk or get a taxi, I drive and I just don't drink.

It isn't that long ago that not everyone in Ireland owned a car,
what did people do then?

It is discrimination as it stands already as I know that I have a much higher
chance of getting stopped and breathalysed as I live in a city. Random
breath tests in non-urban areas are just that - truly random to the extent that if you live in the back of beyond you know the chances of being
stopped are slim to none.

We should adopt the model in New Zealand where the traffic corp
from the cities travel undercover to rural villages, park up on all
the roads in and out of town and breathalyze everyone. About time we had
some booze buses targeting the rural outposts.

Well done Fianna Fail and PDs, you've given me another reason to
ensure I never vote for you.

MadsL

"can ye not go to the pub and have a mineral" camp sound like puritan loonies.

Seriously. Is it THAT hard??? Scary.

I lived for two years in a rural community in Wiltshire, a 6 mile drive home from the small market town where I worked. I repeatedly got breathalysed - 3 consecutive nights one week. It isn't that hard, get real.

maidhc

The point is thus:

Person A:
55yrs old. Lives in the countryside. Likes 3/4/5 quiet pints on a saturday evening. No "gang" of friends to go with. Just shows up meets Tom/Dick/Harry in the local. Drives like a nun. Terrified of getting caught drink driving, even more terrified of getting caught going to 9.30 mass the next day. Feels persecuted.

Person B:
25yrs. Does not drink and drive, but when he drives he steers a Civic type R. Knows it all, brilliant driver. Wraps himself around a tree at 4am after dropping a few friends home.

Ultimately person A, even with 15pints and semi unconscious will be a safer driver than person B. I'm all for enforcement of rules, but it is important to see the wood from the trees at times as well.

The self righteous attitude in this thread worries me. How many people are driving on the roads believing themselves to be infallible? Arrogance has surely killed more people than beer.

ninty9er

event wrote:

again, im not condoning drink driving, but people in teh city have other things to do

they can go to a cafe
go to the cinema
go to a library
go shopping
etc etc

people in the country do not have this

First of all you told us that the pub was the only social outlet, now it's libraries and whatnot.

If I go to a library a)I can't socialise there because of the quietness rule and b)I'll have gone there to get something and get out again asap

If I go to the cinema a) There are only 2 in Limerick b)Whichever one I go to it is closer to rural Co. Limerick than it is to me (until one opens in the vacinity in 2009) c)I have to drive anyway d) other cinema goers won't take kindly to me having a "social chat" with my frineds while they're trying to watch the movie.

I wouldn't consider shopping a social outlet but if I did a) I would have to drive to get to shops open after 6pm and b) I would feel miserable at not having money to buy all the stuff I like, but that's just the way things are (much like people wanting to drive after 5,6,7 pints, they just fu88ing well can't get used to it)

Cafés.....I don't live in Dublin, the only cafe's within walking distance of me close after 7pm....

PLEASE NOTE
I am an urban dweller, yet I have to drive to get to these amenities.....I see no reason why ruralites cannot drive to a café 10 miles away or a shopping centre or a cinema if they see them as fitting social outlets...

md99 wrote:

Also might I add that many of us do not share in your willingness to stay sober on a night out!

I don't have a willingness to stgay sober either, I just have a willingness not to wait an hour for a taxi.

I have just as many if not more nights out after which I could be accused of abuse of the liver in the 1st degree...I won't drive to work or college the following morning either if it's been a really heavy night.

md99 wrote:

If taxis were available to these rural drinkers then there would be no debate over the issue.

I spent a week back on Caragh Lake in Co. Kerry during the summer, Fairly isolted, but still managed to get a taxi/hackney to do the round trip. It cost a few quid, but it's not like there's no taxis in rural Ireland.
My friend's dad is a taxi driver and will drop people to the country after a night out. Ends up half-way to Galway sometimes!!!

@mods-Is there a problem with the server as I'm 99% sure I posted something almost the same a few hours ago and it's not here

C.D.

maidhc wrote:

The point is thus:

Person A:
55yrs old. Lives in the countryside. Likes 3/4/5 quiet pints on a saturday evening. No "gang" of friends to go with. Just shows up meets Tom/Dick/Harry in the local. Drives like a nun. Terrified of getting caught drink driving, even more terrified of getting caught going to 9.30 mass the next day. Feels persecuted.

Person B:
25yrs. Does not drink and drive, but when he drives he steers a Civic type R. Knows it all, brilliant driver. Wraps himself around a tree at 4am after dropping a few friends home.

Ultimately person A, even with 15pints and semi unconscious will be a safer driver than person B. I'm all for enforcement of rules, but it is important to see the wood from the trees at times as well.

The self righteous attitude in this thread worries me. How many people are driving on the roads believing themselves to be infallible? Arrogance has surely killed more people than beer.

Arrogance thinking you are infallible behind the wheel even after "3/4/5 quiet" pints. Perhaps I should put it in your words:

maidhc wrote:

The self righteous attitude in this thread worries me.

ninty9er

bravo C.D

BnA

I am 100% against drink driving. I don't agree with it and I don't do it.

Also I think this proposal is just cheap electioneering bull and hasn't an ounce of decent substance to it.

However, I am utterly appalled at the clap trap spouted here by a bunch of self-righteous bloated ill informed fools about rural people and rural life in general.

kbannon wrote:

Its gas!
Rural people are allergic to non alcoholic drinks!

Self-righteous cobble

Stekelly wrote:

It's the publicans doign the moaning, why dotn they fund the busses themselves?

If they are losign so much money they woul make back much more than the cost of having a minibus on the road roudign up punters who would effectivly drink for as long as the publican wants before shipping them off home. They cant be that hard up if they arnt willign to do anythign about it.


Plus the fact that people are only seeing other people at all in pubs is more a reflection on the people than the drink drive laws.

A very good point ruined by a stuiped dig.

The fact that the only place to meet people is the pub is a reflection on the fact that the pub is the only freggin thing that's there. There is nowhere else.

Stekelly wrote:

If every 5 of the people took it in turns one at a time they could carpool and only have to not drink 1 in 5 visits to the pub? Is it too much to ask for them to do this?

That would be all fine and well if all 5 people lived beside each other. But the could all live 10 or 15 miles apart all in opposite directions away from the pub.

Stephen wrote:

I live in Kilkenny. Most rural townlands around here have some kind of taxi/hackney service available, so WTF is the problem?

I'm delighted for you all in Kilkenny. Every townland has it's own Hackney....? Is that where are the freggin hackneys are gone, because there sure as hell isn't one in every townland in Clare

kbannon wrote:

As I said in a similar thread in commuting/transport, if I get a chance to go out I meed my friends on the other side of Dublin. My options to get home are:
* 2 busses (and the usual waits) assuming public transport is operating - trains & busses heading into the city tend to stop about 11:30!
* taxi (at a cost of about €40 or €50)
* drive myself (which means that I can't drink alcohol)
Realistically, option 3 is the only viable option and Im quite happy to do this. I drink Becks, Holsten or Erdinger N/A or else minerals or coffee.
My travel home is not subsidised! Why should I be treated differently.
Also as Im driving I can give friends a lift home if needed.
Answer me this, why can't rural dwellers get a taxi (if available), get a lift off a friend who is not drinking or just not drink and drive?

The differece is kbannon. You have options. In traveling your €40 or €50 taxi drive accross town you must pass at least 50 other pubs you could go to instead as well as countless eateries, cinemas etc etc etc. In some rural areas, the nearest place to do any kind of socialising at all is 10 miles away, and surprise surprise, it's a pub

MadsL wrote:

So go to the pub. Last time I checked it was not compulsory to drink alcohol in a pub.

I would rather see the money that this 'scheme' would cost being 'spent' on zero rating VAT on non-alcoholic drinks.

What utter rubbish. Why would you waste time and money on such crap. Do you think the reason people drink and drive is bacause Non-alcoholic drinks are too expensive....????#

layke wrote:

I live in Dublin. Where's my free bus home after work that i'm paying for?

As for the pubs being the heart and soul of a village? Well imo using that argument makes you sound like a bunch of alcoholics who need help to stop drinking.

1) At least you have a bus

2) Sorry. What should we do instead....?

hawker wrote:

...Believe it or not there is life beyond the pale.

You know what. I don't think they believe that there is.

ninty9er wrote:

I live in Limerick, I don't have a LUAS. Taxi is my only option after 10:40pm on a Saturday. I live one mile from the city centre and it'll cost €6.50

Why should rural dwellers get free taxis when we urban dwellers have to pay for them.

Everyone I know living in the country would be utterly delighted to have the option of paying a taxi €6.50 to get home from the pub.

miju wrote:

i do be down in ennis very regularly , i always get a taxi to a home i stay about 5 miles out of town , while all the locals who i've just been on the rip with have no bother tearing on off up the road towards Quin pissed out of their heads at well over 80kmh , so sorry no dice on this point

Utter, utter rubbish. Young lads from Quin who go on the p1ss in Ennis and drive home are not what this whole argument is about.

It is about rural areas (there are places more rural than Ennis you know) where a taxi service is quite simply not available.

Gran Hermano wrote:

It is discrimination as it stands already as I know that I have a much higher chance of getting stopped and breathalysed as I live in a city. Random
breath tests in non-urban areas are just that - truly random to the extent that if you live in the back of beyond you know the chances of being
stopped are slim to none.

Well I have found the opposite to be the case. I live and work in Limerick City. I regularly drive in and out of City centre late on Friday \ Saturday and Sunday nights. (I have an Abrakebra problem). I have never once been stopped by the cops. However I have often been stopped by them around my (real) home in Clare

ninty9er wrote:

I spent a week back on Caragh Lake in Co. Kerry during the summer, Fairly isolted, but still managed to get a taxi/hackney to do the round trip. It cost a few quid, but it's not like there's no taxis in rural Ireland.
My friend's dad is a taxi driver and will drop people to the country after a night out. Ends up half-way to Galway sometimes!!!

Yes there are taxi's in rural areas. But there is often only one taxi serving a huge area. So trying to get it on anything remotely close to peak taxi time is nigh on impossible.

And as for your friend's father. Fair play to him. But me and my friends regularly had taxi's drive away from us because they didn't want to do our 20 mile trip home from town



Again, I repeat. I do not condone drink driving in any shape or manner and I think this free buses thing is just rubbish. But the lack of understanding here about what the actual problem is, is quite sad.

In my own opinion the answer lies in the local publican getting their own hackney licence and ferrying people to and from his pub. I wouldn't cost that much to do. You would get a decent runabout people carrier for less than 5k and drive it yourself. Customers would be more than happy to pay something like a tenner each for the round trip (to and from the pub). If you made a decent effort to organise it, it would pay for itself.

In a small village with 2 or 3 pubs, if the publicans have a good relationship they could share out the cost.

If it was to be subsidised by the Government (and I don't really think it needs to be) they could do so by giving a grant towards the cost of the vehicle or the cost of tax and insurance.

cashback

I really don't see why there's so much fuss over this proposed scheme. Anything that might cut down on road deaths should be supported.
I'm fairly sure most of the people from cities that are posting here don't realise the importance of the country pub to the community.
There is a huge amount of people in their sixties and older whose only social outlet is the pub. They'll go down, talk about the farm or football, have a few pints and it might be the only chance they have to socialise.
People are asking why can't they walk? Walking two or three miles on back roads late at night isn't exactly the safest. Many elderly people would find it difficult to walk this far anyway.
Other people are saying why can't they go to a pub and not drink. That might be fine for people in their twenties but imagine Tom walking into the bar and suddenly asking for a lucozade after thirty years or so. It's not going to happen. Routine is a comfort for older people. It doesn't mean they're alcoholics.
I'm certainly not advocating people driving after a few pints. But I don't understand how someone can be so opposed to a proposal that could preserve some of the few social outlets in the countryside and save some lives in the process.

BnA

Well said.

Good point RE if it cuts down on road deaths it's a good thing. I think though that the time and money could be better spent on a better thought out scheme

cashback

BnA wrote:

Well said.

Good point RE if it cuts down on road deaths it's a good thing. I think though that the time and money could be better spent on a better thought out scheme

Well tbh I haven't thought too much about the actual proposal. Haven't read too much into it. The hackney idea could well work better alright.
Didn't see your post before I posted.
Most other people can't get their head around the social fabric of the countryside. You can't just tell all these auld fellas to start drinking coffee or soft drinks. Would it be better if they were all sitting home alone in isolation, watching the telly?

C.D.

cashback wrote:

Routine is a comfort for older people. It doesn't mean they're alcoholics.

Speeding is pretty routine for me. As is not wearing my seatbelt. I also like to leave my foglights on. I occasionally like to dose up before I drive- its ok though, I'm not an addict, it's routine for me.

Am I a dangerous driver?

If I changed my "routine" would I, could I save lives?

The whole problem with road safety is that people aren't willing to change their "routine", to accept doing things differently can and will save lives.

I know you don't endorse drink-driving and I commend you on that. The only routine that needs changing in this case is the mentality that "I must have a drink if I go to the pub".

cashback

C.D. wrote:

Speeding is pretty routine for me. As is not wearing my seatbelt. I also like to leave my foglights on. I occasionally like to dose up before I drive- its ok though, I'm not an addict, it's routine for me.

Am I a dangerous driver?

If I changed my "routine" would I, could I save lives?

The whole problem with road safety is that people aren't willing to change their "routine", to accept doing things differently can and will save lives.

I know you don't endorse drink-driving and I commend you on that. The only routine that needs changing in this case is the mentality that "I must have a drink if I go to the pub".

Ok, but you're not going to be able to change that mentality in some of the older rural-dwellers. It's just a part of life for them.
I wouldn't equate having a few pints in the local with your friends with leaving your foglights on. It's the younger generation whose mentality could be changed about alcohol and that's something which should be encouraged.
I don't think the issue is about how much people drink but how they get home when they're finished drinking. Which is why I'm in favour of any proposals that stop people getting in their cars.

C.D.

You're absolutely right, younger people are probably just as bad. I agree it would take a while to change that kind of mentality- no doubt about it. But offering free transport only encourages the mentality that if I'm in a pub, I must have a drink.

About whether younger\older people are more prone to drink driving isn't a debate thats worth having- there really is no statistical evidence to support either side, I wouldn't feel comfortable blindly making accusations. I do feel (21 years in Ireland, born and bred) that as a culture our approach to alcohol is atrocious irrespective of age, gender or class.