The Hazards of Belief

Gbear

Penn wrote: »

Not quite religious belief, but belief in homeopathy. This is unbelievable...

http://www.abc.net.au/austory/content/2011/s3260776.htm

It's easy to trot out Caveat Emptor until you read something like that.

Homeopaths are scumbags and are all either liars or dangerously stupid.

The Mad Hatter

Penn wrote: »

Not quite religious belief, but belief in homeopathy. This is unbelievable...

http://www.abc.net.au/austory/content/2011/s3260776.htm

:eek:

MrPudding

Penn wrote: »

Not quite religious belief, but belief in homeopathy. This is unbelievable...

http://www.abc.net.au/austory/content/2011/s3260776.htm

I am somewhat conflicted about this story. Like the victims of the psychics, I have some sympathy, but how much medical advice and how many medical practitioners must this woman have ignored in order to drop all conventional treatment?

MrP

joseph brand

Dated 2009, but a very interesting read.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/belief/2009/aug/19/religion-catholic-agnostic

That's just the Anglicans. Other Protestant sects are even worse: my prize for malignity going to the Jehovah's Witnesses, whose leadership denies followers blood transfusions even in medical emergencies, on pain of being cut off from all fellowship even with relatives, because of some bizarre misreading of a solitary obscure Biblical text written in an age long before transfusions were possible. Of course, the Watchtower leadership in Brooklyn do not deny transfusions to themselves; they just don't boast about it.

Don't get me started on Catholicism. A South American bishop was recently censured for excommunicating the medical staff who had carried out an abortion on a nine year-old child to save her life after she had been raped by her father, but the fact that he saw nothing wrong with his decision – he also excommunicated the child's mother, though not her father – is a dazzling revelation of church attitudes that are all too common.

The Mad Hatter

MrPudding wrote: »

I am somewhat conflicted about this story. Like the victims of the psychics, I have some sympathy, but how much medical advice and how many medical practitioners must this woman have ignored in order to drop all conventional treatment?

MrP

From the letter, it sounds like the alternative medicine lady was a friend to her as well - like it or not, we're inclined to trust our friends on this sort of thing, especially when they claim "expertise."

Galvasean

And people wonder why I'm a homeophobe..

Penn

The Mad Hatter wrote: »

From the letter, it sounds like the alternative medicine lady was a friend to her as well - like it or not, we're inclined to trust our friends on this sort of thing, especially when they claim "expertise."

Plus, the medical side never claimed they could definitely cure her.

I was probably overly harsh in the other thread (the one about the psychics who conned millions out of people) when I said the victims of a plot like that almost deserved it for being stupid. Sometimes the victims of plots like these are exactly that.... victims.

Look Ma, I'm growing as a person!

Galvasean

Penn wrote: »

I was probably overly harsh in the other thread (the one about the psychics who conned millions out of people) when I said the victims of a plot like that almost deserved it for being stupid. Sometimes the victims of plots like these are exactly that.... victims.

Look Ma, I'm growing as a person!

Sadly, the unscrupulous homeopaths, psychics and snake oil merchants are not...

robindch

"Teen Pregnancies Highest In States With Abstinence-Only Policies"

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2012/04/10/461402/teen-pregnancy-sex-education

Think Progress wrote:

The number of teen births in the U.S. dropped again in 2010, according to a government report, with nearly every state seeing a decrease. Nationally, the rate fell 9 percent to about 34 per 1,000 girls ages 15 through 19, and the drop was seen among all racial and ethnic groups. Mississippi continues to have the highest teen birth rate, with 55 births per 1,000 girls. New Hampshire has the lowest rate at just under 16 births per 1,000 girls.

This is the lowest national rate for teen births since the Centers for Disease Control began tracking it in 1940, and CDC officials attributed the decline to pregnancy prevention efforts. Other reports show that teenagers are having less sex and using contraception more often. Studies have backed this up. Researchers at the University of Washington in Seattle found that teenagers who received some type of comprehensive sex education were 60 percent less likely to get pregnant or get someone else pregnant. And in 2007, a federal report showed that abstinence-only programs had “no impacts on rates of sexual abstinence.” But 37 states require sex education that includes abstinence, 26 of which require that abstinence be stressed as the best method. Additionally, research shows that abstinence-only strategies could deter contraceptive use among teenagers, thus increasing their risk of unintended pregnancy.

[...] Mississippi does not require sex education in schools, but when it is taught, abstinence-only education is the state standard. New Mexico, which has the second highest teen birth rate, does not require sex ed and has no requirements on what should be included when it is taught. New Hampshire, on the other hand, requires comprehensive sex education in schools that includes abstinence and information about condoms and contraception.

Delirium

Leading Indian Rationalist facing blasphemy charges over miracle clash with Catholic Church

Sanal Edamaruku, Secretary General of the India-based organisation Rationalist International, is facing charges of blasphemy after he exposed a "miracle" involving a crucifix statue in the Vile Parle area of Mumbai.

On 10 March, Edamuruku, who is well-known in India for his debunking of supposed miracles and the abilities claimed by religious gurus (see this 2008 piece for New Humanist), was invited by the TV-9 channel to visit the Church of Our Lady of Velankanni in Vile Parle, where water had begun dripping from the feet of a statue of the crucified Christ. Worshippers claimed that this was "holy water", and the crowds flocked to the church to collect the miraculous liquid in containers.

Upon inspection, Edamuruku was able to reveal that the source of the "miracle" was a leaking drainage system, the water from which was being sucked up and ejected through the nail holes of the crucifix via a capillary action.

Sarky

That water would be filthy, I hope nobody was dumb enough to... Oh, who am I kidding, of course someone drank it.

Delirium

Australia's most senior-ranked Catholic says Jews 'intellectually and morally inferior'

In a widely watched televised debate – which led to ongoing debate over the winner – Cardinal Pell said "the little Jewish people" were shepherds who lacked intellectual development.

"I've got a great admiration for the Jews but we don't need to exaggerate their contribution in their early days," he said on ABC television. "They weren't intellectually the equal of [the Egyptians or Persians] – intellectually, morally ... The poor – the little Jewish people, they were originally shepherds. They were stuck. They're still stuck between these great powers."

Sarky

Oh, Catholicism. You do it to yourself* really, and that's what makes it so funny.



*Well the rape you do to defenseless children, but in all other respects...

robindch

koth wrote: »

Australia's most senior-ranked Catholic says Jews 'intellectually and morally inferior'

That full debate is here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tD1QHO_AVZA

And this facepalm moment:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSo4zjTbokY

Hard to say who won. Dawkins lack of humor is no help in this kind of debate...

Delirium

Christian group (UK) books anti-gay ads to appear on buses

London buses have been booked to carry a Christian advertising campaign expected to start next week, which asserts the power of therapy to change the sexual orientation of gay people.

The full length advert, which will appear on five different routes in the capital, is backed by the Core Issues Trust whose leader, Mike Davies, believes "homoerotic behaviour is sinful". His charity funds "reparative therapy" for gay Christians who believe that they have homosexual feelings but want to become straight. The campaign is also backed by Anglican Mainstream, an worldwide orthodox Anglican group whose supporters have equated homosexuality with alcoholism.

Sarky

How long before Mike Davies is found in a brothel wearing suspenders, bra and surrounded by 3 Thai ladyboys?

Cossax

robindch wrote: »

That full debate is here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tD1QHO_AVZA

And this facepalm moment:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSo4zjTbokY

Hard to say who won. Dawkins lack of humor is no help in this kind of debate...

Granted I only watched the last 30 minutes or so but I don't think he had a lack of humour in what I saw? It wasn't really a debate, per se, so I'm not sure there was ever going to be a winner/loser especially with the nature of some of the questions.

Gbear

koth wrote: »

Christian group (UK) books anti-gay ads to appear on buses

I wonder could they get away with stating that therapy and faith in god could turn black people white?
Can you advertise with factually incorrect statements?

joseph brand

robindch wrote: »

That full debate is here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tD1QHO_AVZA

And this facepalm moment:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSo4zjTbokY

Hard to say who won. Dawkins lack of humor is no help in this kind of debate...

I think Dawkins is tiring of the same old questions. He is always asked about where we would get our morals from, in the absence of religion. You'll notice him look up to the ceiling in many debates when asked this garbage.

You're right about his 'lack of humor', but as he mentioned himself when he tried to remember Julia Sweeney, he was suffering jet lag. Wouldn't it have been great if Dawkins were able to tag Hitchens, who could then take his place half-way through, and just go straight for Pell's jugular.

There was nothing at all new in this debate, same old same old. I'd say Dawkins was mainly looking forward to his talk with Krauss. Far more interesting and mentally stimulating.

BTW, judging by the vote results, Dawkins was the winner.

Delirium

Gbear wrote: »

I wonder could they get away with stating that therapy and faith in god could turn black people white?
Can you advertise with factually incorrect statements?

Seems the mayor of London isn't too happy about the ads and has made a move to block them.

Anti-gay adverts on London buses blocked by Boris Johnson

A clearly angered Johnson said: "London is one of the most tolerant cities in the world and intolerant of intolerance. It is clearly offensive to suggest that being gay is an illness that someone recovers from and I am not prepared to have that suggestion driven around London on our buses."

joseph brand

Do religious folks ever stop thinking about sex? They're obsessed with gay sex.

Gbear

"London is one of the most tolerant cities in the world and intolerant of intolerance."

A bizarre choice of words making the statement utterly nonsensical.

recedite

Gbear wrote: »

A bizarre choice of words making the statement utterly nonsensical.

Ah no, Boris just loves a bit of irony, which makes it hard for some to take him seriously, but his heart is in the right place.

CiaranMT

recedite wrote: »

Ah no, Boris just loves a bit of irony, which makes it hard for some to take him seriously, but his heart is in the right place.

Yeah, I don't think he takes himself all that seriously.

Penn

CiaranMT wrote: »

Yeah, I don't think he takes himself all that seriously.

Except when he's playing wiff-waff

Genghiz Cohen

recedite wrote: »

Ah no, Boris just loves a bit of irony, which makes it hard for some to take him seriously, but his heart is in the right place.

I couldn't fail to disagree with you less.

Penn

Genghiz Cohen wrote: »

I couldn't fail to disagree with you less.

Has anyone ever been so far as decided to use even go want to do look more like?

robindch

A monk asked Joshu, "Has a dog Buddha-nature or not?"

Joshu answered "Mu".

Sarky

Those Zen masters were all trolls of the highest order.

Galvasean

koth wrote: »

Leading Indian Rationalist facing blasphemy charges over miracle clash with Catholic Church

So they are charging him with blasphemy for exposing a fake miracle? You'd think they'd be happy.