Front Fog Lights - Fashon Accessory?

Alun

ArthurF wrote:

Good point Alun and fair enough if they are true driving lights, but the scurge we are really talking about here are the (Fog Lights) on the Nissan Micras of this world and the fact that 99 times out of 100 the Front Fogs are used at the expense of the Dipped beams (through ignorance)???

Yeah, I know that, and I agree 100%, but the discussion had taken a silly turn, and there seemed to be some confusion between some posters as to what driving lights were, so I thought I'd try and clear it up.

69 mustang

maidhc wrote:

I have never seen the option of having "driving lights or fog lights", apart from the old days when there was a craze of having lights set into the grille. Indeed most manufacturers (Ford, Toyota etc) refer to the clear lights below bumper level as "fog lights".
.

My last experience was with an Hyundai Accent 00 they give that option but not many people want the fog light type any more.

Balfa

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_Lighting wrote:

Driving lamps

"Driving lamp" is an obsolete term referring to auxiliary main-beam headlamps. They are most notably fitted on rally cars, and are typically fitted to production vehicles derived from or imitating such cars.
[edit]

Front fog lamps

Fog lamps provide a wide, bar-shaped beam of light with a sharp cutoff at the top, and are generally aimed and mounted low. They may be either white or selective yellow. They are intended for use at low speed to increase the illumination directed towards the road surface and verges in conditions of poor visibility due to rain, fog, dust or snow. As such, they are often most effectively used in place of dipped-beam headlamps, reducing the glareback from fog or falling snow (although use without headlamps may not be permitted in some countries ).

Use of the front fog lamps when visibility is not seriously reduced is often prohibited (for example in the United Kingdom), as they can cause increased glare to other drivers, particularly in wet pavement conditions, as well as harming the driver's own vision due to excessive foreground illumination.

The respective purposes of front fog lamps and driving lamps are often confused, sometimes to the extent of manufacturers advertising models with "sporty fog lamps". Indeed, in most countries, weather conditions necessitating their use are very rare, and there is no legal requirement for them, so their primary application is often simply a way of manufacturers distinguishing different specification variants in a model range.

I know wikipedia is not the be-all and end-all of factual information, but I'd much sooner trust it than any of you. Fog lights used to irritate me. Thankfully they're not at all trendy in the US so I don't have that problem any more.

Unfortunately, the standards on dipped lights over here are ****, so I have a whole new problem

69 mustang

ArthurF wrote:

All I am saying to you (69Mustang) is .....................................
Why go to all the trouble of wiring-in a couple of Spots/Fogs to your side lights and then turning off your Dipped beams?
(personally I cant see the point) I mean to say "Why not use your dipped Hedalights instead"?

I have the lower voltage dips when on side lights.

What I'm saying is I don't see how people a being blinded by factory fitted 55w driving lights as they in design meant to point down for the car with them to be seen not to see with in rain at dawn etc which is why I have them on,
I also have never been flashed at for them or never had to flash factory fitted ones.:)

BeardyGit

I have 900W of lighting on my 4x4. Only 110W of that is for fogs. The rest is for returning the favour to Micra drivers to show them what *real* driving lights are all about.

I never use lights that I don't need. They're all there when the situation calls for it (and I actually put my 4x4 to real work at times) but that's the only reason for having 'em there.

I know lots of car drivers (me being one of them during the working day) get annoyed with people driving with spotlights/fogs on during the day. But there's nothing we can do about it really.

Xenon headlights are another matter altogether. Factory fitted Halogen lights have served perfectly well for the last decade or two on Irish roads. There is absolutely no need for them - I don't care how cool the tosser in the BMW/Audi/Merc/Range Rover etc. think they look. I don't care how much better one claims they can see at night. They are very hard on oncoming traffic and also those driving in front of them on a dark road. The intensity is the problem, not the brightness - All of us have experienced the "flashing" in the rear view mirrors. To me, that's more irritating and more dangerous lighting practice than the idiot driving through town with his fogs lit up on a nice sunny day.

Ban Xenon. Ban Micras. Ban tossers. Sorted.

Gil

C_Breeze

what are ya talkin about Ban regular xenons , why?-cos you know better than all the engineers at the top car manufactures?

Standard fit xenons that come on the likes of Mercs Audi and BMW , that are adjusted correctly should not dazzle you anymore than another cars lights if both are driving towards you with dipped beams.

would the old yellow French style lights be more to your liking?


This is such a stupid argument about fogs and these so called driving lights -
JUST turn them off if its not foggy for gods sake.

this is how it works :

Dusk - Sidelights
Night- Low Beam
Bad night visibility - High beam ( and ofcourse low beam for oncoming traffic.)
Fog - Fog lights.


and if you are a twat and insist of having your lights on during the day , use either Side lights or low beam - SIMPLE!!

Balfa

69 mustang wrote:

factory fitted 55w driving lights

It seems to me if wikipedia reckons "driving lights" is an obsolete term, the only reason people keep using it is to have some excuse to have their foglights on.

they in design meant to point down for the car with them to be seen not to see

There's no such thing as a light designed to be seen (as opposed to designed to illuminate something, such as the road in front of you) being pointed away from something, or indeed being pointed any direction at all because they're not directional beams, they don't have a silvered backing to focus all light forward. Do taillights need to be angled away from people? No, they're just low powered, omnidirectional lights designed to be seen, not illuminate. Just like "driving lights" would be, if they were actually what you had.

Did you also know that taillights (to be seen) are usually about 5W and dipped headlights (to illuminate the road) are usually 55W to 65W? So your 55W "driving lights" are beginning to sound more and more like fog lights now, aren't they?

never had to flash factory fitted ones.:)

Because you can tell when passing someone at night, in the dark, heading 60mph towards each other for a combined passing speed of 120mph whether fog lights are factory fitted or not?

And besides, Alun (and wikipedia) just told you that "driving lights" are not for being seen, "They are most notably fitted on rally cars" to provide even greater illumination of what's in front of you.

Litcagral

C_Breeze wrote:

Dusk - Sidelights

and if you are a twat and insist of having your lights on during the day , use either Side lights or low beam - SIMPLE!!

Parking lights or "sidelights" as you call them are for PARKING only. They should not be used on their own in a moving vehicle. Dipped headlights should be used if desired or required during the day.

Balfa

Litcagral wrote:

Parking lights or "sidelights" as you call them are for PARKING only. They should not be used on their own in a moving vehicle. Dipped headlights should be used if desired or required during the day.

Well technically they are sidelights. They're there to mark the corners of the car so that it's easier to tell its width, etc. Parking lights are mainly a German thing and you can switch on either the left side lights or right side lights depending on which side of the road your car's parked on, which is what I would consider to be the main distinction between parking and sidelights.

But yes, according to the (Irish) rules of the road, dipped headlights are for dusk. It makes no mention of running sidelights by themselves. However, I've yet to be given a reason by anyone why this is a bad thing to do in, say, very early dusk. I don't do it myself, but I don't mind others doing it.

And Main beams are for night, except in built-up areas or when facing other traffic, etc. Main beams are not solely for "bad visibility night driving". They are to be used all the time unless there's a reason not to as mentioned above.

Squirrel

Balfa wrote:

Well technically they are sidelights. They're there to mark the corners of the car so that it's easier to tell its width, etc. Parking lights are mainly a German thing and you can switch on either the left side lights or right side lights depending on which side of the road your car's parked on, which is what I would consider to be the main distinction between parking and sidelights.

But yes, according to the (Irish) rules of the road, dipped headlights are for dusk. It makes no mention of running sidelights by themselves. However, I've yet to be given a reason by anyone why this is a bad thing to do in, say, very early dusk. I don't do it myself, but I don't mind others doing it.

And Main beams are for night, except in built-up areas or when facing other traffic, etc. Main beams are not solely for "bad visibility night driving". They are to be used all the time unless there's a reason not to as mentioned above.

Technically they're not side lights, because they aren't on the extreme sides of the car, so don't mark the width of a car too well then. It could've been an Accord or Legend I saw on my way training with parking lights (or sidelights) on, and they were closest to the grill

Litcagral

Balfa wrote:

.

But yes, according to the (Irish) rules of the road, dipped headlights are for dusk. It makes no mention of running sidelights by themselves. However, I've yet to be given a reason by anyone why this is a bad thing to do in, say, very early dusk. QUOTE]

It's much easier and safer just to use dipped lights while moving and there is less danger of neglecting to switch them on later. I can't think of any reason to use parking lights only. I think half the country are still fooling themselves that they are "saving the battery".

johnnyrotten

On a side note,
I was out driving today about noon. It was raining heavy and it was quite dark for the time of day. I had dipped headlights on. The amount of people driving with no lights on was crazy. When visability is poor in rain etc, turn on your lights ( dipped main beams) people

Squirrel

johnnyrotten wrote:

On a side note,
I was out driving today about noon. It was raining heavy and it was quite dark for the time of day. I had dipped headlights on. The amount of people driving with no lights on was crazy. When visability is poor in rain etc, turn on your lights ( dipped main beams) people

I'll agree with that, it was shocking. The road up the side of Marlay park/Grange golf club past the church was pretty dark, and there was only 2 cars with any lights on when I was on it

johnnyrotten

It should be standard in all new cars to have low energy day running lights like in the Volvos

C_Breeze

johnnyrotten wrote:

It should be standard in all new cars to have low energy day running lights like in the Volvos

No , no it shouldnt , damn commies - if i wanna switch em off i want to be able to do so.

prospect

Getting back to the point:

IF it is FOG LIGHTS we are talking about then:

It is irrelevant if you:
:rolleyes: Think they look cool
Dont think they are annoying
:mad: Like to use yours all the time
:v: Think there are worse offenses

It is very relevant that:
It is illegal to use them when it is not foggy
That they are designed to be used only in low speed foggy situations

Ernie Ball

My car is pretty low to the ground.;) The fog lights on SUVs are frequently totally blinding to me. Yesterday I was on the M4 and it was a fog-free evening. The tw*t in the SUV behind me had his foglights on and it was like that scene on the rural road in Close Encounters of the Third Kind inside my car.

After a bit of this, I finally put on my rear fog lights. Didn't take the hint. So I flashed the rear fog lights. No go. Finally I just floored it and got out of there.

Of course, this being Ireland, nothing can be done.:mad:

franksm

I was behind some twit in a red VW Bora on the M50 at about 0710 this morning with rear fogs lit up. I had just driven all the way from Belfast (yella plates, doesn't mean I'm a bad driver ) so I didn't drive all that way just to be blinded by some pox-bag.

I un-flashed him (switched off my dips) and on again - no availl; then flash him for real - no avail; so just did that for a good few minutes. I managed to get into lane 2 to overtake him, I had had enough and got alongside him - he made a point of not looking at me (you know the way you can tell) which says to me that he knew what was what. When I got past him lo and behold he had one headlamp out (left), front fogs switched on, but foglight on the right pointed up in the air practically. Idiot.

johnnyrotten

Thems the muppets I'am talking about

mike65

Can I close this thread, please?

Mike.

prospect

Please do.