Should convicted rapists be castrated

Zulu

df001i6876 wrote:

Ive never needed the law in my life ive all ways sort it out.

Law is what hold society together around you. Do you work? The law ensures you get paid.

df001i6876 wrote:

Ok, you ring them and they turn up when they feel like. mmm. I would hate haveing to rely on them turning up. We will all end up like tony martin.

You are refering to a police force, not the law as a concept. Please be clearer. I don't particulary like the Gaurdai either, but thats not what the argument is about.

df001i6876 wrote:

and as for afganistan i leave that to the army.

Ahh marshal law - its great!

df001i6876

give = take that the law

df001i6876

df001i6876 wrote:

give = take that the law

put your hands up your under a rest.

amp

df001i6876 wrote:

put your hands up your under a rest.

Dude, I don't know what you're on but do you mind not doing it in here? Cheers

df001i6876

A soap box. Its against the law [ drugs] hoildays are made in heaven.

amp

I'll take that as a no then. You can come back to Humanities when you've mastered the art of constructing readable sentences.

MrNuked

Castration after a male has reached sexual maturity will not remove sexual impulses and sexual frustration.
So castration will not remove the problem.
It may, however, prevent the problem.
Elizabeth I force fed some prisoners their own testicles. Sounds like an idea in cases like this. Then they should be looked in a cell and left to starve to death (cheapest way probably).
The judicial system in this country is a joke because there are not enough resources to keep offenders in prison long enough or often enough as they deserve. The death penalty, and brutal physical penalties, would be strong deterrents.
I hate the IRA, but I have heard that communities in which they are the primary law-enforcers suffer very little crime. Because people in those areas equate crime with swift and brutal punishment.

Pet

MrNuked wrote:

Castration after a male has reached sexual maturity will not remove sexual impulses and sexual frustration.
So castration will not remove the problem.
It may, however, prevent the problem.
Elizabeth I force fed some prisoners their own testicles. Sounds like an idea in cases like this. Then they should be looked in a cell and left to starve to death (cheapest way probably).
The judicial system in this country is a joke because there are not enough resources to keep offenders in prison long enough or often enough as they deserve. The death penalty, and brutal physical penalties, would be strong deterrents.
I hate the IRA, but I have heard that communities in which they are the primary law-enforcers suffer very little crime. Because people in those areas equate crime with swift and brutal punishment.

Castration will stop the production of testosterone, reducing sexual desire to almost nothing.

But it will also reduce violent impulses by the same amount, because testosterone is the leading cause/spur of aggression.

So, castration would be effective for these people. And it would deter people from rape too.

All that remains is the question of morality.

Zulu

Pet wrote:

Castration will stop the production of testosterone, reducing sexual desire to almost nothing.

...of course you're making the massive leap of faith here the rape is caused by sexual desire, and not power.

Pet wrote:

But it will also reduce violent impulses by the same amount, because testosterone is the leading cause/spur of aggression.

This is just made up.

Pet wrote:

So, castration would be effective for these people. And it would deter people from rape too.

As already discussed - it would not deter rapists, just as cutting off peoples hands for theft dosen't stop it; just as stoning people to death for adultry, dosen't stop adultry; just as the death sentence dosen't stop murder.

Pet wrote:

All that remains is the question of morality.

Arguably the most important.

pretty-in-pink

I dunno, testosterone is related to aggression.For normal people you remove the largest contributing factor, yuo remove the problem. but normal people dont do this sort of thing anyway. The people who do this have an anger already, and a few screws loose, so how effective would such measures be on people who have lost contact with their humanity?answer equals not at all.

Proven fact by physcologists:such offenders graduate through crimes, and lose the self disgust that is there for the first few offences. They can turn from a peeping tom, to smash and grab, to violent assualt/robbery, to sexual assualt, to rape, to violent rape, to murder. Its scary. these perps are not nice people who screwed up. It becomes an addiction, and that needs help. You give them more reason to be angry at society, and they get more dangerous. It really is death or rehab, or life behind bars (proper life NOT 20 years). in the next decade some of the most aggresive, sexual, cold blooded men in Ireland are gettting out of jail. Why? "Good behaviour" and we dont have consecuative sentencing. Physcologists have said that these men and oters liek them can "fake" being good, they show no remorse, and because our system sucks they get out.

Two of these men are most likely to be responsible for all those women who dissappeared, when they went down, the dissappearences stopped. They were caught after brutal assualts on women were stopped before tehy could kill. one of them kidnapped, beat and raped the women for several hours in every way, with himself and using devices such as hammers, he got caught before he finished the job so to speak. when told the woman was really screwed up over him, he said "well she's alive".

Two more will pick up where they left off.raping and killing a woman a week.every week.

So go society, we are letting physcotic killers out again. Our entire system needs to change. god help me for saying it, but we need a system like the english or americans have.

***source of info above, "frozen blood", a book about irish physco + serial killers. very interesting, very sad, but an excellent read

Zulu

...well in all fairness - the last thing we need is a system like they have in America.

pretty-in-pink

not exactly the same as there- but some of the principles ,

such as the same crime detection/fighting facilities as here so that you dont need a body, not like here where you need a body, and lots of other stuff too. even with an admital you need the body or they walk.i mean if you find them acting weird(burning stuff, doging people, hiding out etc), with the victims blood/clothing etc on them or in their cars/homes etc....but there is no body, then you cant hold them.

and with the possibility of consecutive sentencing, here even if you are known to have killed say 5 people, you still only get 1 life sentence. its really stupid.

bigmike

In my view rape is as much about power, control, frustration, insecurity, a feeling of inadequacy than it is about sex. Taking away a sexual desire through castration could well create a monster of another nature. Understanding the causes of rape, and following through a programme of treatment and then learning from this programme is ideal. Failing that the bastards should be locked up for life, preferably in a cell with other frustrated blokes with huge libidoes

test999

I see lots of people on here saying that chemical castration, results in a monster of a different sort. I hadn't heard about that, does anyone have a link to a study proving that? Or do I get the feint whiff of sh1T?

I suppose that choppin a rapists mickey off is a no no with the wet pants libs on this board?

Zulu

test999 wrote:

I see lots of people on here saying that chemical castration, results in a monster of a different sort. I hadn't heard about that, does anyone have a link to a study proving that? Or do I get the feint whiff of sh1T?

Read the other post then. You might find studys proving that point, or you mightn't, but at least everyone won't have to repeat themselves...... again.

test999 wrote:

I suppose that choppin a rapists mickey off is a no no with the wet pants libs on this board?

:rolleyes: Thats insightful.

HCOOK3

HEY, I'M NOT TRYING TO BE A B*TCH, BUT THE FACT IS UNLESS YOU HAVE BEEN RAPED YOU DON'T KNOW. I HAVE AND I WANT MORE THEN ANYTHING FOR THE LAW TO TAKE A KNIFE AND CUT IT OFF IN THE MOST PAINFUL WAY. YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT RAPIST TAKE AWAY FROM THEIR VICTIMS...SO WHY SHOULD THEY KEEP THE ABILITY TO ENJOY SEX WHEN WE CAN'T! PLEASE TELL ME. EMAIL ME BACK AT [email]snip[/email]


Mod edit to remove email address

HCOOK3

Syth wrote:

I don't think convicted rapists should be castrated. I don't think it's a good
detterent. Look at the deterent we have now. Look at the social stigma a rapist
has. Some say that out society encourages rape, but try going into a bar and
proudly announcing that you are a rapist. See if you are encouraged. As for the
revictism argument, it don't think it will work. Many have already mentioned
that it's possibe to still sexually assault somone even if the little general
is dead. Also should we now start cutting of the hands of thieves? Should we
break the spines of murders to make sure they can't kill again? Should we make
blind anyone who knocked a person donw in a car, so thay can't drive again? No.

As for the whole 'rape is nothing to do with sex' argument, I think that is
false. consider these 2 simple facts:
o Men will do lots of things to have sex. Many, many men are willing to chase
(figurativly) after women to have sex, heck, sme are even willing to pay for
sex. Many men really wan tsex.
o There are some men who are willing to use violence to get what they want.
Whether it is some cash or a flash phone, there are men who are willing to use
violence to get what they want.
Thus it seems obvious that there will be a small amount of men who are willing to use violence to get sex, ie willing to rape.

Also there are cases where a man and a woman are "gettin' it on", and the woman
doesn't want it to go that far, she wants to stop. Most men would stop, a tiny
amout wouldn't and whould then rape the woman. If the 'rape is nothing to do
with sex' argument was true, then the man would change from thinking about sex
just before the woman wanted to stop (actually it's probably all he can think
about), and then suddenly, not be thinking about sex. Most of the men out there
will tell you that that kind of switch doesn't happen.

HEY, I'M NOT TRYING TO BE A B*TCH, BUT THE FACT IS UNLESS YOU HAVE BEEN HELD DOWN WHILE SOMEONE COMPLETELY VIOLATES YOU THEN YOU DON'T KNOW. I HAVE BEEN RAPED SO I DO KNOW AND I PERSONALLY WISH THAT THE LAW WOULD SLOWLY AND PAINFULLY CUT OFF HIS PENIS. WHY SHOULD HE EVER ENJOY SEX WHEN I CAN'T. PLEASE REPLY TO ME EMAIL ME IF YOU WANT AT [email]snip[/email]

mod edit to remove email address

Zulu

HCOOK3 wrote:

HEY, I'M NOT TRYING TO BE A B*TCH, BUT THE FACT IS UNLESS YOU HAVE BEEN RAPED YOU DON'T KNOW...

Firstly - take off Caps Lock.
Secondly - while we can all sympatise with rape victims, we don't need to have been raped in order to discuss this topic. If you were to apply that kind of logic to murder - we could never find a punishment, as the victims are dead.

Zulu

HCOOK3 - you don't need to keep repeating yourself. ...and why do you want people to e-mail you?

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

HCOOK3 wrote:

I HAVE BEEN RAPED SO I DO KNOW AND I PERSONALLY WISH THAT THE LAW WOULD SLOWLY AND PAINFULLY CUT OFF HIS PENIS.

if he'd used a broomstick would you want his household cleaning utensils mutilated also?

amp

Meanwhile back on topic

LegacyUser

I didn't read this thread, just the title, and the answer is no, miscarriages happen, then what ?

pretty-in-pink

hcook3, I can fully sympathise with you, and understand your anger, I felt the same myself.

There are a few girls and guys who have posted here who have been raped, some by partners, some family, some strangers.

By holding such an immense anger towards them, and wanting them to suffer as much as you, you are behaving in the same kind of way they did.

I know its hard, but by letting them run/ruin your life you are letting them win over and over again.

The lord will deal with all those perps who dont repent, and those that do deserve a new shot at life.

Don't get me wrong, I wont be making freinds with the guy who did it to me, but if he truly regrets it then nothing can ever be as hard as the guilt he will put himself through.

We do need harsher punishments, and I can see a vigilante thing happening, especially in places like Limerick. I still feel so angry at the excuses made for perps. I dont think we should excuse them, but nor should we damage their bodies. "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone"........live by that, and soon it will become obvious that no-one is without sin.

Barbaric punishement will only lead to more trouble, and as those really intent on causing damage will find a way out of any situation they get caught in, then we will never be able to appropriately punish those who are so coldly evil it defies logic.What makes a person act out on the dark fantasies that nearly everyone harbours (and yes, they do, i.e. being your 16 century masters sex slave, killing your boss, being tied up and shagged for hours, punching people because your angry, setting thinngs on fire etc) is a mystery. We can speculae all we want, all that remains is that for some reason these very angry people can't stop. They lose sight of right and wrong. Its them, their ego, their rage and their plans. How can making these deeply disturbed people any angrier make things better?

(sorry for the long post!!)

the_syco

Castration wouldn't make them less pissed off. I'd say it'd be the total opposite. If they were castrated, when they were released, they'd be pretty pissed off individuals. Sure, they may not be able to f*ck, but they'll be able to create hell.

naughty_girl wrote:

The revenge id be most happy with is something fair. say name them.

This happens already. And when its found out that she made it up, they're left with the tag, and the b|tch is never named.

=====

So testosterone is bad, hmmm? This seems to be what most of youse think. Seemingly, it has nothing with them being sick little mofo's.

Some say snip off a dogs balls, and he doesn't shag anymore. Well, he just can't, thats all. As for humans, they'll know why they don't feel any sexual tendecies, and they'd proberly feel one of either two feelings

a) worthlessness, and commit suicide.
b) anger, and track down the woman, and give her hell.

And if they were truely sick f*cks, it'd be B.

test999

Victor wrote:

Are you two getting off on this thread?

No.

And you may not like the idea of using a sword, how about using a surgical instrument? and not in a dramatic way?

I don't believe castration creates another kind of monster, and I am aware that it won't stop specific types of rape.

How many of you believe that rapists can be rehabilitated? I don't believe it's possible. So castration, by physical or chemical means is the first option.

If they rape again, you have two choices, a life time in prison or the death penalty.

Keeping people in prison is expensive, I don't want to have to pay for that, so I would offer two time rapists the lethal injection.

I am aware that this view may be too simplistic for some of you, or you may consider this post a troll. If that's your view, I suggest you read up on rape and the efficacy of rehabilitation, and how other countries deal with rapists.

And the name and shame idea is not going to work. These people have no shame. The damage being raped causes lasts a life time, naming the rapist for most people who have been raped wouldn't be enough.

pretty-in-pink

test999 wrote:

No.
And the name and shame idea is not going to work. These people have no shame. The damage being raped causes lasts a life time, naming the rapist for most people who have been raped wouldn't be enough.

Yes and No, the damage doesn't go away ,especially if it was a traumatic rape, the perpees' will always get flashbacks and remember the way she/he felt at the time of the attack/attacks. So in theory the persons life is "ruined".

However I feel that your life is not neccesarily ruined, tainted maybe, but if you are lucky then you can get over it, and have a normal life, with friends and a sexual partner, and have a family, even forgive. Now I'm not saying everyone can get over it, and I'm not saying its a good thing to happen to someone just cause it makes those who cope with the act and aftermath much stronger. Its a pardoxical situation, with the ones who pull through being a mixture of tough as nails, but fragile as a piece of cyrstal. Yes these people are more breakable on the one hand, but on the other hand they are far stronger, as they have lived through one of the most horrific experiences possible. That removes a lot of the fear, and there is nearly an acceptance of whatever their future might hold, no matter how bad - or good.

A lot of the victims come through with more grace, dignity and the ability to move on then the people who surrond them, the people closest to a victim, once they know about the attack seem to feel guilty, and freak out - wanting to extract revenge. 90% or more of the time this is not what the victim needs. They have to deal with their pain, the pain of anyone who knows, and the same for the anger factor. Except they also get to feel guilty not only about being so wholey invaded, but alos for making their friends and family so guilty, angry, shocked and sad.

More should be done to help out all parties, the perp, perpee ,the perpees close ones and the perps close ones. Crime affects more then the immediate perp and perpee, and anyone who can lash out so cruely at another human being is sick, and in need of help.

I also think that seeing the perp in rehab, and having to live with everyone knowing, evryday for the rest of their lives what they did wouldd be punishment enough. Like the song goes "needle broken, and the damage done, a little part of it in everyone"

Can you imagine having everyone know who you are, what you do/have done, all the details of your live before they meet you? Yes a fair amount of pereps are cold, callous, evil and sick. They might even thrive on having their kinsmen and countrymen being revulsed by them, but equally a lot of them are just stupid men and women who acted without thinking, who were drunk, angry, hurt, screwed up people- maybe even they too are/were perpees. To have everyone they ever met or will ever meet be disgusted by them, to have to look in the mirror knowing the gravity and sickness of their crime, to never be allowed leave the contry, to be under constant police survailence, to maybe never get married or have kids is a big price to pay, a fair price to pay.

The U.N might go on about "criminal rights", but everyone has rights, and I think the perpee(s) of each attacker should have a hand in the punishment, as they will be relitivly calmer then those close to them, and are less likely to say "oh look, broken home, no secondary education, drug addict, let them go".

Optikus

In a nutshell ..YES.

StRiKeR

they should be locked up for good, if you can do it the first time, they and all they get is a few yrs, they can do it again, its all in thier head, if they do it again and get away with it, they carry on doing it till they get lock up again, then out and do it again!

pretty much same as those sicko that sexually abuses children, read about them before, they get cought, convicted, when they out they do it again, even when they are not able to use there man hood, they are still at it, there are many of these cases around in this world!

test999

I just got negative reputation from "Fysh"...

From Fysh=What next, will you identify the rapist gene? Rape is an act committed by an individual. It isn't necessarily easy, but they can be re-conditioned not to do it. If they can't, I'd argue there's a mental deficiency involved at some stage.

Is that how the reputation system works? some child who doesn't like my position on a topic so they lash out and manically click the neg rep button?

I could point out to you Fysh, that your question about identifying the gene is supercilous and I could give you negative rep, but I'll be grown up about it (not to mention that my rep has no weight)

Rapists cannot be reconditioned like a faulty PC, so you'd argue there is a mental deficiency...
So, ho hum, rapists (very bad people that they are) couldn't possibly exist in a perfectly healthy way? What do you base that argument upon????????

A huge number of multiple rapists are of perfectly sound mind.

Fell free to post your reply here and not on my reputation, thank you.

MrPudding

MrNuked wrote:

The death penalty, and brutal physical penalties, would be strong deterrents.

Like it is the the States? Oh no actually it doesn't work there. Hmm, lik eit is in Saudi Arabia then, they are really brutal there. Ooops, it doesn't work there either. I can't think of anywhere the death penalty or brutal punishments work as a deterrent. Could you provide me with a link to show how you know they would be deterrents?

MrP