READ BEFORE POSTING OR YOU WILL BE BANNED

dogs

The Rules bit:

ALL* security related threads are welcome here. Really. You don't have to be ub3r-l337, you don't even have to be 1337. ANY* security related discussion is fine here. Tech support questions are not. This includes not knowing how to remove a virus from your computer, why Internet Explorer keeps loading webpages that you don't want, etc. In other words; you're posting because you have some problem you want fixed, not because you're interested in some aspect of security.
*Provided it complies with all rules written and unwritten of boards.ie and it's right-wing admins.

NO tech support requests.
NO what's the best spyware remover.
NO new anti-virus threads, you can see what's recommended and you can recommend your own here

We've had these threads already. The answers are always the same. Do your own homework.

If you'd like to make a guide to securing your operating system/access point/whatever of choice, great! Just start a new thread and if it's useful I'll make it sticky.

Post in this thread if you have any comments about how this forum is moderated.

end of rules bit


I like to think I've taken a pretty relaxed approach to modding this board, but things are going to have to change

This board was originally created as a place to discuss security; from new exploits to the privacy implications of particular technologies.

Lately it's become a tech support board and downright painful to read. While it's nice to see so many people willing to help, this is not the place.


To make myself clear, if you've got a virus or some spyware or you think your ISP is haxxing you with pings... don't post here. This isn't the place, contact tech support or try another board where it may be closer to the topic.

I think it's reasonable to say that the type of person posting here already knows how not to become overrun with spyware, they're pretty capable when it comes to patching their systems and generally they don't double click when their best friend mails them annakournikova-installs-unlicensed-solaris-naked.jpeg.pif

I'll leave this thread open for any suggestions you might have and, as always, if you think I'm being unfair you can contact the admins on the Feedback or Help boards.

From now, though, off-topic posts will be locked & recycled and off topic posters will just be recycled

chump

I must say I'm a bit disappointed with your attitude.
I remember the good old days when these boards were helpful (esp. back when they were pure quake boards) and any punter who had a problem however trivial (despite myabe being slagged off) was assisted and sent in the right direction.

The internet community seemed to enjoy helping people out, but instead you seem to have decided to run this board as YOU see fit without taking into consideration the security help this board could provide to users who may not be necessarily as wise as yourself.

Of course maybe you believe, being the MOD, that you may run it as you see fit and I suppose you may, but I think you're wrong.

Chump.

dahamsta

Most of the posts in question are Windows spyware/virus problems, I'm surprised you haven't just shoved them into the Windows forum; and you're welcome to start now. I'm overrun with the dopey little boll1xes anyway, another few won't hurt.

adam

RicardoSmith

Just put a sticky "Windows spyware/virus problems" or "Newbie questions" saying any questions of that sort, will get the author banned. Personally I would have assumed "Windows spyware/virus problems" were security issues still I read this thread. You could make it a private forum if annoys you that much.

dahamsta wrote:

...dopey little boll1xes....

Such community spirit is heart warming to read...

ecksor

Well, the board is somewhat diluted and painful to read for security discussion when every second thread is how to clean your PC for people who aren't quite sure how to properly use their computer. The windows mod agrees that they fit well into the windows forum so I don't see what the problem is or the complaints are about.

liamo

Totally agree. Security Board for Security Posts.

Liam

mneylon

Maybe a sub-forum for "basic" security "issues" might be a better compromise.
Shoving all the queries over to the windows' board isn't too fair on Adam, while leaving them here turns this board into something it was not meant to be.

chump

I agree that a compromise can be met, and that a few sticky's would solve most problems, but the attitude of just telling people where to go and threatening banning is a bit ridiculous.

A bit of decency is all that's needed.

ecksor

Repeatedly posting off-topic after a warning can potentially get you a banning from any forum. dogs is running this board as he sees fit, but quite frankly he's the one running it so how else would he run it? It isn't like boards is clamping down on the discussion altogether, since we've identified somewhere where those posts are on-topic.

Your post about "The good old days when they were pure quake boards" makes me wonder if you're the reincarnation of someone we banned before btw.

dogs

chump wrote:

I must say I'm a bit disappointed with your attitude.
I remember the good old days when these boards were helpful (esp. back when they were pure quake boards) and any punter who had a problem however trivial (despite myabe being slagged off) was assisted and sent in the right direction.

Hmm, so what you're saying is that my approach so far has been wrong ? That asking for feedback and giving plenty of notice is too much to ask of people ? Boards.ie has a pretty strong community, with a lot of intelligent and helpful people; that still doesn't make it acceptable to post your favourite knock-knock jokes on the Boards Events board.

If the Windows mod is happy to take these threads that's fine with me, it's not my intention to stop people getting help but the Security board was never intended to be first-line tech support.

Security board for security discussion, that's it. If that's a problem I'm sure the boards.ie admins will correct me.

dahamsta

dogs wrote:

If the Windows mod is happy to take these threads that's fine with me

No worries.

Cake Fiend

Thumbs up, Dogs. Having to filter through the several moronic posts about <insert worm here> makes me sick to my ass.

damnyanks

Thats fine run it that way. The forum will probably die off soon enough then look at the posts in the last 90 days do you see many posts related to what you want? A warning to newer posters about whats acceptable is a step in the right direction

ecksor

damnyanks wrote:

The forum will probably die off soon enough then look at the posts in the last 90 days do you see many posts related to what you want?

Irrelevant noise is discouraging to people who want to post on-topic threads and discouraging to people who might answer on-topic threads because they get sick of coming back. It used to be that relevant threads used to find their way onto the Unix or Programming or less often the Technology forums, perhaps that's still going on, I don't know. If the overall traffic to the forum is reduced, then so be it but the current situation isn't good and it just sorta creeped into that situation.

RicardoSmith

Sico wrote:

Thumbs up, Dogs. Having to filter through the several moronic posts about <insert worm here> makes me sick to my ass.

What a weird comment.

ecksor

At least it wasn't superfluous.

chump

Dogs: Hmm, so what you're saying is that my approach so far has been wrong ? That asking for feedback and giving plenty of notice is too much to ask of people ?

All I'm saying is, I stumbled across a problem on my computer that I thought may be security related. I like boards.ie, so I thought, hell let's ask the security board folk - and so I did.
And so I asked and some people replied with help, I soon solved the problem and what then you respond with a completely up-your-arse comment...
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=178401

And I just think from reading some of the other posts and seeing your approach to other trivial issues - I've concluded that you have a bad attitude.

Fair enough if you don't want these issues discussed, give the person whose just posted their first message on the forum a pointer in the right direction, tell them in a decent manner that maybe they should read the stickies and wish them a bit of luck.

Dogs: that still doesn't make it acceptable to post your favourite knock-knock jokes on the Boards Events board.

Gee, what a comparison! You're comparing someone posting a topic on a Security board about trying to save their computer from a worm or some such to posting an irrelevant post on the wrong board!

ecksor: Your post about "The good old days when they were pure quake boards" makes me wonder if you're the reincarnation of someone we banned before btw.

Afraid that's not me good sir! I don't think I'd be bothered going off and registering a new nick and all that business to post on this board.

I understand that a certain amount of snobbery and intolerance should be expected from some of the EXPERTS and directed towards "newbies" and general computer virgins - it's just the way some technical people are... but I don't think it should be a policy

ecksor

chump wrote:

All I'm saying is, I stumbled across a problem on my computer that I thought may be security related. I like boards.ie, so I thought, hell let's ask the security board folk - and so I did.

In future try thinking something like this:

"By gum, there's something wrong with my computer and I don't have the foggiest what that is. Gosh, I'd better not post on the Security forum as if it was some sort of a technical support forum, because it isn't."

chump wrote:

Gee, what a comparison! You're comparing someone posting a topic on a Security board about trying to save their computer from a worm or some such to posting an irrelevant post on the wrong board!

What part of this are you having trouble with?

chump wrote:

Afraid that's not me good sir! I don't think I'd be bothered going off and registering a new nick and all that business to post on this board.

You didn't exactly have the most comprehensive experience of what boards was like as a pure quake board then.

chump

nice response ecksor!

I like this bit especially...

You didn't exactly have the most comprehensive experience of what boards was like as a pure quake board then.

I dare say I haven't a notion what you're talking about.
Anyway I don't really want to continue with this inane discussion. I think the points I made were fairly valid, or at the very least a valid opinion.

I'm disappointed you don't agree with me, but I'll grow and learn.
Best of luck!

Cabaal

chump wrote:

I dare say I haven't a notion what you're talking about.

boards used to be a quake discussion forum,
nothing like what you see today....

ecksor

I think he knows that, he was the one who brought it up in his first post.

dogs

*shakes Iron Fist of Repression*

secret_squirrel

If adam is fine to take the trivial posts then why not show a bit of tolerance and move the thread to the windows forum rather than banning them. It wouldnt be any more effort. The PI mods have to deal with far more off topic posts and they dont have any problem moving them rather than banning.
I think this kind of elitism belongs in the dark ages of the internet or obscure irc channels tbh.

ecksor

secret_squirrel wrote:

If adam is fine to take the trivial posts then why not show a bit of tolerance and move the thread to the windows forum rather than banning them.

It wasn't getting the message across.

secret_squirrel

ecksor wrote:

It wasn't getting the message across.

Fair enough then didnt realise moving had already been tried. Still a bit of a shock to see a ban like in the free anti virus thread, if you're not expecting it. Kinda contrary to the general noob friendly nature of board imo but each to their own. thanks for the clarification.

dogs

There are several threads with the "Moved:" icon beside them.

There's a stickied post at the top of the board saying "READ BEFORE POSTING OR YOU MAY BE BANNED".

It's hardly a subtle hint that, perhaps, before hitting the New Thread button you might need to spend a minute or two familiarising yourself with the purpose of the board. I don't think this is any different from asking people not to post in all caps, etc -- just basic netiquette.

How many "what's the best free anti-virus for windows" threads do we need ?

I don't like elitist attitudes either; there's nothing worse than a condescending mod, but is it too much to ask a new user spend 30 seconds reading before posting ?

secret_squirrel

Again dont disagree with that but bear in mind that ppl posting replys may have done nothing worse than use the 'New Posts' link. Good luck to ya.

dogs

Nobody was banned for replying to an off-topic thread. Nobody will be "punished"* for being helpful.


*unless they do something that would normally get them banned.

Blub2k4

Of course discussing security issues such as spyware and viruses are not 1337 h4Xor material but they are still security issues. Perhaps you should change the title of the forum to 52curi7y f0rU|\/| that way people will know what type of posts you want here.

dogs

Security discussion, not tech support.

It really is that easy.


Edit; I'll bite:

Blub2k4 wrote:

Of course discussing security issues such as spyware and viruses are not 1337 h4Xor material but they are still security issues.

Spyware and virii are security issues, yes. Four "What's the best free antivirus software for Windows" threads aren't. Similarly, the process of removing spyware from an infected PC isn't either.

Sure, it's quite interesting exploring what lengths malware will go to to prevent its removal but these threads don't discuss that.

Restricting repeat postings of questions that have already been answered, in detail, and could just as easily be answered with a quick Google search doesn't limit this board to 0-day hax0r discussion. Even at that, if you do have a problem with your computer there are a lot more appropriate boards with lots of friendly people ready to help. The Security board is for security discussion, for people who don't want to read the same tech support threads daily.


That people have gotten two pages through this thread and still don't understand this is beyond me.

mneylon

dogs wrote:

Security discussion, not tech support.

It really is that easy.

For you maybe, but not end luser who has managed to get their pc infected with the latest M$ virus.

dahamsta

blacknight wrote:

For you maybe, but not end luser who has managed to get their pc infected with the latest M$ virus.

Careful now Michele, the lusers get fierce upset when you diss them, and start doling out bad rep. I nearly cried that day. *sob*

Zico

I'll be sure not to ask anyones advice on anything I'm not 110% sure is security related. I see your point though, I can imagine it must get annoying if the same issues are being raised over and over on numerous threads.

Tazz T

Methinks apart from 'what's the best antivirus product to use against (deleted)' this is gonna be a very quiet area of the board in future.

dogs

Tazz T wrote:

Methinks apart from 'what's the best antivirus product to use against (deleted)' this is gonna be a very quiet area of the board in future.

Yes. You win the special prize. Hooray for missing the point!

SPOOONS!

condra

dogs you seem to enjoy your little bit of virtual authority but thankfully it probably doesnt extend to the real world. [thats the place outside this screen]

Boards and forums are best when somebody can post a question that has been asked before and still get a helpfull reply or even a reference without being shouted at or patronised by someone who spends too much time in the Forum.

Theres nothing more disguisting than a mod on a power trip. Learn to take critism and listen to the people youre supposed to be helping.

ecksor

womoma wrote:

dogs you seem to enjoy your little bit of virtual authority but thankfully it probably doesnt extend to the real world. [thats the place outside this screen]

Are you being deliberately ironic when you complain about dogs being patronising?

Boards and forums are best when somebody can post a question that has been asked before and still get a helpfull reply or even a reference without being shouted at or patronised by someone who spends too much time in the Forum.

What does this have to do with anything? Posts should be on-topic. Many types of posts have been clearly stated to not be on-topic (but they are on-topic on other boards forums).

Theres nothing more disguisting than a mod on a power trip. Learn to take critism and listen to the people youre supposed to be helping.

Who is he supposed to be helping? This isn't a technical support forum if that's what you mean.

dogs

womoma wrote:

dogs you seem to enjoy your little bit of virtual authority but thankfully it probably doesnt extend to the real world. [thats the place outside this screen]

womoma wrote:

Boards and forums are best when somebody can post a question that has been asked before and still get a helpfull reply or even a reference without being shouted at or patronised by someone who spends too much time in the Forum.

So lots of repeat threads about the same off-topic topic are a good thing and essential to any forum ? Thanks for the top tip!

womoma wrote:

Theres nothing more disguisting than a mod on a power trip. Learn to take critism and listen to the people youre supposed to be helping.

If I really didn't want to listen to the nay-sayers of my empire I could lock this thread on a mere whim. Now prostrate yourself and beg for mercy!

Besides, the people I'm supposed to be helping are the people who would like to read this board daily but find it painful to do so because of the amount of off-topic posts (that could be answered with 20 seconds of effort and google).

dahamsta

Perhaps if you renamed the title to something more explicit, like "REPORT WINDOWS PROBLEMS IN WINDOWS FORUM"? Alternatively, create a "Windows Problems" subforum and use vBulletin's forum redirect facility to push them off there automatically.

The current solution certainly isn't working for you anyway, and banning every TD&H that comes in here isn't really solving anything (bar the feelgood factor).

adam

Gilgamesh

with this policy, why not just close security completely.

I mean, having a virus on the machine, what doesn't have a Antivirus software is a security related issue, if that person asks which software he could use to see what it going on, I wouldn't consider that tech support.
Then again, EVERYTHING security related is tech support, to a certain extent.
If someone asks which protocol needs to be enable for emails to go out, you are allready giving technical support.

I could only recommend the following as bannings and closing is going to give this forum a bad rep imho.

Create Stickys for the stupid questions like' what is the best AV Software', and include a Poll in for the most commonly mentioned AV solutions, and also create stickys for other things, like.
'THE TEN COMMENDMENTS FOR SECURING WINDOWS!!!'
then place the 'install Linux' in first place and 'Use Firefox' in second, as an example, or even update you windows frequently.

Man, it is easy enough to do this, and I think it will be a bit of work at first to get this together, but hey, in the long run, you won't be alienating n00bs and regulars from the thread.

Oooohhhh Look at me... I am new and have a problem..... whicih AV software shall I use????....... (MOD looks down on him and n00b cowers) ...... DIE YOU PLAGUE MWHAHAHAHA......

doesn't make good reputation.


I think this can be treated a lot better than this ruling, which, in my opinion is close to bullying

dogs

Gilgamesh wrote:

with this policy, why not just close security completely.

Then what would I do with my free time ?

I mean, having a virus on the machine, what doesn't have a Antivirus software is a security related issue, if that person asks which software he could use to see what it going on, I wouldn't consider that tech support.

From what I can piece together from your assorted collection of words, you have a pet that's ill ?

Then again, EVERYTHING security related is tech support, to a certain extent.

No, it's not.

If someone asks which protocol needs to be enable for emails to go out, you are allready giving technical support.

Yes, and that indeed is technical support and is off-topic.

Create Stickys for the stupid questions like' what is the best AV Software', and include a Poll in for the most commonly mentioned AV solutions, and also create stickys for other things, like.
'THE TEN COMMENDMENTS FOR SECURING WINDOWS!!!'
then place the 'install Linux' in first place and 'Use Firefox' in second, as an example, or even update you windows frequently.

Man, it is easy enough to do this, and I think it will be a bit of work at first to get this together, but hey, in the long run, you won't be alienating n00bs and regulars from the thread.

By all means, if you create the threads I'll make them sticky.

dogs

dahamsta wrote:

Perhaps if you renamed the title to something more explicit, like "REPORT WINDOWS PROBLEMS IN WINDOWS FORUM"? Alternatively, create a "Windows Problems" subforum and use vBulletin's forum redirect facility to push them off there automatically.

Interesting, I didn't know about that vBulletin feature, I'll have a word with ecksor and see what he thinks. I have no problem changing this threads title but if people don't read it now I'm not sure they'll read it regardless of what I set it to.

The current solution certainly isn't working for you anyway, and banning every TD&H that comes in here isn't really solving anything (bar the feelgood factor).

Definitely, it made a little improvement initially but those gains seem to have gone now. Banning people is not an ideal soloution, the ban is really just to get their attention and as soon as I get a reply PM saying "oops, my bad" I'll lift it. Sometimes this happens in under 10 minutes -- but these people are unlikely to post a thread here again even if it is on topic .

Keyzer

Why don't you put forward the idea of having a dedicated tech support sub-section under the comp topic, because as it is if someone has a problem with any aspect of computers and need help they'll check the available sections, and post in the appropriate (or closest too) thread.
Example being, I posted a question a while back (which you banned me for, thanks for that) in relation to opening ports or something. It was security related so I posted it in here.
Seeing as you don't want any tech support questions in here, why not have a brand new tech support section setup.

This site is a great resource for people who aren't computer savvy or for someone who has a weird/obscure problem, therefore I think its a shame not too have a collective resource available for people to post in.

Also, your attitude stinks....

Static M.e.

Could create another sub section under "Comp" called "General Security" and rename "Security" to "Secuity Discussion" or something.

Just a random thought, might clear the whole thing up for people who dont know what the board is about.

At least it would be blatently obvious to anyone then at least and also other people would have a place to ask their questions about
"what is the best antivirus today then?" all they want and fear being banned.

Couple of stickies thrown up would answer most questions and I wouldn't think it would require that much modding.

Might work

dogs

Keyzer wrote:

Why don't you put forward the idea of having a dedicated tech support sub-section under the comp topic

Why would I be doing this ? You are completely free to suggest this here.

dogs

Static M.e. wrote:

Could create another sub section under "Comp" called "General Security" and rename "Security" to "Secuity Discussion" or something.
...
Couple of stickies thrown up would answer most questions and I wouldn't think it would require that much modding.

Then suggest it I don't want to mod a tech support board so I'm not going to suggest one.

Static M.e.

Ok done and done ,

just made a quick reponse, leaving work at the moment will check back later tonight.

thebutlerdidit

Despite the gentle tirade at the beginning of this thread about staying on topic and not having it full of non related BS was the idea of this thread not to discuss security ideas?? Why not just call this thread "lets give out about NEWBIES" have you discussed even one new security idea? no. instead its turned into a debate over what gets posted here.....

ecksor

thebutlerdidit wrote:

Despite the gentle tirade at the beginning of this thread about staying on topic and not having it full of non related BS was the idea of this thread not to discuss security ideas??

Incorrect. I don't know where you got that idea from.

Why not just call this thread "lets give out about NEWBIES" have you discussed even one new security idea? no. instead its turned into a debate over what gets posted here.....

The nature of posts on this forum is exactly the point of this thread.

sauv

hey guys, maybe this is a stupid qustion but where is the tech support forum??

Static M.e.

sauv

There is no dedicated Tech Support forum but if you have a tech problem most people post it under

Comp --> Computers / Technology

or if its windows based under

Comp ---> Operating System ---> Windows