MayDay DISGRACE!!!

Spacedog

I can only be held responsable for my own actions, as can anyone, how can the organisers be held responsable for yobs who happen to show up? it's like blaming the sports clubs for soccer riots?

seamus

Originally posted by Spacedog
I can only be held responsable for my own actions, as can anyone, how can the organisers be held responsable for yobs who happen to show up? it's like blaming the sports clubs for soccer riots?

Which does happen...
IIRC a few football clubs have been fined over the behaviour of their fans.

If you organise an event, then you're responsible for who shows up. It's pretty simple.

I can only be held responsable for my own actions, as can anyone, how can the organisers be held responsable for yobs who happen to show up? it's like blaming the sports clubs for soccer riots?

Of course they're responsible. They're calling for large crowds to come to an area and then speak about things that they are passionate about. Who else is responsible? (Apparently, we're all responsible for each others actions, as i've found out recently here)

Hardly the police forces, since you're so determined to blame them for any violence that occurs. Then who else? Each individual? Sounds nice but its unrealistic. If these people wish to organise these protests they should provide their own security to prevent violence, otherwise all they're doing is passing the buck.

bobbyjoe

Ehh check out what happened in Gothenburg and Genoa when the same groups of people got together to "protest".

Genoa had 250,000 marchers, Dublin is expecting between 1 to 5 thousand. There will probably be more cops than protestors.

Why? Because they're showing a part of the protest that you haven't restrained? You need to organise these protests properly, otherwise its your fault if violence or such occurs. The Gardai are not to blamed for stopping the chaos u create.

So a thousand people can march peacefully and one drunk,who is not part of the march is used to represent it on TV. Thats an accurate representation of what happened?
People were actualy telling him to shut up but he wouldn't, also he was shouting etc but not violent.

Don't believe the hype!!!!

Hope its as sunny as today.

Spacedog

Originally posted by seamus
Which does happen...
IIRC a few football clubs have been fined over the behaviour of their fans.

If you organise an event, then you're responsible for who shows up. It's pretty simple.

Football clubs charge people to for tickets who come to games and use a minimal amount of profits on security. as the organisers are non profit organisations they spend 100% of their profits on securing protests (€0)

Yet when football riots breakout, the police don't go charging into the crowd of passive footy fans there to see the game with their serial numbers missing? if I am protesting peacefilly I expect the police to protect me, a citizen of this fine country, and not to be sprayed with a water cannon.

seamus

Originally posted by bobbyjoe
People were actualy telling him to shut up but he wouldn't, also he was shouting etc but not violent.

Don't believe the hype!!!!

You have to give people more credit than believing that they think this drunk is part of the norm. The media showed him purely for the comedy value.

Yet when football riots breakout, the police don't go charging into the crowd of passive footy fans there to see the game with their serial numbers missing? if I am protesting peacefilly I expect the police to protect me, a citizen of this fine country, and not to be sprayed with a water cannon.

The incident with the Gardai is being investigated and is certanily not the norm. It's not admissable as why the Gardai are 'bad men'. If you don't want to be sprayed with the cannon, walk away if any violence breaks out.

Simple.

bobbyjoe

You have to give people more credit than believing that they think this drunk is part of the norm. The media showed him purely for the comedy value.

There were plenty of other things to film for comic value, people dressed up, Down with this sort of thing signs etc.

All that was shown was this couple of second clip of that eejit.
For anyone who hadn't been there, this would have been the soundbite impression they were given.

Yet when football riots breakout, the police don't go charging into the crowd of passive footy fans there to see the game with their serial numbers missing? if I am protesting peacefilly I expect the police to protect me, a citizen of this fine country, and not to be sprayed with a water cannon.

If you are indeed protesting peacefully then yes i agree. But I've heard of incidents where Gardai have taken violent protestors (who were damaging property) into Paddy-wagons, and many protestors surrounding that wagon turned nasty, including assaulting both Gardai and the wagon itself. Do you not agree that protestors that act like this should be put down and put down fast?

People were actualy telling him to shut up but he wouldn't, also he was shouting etc but not violent.

I think people are more worried abt violence than a peaceful, but loud mouthed drunk.

If you don't want to be sprayed with the cannon, walk away if any violence breaks out.

Damn Right.

Redleslie

Originally posted by seamus
If you don't want to be sprayed with the cannon, walk away if any violence breaks out.

Yes, at previous protests the heroic police never battered, teargassed or watercannoned anyone except carefully targeted brick and stick wielding baddies.

And people say anarchists are stupid and naive....:rolleyes:

Simple.

But very wrong.

Yes, at previous protests the heroic police never battered, teargassed or watercannoned anyone except carefully targeted brick and stick wielding baddies

Water cannons aren't very precise weapons so of course some people will be hit that are not involved. Also generally there'll be a crowd around when violence occurs. Unfortuently theres a mentality that goes with crowds, to be curious and want to know whats going on. Back away, and move away from the trouble, and you would have been fine. Let me guess, you went over for a peak to see who was causing the trouble?

And people say anarchists are stupid and naive....

Glad to see you're admitting it. And yes, I am being obtuse. But please, grow up, if you believe that the Police forcebly dispersing a crowd thats causing trouble shouldn't happen.

Victor

Originally posted by seamus
IIRC a few football clubs have been fined over the behaviour of their fans.

Presumably based on the contract they have with their Football Association, not under criminal law.

seamus

Originally posted by Redleslie

Yes, at previous protests the heroic police never battered, teargassed or watercannoned anyone except carefully targeted brick and stick wielding baddies.

And people say anarchists are stupid and naive....:rolleyes:

But very wrong. [/B]

Watercannons and tear gas (which I don't think they use in Ireland) are crowd dispersal and riot control mechanisms rather than strategic aiming weapons, as klaz points out. Perfectly reasonable to affect a handful of non-violent people in a non-dangerous way to ensure the safety of everyone. As I said, if you walk away as soon as anybody starts throwing stuff then you won't be affected. If you stand around while other people are throwing stuff instead of running away, you can hardly complain when you get affected by water cannons or smack over the head from a baton.

ferdi

will micky ds be doing this?:





i wish i didnt have an exam on mayday:(


as soon as iget out i will bejoining the party tho

ReefBreak

Originally posted by ferdi
will micky ds be doing this?:


i wish i didnt have an exam on mayday:(


as soon as iget out i will bejoining the party tho

I wish I was in the Riot Squad on monday. Crack some posh/hippy/commie heads.

Victor

Originally posted by seamus
If you stand around while other people are throwing stuff instead of running away, you can hardly complain when you get affected by water cannons or smack over the head from a baton.

Oh come on seamus. Are you saying random people should be attacked by gardaí for "stand(ing) around"?

ferdi

but your not....aw pure you:D

"posh hippy commie"

your grasp of socio-political devisions is amazing, you really dont have a clue, thats why your against it. when people dont understand something, theygeneral oppose it.

Oh come on seamus. Are you saying random people should be attacked by gardaí for "stand(ing) around"?

I think he's pointing out that if you hang around with troublemakers its quite easy to be called one yourself. If theres trouble happening, and you're just standing in close proximity, making no move to get away, its quite acceptable to count u in as being a troublemaker.

ReefBreak

Originally posted by ferdi
but your not....aw pure you:D

"posh hippy commie"

your grasp of socio-political devisions is amazing, you really dont have a clue, thats why your against it. when people dont understand something, theygeneral oppose it.

Yeah, of course - you're right. But at least I can spell.

socio-political devisions

A way of making something perfectly simple, as confusing and imposing as possible. Why not just call them class divisions? Or am I also confused?

Its just like economics, take something perfectly simple, then draw loads of confusing diagrams and then point to it and try to explain it again using the longest most complicated words possible.

ferdi

Originally posted by ReefBreak
Yeah, of course - you're right. But at least I can spell.

'yeah' is not a word.

however, i'm not that petty. you know someone has lost an argument when they point out the other persons grammar/spelling errors.

chabsey

The basic fact is that the majority of the television coverage (assuming there is trouble) will be of hippy-type/studenty type people getting into trouble...either innocently or via aggravating the situation. This is the way it's been for the last few summits and I'm sure it'll continue. As a direct result of this the majority of people watching these news reports (who don't care about the summit, don't give two squirrel's tosses about the peaceful protestors etc.) will come to the conclusion that these riots are incited by student/hippy types who like putting grass on Churchill's head and smashing windows.

I have to agree though, no better way to stamp out globablisation than to shake a car until it's alarm goes off, or even better, throw a rock through a window. Take that you globalisation window you!

After all, look at the huge difference the previous protests have made. The world landscape has changed as a direct result of the stones/paint that was throw. A little more of that attitude and they might even make God declare world peace....it's THAT effective.

chabsey

Originally posted by ferdi
'yeah' is not a word.

however, i'm not that petty. you know someone has lost an argument when they point out the other persons grammar/spelling errors.

LINK


However, yeahh (with two H's) is not a word....maybe that's what you were thinking of?


* Also yyeah and 123yeahttt333 are not words.

ferdi

yeah is a word like gotta is a word. dont trust online american dictionarys.

ReefBreak

Originally posted by ferdi
'yeah' is not a word.

however, i'm not that petty. you know someone has lost an argument when they point out the other persons grammar/spelling errors.

...And I was merely pointing out that if you're going to accuse anyone of opposing anything because you assume they don't understand it, i.e. are uneducated on the issue, then at least get your basic spelling and grammer right while you're doing it.

Oh and by the way, ."Yeah" is a word.

ferdi

see my last post.

i have no interest in a flame war.

ReefBreak

Originally posted by ferdi
yeah is a word like gotta is a word. dont trust online american dictionarys.

I assume you mean "dictionaries"? How about the Cambridge English Dictionary then: http://dictionary.cambridge.org/define.asp?key=91936&dict=CALD

Yeah?

ReefBreak

Originally posted by ferdi
see my last post.

i have no interest in a flame war.

If you don't want a flame war, then don't accuse a poster of being uneducated on an issue, while at the same time displaying the spelling and grammatical prowess of a 10 year-old.

ferdi

ok i'm wrong.

what is your point?


go do some charity work.

ReefBreak

Originally posted by ReefBreak
If you don't want a flame war, then don't accuse a poster of being uneducated on an issue, while at the same time displaying the spelling and grammatical prowess of a 10 year-old.

That was my point.

chabsey

you know someone has lost an argument when they point out the other persons grammar/spelling errors.

No, you know someone has lost an arguement when they say:

"I know you are, but what am I?"


over and over again. I hate it when that happens.