Kilkenny GAA Thread Part 3 MOD NOTE POST 1*

mountgomery burns · 03-06-2018 9:27am

Pigeon Chaser wrote: »

The Munster boys don't bother with defending at all.

I think we would beat any of them, even whilst "rebuilding"

To be honest, ye were lucky to beat Dublin and if ye hadn't ye'd be under big pressure even to get out of Leinster.

Would not have seen ye qualifying from Munster this year but that is just my opinion.

mullinr2 · 03-06-2018 10:00am

mountgomery burns wrote: »

To be honest, ye were lucky to beat Dublin and if ye hadn't ye'd be under big pressure even to get out of Leinster.

Would not have seen ye qualifying from Munster this year but that is just my opinion.

I would have to agree. Kilkenny would not get out of Munster this year the way that they are playing. Leinster championship has been really poor in terms of quality matches. No real flow to the games. Munster teams way ahead along with Galway.
I'd say it'll be another poor match next week with another high free count

dubcat51 · 03-06-2018 2:30pm

mullinr2 wrote: »

I would have to agree. Kilkenny would not get out of Munster this year the way that they are playing. Leinster championship has been really poor in terms of quality matches. No real flow to the games. Munster teams way ahead along with Galway.
I'd say it'll be another poor match next week with another high free count

have been hearing this rubbish for years even when we were winning everything in sight.lets see in august.

Powerhouse · 03-06-2018 3:01pm

dubcat51 wrote: »

have been hearing this rubbish for years even when we were winning everything in sight.lets see in august.

To be fair I doubt anyone claimed when Kilkenny were winning everything that they wouldn't be comfortably in the top three in Munster!!

But since you expect to have to wait until August too see you are fairly confident anyway, fair play! The only championship game in August in the All Ireland final!

dubcat51 · 03-06-2018 3:19pm

Powerhouse wrote: »

To be fair I doubt anyone claimed when Kilkenny were winning everything that they wouldn't be comfortably in the top three in Munster!!

But since you expect to have to wait until August too see you are fairly confident anyway, fair play! The only championship game in August in the All Ireland final!

What chance 2 leinster teams in the final since the all ireland champions and league champions play in leinster.

Powerhouse · 03-06-2018 5:17pm

dubcat51 wrote: »

What chance 2 leinster teams in the final since the all ireland champions and league champions play in leinster.

There's a very good chance two Leinster teams will meet in the All-Ireland final though you are reading too much into the League and the status as League winners as if it is somehow is equivalent to an All Ireland champion status. I said it here last April that people very overrating Tipperary and that I had them at number 3 in Munster. I revised that downwards on the basis of an atrocious performance in the League final. I was told that was "hilarious" and generally mocked over it but of course time has proven me correct. That team is finished and has been for a while.

I also predicted at the start that Kilkenny would contest an All Ireland semi-final (when others were talking about relegation) and lose to Cork (who I assumed would be Munster winners). I still think that's the most likely scenario but an all Leinster All Ireland final is not very unlikely. But I wouldn't go so far as to predict it like you are doing. I still think the top two in Munster will take a bit of beating. Certainly wouldn't be dismissing them like some here are doing.

dubcat51 · 03-06-2018 5:24pm

I personally wouldnt dismiss any team in this new structure

savannahkat · 03-06-2018 8:09pm

We are not comfortable at 3, 6, 8 and 11. Maher is the only midfielder who has pulled his weight and so far Leahy Fogarty and Fennelly have not stepped up to the mark. Padraigh and Cillian are playing out of position and suffering as a consequence. TJ is just not cutting it at center forward. It is the spine of our team that is not operating at anything like All Ireland challengers. During the league it was the spine that brought us success but it aint working in the increased intensity of championship. A full back line of Murphy Lennon Deegan with Delaney Walsh and Buckley fronting them (as some else has suggested) looks a lot more solid than the current positioning and I wonder how a fit Jason Cleere would go at centerfield. We have two games to sort things out so to me this new format has been a blessing in disguise for Kilkenny.

dubcat51 · 03-06-2018 9:04pm

Low attendances in munster no hawk eye in most grounds and some teams playing 3/4 weeks in a row where others dont(not everything about new system is great.)

eigrod · 03-06-2018 9:10pm

dubcat51 wrote: »

Low attendances in munster no hawk eye in most grounds and some teams playing 3/4 weeks in a row where others dont(not everything about new system is great.)

There were 35,000 in Pairc Uí Chaoimh last night. Cumulatively, the attendances will be far more than a knockout Munster Championship, so the GAA will be happy with that.

brookville · 03-06-2018 9:11pm

it'll be intresting to see how things go from here and will cody change things.
padraig has struggled in the first two matches but its unlikely his going to change him now.Id have delaney as best of the next but he'll probably use this year to get experience into him before trying him at 3.
The way i see it alot of the trouble is starting with our half foward line which has struggled badly resulting in our full back line being under pressure.We were cleaned out against dublin and galway and if hogan is fit id start him at 11 and tj and wally on the wings and colin at 14 with scanlon and donnelly.
Buckley has to hold the middle and while keaney and canning drifted off him and got 4 points off him its up to the lads around him to drop back and help him but his distribution has being poor but like the padraig issue who else have we got better at 6 that we can trust?
Its grand saying move this lad here and there but whos better? lennon is to slow and o shea out of favour,joe lyng not long back from study and cleere must be injured,conor browne not ready yet.

Powerhouse · 03-06-2018 9:45pm

brookville wrote: »

it'll be intresting to see how things go from here and will cody change things.

Agreed. I think one of the most interesting things in the hurling championship over the next few years will be how Brian Cody performs in the context of Galway. Kilkenny will probably meet them in the Leinster final and maybe the All Ireland final too. Galway look a fair bit ahead of them on the basis of their previous game and it will be fascinating to see how Kilkenny close the gap. Kilkenny spent many years repeatedly beating the same teams. Can they do anything to prevent themselves becoming Galway's victims in the same way over the next year or two? Under the new system they will meet them regularly and the response will be interesting.

mullinr2 · 03-06-2018 9:56pm

Powerhouse wrote: »

Agreed. I think one of the most interesting things in the hurling championship over the next few years will be how Brian Cody performs in the context of Galway. Kilkenny will probably meet them in the Leinster final and maybe the All Ireland final too. Galway look a fair bit ahead of them on the basis of their previous game and it will be fascinating to see how Kilkenny close the gap. Kilkenny spent many years repeatedly beating the same teams. Can they do anything to prevent themselves becoming Galway's victims in the same way over the next year or two? Under the new system they will meet them regularly and the response will be interesting.

Ur fairly confident we can beat Wexford. I wouldn't be as confident after our first 3 games. Maybe All Ireland? We will be nowhere near All Ireland final

Nonoperational · 03-06-2018 9:59pm

Powerhouse wrote: »

Agreed. I think one of the most interesting things in the hurling championship over the next few years will be how Brian Cody performs in the context of Galway. Kilkenny will probably meet them in the Leinster final and maybe the All Ireland final too. Galway look a fair bit ahead of them on the basis of their previous game and it will be fascinating to see how Kilkenny close the gap. Kilkenny spent many years repeatedly beating the same teams. Can they do anything to prevent themselves becoming Galway's victims in the same way over the next year or two? Under the new system they will meet them regularly and the response will be interesting.

Kilkenny are miles away from an AI final at the moment.

blackcard · 03-06-2018 10:11pm

Nonoperational wrote: »

Kilkenny are miles away from an AI final at the moment.

We don't have the players at the moment to score enough from open play. I agree that we are nowhere near good enough to get anywhere near an AI. I would rank us around seventh or eight in the country at the moment.

dubcat51 · 03-06-2018 11:04pm

Think were much better than 7/8 team in the country.with richie back walter tj cloin ger awlyard etc I think we xan beat anyone on our day.we have pedigree that alot of the others dont have.lim cork clare waterford and even cork (not won since 06)all have potential but they all have failed to fullfill their potential(know clare won in 13)I would still fancy us against any of rhem.

The growler · 03-06-2018 11:10pm

dubcat51 wrote: »

Think were much better than 7/8 team in the country.

Joe McDonagh teams yes

Powerhouse · 04-06-2018 9:01am

blackcard wrote: »

We don't have the players at the moment to score enough from open play. I agree that we are nowhere near good enough to get anywhere near an AI. I would rank us around seventh or eight in the country at the moment.

The problem with ranking Kilkenny 8th in the country is that assuming them to be the second best team in Leinster it means that there are six teams outside Leinster who would beat them which means that you are saying they wouldn't win the Joe MacDonagh cup! Obviously that makes no sense.

Whatever notional ranking Kilkenny are given here's the reality. Worst case scenario Kilkenny (irrespective of how they do against Wexford) are one game away from an All Ireland semi-final (even losing to Wexford, which I don't expect they are in an All Ireland QF anyway). If they beat Wexford (even if they subsequently lost to Galway) they would play the third team in Munster and have a really good chance of winning that game.

Whatever notional ranking we give Kilkenny the point I made here last February still stands i.e. that they probably should reach an All Ireland semi final at least not because they are great but because the format of the competition protects them from a lot of the teams who are potentially better. To be honest about it the Leinster championship and the standard of the teams in it given the one of them was Offaly and another Dublin (albeit much better than expected as it turned out) more or less guaranteed a lot of progress in the championship for Kilkenny.

Of course whether getting to the last four in the championship necessarily makes you one of the best four teams in another discussion (Tipperary got there for the last four years and have 0 wins from 3 games this year) but it's hard to imagine when people look back on the year that Kilkenny will be seventh or eighth in the rankings.

Powerhouse · 04-06-2018 9:12am

dubcat51 wrote: »

Think were much better than 7/8 team in the country.with richie back walter tj cloin ger awlyard etc I think we xan beat anyone on our day.we have pedigree that alot of the others dont have.lim cork clare waterford and even cork (not won since 06)all have potential but they all have failed to fullfill their potential(know clare won in 13)I would still fancy us against any of rhem.

It would have been interesting to see how Kilkenny would fare with a programme of games like Waterford or Tipperary where they had to play these teams home and away week in week out four weeks in a row. In a one-off game in Croke Park things will indeed be tight between them and Croke Park experience will give Kilkenny some benefit.

But no harm to remember as you mention pedigree that Kilkenny have lost their last championship games to three Munster counties and got a fair game from Limerick last year and Limerick have improved too. Clare have given Kilkenny huge problems in League matches in recent years as well. I doubt if any of those counties would worry about Kilkenny's pedigree at this point. At this stage only Limerick of the top other seven counties have lost to Kilkenny the last time they played them in the championship in recent years (Clare haven't played them in years) - Cork, Tipperary, Galway, Wexford and Waterford have all done them. Pedigree didn't save them in those games and will count for little. Younger Kilkenny lads, for example, would be going up against many guys far more successful at underage than they have been.

dubcat51 · 04-06-2018 10:47am

Tipp in 16 cork in 13 or should I say barry kelly and waterford in x tra time last year have beaten us since 06.how nany times have we beaten thise teams in that time.clare in the league cause us problems but we beat them come championship .as for linerick I was at the game in 73 (never forget the rain)when we lost(havent lost to them since.As for wexford and galway our record against them speaks for itself.maybe they wont worry about us but we certaintly wont fear any of them.

Powerhouse · 04-06-2018 12:07pm

dubcat51 wrote: »

Tipp in 16 cork in 13 or should I say barry kelly and waterford in x tra time last year have beaten us since 06.how nany times have we beaten thise teams in that time.clare in the league cause us problems but we beat them come championship .as for linerick I was at the game in 73 (never forget the rain)when we lost(havent lost to them since.As for wexford and galway our record against them speaks for itself.maybe they wont worry about us but we certaintly wont fear any of them.

I've never put any heed in this "we don't fear them" mullarkey. It's funny how you never hear that in any other sport.

Your point was about Kilkenny having "pedigree" as if this somehow mattered. It doesn't. Kilkenny have lost their last championship games against nearly all counties they are likely to meet from now on so any sense that "pedigree" somehow matters is deluded. None of these young players care what happened in 1973 or 1952.

blackcard · 04-06-2018 12:21pm

Powerhouse wrote: »

The problem with ranking Kilkenny 8th in the country is that assuming them to be the second best team in Leinster it means that there are six teams outside Leinster who would beat them which means that you are saying they wouldn't win the Joe MacDonagh cup! Obviously that makes no sense.

Whatever notional ranking Kilkenny are given here's the reality. Worst case scenario Kilkenny (irrespective of how they do against Wexford) are one game away from an All Ireland semi-final (even losing to Wexford, which I don't expect they are in an All Ireland QF anyway). If they beat Wexford (even if they subsequently lost to Galway) they would play the third team in Munster and have a really good chance of winning that game.

Whatever notional ranking we give Kilkenny the point I made here last February still stands i.e. that they probably should reach an All Ireland semi final at least not because they are great but because the format of the competition protects them from a lot of the teams who are potentially better. To be honest about it the Leinster championship and the standard of the teams in it given the one of them was Offaly and another Dublin (albeit much better than expected as it turned out) more or less guaranteed a lot of progress in the championship for Kilkenny.

Of course whether getting to the last four in the championship necessarily makes you one of the best four teams in another discussion (Tipperary got there for the last four years and have 0 wins from 3 games this year) but it's hard to imagine when people look back on the year that Kilkenny will be seventh or eighth in the rankings.

Dublin should have beaten Kilkenny if they converted their frees. Wexford have performed better in the championship than we have. So seventh, eight or indeed ninth is a reasonable assessment

dubcat51 · 04-06-2018 2:14pm

Powerhouse wrote: »

I've never put any heed in this "we don't fear them" mullarkey. It's funny how you never hear that in any other sport.

Your point was about Kilkenny having "pedigree" as if this somehow mattered. It doesn't. Kilkenny have lost their last championship games against nearly all counties they are likely to meet from now on so any sense that "pedigree" somehow matters is deluded. None of these young players care what happened in 1973 or 1952.

Well we will see going forward.waterford in 16 a good example of pedigree.when they saw the winning line they retreated while ours kept doing what they do.anyway we will see.

Powerhouse · 04-06-2018 2:43pm

dubcat51 wrote: »

Well we will see going forward.waterford in 16 a good example of pedigree.when they saw the winning line they retreated while ours kept doing what they do.anyway we will see.

Yeah, but why didn't the same thing happen to Waterford in '17 then? Pedigree hadn't changed one iota. Likewise Galway beat Kilkenny comfortably recently despite having a poor record against them in the past decade or so, one win in the previous 12 matches I think it was. They were just much better.

If Kilkenny do as well as you say they will then they'll do it for good solid technical hurling reasons and not because of what happened in the mists of time. There are guys hurling in this year's championship too young to remember 2006 never mind be psychologically affected by what Kilkenny did back then.

Powerhouse · 04-06-2018 2:45pm

blackcard wrote: »

Dublin should have beaten Kilkenny if they converted their frees. Wexford have performed better in the championship than we have. So seventh, eight or indeed ninth is a reasonable assessment

I think you are trying too hard now. Better if it appears natural and believable.

blackcard · 04-06-2018 4:32pm

Powerhouse wrote: »

I think you are trying too hard now. Better if it appears natural and believable.

So where would you rank KK?

dubcat51 · 04-06-2018 5:08pm

Kk have to be top 4.winners in 14 and 15 beaten in 16 knocked out in xtra time by beaten 17 finalists league winners in 18 by any ranking judgement were in the top
2 or 3.championship will go back to old format from quarter finals on.

Powerhouse · 04-06-2018 5:39pm

blackcard wrote: »

So where would you rank KK?

top 5 definitely. top 4 probably. i predicted in January that theyd be beaten all ireland semi finalists and have seen nothing to change that so far. but unless they improve they are vulnerable in a quarter final too.

brookville · 04-06-2018 5:51pm

anyone attend the under 21 match today against waterford or how did it go?

i just seen kk won by two points im sure management wont be happy to concede 4 goals so work to do there but good to see young tommy walsh back and scoring a point.

Village87 · 05-06-2018 10:49am

The Munster Championship is a great spectacle. About time Derek Mcgrath played 15 on 15 with Waterford, they could be a match for anyone playing like that with the 4/5 top players to come back.They stumbled across an excellent full back in Conor Gleeson . 2 fumbled balls by Brick Walsh & Austin Gleeson cost them big time.

Munster championship has been top drawer stuff, really exciting. Leinster championship has been awful viewing so far apart from the first game. Wexford have been disappointing and offer very little really. Davy will have to change is out of date tactics. Great to see the traditional hurling prevail.

minty81 · 05-06-2018 10:59am

Is it true kk were given the weekend off from training? Good idea if true, sometimes less is more

Village87 · 05-06-2018 11:21am

minty81 wrote: »

Is it true kk were given the weekend off from training? Good idea if true, sometimes less is more

Trained Sunday

Moosey15 · 05-06-2018 12:24pm

https://wexfordweekly.com/2018/06/04/opinion-all-is-not-lost-kilkenny-are-beatable-and-wexford-can-do-it/
What do we think about this little piece ?

brookville · 05-06-2018 12:24pm

Village87 wrote: »

minty81 wrote: »

Is it true kk were given the weekend off from training? Good idea if true, sometimes less is more

Trained Sunday

wonder how close are the lads like kevin kelly,jason cleere and joe lyng are to making the squad?

oconnol1 · 05-06-2018 12:54pm

Moosey15 wrote: »

https://wexfordweekly.com/2018/06/04/opinion-all-is-not-lost-kilkenny-are-beatable-and-wexford-can-do-it/
What do we think about this little piece ?

Propangda ðŸ˜€

Xenophile · 05-06-2018 1:51pm

I have great respect for Brian Cody but he has got it completely wrong looling for a Munster team to be relegated.

greenspurs · 05-06-2018 2:44pm

Xenophile wrote: »

I have great respect for Brian Cody but he has got it completely wrong looling for a Munster team to be relegated.

How ?

No one is allowed say anything about munster hurling ?

".... but..but .. what about Munster..."

greenspurs · 05-06-2018 3:19pm

Meant to post a while back.....

I was buying tickets in my local Centra shop for the KK V Offaly game, and I asked about tickets for the Ardan OCearbhaill (behind the goal) , and I was told they weren't on sale ?

I got tickets for the DeGras instead, and when I got up there the stand behind the goal had only a few dozen people in there.

is it the same situation for sat nights match ? ie . no tickets to buy for behind the goal ?

dastardly00 · 05-06-2018 5:32pm

greenspurs wrote: »

Meant to post a while back.....

I was buying tickets in my local Centra shop for the KK V Offaly game, and I asked about tickets for the Ardan OCearbhaill (behind the goal) , and I was told they weren't on sale ?

I got tickets for the DeGras instead, and when I got up there the stand behind the goal had only a few dozen people in there.

is it the same situation for sat nights match ? ie . no tickets to buy for behind the goal ?

Not sure about Centra...
But tickets for all three stands and the town end terrace are available on gaa.tickets.ie at the moment.

Pat Treacy · 05-06-2018 7:17pm

Will it be a full house Saturday evening in the park a must win game for kilkenny the best of luck to the team.

Pat Treacy · 05-06-2018 7:28pm

Village87 wrote: »

The Munster Championship is a great spectacle. About time Derek Mcgrath played 15 on 15 with Waterford, they could be a match for anyone playing like that with the 4/5 top players to come back.They stumbled across an excellent full back in Conor Gleeson . 2 fumbled balls by Brick Walsh & Austin Gleeson cost them big time.

Munster championship has been top drawer stuff, really exciting. Leinster championship has been awful viewing so far apart from the first game. Wexford have been disappointing and offer very little really. Davy will have to change is out of date tactics. Great to see the traditional hurling prevail.

People talk about the kilkenny full back line who did people rate the tipperary full back line last sunday bad. The all Ireland is galways to loose.

Nickindublin · 05-06-2018 8:44pm

Pat Treacy wrote: »

People talk about the kilkenny full back line who did people rate the tipperary full back line last sunday bad. The all Ireland is galways to loose.

Galway look to have the best full back line so far. But they have not had a proper test yet. I believe they are deserving favs but I think they can be beaten. Whoever wins this All Ireland will need a bit of luck and no injuries to key players.

dastardly00 · 05-06-2018 10:56pm

Pat Treacy wrote: »

Will it be a full house Saturday evening in the park a must win game for kilkenny the best of luck to the team.

Is it a must win for either team really though?
Likelihood is that both teams will end up in the quarter finals

Pat Treacy · 05-06-2018 11:35pm

I wonder about that any game against Wexford is a must win situation especially in your own back yard.

greenspurs · 06-06-2018 8:21am

Nickindublin wrote: »

Galway look to have the best full back line so far. But they have not had a proper test yet. I believe they are deserving favs but I think they can be beaten. Whoever wins this All Ireland will need a bit of luck and no injuries to key players.

But who is going to beat them ?
Cork, or Limerick ? Because KK couldn't, and the way Tipp and Waterford are going I couldnt see them beating Galway either.

brookville · 06-06-2018 11:39am

greenspurs wrote: »

Nickindublin wrote: »

Galway look to have the best full back line so far. But they have not had a proper test yet. I believe they are deserving favs but I think they can be beaten. Whoever wins this All Ireland will need a bit of luck and no injuries to key players.

But who is going to beat them ?
Cork, or Limerick ? Because KK couldn't, and the way Tipp and Waterford are going I couldnt see them beating Galway either.

While theres no doubt galway are rightfully favourites for the ai the only thing is at the moment galway havent being properly tested yet.The 3 teams they've beat already were poor but they can obviously only beat what they play but there's a long way to go and we've seen at semi final stage with no safety net anything can happen especially if the media and supporters blow you up as unbeatable.
division 1b has suited them while other teams were going harder than others this is like galway playing the league in 1a now while ourselves and wexford were tired on our 3rd week but everyone knew the format and a league title was important for our rebuild but a win saturday and day out in croker is also important.
While all teams have injuries during a campaign some are hit harder than others and galway are lucky to have a settled team with a brillant spine and a full deck with the exception of colm callinan

Nickindublin · 06-06-2018 12:06pm

brookville wrote: »

While theres no doubt galway are rightfully favourites for the ai the only thing is at the moment galway havent being properly tested yet.The 3 teams they've beat already were poor but they can obviously only beat what they play but there's a long way to go and we've seen at semi final stage with no safety net anything can happen especially if the media and supporters blow you up as unbeatable.
division 1b has suited them while other teams were going harder than others this is like galway playing the league in 1a now while ourselves and wexford were tired on our 3rd week but everyone knew the format and a league title was important for our rebuild but a win saturday and day out in croker is also important.
While all teams have injuries during a campaign some are hit harder than others and galway are lucky to have a settled team with a brillant spine and a full deck with the exception of colm callinan

If they win the Leinster Final as easily as the other games in Leinster they just might get caught in a Semi. I do think that Tipp team can beat if they get out of Munster. I don’t think KK are strong enough physically for them. But we may give them a better game next time.

Nedflanders02 · 06-06-2018 1:57pm

Pat Treacy wrote: »

Will it be a full house Saturday evening in the park a must win game for kilkenny the best of luck to the team.

The county board are only expecting a crowd of around 15k to 17k

Nedflanders02 · 06-06-2018 1:58pm

Just wondering does anyone have the U-21 team that played Waterford on Monday?

Village87 · 06-06-2018 3:09pm

Xenophile wrote: »

I have great respect for Brian Cody but he has got it completely wrong looling for a Munster team to be relegated.

Why dont the bottom team in Munster play the bottom team in Leinster in a Relegation Play off ?

Kilkenny GAA Thread Part 3 **MOD NOTE POST 1***

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Kilkenny GAA Thread Part 3 MOD NOTE POST 1*