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Has ignoring red lights gotten a lot worse?

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Comments

  • #502
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,440 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Kevin Irving wrote: »
    Completely agreed, you've worded it better than me. What gets me is that certain people here take any comment whatsoever on cyclists as such a grave personal insult that it soon descends into a debate using the same tired old analogies about potential damage done by cyclists vs cars.

    Just for the record, I don't take grave personal insult at any comment about cyclists whatsoever. In fact, I'm happy to give grave personal insults to cyclists, especially the little bollixes who shoal or block junctions for pedestrians.

    What I take grave personal insult at is the suggestions that cyclists are a significant problem on the roads that needs to be fixed, as long as motorists are killing 2 or 3 people each week.


  • #503
    PhilOssophy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    You are just not getting it Andrew. The sole metric of whats OK on the road is not whether you kill somebody or who kills anybody.
    It is up to everybody to obey the rules of the road, whether you are a cyclist or a driver or whatever you are peddling or driving.
    As I have repeatedly said, as a pedestrian, I have a much bigger problem with cyclists than with car drivers running red lights.
    You just won't take any criticism of cyclists, will you? Get down off that high moral ground and look around you.


  • #504
    trellheim
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,964 ✭✭✭trellheim


    As I have repeatedly said, as a pedestrian, I have a much bigger problem with cyclists than with car drivers running red lights.


    There a giant big thread about cyclists running reds - this is the one for motorists running reds and for me its a million times a bigger problem than pushbikes running reds.


  • #505
    jjpep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 658 ✭✭✭jjpep


    PhilOssophy wrote: »
    You are just not getting it Andrew. The sole metric of whats OK on the road is not whether you kill somebody or who kills anybody.
    It is up to everybody to obey the rules of the road, whether you are a cyclist or a driver or whatever you are peddling or driving.
    As I have repeatedly said, as a pedestrian, I have a much bigger problem with cyclists than with car drivers running red lights.
    You just won't take any criticism of cyclists, will you? Get down off that high moral ground and look around you.

    I'd agree it shouldn't be the sole metric of what's accepted on the roads. But in a world of finite resources there should be a logic in where we apply those resources. And if one group/demographic is shown to be more measurablely dangerous than others than that's where the resources should go.

    Like most people I drive, cycle, walk and use public transport. It's not a them Vs us thing. It's literally the application of logic and not allowing emotion to be part of it ie 'i saw someone on a bike break a red light and I feel angry about that'.


  • #506
    PhilOssophy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    trellheim wrote: »
    There a giant big thread about cyclists running reds - this is the one for motorists running reds and for me its a million times a bigger problem than pushbikes running reds.

    No I think you'll find the title is "Has ignoring red lights gotten a lot worse", under the thread of "commuting & transport", under "Motoring and Transport".

    Last time I looked a bike is a form of transport, is used for commuting. So no, I think it is fair game to discuss it here.


  • #507
    PhilOssophy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    jjpep wrote: »
    I'd agree it shouldn't be the sole metric of what's accepted on the roads. But in a world of finite resources there should be a logic in where we apply those resources. And if one group/demographic is shown to be more measurablely dangerous than others than that's where the resources should go.

    Like most people I drive, cycle, walk and use public transport. It's not a them Vs us thing. It's literally the application of logic and not allowing emotion to be part of it ie 'i saw someone on a bike break a red light and I feel angry about that'.

    I agree largely, that doesn't cut it. It isn't just about who is dangerous on the road, it is a basic expectation that all road users should obey the rules of the road. Whether driving a bike, car, or walking.

    It is not possible for the Gardai to police every junction in the city, what is possible is that everyone will show a bit of civic decency and wait their turn. That isn't too much to expect in a civilised society, is it?


  • #508
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 50,168 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    it's fairly simple; gardai, when they police a junction, should pull in and fine light breakers, be they motorists or cyclists. that is all.
    the issue is that they don't police junctions.


  • #509
    PhilOssophy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    it's fairly simple; gardai, when they police a junction, should pull in and fine light breakers, be they motorists or cyclists. that is all.
    the issue is that they don't police junctions.

    Spot on. Unfortunately they don't police anything. But they can't police every junction either so people need to show some pride about how they represent themselves.

    Anyway I've had enough of this argument.

    Unfollow. Have a good weekend!


  • #510
    blackwhite
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,960 ✭✭✭blackwhite


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    it's fairly simple; gardai, when they police a junction, should pull in and fine light breakers, be they motorists or cyclists. that is all.
    the issue is that they don't police junctions.

    Red light cameras and yellow box cameras with automatic fines are needed.

    Or my personal favorite suggestion (although impractical and certainly too costly to ever do) - have recessed "stinger"-style spikes in the white line at lights. (the type of spikes that cause a controlled puncture as opposed to a blowout)
    When lights go red, spikes come up!

    Not sure our compo culture would allow for these though :P


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  • #511
    trellheim
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,964 ✭✭✭trellheim


    PhilOssophy wrote: »
    No I think you'll find the title is "Has ignoring red lights gotten a lot worse", under the thread of "commuting & transport", under "Motoring and Transport".

    Last time I looked a bike is a form of transport, is used for commuting. So no, I think it is fair game to discuss it here.

    Read the OP. Its about motorists in cars breaking yellows and reds. Discussing cyclists here just lets people go on about cyclists when we have a multi-thousand post thread for just that purpose.


  • #512
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,440 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    PhilOssophy wrote: »
    You are just not getting it Andrew. The sole metric of whats OK on the road is not whether you kill somebody or who kills anybody.

    Fair enough - you're right. Killing is not the sole metric


    We should look at the numbers of those seriously injured as well. It was 8-10 people maimed each week by motorists last time I looked.


  • #513
    Breezer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,228 ✭✭✭Breezer


    Crossing at a green man from the top of Westmoreland St to the median on O'Connell Bridge yesterday. A fella in a Range Rover comes southbound across O'Connell Bridge and starts to make an illegal right turn through a straight ahead arrow across my path. He stops, looks at me, decides "ah sure he's not so far across the road that I'll hit him" and proceeds through the green man and across the traffic lanes from Westmoreland St onto the South Quays.


  • #514
    fullstop
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,498 ✭✭✭✭fullstop


    Another thread ruined by our favourite cyclist :rolleyes:


  • #515
    Shai
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 226 ✭✭Shai


    fullstop wrote: »
    Another thread ruined by our favourite cyclist :rolleyes:

    Not sure what you're on about. It's not Andrew who is trying to shift the thread towards cyclists.


  • #516
    jjpep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 658 ✭✭✭jjpep


    It's interesting how if you drive, cycle and walk you're a cyclist and anything you say about driving must be because you're anti motorist.


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  • #517
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 40,290 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    This is just going around in circles now with the cars vs cyclist crap.
    The issue is the lack of due care by some road users, regardless of mode of transport, when it comes to red lights. The potential for injury or death is increased from red light gambling especially by those travelling faster in heavier vehicles. The claim that someone on a bike may not cause as much damage isn't necessarily valid because they could collide with a car causing injury or death to themselves.

    This is down to many factors including heavier volumes, longer travel times, lack of proper enforcement. The main reason that some people travel through red lights, regardless of whether they are on bikes or cars us because there's next to no enforcement.

    Changing behaviour needs to be marketing driven just like the drink driving campaigns but there's no point doing that if there's no enforcement.


  • #518
    Zipppy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,054 ✭✭✭Zipppy


    Seth Brundle wrote:
    Changing behaviour needs to be marketing driven just like the drink driving campaigns but there's no point doing that if there's no enforcement.


    3 cycles of the lights in Phibsboro last nite cars broke the lights.. 2 Garda were on duty a few meters away..just looked on...
    Meanwhile today at Doyle's corner an Audi flew (and I mean flew) up the inside of 2 buses and brokes lights about 3 seconds after the red..no way he could have seen anything or be seen..no one cares it seems..least of all the Garda car that was stopped in traffic coming opposite...really don't know how there wasn't carnage..


  • #519
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 50,168 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    jjpep wrote: »
    It's interesting how if you drive, cycle and walk you're a cyclist and anything you say about driving must be because you're anti motorist.
    in a not-quite-argument i was once having with someone (who does not cycle) about cyclists, i was accused of being 'biased' because i do cycle. i had to pause for a second or two to process the enormity of that amount of - quite sincere - idiocy.
    the 'of course you would say that, you're a (insert type of road user)' concept *only* seems to apply to cyclists.


  • #520
    jjpep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 658 ✭✭✭jjpep


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    in a not-quite-argument i was once having with someone (who does not cycle) about cyclists, i was accused of being 'biased' because i do cycle. i had to pause for a second or two to process the enormity of that amount of - quite sincere - idiocy.
    the 'of course you would say that, you're a (insert type of road user)' concept *only* seems to apply to cyclists.

    Yep, and I'm not trying to bring this back to a cyclist Vs motorist thing nor am I saying that if one individual drives and cycles than everything that individual says on those topics is correct. It's just that weird illogic that you've observed too.

    If I criticise driver behaviour and I'm see as a driver then it's fine. I'm one of 'us'. If I'm see as a cyclist then it's not, I'm one of 'them'. And in my mind I'm both.


  • #521
    RobbieMD
    Registered Users Posts: 449 ✭✭RobbieMD


    Zipppy wrote: »
    3 cycles of the lights in Phibsboro last nite cars broke the lights.. 2 Garda were on duty a few meters away..just looked on...
    Meanwhile today at Doyle's corner an Audi flew (and I mean flew) up the inside of 2 buses and brokes lights about 3 seconds after the red..no way he could have seen anything or be seen..no one cares it seems..least of all the Garda car that was stopped in traffic coming opposite...really don't know how there wasn't carnage..

    Maybe the garda driving the car is one of the huge number not qualified to drive with blue lights and sirens....


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  • #522
    Duckjob
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,859 ✭✭✭Duckjob


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    The claim that someone on a bike may not cause as much damage isn't necessarily valid because they could collide with a car causing injury or death to themselves.

    While the above is true, The bolded word is highly significant and is continually glossed over by people trying to draw equivalence between people in cars breaking rules and people on bikes breaking rules.

    A cyclist going through a red light, while for sure it may irritate, is largely risking their own safety more so than others. A car driver going through a red light is literally gambling not only the safety, but the very lives of others.

    In 25+ yrs of driving, I've never ever ever sat in my car watching a cyclist go through a red and thought that because of them I may not make it back to my family that evening. I can't say the same in reverse about last 5 yrs of cycling.


  • #523
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,440 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    The claim that someone on a bike may not cause as much damage isn't necessarily valid because they could collide with a car causing injury or death to themselves.

    Does that happen often?


  • #524
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 40,290 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    Does that happen often?
    Are those stats released?


  • #525
    Zipppy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,054 ✭✭✭Zipppy


    Duckjob wrote:
    A cyclist going through a red light, while for sure it may irritate, is largely risking their own safety more so than others. A car driver going through a red light is literally gambling not only the safety, but the very lives of others.


    So cyclists running red lights is ok?..its just an irritant ?
    Surely motorists and cyclists are equally in the wrong.. both are breaking the rules of the road. one may pose more of a danger but both are wrong and should be clamped down on with equal force..which brings us back to this thread..we should be discussing how we can step both modes breaking lights and not nit pick about who is worst..


  • #526
    jjpep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 658 ✭✭✭jjpep


    Zipppy wrote: »
    So cyclists running red lights is ok?..its just an irritant ?
    Surely motorists and cyclists are equally in the wrong.. both are breaking the rules of the road. one may pose more of a danger but both are wrong and should be clamped down on with equal force..which brings us back to this thread..we should be discussing how we can step both modes breaking lights and not nit pick about who is worst..

    This has already been gone over at least once in this thread.


  • #527
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,440 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    Are those stats released?


    You tell me. You're flagging up the problem so I'd have hoped that you had a good understanding of what's behind it.



    I'm fairly confident that no cyclist has been killed in Ireland as a result of breaking a red light in living memory. I've never heard of any case of a cyclist being seriously injured as a result of breaking a red light. Given the enthusiasm of much of the media to join in a round of cyclist-bashing, I'd be fairly confident that this hasn't happened in living memory.


    RSA track stats on people killed and seriously injured, so I'm fairly confident that they would have recognised any trend in this area.

    Zipppy wrote: »
    So cyclists running red lights is ok?..its just an irritant ?
    Surely motorists and cyclists are equally in the wrong.. both are breaking the rules of the road. one may pose more of a danger but both are wrong and should be clamped down on with equal force..which brings us back to this thread..we should be discussing how we can step both modes breaking lights and not nit pick about who is worst..


    Why would you expect both to be clamped down with equal force? Do you expect the authorities to 'clamp down on equal force' on people who by more than their daily allowance of paracetamol and people who are injecting heroin on the streets? I'd expect the Gardai to focus on addressing danger, death and injury in their clampdown. They would therefore focus on the motorists that kill 2 or 3 people each week and maim many more.

    Would you be in favour of a Garda clampdown on the 60-82% of motorists that break speed limits?


  • #528
    Weepsie
    Site Banned Posts: 20,686 ✭✭✭✭Weepsie


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    Fair enough - you're right. Killing is not the sole metric


    We should look at the numbers of those seriously injured as well. It was 8-10 people maimed each week by motorists last time I looked.

    You can add to to that the 240k drivers with some sort of driving offence against them at present. That number has hovered around that for years too, so as points expire, people are still racking them up.

    That would be higher too if all were caught.

    Conversely, if people thought they'd be caught there'd be less.


    Solution is of course helping technology and civilian staff to issue fines/points. Free up Gardai to do more meaningful work than policing bus lanes etc and making driving, cycling and even walking safer for all.


  • #529
    Duckjob
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,859 ✭✭✭Duckjob


    Zipppy wrote: »
    So cyclists running red lights is ok?..its just an irritant ?
    Surely motorists and cyclists are equally in the wrong.. both are breaking the rules of the road. one may pose more of a danger but both are wrong and should be clamped down on with equal force..which brings us back to this thread..we should be discussing how we can step both modes breaking lights and not nit pick about who is worst..


    Are you Cathy Newman by any chance ? Show me where I said running red lights is "ok" ?

    You can draw all the moral equivalences you want between cars and bikes breaking lights.

    We can discuss until the cow come home whether a cyclist breaking a red is as morally wrong as a car breaking a red. I would argue the moral wrong of a motorist breaking a red is much greater because, as I am other posters have pointed out the safety implications to *others* are on an entirely different scale. That doesn't mean I think cyclists going through red is ok.

    At the end of the day though, if you want to address road safety effectively, then unless you're clinging to some sort of petty anti- mentality against another group of road users, then perceived morality doesnt really have any place in the discussion. Physics does.


  • #530
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,440 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Weepsie wrote: »
    You can add to to that the 240k drivers with some sort of driving offence against them at present.
    And the 100k-150k uninsured vehicles on our road, but yeah, let's pull resource off reducing the death toll on the roads to clamp down on cyclists.


  • #531
    Shai
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 226 ✭✭Shai


    Duckjob wrote: »
    At the end of the day though, if you want to address road safety effectively, then unless you're clinging to some sort of petty anti- mentality against another group of road users, then perceived morality doesnt really have any place in the discussion. Physics does.

    I can't speak for everyone, but if it were possible for cars to be made of some magical new material that caused them to do only as much damage as a bike could in case of a collision, I personally would be a whole lot less worried about cars jumping red lights.


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  • #532
    Duckjob
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,859 ✭✭✭Duckjob


    Shai wrote: »
    I can't speak for everyone, but if it were possible for cars to be made of some magical new material that caused them to do only as much damage as a bike could in case of a collision, I personally would be a whole lot less worried about cars jumping red lights.

    Would be nice.

    While car makers have gone to the ends of the earth to increase the safety (or at least the perceived safety) of those inside their vehicles, the sad reality is that the safety of anyone outside the vehicle Is of secondary importance to the vanity of the car owner. The failure to ban bull bars from our urban spaces would be a prime example of this. But that's another thread.


  • #533
    Weepsie
    Site Banned Posts: 20,686 ✭✭✭✭Weepsie


    Duckjob wrote: »
    The failure to ban bull bars from our urban spaces would be a prime example of this. But that's another thread.

    The types of vehicle that bull bars tend to installed on, are for the most part completely unsuited and unnecessary in urban environments too, but you know, people just have to have their 4wd, SUV, jeep-style/landcruiser style to ferry their various accessories about the place.


  • #534
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    Shai wrote: »
    I can't speak for everyone, but if it were possible for cars to be made of some magical new material that caused them to do only as much damage as a bike could in case of a collision, I personally would be a whole lot less worried about cars jumping red lights.

    Cyclists can be fatal to pedestrians too.


  • #535
    jjpep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 658 ✭✭✭jjpep


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    Cyclists can be fatal to pedestrians too.

    Can you imagine the uproar if 50 or 60 pedistrians were killed each year by cyclist's?


  • #536
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,440 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    Cyclists can be fatal to pedestrians too.

    They can be - but that is a very, very rare event. In Ireland, it is more than 15 years since a cyclist killed a pedestrian. In that time, motorists have killed more than 3,500 people here.

    In the UK, cyclists kill 1 or 2 people each year. Motorists kill 4 or 5 people each day.

    That will give you some idea of the real source of danger on the roads.


  • #537
    Charles Babbage
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,890 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    They can be - but that is a very, very rare event. In Ireland, it is more than 15 years since a cyclist killed a pedestrian. In that time, motorists have killed more than 3,500 people here.

    In the UK, cyclists kill 1 or 2 people each year. Motorists kill 4 or 5 people each day.

    That will give you some idea of the real source of danger on the roads.


    Is only death of interest here? Are the injuries and intimidation caused not also of public interest?


  • #538
    Shai
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 226 ✭✭Shai


    Charles Babbage wrote: »
    Is only death of interest here? Are the injuries and intimidation caused not also of public interest?

    I'm not gonna comment on injuries here, as I don't have any numbers handy, but I want to ask you what exactly you mean by intimidation. When people talk about cyclists intimidating others, I often have the impression that they're really talking about teenagers on bikes trying to act tough, racing on pedestrian lanes and generally just being a pest to pedestrians. Am I misreading this?


  • #539
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,440 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Charles Babbage wrote: »
    Is only death of interest here? Are the injuries and intimidation caused not also of public interest?
    I addressed injuries in this recent post.


    I'm not sure what you mean by intimidation, tbh.


  • #540
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    I addressed injuries in this recent post.


    I'm not sure what you mean by intimidation, tbh.

    People behind you speeding up as the light goes to amber.


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  • #541
    Corruptedmorals
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,194 ✭✭✭Corruptedmorals


    It has definitely gotten worse. Cars and cyclists breaking green pedestrian lights is especially frustrating at crossings where the pedestrian time is too short for your average person to cross without it going amber. It wrecks the sequences to have the pedestrians stop or pull back for cars to bulldoze through and then be in danger then crossing on red. The worst one I encounter is lower Leeson Street lights a bit up from the Stephen's green junction..plenty cars and cyclists breaking a very short pedestrian sequence...and a huge amount of the pedestrians crossing are schoolchildren.


  • #542
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,161 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    it's fairly simple; gardai, when they police a junction, should pull in and fine light breakers, be they motorists or cyclists. that is all.
    the issue is that they don't police junctions.
    True, I see cars breaking lights in front of Gardai all the time, a Garda clearing a bus lane on the N11 a few weeks ago didn't bother issuing fines to the 45 cars, just stood there and waved them out, even though some were paying so little attention, they did not even see him.
    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    I've never heard of any case of a cyclist being seriously injured as a result of breaking a red light. Given the enthusiasm of much of the media to join in a round of cyclist-bashing, I'd be fairly confident that this hasn't happened in living memory.
    Only one I have ever heard of at O'Connell bridge, and he was not seriously injured, only reason it made the news is that he claimed the car ran the red but an overwhelming amount of evidence showed him to be an arm chancing scumbag and the judge ruled against him
    Dravokivich wrote: »
    Cyclists can be fatal to pedestrians too.
    Once since the turn of the century. That's it, once. Cyclist completely at fault, accepted blame, and had life destroyed. I worked just up the road at the time. It was awful, one way street and the courier was going against traffic, pedestrian stepped off the pavement.


  • #543
    Charles Babbage
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,890 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage


    Shai wrote: »
    I'm not gonna comment on injuries here, as I don't have any numbers handy, but I want to ask you what exactly you mean by intimidation. When people talk about cyclists intimidating others, I often have the impression that they're really talking about teenagers on bikes trying to act tough, racing on pedestrian lanes and generally just being a pest to pedestrians. Am I misreading this?


    If you are a pedestrian crossing on a green light at a crossing and cars and cyclists are not stopping then that is intimidating. If you are pedestrian on a footpath and a cyclists whizzes past you with cm that is intimidating. The whole point of a footpath is that you should not have to look out for traffic.


  • #544
    pmcc1
    Registered Users Posts: 71 ✭✭pmcc1


    Let’s say I was interested in helping put manners on red-light runners on my local crossroads.
    And I am. (Doyle’s Corner – getting really dangerous)
    If I were to record “evidence packs” - High quality video clips, indexed in spreadsheet - likely I would be wasting my time providing same to the police.
    However, if the offender’s insurer were identifiable, they would perhaps be more interested in making life more uncomfortable for serial red-light runners.
    The UK have a look-up service to find an insurer from a license number.
    Wonder would the Motor Insurer’s Bureau of Ireland set up similar, or endorse such a citizen-fed scheme?


  • #545
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,440 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Charles Babbage wrote: »
    The whole point of a footpath is that you should not have to look out for traffic.

    You're dead right

    https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/video-cork-gardai-probing-dangerous-driving-on-busy-city-footpath-827339.html

    Take a look at these search results: https://twitter.com/search?q=makewayday&s=09


  • #546
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,161 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    Charles Babbage wrote: »
    If you are a pedestrian crossing on a green light at a crossing and cars and cyclists are not stopping then that is intimidating. If you are pedestrian on a footpath and a cyclists whizzes past you with cm that is intimidating. The whole point of a footpath is that you should not have to look out for traffic.

    Its ****ehawk behaviour, pedestrian lights beside my kids school, often you have to wait on the green man for cars to stop, and on some occasions, the lights have went back to red as people kept driving through.

    I remember years ago a courier doing his at College Green, old guy just stopped and jammed his shoulder out and the courier came to a dead stop and planted himself into the ground. The old guy was like the Glimmer man, didn't say a word, didn't give out, just blended into the crowd and was gone. Courier was so stunned he became confused that no one else was lying on the ground with him. Not saying I agree with physical confrontation but I have to say, it was a lesson well learned.

    Red light jumping needs a cultural shift, it will take years, the only way to do this effectively is enforcement, the only reasonable and safe way to make that work is automate it and hand over Admin to a civilian team. Once it becomes the norm, younger people will not even think about it as its not the done thing, and then it will all but disappear.


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  • #547
    average_runner
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,855 ✭✭✭✭average_runner


    If you want to see how bad things are just go to these two junctions:

    1. O'Connell bridge, massive junction but the amount of red light breaking from traffic from the port to the west is unreal. A clear red and they still go through that big junction. You want to know why people have a bad opinion of motorists, well just stay here for a half hour in the morning/evening rush and you see why.

    2 Camden St junction down by Whelan's pub. You want to know why people have a bad opinion of cyclists, well just stay here for a half hour in the morning/evening rush and you see why.


    Sometimes I feel like bringing a hurl with me and hit everything that goes through a red light, might not be a good idea though:eek:


  • #548
    trellheim
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,964 ✭✭✭trellheim


    Camden St junction down by Whelan's pub. You want to know why people have a bad opinion of cyclists, well just stay here for a half hour in the morning/evening rush and you see why.

    That was my commute a while back. I was waiting up the front at the red on the pushbike to go down Aungier st completely day-dreaming and a cyclist blazed past me ... didn't spot the copper on the motorbike right beside me who took this as a personal insult and went after him the lols were very funny


  • #549
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,161 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    trellheim wrote: »
    That was my commute a while back. I was waiting up the front at the red on the pushbike to go down Aungier st completely day-dreaming and a cyclist blazed past me ... didn't spot the copper on the motorbike right beside me who took this as a personal insult and went after him the lols were very funny

    I always love it when this happens, if your paying so little attention that you don't cop a Garda, on foot, bike or car, then you simply cannot use the excuse that you were somehow "doing it safely". remember a Merc trying to turn right at the bottom of Camden St. (not allowed), sat there for ages, holding up traffic. Two Gardai on foot, down the road, just stood out on the road, waiting for him. Everyone else stopped when they seen the Gardai and he put the foot down and had to skid stop a few metres later. Whole junction erupted in as round of applause for the muppets stupidity.


  • #550
    blackwhite
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,960 ✭✭✭blackwhite


    CramCycle wrote: »
    I always love it when this happens, if your paying so little attention that you don't cop a Garda, on foot, bike or car, then you simply cannot use the excuse that you were somehow "doing it safely". remember a Merc trying to turn right at the bottom of Camden St. (not allowed), sat there for ages, holding up traffic. Two Gardai on foot, down the road, just stood out on the road, waiting for him. Everyone else stopped when they seen the Gardai and he put the foot down and had to skid stop a few metres later. Whole junction erupted in as round of applause for the muppets stupidity.

    TBH I'd always have the same train of thought with Go-Safe vans.

    They are usually so visible in advance that I cannot understand how anybody managed to get caught - they must be half asleep!


  • #551
    amcalester
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭amcalester


    blackwhite wrote: »
    TBH I'd always have the same train of thought with Go-Safe vans.

    They are usually so visible in advance that I cannot understand how anybody managed to get caught - they must be half asleep!

    I got caught by one of them, sailed past at 60km/h thinking what fecking eejit is going to get caught here.

    A few weeks later got the fine in the post, turns out the limit was 50km/h.

    So, to answer my own question. This fecking eejit.


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