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The trashing of our parks and beaches

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    #152
    the purple tin
    Registered Users Posts: 10,943 ✭✭✭✭the purple tin


    We've always had a big litter problem in this country.



    If you go out early on a Sunday morning before the council cleaners have been around or on a bank holiday Monday morning the place is destroyed with fast food wrappers, smashed glasses and bottles etc.


    People who come back to the same spot every week and dump bags of household rubbish; usually it is eastern-european stuff.


    I once saw a mother out with her young daughter, Ma was casually throwing litter on the ground when there was a bin 5 metres away. That was on a busy street too, the little girl will be a litter-bug when she grows up and pass it on to her kids.
    You can teach the kids to respect the environment etc in school but they will always follow the parents' example when it comes down to it.


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    #153
    Pinch Flat
    Registered Users Posts: 7,761 ✭✭✭Pinch Flat


    We are a socially immature country where everything is someone elses problem and there's an absence of the concept of personal responsibility. We also have zero civic pride. These are deeply ingrained in the irish psyche.

    I see it across all walks of life - from the communal kitchen in the office that's treated like a rubbish tip, to the mothers and fathers who dump their coffee cups and other rubbish at the GAA club when watching their darlings play, to the rubbish dumped from car doors at mcdonalds, to household rubbish left at public bins. Any sort of gathering ensures the venue will be treated like an open rubbish tip.

    People dump rubbish and think it's someone elses problem - they just simply can't take personal responsibility for the rubbish they create and don't join the dots that it's a problem they've created. It's embarrassing.

    Our country is strewn with rubbish. We're a filthy nation - up there with the worst in Europe. Visitors comment on it. Plenty of people I know who have come to Ireland expecting this green and natural country are genuinely shocked by the levels of rubbish here and can't understand why people abuse the country in such a way.


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    #154
    d15ude
    Registered Users Posts: 315 ✭✭d15ude


    There are no tourists here atm, so no reputation as a holiday destination to be lost.
    So councils should leave all the rubbish at these beauty spots for a month or so.
    Maybe that will teach people a lesson.


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    #155
    ednwireland
    Registered Users Posts: 14,307 ✭✭✭✭ednwireland


    Deleted User wrote: »
    You should take a walk in our glorious countryside. The amount of discarded coffee cups and drinks cans and bottles is staggering.

    dont forget the new addition of disposable gloves littering the side of the road. definitely not teenagers.

    My weather

    https://www.ecowitt.net/home/share?authorize=96CT1F



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    #156
    Roger the cabin boy
    Registered Users Posts: 365 ✭✭Roger the cabin boy


    This littering is for the most part, by young adults. Scumbags and degenerates are also to blame.

    Drives me nuts and I call the **** out on it when I catch them. (This may be my undoing at some point)

    Like, WTF. Don't treat the world as your trashcan ffs


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    #157
    Pinch Flat
    Registered Users Posts: 7,761 ✭✭✭Pinch Flat


    ednwireland wrote: »
    dont forget the new addition of disposable gloves littering the side of the road. definitely not teenagers.

    And masks. Apparently you just open you door in the car park and dump it on the ground when you're done with it. Car park in my local shopping centre has them everywhere .


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    #158
    Akrasia
    Registered Users Posts: 22,242 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    buried wrote: »
    Look Princess, twist it all you want in whatever ridiculous fashion you want to. I seen the exact same group a few weeks ago do the whole 'save the planet' wolix during last winter now filth up the area near where I live in the last week, last night again too. I seen them. Unless you live in my same community and can claim that they aren't, you can go home with your "ehs" and "eh no's". Its happening. But sure twist away and say it isn't. I know it is!
    So you’re anti littering but oppose action on climate change?


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    #159
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users Posts: 17,841 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    Introduce a bottle and can tax asap. 20c minimum!


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    #160
    Biker79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 794 ✭✭✭Biker79


    Zero tolerance with an efficient way to issue fines. There is no other way to change the culture.

    Done well and it could actually make money. Dog poop and drinking in public could also be included.

    Whoever trots out these littering statistics which relate areas in Ireland to better or worse than ' the European average ' is seriously cooking the books.


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    #161
    Princess Consuela Bananahammock
    Registered Users Posts: 33,048 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Introduce a bottle and can tax asap. 20c minimum!

    The better way to do that is to bring in/back a deposit system.

    Every can - 50c deposit on the can, returned when you bring the empty can back to the supermarket. Soft drinks bottles and cans included.

    They do this in Germany - not only are people more careful with their leftovers, you also get homelss people collecting empty bottles and bringing them back and sometimes even kids looking to earn a little extra pockey money.

    Multiple benefits.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



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    #162
    amadangomor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,148 ✭✭✭amadangomor


    Pinch Flat wrote: »

    I see it across all walks of life - from the communal kitchen in the office that's treated like a rubbish tip, to the mothers and fathers who dump their coffee cups and other rubbish at the GAA club when watching their darlings play

    The local GAA club's entrance is accessed through my estate.

    The lad who maintains the greens complained to the club about people going to the GAA throwing rubbish in the estate. They denied it, saying it was the residents.

    With the GAA ground being now closed there is no rubbish. He is going to talk to the club when they open to say it is unacceptable.


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    #163
    Truthvader
    Registered Users Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭Truthvader


    Akrasia wrote: »
    So you’re anti littering but oppose action on climate change?

    Sadly "action on climate change" is a meaningless virtue badge which boils down to shrill empty street protests, the odd riiot a disturbed teenager holidaying on a $10,000,0000 yacht all in the cause of "somebody else" doing "something". Picking up your own **** actually involves doing something your actual self which makes an actual difference , actually


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    #164
    amadangomor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,148 ✭✭✭amadangomor


    Biker79 wrote: »
    Zero tolerance with an efficient way to issue fines. There is no other way to change the culture.

    Done well and it could actually make money. Dog poop and drinking in public could also be included.

    Whoever trots out these littering statistics which relate areas in Ireland to better or worse than ' the European average ' is seriously cooking the books.

    I have no problem with people drinking in public as long as they take their rubbish with them.

    You see it in Europe and people can enjoy a few beers in the park and cause no hassle and don't litter.


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    #165
    JohnnyFlash
    Registered Users Posts: 7,055 ✭✭✭JohnnyFlash


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    Introduce a bottle and can tax asap. 20c minimum!

    Jesus, you finally said something that makes sense!


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    #166
    Pinch Flat
    Registered Users Posts: 7,761 ✭✭✭Pinch Flat


    https://www.fingal.ie/news/council-appeals-park-and-beach-users-respect-public-health-guidelines-and-take-their-litter

    Just got that through my FB feed. Utterly depressing.


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    #167
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    the purple tin wrote: »
    We've always had a big litter problem in this country.



    If you go out early on a Sunday morning before the council cleaners have been around or on a bank holiday Monday morning the place is destroyed with fast food wrappers, smashed glasses and bottles etc.


    People who come back to the same spot every week and dump bags of household rubbish; usually it is eastern-european stuff.


    I once saw a mother out with her young daughter, Ma was casually throwing litter on the ground when there was a bin 5 metres away. That was on a busy street too, the little girl will be a litter-bug when she grows up and pass it on to her kids.
    You can teach the kids to respect the environment etc in school but they will always follow the parents' example when it comes down to it.

    You are correct that it is so easy to train children not to litter. As a kid I was famous for having my pockets stuffed full of rubbish as I had been trained never to litter. The whole family is the same, and I remember my cousin’s young child crying in distress because he had accidentally dropped a sweet paper and wanted to go back to the pavement where it had fallen.


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    #168
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    we're a profoundly immature society


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    #169
    JustAThought
    Registered Users Posts: 5,323 ✭✭✭JustAThought


    amadangomor wrote: »
    I have no problem with people drinking in public as long as they take their rubbish with them.

    You see it in Europe and people can enjoy a few beers in the park and cause no hassle and don't litter.

    I walk the beach most days and since the ‘re-opening ‘ and access I notice in my area and beautyspot there is a massive number of both Irish families and non nationals using the beaches - the majority of those with beerbottles and walking along slugging from glass bottles are not english speaking. Despite signs with pictures on them at the entrance to the beaches saying no alcohol and no BBQ’s people stagger along carrying them and leave them behind for someone to burn their foot off or impale themselves in. What is really disheartening is that the ones I see are not teenagers but well healed in their 30’s and entirely self entitled. It also bothers me the amount of filthy mothers who unwrap their babies arses at the shorefront and fling the used nappies into the sea or just leave in on the shore - totally unrepentant when you challenge them. This is not helped by ZERO police interest as they are all checking tax and parking, and ZERO council workers actually doing work. They are there in their council vans reading tabloids or on facebook parked up alongside the bins for 6 hours but never exit their council cans to empty an overflowing bin or litterpick ANYWHERE - this seems to now be the unpaid responsibility of volunteers and tidy town volunteers.

    Maybe we should start posting pictures of overflowing bins at 10am and the same refuse still left alongside the bins at 5pm where clearly no state employee has made any contribution or effort since tye start of the working day.

    I’d also like to challenge the practice of council ‘workers’ (I use the term work loosley) sitting in their bin lorrys for 2 and 3 hours and then springing into action at 5 o clock to claim overtime on a bin emptied once in a working day - its a total farce.

    Counceller Geoghan or whomever posted in that twitter account would be far better off recognising that the daily refuse that is placed alongside overflowing bins where the council clearly has not been around or emptied the bin. He might also bother wondering why people on blue flag beaches should have to lug their refuse 7k to an overflowing bin bank at the entranceway when there is almost NO bins for the entire streatch of the rest of the beach. Hardly indicative of a council that is interested in the tidyness of their beaches nor in recycling facilities nor in giving value for money for the 52% tax people pay.

    I’d also like to see stats on how many litter wardens there are and where they ptrol all day as I have never sen one. I’d also
    like to see the stats on bin emptyings and how often this is done and what volume of rubbish is collected versus that picked up by volunteers. At 40-60k a year on a permanant pension and index linked government jobs what exactly are
    these local refuse emptiers and litter wardens delivering ?

    Notwithstanding piles at overflowing bins and never a litter-warden or council litter picker in sight - ever - people are filthy ****ers who would go somewhere beautiful and then fling a nappy, or leave beer bottle, or juice box or plastic wrappings on the ground where they were sitting and just walk away - what kind of disengaged filthy scum does that. There is certainly plenty of them about and certainly not all chav dolescangers but well healed Irish dirty well-dressed family scumbags.


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    #170
    Biker79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 794 ✭✭✭Biker79


    amadangomor wrote: »
    I have no problem with people drinking in public as long as they take their rubbish with them.

    You see it in Europe and people can enjoy a few beers in the park and cause no hassle and don't litter.

    The culture of rebellion is still too strong in certain sections of our community for that to work here. This feeds into a general lack of civic duty.

    I think fines for public drinking could be discretionary, depending on the situation. But it's rare you will see some people in Ireland drinking moderately in public, and then gathering up all the cans when they're done.

    A fine could be avoided by showing a guard how the cans will be disposed of correctly.


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    #171
    Edgware
    Registered Users Posts: 5,875 ✭✭✭Edgware


    amadangomor wrote: »
    The local GAA club's entrance is accessed through my estate.

    The lad who maintains the greens complained to the club about people going to the GAA throwing rubbish in the estate. They denied it, saying it was the residents.

    With the GAA ground being now closed there is no rubbish. He is going to talk to the club when they open to say it is unacceptable.

    Good luck with that


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    #172
    PhilOssophy
    Registered Users Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    JustAThought wrote: »
    I walk the beach most days and since the ‘re-opening ‘ and access I notice in my area and beautyspot there is a massive number of both Irish families and non nationals using the beaches - the majority of those with beerbottles and walking along slugging from glass bottles are not english speaking. Despite signs with pictures on them at the entrance to the beaches saying no alcohol and no BBQ’s people stagger along carrying them and leave them behind for someone to burn their foot off or impale themselves in. What is really disheartening is that the ones I see are not teenagers but well healed in their 30’s and entirely self entitled. It also bothers me the amount of filthy mothers who unwrap their babies arses at the shorefront and fling the used nappies into the sea or just leave in on the shore - totally unrepentant when you challenge them. This is not helped by ZERO police interest as they are all checking tax and parking, and ZERO council workers actually doing work. They are there in their council vans reading tabloids or on facebook parked up alongside the bins for 6 hours but never exit their council cans to empty an overflowing bin or litterpick ANYWHERE - this seems to now be the unpaid responsibility of volunteers and tidy town volunteers.

    Maybe we should start posting pictures of overflowing bins at 10am and the same refuse still left alongside the bins at 5pm where clearly no state employee has made any contribution or effort since tye start of the working day.

    I’d also like to challenge the practice of council ‘workers’ (I use the term work loosley) sitting in their bin lorrys for 2 and 3 hours and then springing into action at 5 o clock to claim overtime on a bin emptied once in a working day - its a total farce.

    Counceller Geoghan or whomever posted in that twitter account would be far better off recognising that the daily refuse that is placed alongside overflowing bins where the council clearly has not been around or emptied the bin. He might also bother wondering why people on blue flag beaches should have to lug their refuse 7k to an overflowing bin bank at the entranceway when there is almost NO bins for the entire streatch of the rest of the beach. Hardly indicative of a council that is interested in the tidyness of their beaches nor in recycling facilities nor in giving value for money for the 52% tax people pay.

    I’d also like to see stats on how many litter wardens there are and where they ptrol all day as I have never sen one. I’d also
    like to see the stats on bin emptyings and how often this is done and what volume of rubbish is collected versus that picked up by volunteers. At 40-60k a year on a permanant pension and index linked government jobs what exactly are
    these local refuse emptiers and litter wardens delivering ?

    Notwithstanding piles at overflowing bins and never a litter-warden or council litter picker in sight - ever - people are filthy ****ers who would go somewhere beautiful and then fling a nappy, or leave beer bottle, or juice box or plastic wrappings on the ground where they were sitting and just walk away - what kind of disengaged filthy scum does that. There is certainly plenty of them about and certainly not all chav dolescangers but well healed Irish dirty well-dressed family scumbags.

    You pose 15 different things to blame, when we just need to cop on and bring our sh1te home with us like every other country (except the Scousers - search "Formby Beach") is able to do.
    There is no reality to dog wardens or litter wardens doing diddly squat or policing anything, we just need a mentality change across our society regarding our litter and dog fouling.


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    #173
    PhilOssophy
    Registered Users Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    Pinch Flat wrote: »
    https://www.fingal.ie/news/council-appeals-park-and-beach-users-respect-public-health-guidelines-and-take-their-litter

    Just got that through my FB feed. Utterly depressing.

    Not being smart, but I bet they could have found a worse photograph than that, unless Fingal was much cleaner than Blackrock yesterday morning.....


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    #174
    Thelonious Monk
    Registered Users Posts: 13,811 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    PhilOssophy wrote: »
    You pose 15 different things to blame, when we just need to cop on and bring our sh1te home with us like every other country (except the Scousers - search "Formby Beach") is able to do.
    There is no reality to dog wardens or litter wardens doing diddly squat or policing anything, we just need a mentality change across our society regarding our litter and dog fouling.

    Half of working class scousers are of Irish stock, coincidence?


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    #175
    StackSteevens
    Closed Accounts Posts: 873 ✭✭✭StackSteevens


    PhilOssophy wrote: »
    Not being smart, but I bet they could have found a worse photograph than that, unless Fingal was much cleaner than Blackrock yesterday morning.....

    Malahide Castle Demesne tends to attract a more refined, tidier class of litterbug!


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    #176
    fly_agaric
    Registered Users Posts: 4,809 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    PhilOssophy wrote: »
    You pose 15 different things to blame, when we just need to cop on and bring our sh1te home with us like every other country (except the Scousers - search "Formby Beach") is able to do.
    There is no reality to dog wardens or litter wardens doing diddly squat or policing anything, we just need a mentality change across our society regarding our litter and dog fouling.

    Yes, it is a mentality change that is required.
    AFAIK the schools do their best trying to inculcate environmentalism in the young for all the sneering about it that has been posted.

    The more unpleasant "stick" side of trying to change behaviour seems to be needed as well though (i.e. having the enforcement in place that makes dog fouling, littering, fly tipping and the like potentially costly & painful instead of easy, cheap & convenient).

    Maybe you are right though, that it's unlikely to happen & it's unrealistic to hope for it.


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    #177
    PhilOssophy
    Registered Users Posts: 2,114 ✭✭✭PhilOssophy


    fly_agaric wrote: »
    Yes, it is a mentality change that is required.
    AFAIK the schools do their best trying to inculcate environmentalism in the young for all the sneering about it that has been posted.

    The more unpleasant "stick" side of trying to change behaviour seems to be needed as well though (i.e. having the enforcement in place that makes dog fouling, littering, fly tipping and the like potentially costly & painful instead of easy, cheap & convenient).

    Maybe you are right though, that it's unlikely to happen & it's unrealistic to hope for it.

    I think the cost of enforcement would massively outweigh the benefits, it is difficult to expect the wardens, etc to police every park/canal/etc in the city. A bit like cars/cyclists/whatever running red lights, just because you get away with it never makes it right.

    We have forgotten "Just because you can, doesn't mean you should" mantra as a society and these constant problems are the upshot.


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    #178
    JustAThought
    Registered Users Posts: 5,323 ✭✭✭JustAThought


    fly_agaric wrote: »
    Yes, it is a mentality change that is required.
    AFAIK the schools do their best trying to inculcate environmentalism in the young for all the sneering about it that has been posted.

    The more unpleasant "stick" side of trying to change behaviour seems to be needed as well though (i.e. having the enforcement in place that makes dog fouling, littering, fly tipping and the like potentially costly & painful instead of easy, cheap & convenient).

    Maybe you are right though, that it's unlikely to happen & it's unrealistic to hope for it.


    Again I ask - why have we permanent litter wardens on staff with permanent government jobs & paid pensions when they are never in sight and ditto working council workers - not just ones sitting in their taxpayer paid electric vehicles and waste lorries reading the tabloid for hours at a streatch. I watched one fingal refuse lorry this afternoon pull up alongside a park where every bin was full bar one - he just looked and drove away. Total waste of space and taxpayers money. No doubt he will be clocking in for his bank holiday weekend salary - just not doing a tap of work. Common sight.


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    #179
    Antares35
    Registered Users Posts: 3,845 ✭✭✭Antares35


    Don't get why people are convinced it's just the young who are doing it. I would have thought they would be more enlightened! Our way is the same except we actually get fly tippers and some of them I swear are repeat offenders. I'd love to f*cking catch them in the act. You'll find their own houses and gardens are pristine but they use the Dublin hills for dumping :(

    We've managed to report a few over the years by going through the bags and finding utility bills (yea they are that stupid at times but what would you expect from such degenerates).


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    #180
    Thelonious Monk
    Registered Users Posts: 13,811 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    Antares35 wrote: »
    Don't get why people are convinced it's just the young who are doing it. I would have thought they would be more enlightened! Our way is the same except we actually get fly tippers and some of them I swear are repeat offenders. I'd love to f*cking catch them in the act. You'll find their own houses and gardens are pristine but they use the Dublin hills for dumping :(

    We've managed to report a few over the years by going through the bags and finding utility bills (yea they are that stupid at times but what would you expect from such degenerates).

    People of all ages dump and litter, but I suppose the litter in my local park is mostly cans, crisp packets, take away boxes, bottles etc strewn in piles here and there where there would have been groups of young people sitting. I'm pretty sure it wasn't middle aged people getting their drink on in the park at night.


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    #181
    Biker79
    Closed Accounts Posts: 794 ✭✭✭Biker79


    You can also note from some of the photos posted via Twitter, that the type of trash being dumped is in many instances quite similar - coke, beer, pizza, cakes etc.

    Trash food makes trashy people produce too much trash.

    ( and nappies )


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