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The Grapevine (OFF TOPIC CHAT) Part II

1…3233353738…40

Comments

  • #1702
    auspicious
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭auspicious


    ..judge Robin Postle ruled he was “satisfied overwhelmingly that ethical veganism does constitute a philosophical belief".

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/theconversation.com/amp/veganism-has-always-been-more-about-living-an-ethical-life-than-just-avoiding-meat-and-dairy-129307

    Under the UK Equality Act beliefs are compatible with human dignity and don’t conflict with the fundamental rights of others.


  • #1703
    65535
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 877 ✭✭✭65535


    Thread in another area of boards called 'Vegan death cult'

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058045320


  • #1704
    Unearthly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,047 ✭✭✭Unearthly


    65535 wrote: »
    Thread in another area of boards called 'Vegan death cult'

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058045320

    When the basis of a topic is from Sv3rige, a racist who has a violent, mentally ill past and wants a world where the strongest survive including rape and murder of humans, then it's fair to say we are on the right side here


  • #1705
    ednwireland
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,452 ✭✭✭✭ednwireland


    living on the veg starts on itv now.actually started last sunday so ep2 on tomorrow.

    My weather

    https://www.ecowitt.net/home/share?authorize=96CT1F



  • #1706
    Tilikum17
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,324 ✭✭✭Tilikum17


    New vegan deli open in Galway.

    Newcastle Rd.


  • #1707
    davidjtaylor
    Registered Users Posts: 755 ✭✭✭davidjtaylor


    GE2020.

    Not wanting to start a political debate here: this is for everyone's information. No responses needed or wanted. Make up your own mind but please don't waste your vote - you will be in effect supporting the old white male parties.

    Please vote for a candidate supporting animal rights (in some form, whether welfare, anti-subsidy or veganism). See below for more info.

    Vote right down the ballot paper, put your least favourite at the bottom (like to start from the bottom and go upwards towards "least worst").

    https://banbloodsports.wordpress.com/2020/01/08/general-election-2020-candidates-and-animal-cruelty-issues/


  • #1708
    ednwireland
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,452 ✭✭✭✭ednwireland


    davidjtaylor wrote: »
    GE2020.

    Vote right down the ballot paper, put your least favourite at the bottom (like to start from the bottom and go upwards towards "least worst").

    do not do this (unless you want to) but if there are candidates you dont want your vote ever going to just leave them off, otherwise your vote could count for someone you dont want it to count for.


    Apologies - mods maybe a ge202 thread might be more appropriate

    My weather

    https://www.ecowitt.net/home/share?authorize=96CT1F



  • #1709
    davidjtaylor
    Registered Users Posts: 755 ✭✭✭davidjtaylor


    ednwireland wrote: »
    do not do this (unless you want to) but if there are candidates you dont want your vote ever going to just leave them off, otherwise your vote could count for someone you dont want it to count for.


    Apologies - mods maybe a ge202 thread might be more appropriate


    Have a read here.


    Individually, it is true, failing to vote right down through the list has only a marginal effect. But if this sin of omission is repeated on a widespread basis by fellow voters it can actually assist a candidate who you would prefer to see defeated by lowering the effective quota, and making it easier for him/her to reach it. As an election proceeds and the number of non-transferable votes accumulates, the number required to be elected – the effective quota – falls.


    In an election in which there is a strong non-transferable trend, this marginal trend can become very pronounced and results become very unpredictable.


  • #1710
    loveisdivine
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,463 ✭✭✭loveisdivine


    We only have 1 candidate here that voted in favour of the hunting ban. The rest all voted against the ban (and various other poor animal welfare views) so what should I do? I definitely don't want my support going to them.


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  • #1711
    davidjtaylor
    Registered Users Posts: 755 ✭✭✭davidjtaylor


    loveisdivine wrote: »
    We only have 1 candidate here that voted in favour of the hunting ban. The rest all voted against the ban (and various other poor animal welfare views) so what should I do? I definitely don't want my support going to them.


    Tough decision. There are other issues to take into account apart from animal welfare though.


  • #1712
    Worztron
    Registered Users Posts: 8,739 ✭✭✭Worztron


    Tar.Aldarion wrote: »
    I would consider that not plantbased but vegan, since it doesn't harm any animals to have it cooked nearby meat I have no issue with it personally.

    +1

    Mitch Hedberg: "Rice is great if you're really hungry and want to eat two thousand of something."



  • #1713
    rainbow kirby
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,928 ✭✭✭✭rainbow kirby


    Tar.Aldarion wrote: »
    I would consider that not plantbased but vegan, since it doesn't harm any animals to have it cooked nearby meat I have no issue with it personally.

    I tend to take a similar view on things like this and the KFC vegan burger. As the veggie-working-towards-vegan separated mum of two young children who are omni to keep their dad happy it opens up many more options for us. I know that my children (nearly 4 and 2) are guaranteed to eat a BK kids meal. There are times when it will be the easy option for us to go somewhere like that. If I can get a meal as well then it makes our lives easier.

    Similarly, with the KFC vegan burger there are actual vegan sides - but if I get the beans then my 2 year old is likely to dive in :D


  • #1714
    Tar.Aldarion
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,104 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    I always think these places are ideal for people in your situation, and people need to realise that others have different circumstances than themselves. Not to mention these places are just cheaper than others and many want to go out for a meal with their family on a budget so this is easier for them in another aspect too.


  • #1715
    rubadub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,382 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    In McDonalds they have the big screens for ordering stuff on yourself, you can customise the burgers. I noticed there was a "remove beef pattie button", I remember hearing of people asking for burgers with no bun who were off bread.

    You can now ask for lettuce and mayo on even the eurosaver burgers. I get double cheeseburgers with the works, extra lettuce, mayo, mustard, pickles, onions, ketchup. They are quite substantial.

    McDonalds do veggie dippers so I guess you could get those and a eurosaver burger with no meat and build your own burger. Might be cheaper than buying the dedicated burger. Or stick some chips in the burger bun.

    It looks like the veggie burger just has 2 dippers in it.

    1577789132341.png

    1546970709863.png


  • #1716
    Tar.Aldarion
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,104 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    https://ourworldindata.org/uploads/2020/01/Environmental-impact-of-foods-by-life-cycle-stage.png

    99c75kKl.png

    https://ourworldindata.org/food-choice-vs-eating-local?fbclid=IwAR3eVgttM6X6RtygEh-RhRXohxyvz0CB2-Mmx1sD8ur-q54eyPUIKtNa0uI


    Nice article explaining why what you eat is far more important than where your food comes from, sometimes local food is even worse for the environment, interestingly.


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  • #1717
    New Home
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 77,025 Mod ✭✭✭✭New Home


    Tar, that picture is really interesting, but it's also massive (to reduce it to the width of the screen I had to reduce it to 30%) - could you possibly resize it, please? If it's just me, then don't worry. :)


  • #1718
    Tar.Aldarion
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,104 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    I made the bigger one clickable and posted a smaller one if that helps! Didn't realise as it's automatically resized for my screen somehow, sorry!


  • #1719
    New Home
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 77,025 Mod ✭✭✭✭New Home


    Thanks Tar. :)


  • #1720
    gozunda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    Tar.Aldarion wrote: »
    https://ourworldindata.org/uploads/2020/01/Environmental-impact-of-foods-by-life-cycle-stage.png

    ...

    Nice article explaining why what you eat is far more important than where your food comes from, sometimes local food is even worse for the environment, interestingly.

    Unfortunatrly the above claim that "what you eat is far more important than where your food comes from, sometimes local food is even worse for the environment" is simply not borne out by the information presented

    The infographic linked is actually derived from data from a meta-analysis study on 'food's environmental impact' by Poore and Nemacek. To put it simply - the infographic uses Poores and Nemaceks aggregated global data from 119 countries. It does not show 'local' data for food production.

    In the infographic the aggregated global data for 'greenhouse gas emissions across food supply chain' is broken down as follows:

    1. Above ground changes in biomass from deforestation and below ground changes in soil carbon
    2. Farm
    3. Animal feed
    4. Processing
    5. Transport
    6. Retail
    7. Packaging

    Taking No. 1 in that list - for example - the percentages of ghg emissions for beef comes from 119 countries and are not measured but taken to be 'global average values' - and those emissions therefore do not represent 'local' data - but rather aggregated data of many different regions and different production systems worldwide.

    Not only does the infographic use aggregated data - it also to fails to demarcate beef production in those countries where cattle are fed mainly forage on existing grasslands or production which does not involve ongoing deforestation and also appears to omit the very important role that grassland plays in carbon sequestration and which has recently been highlighted by the European Environment Agency

    The other significant issue with Hannan Ritchies use of data is that - it is taken from a study about other studies.

    Whilst it is certainly true that such meta-analysis represents a powerful way to summarize data - it remains this type of reseach comes with a host of recognised problems - including the fact that  such reseach may be little more than "an analysis of analyses' and that any findings may not derive from objective study but rather the cherry picking of selected data
    Scientists have to make several decisions and judgment calls that influence the outcome of a meta-analysis...

    Even when no money is at stake, researchers may have an interest in the outcome of a meta-analysis—for instance because they may hope to confirm what their own studies had previously shown, or because they’ve supported certain policies.

    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/09/meta-analyses-were-supposed-end-scientific-debates-often-they-only-cause-more

    Which brings me to my last observation. I would be rightly lambasted if I were to present a piece here for example giving data from a meta-analysis of different studies showing beef to be good for you (even given that was peer reviewed reseach) written by someone working or who has worked in the beef industry.

    The fact is that the author of the above article Hannah Ritchies has worked in the plant food industry with a company involved in the development of plant derived proteins made from bioethanol - a company whose stated aim is to promote commercial alternatives to traditional protein farming ...


  • #1721
    davidjtaylor
    Registered Users Posts: 755 ✭✭✭davidjtaylor


    Tar.Aldarion wrote: »
    https://ourworldindata.org/uploads/2020/01/Environmental-impact-of-foods-by-life-cycle-stage.png

    99c75kKl.png

    https://ourworldindata.org/food-choice-vs-eating-local?fbclid=IwAR3eVgttM6X6RtygEh-RhRXohxyvz0CB2-Mmx1sD8ur-q54eyPUIKtNa0uI


    Nice article explaining why what you eat is far more important than where your food comes from, sometimes local food is even worse for the environment, interestingly.


    Taking the 'nuts' example at the bottom, I think of how our patch has been transformed - we have lots of trees now plus have turned grazing into semi-self-sufficient food production. The land may not be CO2 negative but it's possibly as neutral as one can get.


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  • #1722
    gozunda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    davidjtaylor wrote: »
    Taking the 'nuts' example at the bottom, I think of how our patch has been transformed - we have lots of trees now plus have turned grazing into semi-self-sufficient food production. The land may not be CO2 negative but it's possibly as neutral as one can get.

    David - is there anyone in Ireland growing nuts as a commercial crop?


  • #1723
    Tilikum17
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,324 ✭✭✭Tilikum17


    Pizza Hut in the UK plans to go go dairy free by 2030. Never hat a Pizza Hut to be honest.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/vegannewsnow.com/2020/02/28/pizza-hut-dairy-free-carbon-neutral/amp/


  • #1724
    Tilikum17
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,324 ✭✭✭Tilikum17


    After trying for ages to find nice vegan boot I came across the website below. They have a vegan section with a brand I hadn’t heard of before. There’s also 20% off at the min. I’m not in any way or know anyone attached to the site.

    https://www.soletrader.co.uk/mens/vegan/

    I ordered a pair on Sunday eve & got them today. Delighted with them tbh.


  • #1725
    Unearthly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,047 ✭✭✭Unearthly


    Hoping everyone is safe and well these days.


  • #1726
    Worztron
    Registered Users Posts: 8,739 ✭✭✭Worztron


    Unearthly wrote: »
    Hoping everyone is safe and well these days.

    +1

    Mitch Hedberg: "Rice is great if you're really hungry and want to eat two thousand of something."



  • #1727
    auspicious
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭auspicious


    https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-52638628


  • #1728
    New Home
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 77,025 Mod ✭✭✭✭New Home


    https://www.boredpanda.com/vegan-leather-cactus-desserto-mexico/


  • #1729
    auspicious
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭auspicious


    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zmwxZu91NwA


  • #1730
    quickbeam
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 16,287 Mod ✭✭✭✭quickbeam


    I've got a query that I don't think is worth starting a new thread for, so hoping it's okay to ask here.

    I was watching Eat Grow Cook there over the week and they were growing courgettes. Now, I'm no gardener, but I've always fancied the idea of one day having a vegetable garden. But, they used both chicken manure pellets for feeding the courgette plants, and diluted semi-skimmed milk for preventing a fungus infection on the plants. I'm wondering would either, or both of these activities render the courgettes no longer vegan? Certainly the milk would point that way. But even the feed, if it's a bi-product of the poultry industry, surely that would be against the vegan ethos? In fact, to extend the argument further, would all manure, as a bi-product of meat or other non-vegan activities render the crop it is used on also non vegan?

    For the record, I'm vegetarian, not vegan, though I have cut down on my use of animal sourced products in recent years.


  • #1731
    Tar.Aldarion
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,104 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    I think for most people, they just do what is practicable for them, so telling if a courgette in a supermarket was made in this way is quite hard, so they just do their best. They are mostly concerned with the more important aspects, perhaps if everybody was vegan then those things would be under more scrutiny. At the end of the day there are many problems with production at a commercial scale in general that people have to work out. If a vegan was growing at a small scale like that they would probably make endeavours to find an alternative. In general, you can't live without doing harm, but what you can do is try and limit it best you can. :)


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  • #1732
    auspicious
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭auspicious


    End factory farming campaign UK petition.

    https://t.co/YzHG3hQIKs?amp=1


  • #1733
    auspicious
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭auspicious


    Hogwood
    34mins
    Available on Amazon Prime video ( YouTube €2.99)
    https://mobile.twitter.com/vivacampaigns/status/1308466092147462144?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Eembeddedtimeline%7Ctwterm%5Eprofile%3Avivacampaigns%7Ctwcon%5Etimelinechrome&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.vivahealth.org.uk%2Fresources%2Fsafeguarding-childrens-health%2Fhistory-conclusion-online
    https://www.google.com/search?q=hogwood&oq=hogwood&aqs=chrome..69i57j46j0l2j69i60.7851j0j7&client=ms-android-samsung-gs-rev1&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#vch=https://m.youtube.com/watch?v%3Da_mQR7w__F0


  • #1734
    F1ngers
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 10,399 Mod ✭✭✭✭F1ngers


    Not worthy of a new thread.

    Bought Applewood vegan slices in Tesco(square) on Wednesday.

    https://www.veganfoodandliving.com/news/applewoods-smoked-vegan-cheese-is-now-available-in-slices/

    It's ok "raw" but it really comes into its own when toasted.
    I toasted with quorn vegan smoked "ham" and it is absolutely lovely.

    Toast the cheese first until it melts/goes brown, add quorn "ham" and another slice of bread and toast both sides.


  • #1735
    Tar.Aldarion
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,104 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    yeah it's great melted, I quite like it as is too


  • #1736
    auspicious
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭auspicious


    ‘Animals feel pain’: why a farmer’s son turned vegan
    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/people/animals-feel-pain-why-a-farmer-s-son-turned-vegan-1.1953889%3fmode=amp


  • #1737
    auspicious
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭auspicious


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7EWshot-BPM

    https://proveg.com/blog/proveg-launches-campaign-to-stop-eu-veggie-burger-naming-ban/


  • #1738
    Tilikum17
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,324 ✭✭✭Tilikum17


    auspicious wrote: »
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7EWshot-BPM

    https://proveg.com/blog/proveg-launches-campaign-to-stop-eu-veggie-burger-naming-ban/

    Ham burger
    Beef burger
    Veggie burger

    They’ve been around for years but now they want to change it. It’s just shows you how worried they are lol.


  • #1739
    auspicious
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭auspicious


    Katherine Drake StoweResearch Coordinator
    North Carolina Soybean Producers Association
    imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fnebraskasoybeans.org%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2016%2F02%2FSoybeans-101.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fnebraskasoybeans.org%2Feducation%2Ffoodandfuel&docid=APtBxVvgS71QYM&tbnid=FALr64L06ISUmM&vet=1&w=1071&h=834&itg=1&client=ms-android-samsung-gs-rev1&bih=594&biw=360&ved=2ahUKEwj4g52B5sDsAhUPa8AKHQ31CAMQxiAoAHoECAEQFg&iact=c&ictx=1

    https://content.ces.ncsu.edu/north-carolina-soybean-production-guide/soybean-facts


    Soy cultivation is a major driver of deforestation in the Amazon basin. Seeds from the soybean plant provide high protein animal feed for livestock, and 80% of Amazon soy is destined for animal feed; smaller percentages are used for oil or eaten directly. Today Brazil has 24-25 million hectares devoted to the growth of this crop, and is currently the second largest producer of soybeans in the world.
    https://globalforestatlas.yale.edu/amazon/land-use/soy#:~:text=Soy%20cultivation%20is%20a%20major,for%20oil%20or%20eaten%20directly.

    The majority of soybean is grown primarily for animal feed. All soybean is processed for oil first.


  • #1740
    rubadub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,382 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    https://www.thejournal.ie/farmers-ban-burger-steak-milk-vegan-products-5238249-Oct2020/
    One amendment would curtail the use of terms such as ‘steak’, ‘sausage’, ‘escalope’, ‘burger’ or ‘hamburger’ on products that do not exclusively contain meat.
    surely this is not right? the whole idea is ludicrous but are they going to rule out meat sausages that have rusk etc in them?!


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  • #1741
    Unearthly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,047 ✭✭✭Unearthly


    It's extremely short term thinking fear. Plenty of ways around such as the packaging showing the actual product then as products get established, the brand recognition will take over

    Nothing to worry about for me


  • #1742
    auspicious
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭auspicious


    They can just label the ( disks and tube >< ) products cruelty free and antibiotic free.


  • #1743
    rubadub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,382 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    I just don't get it, statements like this
    “We simply cannot have plant-based products deliberately disguised as something they are not,” IFA President Tim Cullinan said.

    do they think people are been conned into buying something? are people mistakenly buying quorn burgers?

    The only time I hear of mistakes is people buying say "spice bugers" thinking the were veggie, even though the ingredients clearly state it. Or people getting "vegetable soup" which was made with chicken stock.

    Do they think they are losing significant sales? and think there will be a big increase in sales of meat if "veggie burgers" are rebranded as "veggie patties".


  • #1744
    auspicious
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭auspicious


    I do laugh at the ridiculousness. Take a turkey sausage for example. Will this fall outside regulations? Sure we all know a sausage means pork, don't we? ( Though pork being an euphemism for pig flesh which wooshes over most heads. )
    Will beef tomatoes need to be renamed if this silly legislation is passed?


  • #1745
    New Home
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 77,025 Mod ✭✭✭✭New Home


    What about Easter eggs (hollow ovoidal chocolate shapes) and chocolate bunnies (hollow leporidae-shaped novelty chocolate )? And creme eggs? And ice cream bombes (do not contain actual explosives)? I still haven't been told why cleansing milk is ok, but almond/soy/oat/etc isn't.


  • #1746
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Peanut butter.

    Cream of coconut.

    Coconut milk.


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  • #1747
    65535
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 877 ✭✭✭65535


    Vote Today:

    https://www.thejournal.ie/poll-should-vegetarian-foods-be-allowed-use-words-like-steak-and-burger-5238520-Oct2020/


  • #1748
    rubadub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,382 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    I this this is the actual proposal

    https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/A-8-2019-0198_EN.pdf#page=169


  • #1749
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    How does one embed in a post whether it’s a video, article or picture ?

    I’m using the touch site on smartphone.


    Thanks in advance


  • #1750
    Worztron
    Registered Users Posts: 8,739 ✭✭✭Worztron


    The IFA are a bunch of Meatflakes.

    Mitch Hedberg: "Rice is great if you're really hungry and want to eat two thousand of something."



  • #1751
    Worztron
    Registered Users Posts: 8,739 ✭✭✭Worztron


    65535 wrote: »
    Vote Today:

    https://www.thejournal.ie/poll-should-vegetarian-foods-be-allowed-use-words-like-steak-and-burger-5238520-Oct2020/

    Done!

    Mitch Hedberg: "Rice is great if you're really hungry and want to eat two thousand of something."



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