Will you take an approved COVID-19 vaccine?

MacDanger · 24-11-2020 4:30pm

For those who want to wait and see what the "long term effects" are - how long would you wait?

A year?
2 years?
10 years?

How did you come to the conclusion that a vaccine would be safe after that amount of time?

El Tarangu · 24-11-2020 4:33pm

dashoonage wrote: »

Atari Jaguar

Blast her with... antibodies.

Hellrazer · 24-11-2020 4:38pm

El Sueño wrote: »

It's not been rushed

8-10 months is a rush in terms of vaccine development.

That could bite us in the ass.

False Prophet · 24-11-2020 4:40pm

People saying that they wont take it as they are "young" and dont need it as wont die.

Isn't the problem/risk going to be that you would spread it to a person who cant take the vaccine for medical reasons, no? Or will you continue to wear masks and take precautions when out?

Plumbthedepths · 24-11-2020 4:42pm

I will, but I will also allow many thousands go before me.

Jafin · 24-11-2020 4:51pm

False Prophet wrote: »

People saying that they wont take it as they are "young" and dont need it as wont die.

Isn't the problem/risk going to be that you would spread it to a person who cant take the vaccine for medical reasons, no? Or will you continue to wear masks and take precautions when out?

Speaking for myself only, yes I will continue to take precautions the same as I am now. Like I said in a previous post I will still be as careful as I possibly can and absolutely will not be out socialising unvaccinated if I am putting others at risk by possibly carrying the virus without knowing it. I work in a shop where I am on my own 99% of the time and I only allow one customer in at a time (when we're open). There is plexiglass between me and the customers, and I sanitise before and after each transaction. As far as I am aware there is a very low chance of me contracting it while at work. I only really leave to house to go to work, and it's a very short walk, so chances of me contracting it and/or passing it on to others is very low.

My stance isn't about keeping myself healthy at all (although of course I want to stay healthy), I don't want to put others at risk either and will continue wearing a mask and using hand sanitiser as much as I can. I understand that that's at odds with me deciding to wait to take the vaccination, but that's just how I feel about it at the moment. That could all change when it's offered to me. It's definitely a "wait and see" approach as to me making the decision. I'm not saying I won't take it all, I'm just saying that I'm not going to be rushing to get it as soon as I can.

MrStuffins · 24-11-2020 4:51pm

False Prophet wrote: »

People saying that they wont take it as they are "young" and dont need it as wont die.

Isn't the problem/risk going to be that you would spread it to a person who cant take the vaccine for medical reasons, no? Or will you continue to wear masks and take precautions when out?

Are there people who can't take it for medical reasons? I was unaware.

breezy1985 · 24-11-2020 4:56pm

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I will, but I will also allow many thousands go before me.

A true hero.

You would have made a great British army general in WW1

MacDanger · 24-11-2020 4:57pm

Hellrazer wrote: »

8-10 months is a rush in terms of vaccine development.

That could bite us in the ass.

Part of the reason (other than the obvious massive resources allocated to it) for the reduced development time is the prevalence of the virus in the community.

For the Phase 3 trials, you give X people the vaccine and X the placebo and you need to wait for Y people (say 100) to get contract the virus - then you see how many of those 100 people got the vaccine and how many got the placebo and that tells you how effective the vaccine is. For most viruses, you might have to wait years for 100 people to contract the virus but with Covid, it's very prevalent so that waiting time is greatly reduced.

Deeper Blue · 24-11-2020 4:59pm

Hellrazer wrote: »

8-10 months is a rush in terms of vaccine development.

That could bite us in the ass.

See MacDanger's post above

As I say, it's not been rushed

Done quickly? Absolutely

But that does not mean it was rushed

24-11-2020 5:01pm

Yes.

ixoy · 24-11-2020 5:05pm

Hellrazer wrote: »

8-10 months is a rush in terms of vaccine development.

That could bite us in the ass.

There's a good read here from the BBC about why it's not rushed. Coming out fast relative to other vaccines does not mean short cuts have been taken - just urgency and optimal development being possible when money is no object.

grogi · 24-11-2020 5:12pm

Yes, of course. But when the time comes.

Taking an active substances always have risks and side effects. If it doesn't have side effects, it simply doesn't work. It is a balancing act between risks and benefits.

As it stands right now, the benefits for me are small and IMHO not worth taking the risk. Later on, if it is required to travel - sure. If I am preventing herd immunity - sure. But I'll gladly let others with much more to gain (elderly, frontline workers, people with existing medical conditions etc) to take it before.

grogi · 24-11-2020 5:14pm

Hellrazer wrote: »

8-10 months is a rush in terms of vaccine development.

That could bite us in the ass.

It's not really rushed. The research doesn't have to wait on grant/budget approval. Any administrative tasks are done without any unnecessary delay etc. It is massively optimized, but the research itself isn't much different than with any other vaccine.

peter kern · 24-11-2020 5:16pm

MacDanger wrote: »

Part of the reason (other than the obvious massive resources allocated to it) for the reduced development time is the prevalence of the virus in the community.

For the Phase 3 trials, you give X people the vaccine and X the placebo and you need to wait for Y people (say 100) to get contract the virus - then you see how many of those 100 people got the vaccine and how many got the placebo and that tells you how effective the vaccine is. For most viruses, you might have to wait years for 100 people to contract the virus but with Covid, it's very prevalent so that waiting time is greatly reduced.

so you are saying phase 3 trials can predict long term side effects ? which i think is the point of the people that talk about rushing it and iam sure it makes a lot of sense to rush it for higher risk people. especially older people where the long term effects dont matter so much given they dont have such a long time left.
i guess another interresting point is which one people will prefer to going to take and i would be interested to know more of the differences between the three on offer so far.
btw what happend to the russian one?
so i guess some people would be wise not to answer yet with a definite yes or no but try to learn more about. i

_Brian · 24-11-2020 5:18pm

Small sample but reassuring numbers in the poll, only 11% not willing to get it.

The Belly · 24-11-2020 5:19pm

ixoy wrote: »

There's a good read here from the BBC about why it's not rushed. Coming out fast relative to other vaccines does not mean short cuts have been taken - just urgency and optimal development being possible when money is no object.

And the governments have agreed to indemnify the pharma companies producing the vaccine above a certain amount should it turn out that things go wrong the terms of which are not being made public.

Macy0161 · 24-11-2020 5:21pm

Yes for me. I doubt I'll be getting it immediately though, given how long I've been waiting to get this years Flu vaccine!

breezy1985 · 24-11-2020 5:21pm

peter kern wrote: »

so you are saying phase 3 trials can predict long term side effects ? which i think is the point of the people that talk about rushing it and iam sure it makes a lot of sense to rush it for higher risk people. especially older people where the long term effects dont matter so much given they dont have such a long time left.
i guess another interresting point is which one people will prefer to going to take and i would be interested to know more of the differences between the three on offer so far.
btw what happend to the russian one?
so i guess some people would be wise not to answer yet with a definite yes or no but try to learn more about. i

The Russian one is most likely BS to begin with and is about as believable as a Nigerian prince.

Thing about long term side affects is how long do you wait. 2,5 or even 10 years. I am a little worried that this will be a new thalidomide scandal in 30 years but I'm far less worried about that than I am about carrying on as things are now

billyhead · 24-11-2020 5:23pm

No thanks. I'd be worried I might end up with hair growing out of my eyeballs. Let Leo @ Michael Martin go first and than I will sit back and wait a while before jumping the gun.

Plumbthedepths · 24-11-2020 5:25pm

_Brian wrote: »

Small sample but reassuring numbers in the poll, only 11% not willing to get it.

A polll on this site is absolutely meaningless. Here's one from the Times, prehaps a little out of date .
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/survey-finds-55-of-irish-people-would-take-covid-vaccine-1.4391037
Edit,
Sorry didn't paste the first time.

breezy1985 · 24-11-2020 5:28pm

billyhead wrote: »

No thanks. I'd be worried I might end up with hair growing out of my eyeballs. Let Leo @ Michael Martin go first and than I will sit back and wait a while before jumping the gun.

Why does everyone always worry that the side effects will be bad?

Maybe we will get super strength or telepathy or something

Rubberchikken · 24-11-2020 5:32pm

No. This whole thing has happened far too quickly and the idea of a vaccine being produced so soon makes the cynic in me say no way would I touch it.

We have china to thank for the year we've had so far, we then go cap in hand for ppe to protect us from their crap and now we're expected to be happy with a vaccine pushed out as quick as possible by companies who's only interest is making hugh amounts of money at any cost

How much more stupid do we have to be?

CalamariFritti · 24-11-2020 5:35pm

MacDanger wrote: »

For those who want to wait and see what the "long term effects" are - how long would you wait?

A year?
2 years?
10 years?

How did you come to the conclusion that a vaccine would be safe after that amount of time?

By observing whether not so good stuff happens to the people who took it before me? Thought that was quite obvious?

quokula · 24-11-2020 5:38pm

breezy1985 wrote: »

Why does everyone always worry that the side effects will be bad?

Maybe we will get super strength or telepathy or something

And why do people who obsess over the unlikely possibility of long term side effects of a vaccine, so often ignore the long term side effects that have been observed in many people who've actually caught covid?

The benefit of the vaccine that might have a miniscule chance of long term side effects, though none of been seen in the many of thousands of people tested, far outweighs the risk of not getting one and catching a disease with a small chance of imminent death, a larger chance of heavy short term suffering, and some chance of major long term side effects which are not yet fully understood but have already observed in a sizeable number of people - with all of these chances also accompanied by the possibility of passing them on to your friends and loved ones who may suffer as badly or worse.

ixoy · 24-11-2020 5:39pm

CalamariFritti wrote: »

By observing whether not so good stuff happens to the people who took it before me? Thought that was quite obvious?

The question is how long will you wait and observe for? After six months, will you be happy it's okay? Six years? What'll be sufficient.

24-11-2020 5:39pm

Neamhshuntasach wrote: »

Won't be taking it. And I don't care what airlines or governments say. I'm entitled to a holiday and I'll be visiting without any covid vaccine. Nobody is going to force me to put this untested junk in my body. I took enough to last me a life time when travelling around South America and I'm pretty sure the 10 year yellow fever one killed lots of my brain cells.

That does seem evident.

CalamariFritti · 24-11-2020 5:40pm

ixoy wrote: »

The question is how long will you wait and observe for? After six months, will you be happy it's okay? Six years? What'll be sufficient.

Dunno tbh. I was really answering to this one.

How did you come to the conclusion that a vaccine would be safe after that amount of time?

John O.Groats · 24-11-2020 5:40pm

Neamhshuntasach wrote: »

Won't be taking it. And I don't care what airlines or governments say. I'm entitled to a holiday and I'll be visiting without any covid vaccine. Nobody is going to force me to put this untested junk in my body. I took enough to last me a life time when travelling around South America and I'm pretty sure the 10 year yellow fever one killed lots of my brain cells.

If all airlines insist on a passenger having taken the covid vaccine before being allowed to travel then what are you going to do? Swim? As for being "entitled" to a foreign holiday without observing health and safety measures you are completely mistaken despite your show of bravado on here. Anyway as soon as the vaccine becomes available I will be queueing up for it if need be.

grogi · 24-11-2020 5:43pm

quokula wrote: »

And why do people who obsess over the unlikely possibility of long term side effects of a vaccine, so often ignore the long term side effects that have been observed in many people who've actually caught covid?

Because the possibility of contracting COVID is very small as well. Especially if there is massive vaccination effort happening around.

We had 70k cases so far - so (if my napkin calculation is right) you have roughly 3% chance of contracting (technically being a detected case, not actual contracting) the virus over a period of a year. Reduce your exposure, always have protection - you lower those number even further. And if you do get unlucky, the probability of serious complications for loads of people are slim as well.

The Belly · 24-11-2020 5:45pm

John O.Groats wrote: »

If all airlines insist on a passenger having taken the covid vaccine before being allowed to travel then what are you going to do then? Swim? As for being "entitled" to a foreign holiday without observing health and safety measures you are completely mistaken despite your show of bravado on here.. Anyway as soon as the vaccine becomes available I will be queueing up for it if need be.

They will have a problem implementing that given the EU General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR).

grogi · 24-11-2020 5:46pm

The Belly wrote: »

They will have a problem implementing that given the EU General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR).

That's voluntary disclosure. You disclose your vaccination record, you fly. You don't disclose it, you don't fly. It is not in violation of GDPR.

Plumbthedepths · 24-11-2020 5:50pm

grogi wrote: »

That's voluntary disclosure. You disclose your vaccination record, you fly. You don't disclose it, you don't fly. It is not in violation of GDPR.

You'll be able to fly with RA unless the EU makes vaccination mandatory which I doubt they will. https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/travel/covid-jab-ryanair-will-not-ask-for-proof-of-vaccination-within-eu-1.4417851

Russman · 24-11-2020 5:58pm

The Belly wrote: »

And the governments have agreed to indemnify the pharma companies producing the vaccine above a certain amount should it turn out that things go wrong the terms of which are not being made public.

Isn't that true of every vaccine ? maybe even every drug that get approved IIRC.
It was discussed on the other thread I think, way back. Something about there never would be any research or trials done if it wasn't the case.

Anyway, I'd take it if its approved. I like to think I'm relatively low risk, so it'll probably next summer before they'd give it to me anyway, but when the time comes, inject away.

MacDanger · 24-11-2020 5:59pm

CalamariFritti wrote: »

Dunno tbh. I was really answering to this one.

The question was related to the amount of time though, perhaps I should have bolded it as below:

How did you come to the conclusion that a vaccine would be safe after that amount of time?

John O.Groats · 24-11-2020 6:01pm

breezy1985 wrote: »

A true hero.

You would have made a great British army general in WW1

some-of-you-may-die-but-that-is-a-sacrifice-17417790.png

MacDanger · 24-11-2020 6:03pm

peter kern wrote: »

so you are saying phase 3 trials can predict long term side effects ? which i think is the point of the people that talk about rushing it and iam sure it makes a lot of sense to rush it for higher risk people. especially older people where the long term effects dont matter so much given they dont have such a long time left.
i

No, I'm not saying that at all.

Are you worried about the "long term side effects"? If so, how much data would you need to make you happy about the safety of a vaccine? 1 year? 2 years? 10 years?

hatrickpatrick · 24-11-2020 6:06pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Neamhshuntasach wrote: »

Won't be taking it. And I don't care what airlines or governments say. I'm entitled to a holiday and I'll be visiting without any covid vaccine. Nobody is going to force me to put this untested junk in my body. I took enough to last me a life time when travelling around South America and I'm pretty sure the 10 year yellow fever one killed lots of my brain cells.

That does seem evident.

Ah come on, you walked right in to that one

John O.Groats · 24-11-2020 6:08pm

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

You'll be able to fly with RA unless the EU makes vaccination mandatory which I doubt they will. https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/travel/covid-jab-ryanair-will-not-ask-for-proof-of-vaccination-within-eu-1.4417851

Why do you think vaccination will not be made mandatory?

hatrickpatrick · 24-11-2020 6:26pm

John O.Groats wrote: »

Why do you think vaccination will not be made mandatory?

It's extremely unlikely in the current climate that the EU would make vaccines mandatory, they are acutely aware of how anti-vax sentiment and euroskeptic sentiment tend to go hand in hand, and thus how this could be used very easily to further anti-EU campaigns on social media etc. I very, very much doubt they'd take such a risk, particularly with Brexit still ongoing.

CalamariFritti · 24-11-2020 6:28pm

MacDanger wrote: »

The question was related to the amount of time though, perhaps I should have bolded it as below:

Got you. But I dont know the answer to that because me personally I didnt put a time limit on it. A year sounds reasonable, no?

Me personally I wouldnt rush to get vaccinated because this virus doesnt worry me much on a personal level. I'm reluctant to put anything into me that I'm not fully sure I need. Wouldnt be running to a doc for antibiotics for every little thing either. Just as an example.

But as for the people saying I'd like to sit back a bit for safety reasons I find that perfectly understandable.

Our governments and public health bodies haven't exactly been honest with us. They continue to overreact and turn this into a political plaything. And they also talk up individual risk no end to keep the public in line.

Now maybe thats what they have to do with regards to a public health message. But my takeaway from that is they have not been - and granted, maybe cannot be - totally honest with us.

And by extension of that I fully expect them to be not fully honest with regards to vaccine risks either.

And obviously I'm not the only one thinking that way.

hmmm · 24-11-2020 6:29pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

It's extremely unlikely in the current climate that the EU would make vaccines mandatory, they are acutely aware of how anti-vax sentiment and euroskeptic sentiment tend to go hand in hand, and thus how this could be used very easily to further anti-EU campaigns on social media etc. I very, very much doubt they'd take such a risk, particularly with Brexit still ongoing.

The EU are not going to make vaccines mandatory.

Individual countries might decide to make it mandatory. Businesses might decide they will make more money by not catering for unvaccinated people. There will be an interesting argument in the future as to whether businesses need to protect their staff from unvaccinated people, but that's probably for courts to decide.

Plumbthedepths · 24-11-2020 6:42pm

John O.Groats wrote: »

Why do you think vaccination will not be made mandatory?

I'll turn the question back on you , which are mandatory to-date here in Ireland for example?
There are many illnesses far more deadly than Covid yet even though we have vaccines for them they are not mandatory.
The flu vaccine yet the uptake by medical professionals is very low.

Plumbthedepths · 24-11-2020 7:01pm

hmmm wrote: »

The EU are not going to make vaccines mandatory.

Individual countries might decide to make it mandatory. Businesses might decide they will make more money by not catering for unvaccinated people. There will be an interesting argument in the future as to whether businesses need to protect their staff from unvaccinated people, but that's probably for courts to decide.

In the absence of a state making a vaccine mandatory I can guarantee you a business operating in a state without mandatory vaccination laws will not impose their own. Fighting a discrimination case will focus the minds of others who would wish to go maverick.

Simpsonsfan17 · 24-11-2020 7:02pm

No.

freshpopcorn · 24-11-2020 7:07pm

I’d get it eventually but would like it to be some sort of hassle free walk in clinic to get it.
I’ve learnt of a few people who are anti vaccine and they’d surprise you.

hatrickpatrick · 24-11-2020 8:57pm

freshpopcorn wrote: »

I’d get it eventually but would like it to be some sort of hassle free walk in clinic to get it.

This is something I reckon isn't getting enough attention. We all know how disastrous the HSE tends to be at logistics - to quote Bishop Brennan, they couldn't organise a nun shoot in a nunnery. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I have a feeling the roll out of this vaccine is going to be a logistical nightmare primarily because the people running the HSE seem to have no idea how to organise anything. Just a couple of days ago there was an article about how cumbersome and archaic some of the procedures were - many designed before computers existed and have never since been upgraded, for example - which would certainly give one pause for worry about how disorganised the roll out could become.

24-11-2020 9:16pm

Rubberchikken wrote: »

No. This whole thing has happened far too quickly and the idea of a vaccine being produced so soon makes the cynic in me say no way would I touch it.

We have china to thank for the year we've had so far, we then go cap in hand for ppe to protect us from their crap and now we're expected to be happy with a vaccine pushed out as quick as possible by companies who's only interest is making hugh amounts of money at any cost

How much more stupid do we have to be?

The oxford vaccine is being sold at cost,or close to it,a fiver a pop

I can see the army involved in the roll out of this,and think/hope they'll use all.the test centres around the country

tamara25 · 24-11-2020 9:31pm

Definitely won’t be getting it. People have a very short memory, remember the swine flu vaccine & narcolepsy....

Neamhshuntasach · 24-11-2020 9:32pm

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Ah come on, you walked right in to that one

I can't believe people replied seriously to what I said given the content. Someone even went to the bother of making one of those picture yokes. Anyways I was somewhat paraphrasing what I heard someone on one of those radio call in shows say today. Thinking they had some right to travel and spouting ****e about vaccines when it was clear they hadn't a clue.

Will you take an approved COVID-19 vaccine?

Comments