Waterford University discussion

fits wrote: »

I really dont see this hostility at all. I find the persecution complex in this thread perplexing.

I’m no expert on third level education, far from it. However, I have seen WIT wanting to be upgraded and a glaring need in the region for a university. I have also seen how this need has been hijacked by various national interests and regional petty interests and has ended up with a technological university fudge that has caused WIT to be stifled while Dublin and Cork get technological universities, two cities that have multiple universities between them. Then you have ill-informed people like yourself saying Waterford people have a persecution complex. Waterford people are too quite if you ask as me.

BBM77 wrote: »

I wonder why there is such hostility from existing universities to WIT being upgraded.

https://www.waterfordlive.ie/news/news/555200/waterford-irelands-ict-innovation-capital-top-ranking-for-wit-in-european-research-funding.html

Great to see, just goes to show how well WIT does in some areas (it ain't perfect obviously)
with one hand tied, it's well known, WIT was a top performer, second only to UCD in this case. If only it could get a fair crack at government funding.

fits wrote: »

This is impressive however, TSSG have won the vast majority of that funding. The rest of the institute accounts for 1.8 million euro.

Tssg is WIT

imacman wrote: »

Yes TSSG is a research center in WIT along with SEAM (South East Applied Materials Research Centre) , PMBRC (Pharmaceutical & Molecular Biotechnology Research Centre) and NRCI (Nutrition Research Centre Ireland). WIT is the only IT with 4 research centers

Im not sure how you missed 'the rest of the institute' bit. TSSG's performance in H2020 is indeed impressive. The rest is mediocre.

fits wrote: »

Im not sure how you missed 'the rest of the institute' bit. TSSG's performance in H2020 is indeed impressive. The rest is mediocre.

Yes but that is just on the Horizon 2020 funding scheme, all the research centers get funding from other EU funds, SFI, EI and REDF regularly .If you look in detail TSSG put in for way more funding that the other research centers as they had projects that were ready to go and a good fit for the H2020 model
Here a just a few examples of some the funding those research centres have secured
http://pmbrc.org/news/pmbrc-team-lead-e4m-project-to-train-researchers-to-improve-sight-saving-treatments/
https://profjohnnolan.com/eu-funding-makes-the-invisible-visible-wit-researcher-says/
https://www.wit.ie/news/other/seam-wit-partners-in-22m-sfi-advanced-manufacturing-research-centre
https://irishadvantage.com/ireland-science-commercial-impact/
https://irelandsoutheast.com/2019/03/26/ireland-south-east-at-heart-of-21st-century-manufacturing-as-wit-unveils-3dwit/

fits wrote: »

Thats great but the argument here is that WIT should be a university because of success in Horizon 2020. I would argument is not well-grounded because the funding is not well dispersed across the institute.
Anyway WIT is a good academic performer and Im not disputing that at all.

No one said that its a case for Uni, does support it, just pointing out, WIT can and does well in areas despite everything going against them. Arguing that most grant went to TSSG is kind of pointless, it's really only research that gets those types of grants and where does most of the research happen in WIT, Tssg. Your average department whose main job is teaching would only be doing academic desktop type research, hence, much lower amounts, I'd guess this mostly the case worldwide.

Max Powers wrote: »

Your average department whose main job is teaching would only be doing academic desktop type research, hence, much lower amounts, I'd guess this mostly the case worldwide.

That wouldnt be true in the universities at all. But those in universities have lower teaching loads.

They also attend work in the summer months :pac::pac::pac:

Max Powers wrote: »

You think in universities, with most of the department's, their main role is NOT teaching? I'd like to see something to back that up.

Ha! Many university academics I know see teaching as an inconvenience and their careers are judged by their success in attracting funding and publishing papers. Not saying that’s right mind.

fits wrote: »

Im not sure how you missed 'the rest of the institute' bit. TSSG's performance in H2020 is indeed impressive. The rest is mediocre.

A come on ... that is not fair. I brought in €3.6m last year into the School of Business. Not to shabby.... or mediocre.


In fairness, when you see what TSSG has done, it made me step up and get my game face on. Everywhere in WIT I see colleagues busting a gut to deliver for the region... for our students and community. There are plenty of jobsworths, but far fewer that in the other universities and colleges I worked in along the way to WIT.

Just a little reminder...

https://www.fiannafail.ie/fianna-fail-will-scrap-labours-forced-mergers-of-institutes-of-technology/

What say you now Taoiseach?

Muttley79 wrote: »

https://wexfordweekly.com/2020/07/08/sinn-fein-it-carlow/
Since when is Carlow IT calling the shots with Wexford for a university in the south east thus diluting the whole region.carlow wants all counties in the south east to have some sort of university.

Read to me that Carlow are trying to get Wexford 'on side' by discussing a campus in Wexford for the proposed SE University.

Hardly surprising that more than one 'satellite campus' would be proposed.

fits wrote: »

IT Carlow already have satellite campuses in Wexford and Wicklow. They’ve been looking for a site in Wexford for years. Nothing to do with the TU.

The whole Wexford campus thing is a joke , the campus they have there already is barely viable and all the local councillers and TDs seems to think Wexford is something special and deserves a Third level campus . At that rate we should have campus in Portlaoise , Durrow , Abblyleix etc.

Also ITcarlow was given 2 million for a new Wexford campus ( facilitated by local TD Brendan Howlin) around 4 years ago and they have found it hard to even find a site for that money. An even if they found a site where is the money going to come from to build the campus , why would Carlow put money into Wexford when they could use it to continue developing their main campus.

The wall of silence that has come out of Carlow about the Wexford campus points to the fact that they dont want to invest their capital ( which is much smaller that a few years ago)into Wexford and I think they are right not to. Why does Wexford deserve a third level campus when Waterford and Carlow are 40 mins away, its just pure parish pump stuff
https://www.independent.ie/regionals/wexfordpeople/news/council-in-talks-with-other-colleges-over-campus-after-it-carlow-snub-39058446.html

Bards wrote: »

What I don't understand is that Dublin City University moved all of their disparate campuses into one new large mega campus as it was the right thing as they couldn't operate effectively as a University.

But in the south east they want to create a bunch if disparate campuses around the south east and called it a UNIVERSITY... does anyone not see the irony of this bull****

I think DCU has always been centralised on its Finglas (NIHE Dublin) campus. DIT is selling all its old buildings which are spread around the city and are building a new €1 billion campus for Tech Uni Dublin at Grangegorman.

What is being presented in Wexford local media is in effect what people are being told and have been told by politicians who are being dishonest about the idea of a university i.e. you can buy a field , build a building and hey presto, there it is. The failure of the Carlow IT outreach there over the past two decades should have informed the present aspirations, but it has not. The proposed TUSE with Carlow IT effectively trying to lead from the front, because of political support, will never deliver what is required, but that failure suits current university stakeholders in Cork and Dublin. A proper university in the south east depends on a strong and fully developed WIT. Thousands of kids from Wexford and Kilkenny have already had a good third level education from WIT, but instead of that garnering support for further development, it seems to have had the opposite effect on the political class in those two counties.

It is ironic that the creation of UL grew from the support of Clare, North Tipp and North Kerry for a facility in Limerick. The support of politicians across the south east is the very thing that just eventually will provide top class regional cardiology for the south east in UHW. The Hogan and Howlin political class never seem to learn and their failed message ( I have no political allegiance) is to keep doing the things that have made this region poor. Sinn Fein is now adopting the same populist mantra.

Waterford city is the largest population centre in the region by far. It is close to and accessible to every other county in the south east region. North south motorway (M9) and railway and east west developing motorway (N25) and railway if Iarnród Eireann can be forced not to abandon the Rosslare/Waterford /Limerick line. You can argue with many things, but not with that.

invara wrote: »

So, AK47 was in town to promise a university. What an odd position... allow TU to run its course, but if not done by September push on with real university process for WIT. New leader, new labour. But what are we to make of the promise from the party that was in the driving seat when WIT leadership was taken out by RQ, labour minister for Ed. Call me a cynic, but I cannot see this promise having any impact (labour out in the cold for the next five years). If the promise was credibly made before the last election Pratt would have stood a better chance.

What is labour going to do about this promise to make it real, what Dáil activity will follow the new position?
Does this mean that if the TUSE is forced on WIT, Labour will upgrade it to a full university when in power next?

Oh they will and move the HQ to Wexford

He's OK, he went to UL. Selling second class status to the masses. Ah sure ye'll be grand.

Harry Palmr wrote: »

https://twitter.com/MaryButlerTD/status/1287754536975831041?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

That woman damages my mental health.

invara wrote: »

Simon Harris pre-empts cabinet by annoucing Tom Boland as an "independent expert" to accelerate plans for TUSE.
Worth reading his evidence to PAC and forming your own view about his suitability:
https://www.kildarestreet.com/committees/?id=2015-12-10a.107&s=%22kieran+byrne%22#g251

The same Tom Boland who was a hired gun to write why there should be a third level campus in Kilkenny
https://www.kilkennycoco.ie/eng/Services/Economic-Development/From-Charter-to-Framework-The-case-for-Higher-Education-Provision-in-Kilkenny.pdf

And of course we remember the launch of that document where all of the top brass from Itcarlow attended and only the head of the governing body from WIT was invited ( who has strong ties to Itcarlow as mayor of Wexford with the campus there).
Im not sure you could call him "independant", I fully expect him to recommendation is the corporate headquarters of the TU should be in Kilkenny as a compromise which suits Carlow more than WIT

JaCrispy wrote: »

Why would a HQ in Kilkenny suit Carlow more than WIT?

The Kilkenny politicians have always been in Carlows camp and to have the Headquarters of the Southeast TU outside the only real city in the region would be another in a long line of humiliations for the city.

fitzeyboy. wrote: »

So Basically WIT are being asked to merge with a part time clown college?

Yes I'm afraid so and it all comes down to politics within the region.instead of the four counties all coming together and working as a region they are working separately.kilkenny,Wexford Carlow are Leinster counties and see themselves closer to the capital dublin within an hour's drive than see Waterford a city in Munster being slowly cut adrift by governments old/new

fitzeyboy. wrote: »

So Basically WIT are being asked to merge with a part time clown college?

Lovely turn of phrase, but IT Carlow is a good college.
Nonetheless IT Carlow does a very different job to WIT.
IT Carlow is at the Northern edge of the region, and above it there are five universities commutable in the 1hr+ mark, which is at the edge of what is doable for a 4 year degree. Thus IT Carlow’s hinterland (mainly to the North) only supplies students unwilling or unable to enter university- CAO points or money/mindset. IT Carlow’s portfolio of programmes is positioned around having large competitor universities on its doorstep. It is very like Limerick IT and Galway IT in that respect.