Victory for electoral fraud

Egginacup · 23-05-2015 5:51pm

stefanovich wrote: »

Okay, nobody checks.

Another lie.

BoJack Horseman · 23-05-2015 5:53pm

fed up sick and tired wrote: »

But not a Christian one.

Indeed.

Today was a step towards being a more Christian nation.

And a less catholic one.

Grayson · 23-05-2015 5:54pm

Deleted User wrote: »

That opening post got a great laugh out of a table of drinkers here in Vietnam. Thanks OP.

same here in thailand

and actually I was discussing it with friends in saigon this morning. We were laughing at some of the stupider no arguments, but still worried the vote might not pass

mickydoomsux · 23-05-2015 5:55pm

Mass organised electoral fraud is obviously much more likely than people who are anti gay marriage being a minority.

The sourest of grapes.

"Ye only won because ye cheated"

FrStone · 23-05-2015 5:55pm

Egginacup wrote: »

Maybe

But if it's so easy to get on the register twice then why isn't the OP yammering about people IN Ireland being on the register twice (and DEFINITELY being in breach of the rules) instead of focussing on people returning from abroad and being perfectly eligible to vote and NOT in breach of the rules....and then using this yardstick of hypothetical claptrap to beat the result along with the integrity of the system?

Well there weren't people saying on the news that they intended on voting twice...

There were people claiming that they were out of the country with years saying they flew home to vote. While I don't agree with his views on marriage, I do agree that electoral fraud was committed and is being celebrated by the media.

That said I don't agree with extending the right to vote to those abroad either.

stefanovich · 23-05-2015 5:57pm

mickydoomsux wrote: »

Mass organised electoral fraud is obviously much more likely than people who are anti gay marriage being a minority.

The sourest of grapes.

"Ye only won because ye cheated"

It's pretty obvious they would have won anyway.

stefanovich · 23-05-2015 5:57pm

FrStone wrote: »

Well there weren't people saying on the news that they intended on voting twice...

There were people claiming that they were out of the country with years saying they flew home to vote. While I don't agree with his views on marriage, I do agree that electoral fraud was committed and is being celebrated by the media.

That said I don't agree with extending the right to vote to those abroad either.

Thank you voice of reason.

Clandestine · 23-05-2015 6:02pm

My name is URL wrote: »

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Cultural_Marxism

Linking to rationalwiki is like linking to conservapedia - its a socialist hugbox.

Egginacup · 23-05-2015 6:02pm

Collie D wrote: »

Hardly a fact if two posters above you just said they didn't show ID. I wasn't asked for mine either but handed I over anyway

A lazy polling station worker is not proof that ID is not required. You are required to have photo ID. Yo are required to have this ID to register and again to vote. That a smattering of people skipped through the process is not by any stretch of the imagination an indication that the system is massively vulnerable to abuse as asserted by the OP.

You need a passport to get from England to Belgium. If some guy in a row boat on a calm day gets across the channel undetected does that mean the checks for travellers from England to Belgium is massively vulnerable to abuse?

stefanovich · 23-05-2015 6:04pm

Egginacup wrote: »

A lazy polling station worker is not proof that ID is not required. You are required to have photo ID. Yo are required to have this ID to register and again to vote. That a smattering of people skipped through the process is not by any stretch of the imagination an indication that the system is massively vulnerable to abuse as asserted by the OP.

You need a passport to get from England to Belgium. If some guy in a row boat on a calm day gets across the channel undetected does that mean the checks for travellers from England to Belgium is massively vulnerable to abuse?

Someone else added me to the register. I wasn't there. No form was filled. My name was just added. I have never been asked for ID when voting.

Timberrrrrrrr · 23-05-2015 6:05pm

stefanovich wrote: »

.

Nice vocabulary.

Yet true.

Egginacup · 23-05-2015 6:08pm

Grayson wrote: »

same here in thailand
and actually I was discussing it with friends in saigon this morning. We were laughing at some of the stupider no arguments, but still worried the vote might not pass

It's called Ho Chi Minh City.

Pining for colonial times, are you?

RecordStraight · 23-05-2015 6:16pm

Egginacup wrote: »

It's called Ho Chi Minh City.

Pining for colonial times, are you?

To be fair, it was called Saigon for a thousand years before the French arrived.

RecordStraight · 23-05-2015 6:18pm

stefanovich wrote: »

Whatever dude. I haven't live at home for a very long time. You see, not having a degree in the arts or women's studies has its advantages.

Some pretty serious disadvantages too, by the looks of things.

FrStone · 23-05-2015 6:27pm

Egginacup wrote: »

A lazy polling station worker is not proof that ID is not required. You are required to have photo ID. Yo are required to have this ID to register and again to vote. That a smattering of people skipped through the process is not by any stretch of the imagination an indication that the system is massively vulnerable to abuse as asserted by the OP.

You need a passport to get from England to Belgium. If some guy in a row boat on a calm day gets across the channel undetected does that mean the checks for travellers from England to Belgium is massively vulnerable to abuse?

The presiding officers are instructed to ask for id for one in four voters aprox. Many of us have been doing it for years so we know most voters to see, and would only ask for those we don't recognise.

Also it is possible to register to vote with out visiting a garda station and providing id. You only need to do that to be put on the supplement. If you register to be put on the main register, you only need to send off a form to your local council. In many cases the local politician will register you on your behalf.

backspacer · 23-05-2015 6:28pm

At the risk of sounding glib,surely the 66,000 argument is moot,considering the Yes side are probably going to win by 600,000 odd votes.

The Backwards Man · 23-05-2015 6:31pm

FrStone wrote: »

They still wouldn't be passing tax here though. If you are non resident you don't pay tax on Ireland. Only exception is if you sell specified Irish assets, which would be rare.

You still pay tax in Ireland and are considered tax resident if you are on the Irish payroll. No vote though. Or residency.

mickydoomsux · 23-05-2015 6:36pm

backspacer wrote: »

At the risk of sounding glib,surely the 66,000 argument is moot,considering the Yes side are probably going to win by 600,000 odd votes.

Let's take 33000 off both sides because we don't know how these people were going to vote, in the interest of fairness of course

FrStone · 23-05-2015 6:37pm

The Backwards Man wrote: »

You still pay tax in Ireland and are considered tax resident if you are on the Irish payroll. No vote though. Or residency.

Nope, you are wrong.

If you are non resident you don't pay tax here, even if you are on the Irish payroll. Tax is paid in the country of residency. Some companies would set up a shadow payroll for those working abroad so it looks like you are paying tax to the Irish revenue, but at the end of the year your company claims it all back, and then pay the tax due on your employment abroad to the relevant foreign tax authorities.

RecordStraight · 23-05-2015 6:45pm

FrStone wrote: »

Nope, you are wrong.

If you are non resident you don't pay tax here, even if you are on the Irish payroll. Tax is paid in the country of residency.

There are some exceptions to this. I know of a group of people living and working abroad and paying tax in Ireland.

The Backwards Man · 23-05-2015 6:45pm

FrStone wrote: »

Nope, you are wrong.

If you are non resident you don't pay tax here, even if you are on the Irish payroll. Tax is paid in the country of residency. Some companies would set up a shadow payroll for those working abroad so it looks like you are paying tax to the Irish revenue, but at the end of the year your company claims it all back, and then pay the tax due on your employment abroad to the relevant foreign tax authorities.

What country of residency? The one you spend a week in January in? Or a fortnight in November? Be a good number for an accountant sorting that one out.:rolleyes:

Paramite Pie · 23-05-2015 6:53pm

stefanovich wrote: »

What this referendum has highlighted even more clearly is the lack of security in our electoral system, how broken and open to abuse it is.

66,000 non-residents return to vote yes. Enda is overjoyed.

As far as I know, If you've lived in Ireland for three years or more within the last five years then your entitled to vote in referendums. This rule also applies to claiming third level grants and other things.

Most young emigrants work in Oz for a year or two. I'm fairly sure there's still almost half a million emigrants who stayed abroad, ie most of them.

FrStone · 23-05-2015 6:53pm

RecordStraight wrote: »

There are some exceptions to this. I know of a group of people living and working abroad and paying tax in Ireland.

Tax legislation doesn't provide for exceptions to this I'm afraid.

Egginacup · 23-05-2015 6:54pm

FrStone wrote: »

Well there weren't people saying on the news that they intended on voting twice...

There were people claiming that they were out of the country with years saying they flew home to vote. While I don't agree with his views on marriage, I do agree that electoral fraud was committed and is being celebrated by the media.

That said I don't agree with extending the right to vote to those abroad either.

I have yet to see an instance of voter fraud and certainly would love you to show me where fraud was celebrated in the media.

RecordStraight · 23-05-2015 6:55pm

FrStone wrote: »

Tax legislation doesn't provide for exceptions to this I'm afraid.

You may well be right. The amusing thing is that they work for the government...

FrStone · 23-05-2015 6:55pm

The Backwards Man wrote: »

What country of residency? The one you spend a week in January in? Or a fortnight in November? Be a good number for an accountant sorting that one out.:rolleyes:

You have to spend 183 days in Ireland a year to be resident here.

People are quoting stuff they heard from a friend in the pub here. Let's keep the discussion based on facts and logic.

The Backwards Man · 23-05-2015 7:02pm

FrStone wrote: »

You have to spend 183 days in Ireland a year to be resident here.

People are quoting stuff they heard from a friend in the pub here. Let's keep the discussion based on facts and logic.

Or 200 over two years. We're talking about real events, and real people, not shite heard down the pub, and actual appeals with Registrars. If you are not resident anywhere else, and you work out of the country all year, you pay Irish tax and you have no vote.

Fact and logic.

FrStone · 23-05-2015 7:13pm

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Or 200 over two years. We're talking about real events, and real people, not shite heard down the pub, and actual appeals with Registrars. If you are not resident anywhere else, and you work out of the country all year, you pay Irish tax and you have no vote.

Fact and logic.

The 200 only really applies on the year you leave our return. It allows people who return in December for good, to elect to be resident on the basis they will be here next year.

You have no basis for your argument. If you are not Irish resident and work out of Ireland for the whole year, you won't pay a penny in tax to the Irish revenue. It is quite simple. It is provided for in legislation.

23-05-2015 7:44pm

Grayson wrote: »

same here in thailand
and actually I was discussing it with friends in saigon this morning. We were laughing at some of the stupider no arguments, but still worried the vote might not pass

I was convinced it wouldn't but so glad it did.. More pride than if Ireland had won the World Cup.

Paramite Pie · 23-05-2015 8:02pm

stefanovich wrote: »

Someone else added me to the register. I wasn't there. No form was filled. My name was just added. I have never been asked for ID when voting.

I have. I've voted in essentially every election/referendum for the last 10 years, and even though the guy at the polling station knew my Dad personally & I arrived with him, I was still ID'd the first couple of times and sporadically after that.

Wasn't ID'd yesterday.

stefanovich · 23-05-2015 8:05pm

Must depend on the polling station then.

Egginacup · 23-05-2015 9:28pm

pablomakaveli wrote: »

I find it mind boggling how he can be on here celebrating the result while often banging the drum for a country that brutally represses homosexuals.

Your little dig, I assume, is at my oft verbalised opinion regarding the barrage of propaganda aimed at the country of Russia.

You mention that this country brutally represses homosexuals. A loaded statement and one I'm sure you will backup with examples and evidence. Should you come up with some appallingly amateurish connect to someone at the World Health Organisation determining that transgenderism is a mental condition and then using that to flag Russia as anti-gay because there it is prohibited to drive a car if you have a mental condition (ergo connecting the two) then don't waste your time typing back.

Homosexuality was decriminalised in Russia in 1993....the same year that it was decriminalised in Ireland.

It's still illegal, under punishment of death....that's DEATH, in many of the countries that you stipulate would be model societies. Not only that but Russia, this bastion of anti-gay oppression, does not have the penalty of killing someone as punishment for anything... a fact, no doubt, lost on you in your blinkered and spiteful approach to all things with which you are familiar and comfortable as being good, and all else negative, wretched and suspect.

Now roll the dice and take your chances regarding debating me about facts, the rule of law ...national and international....and where you think my sympathies lie.

If your mind boggles as to why I would celebrate this referendum result then it doesn't take much to boggle your shallow little mind.

stefanovich · 23-05-2015 9:32pm

Egginacup wrote: »

Your little dig, I assume, is at my oft verbalised opinion regarding the barrage of propaganda aimed at the country of Russia.

You mention that this country brutally represses homosexuals. A loaded statement and one I'm sure you will backup with examples and evidence. Should you come up with some appallingly amateurish connect to someone at the World Health Organisation determining that transgenderism is a mental condition and then using that to flag Russia as anti-gay because there it is prohibited to drive a car if you have a mental condition (ergo connecting the two) then don't waste your time typing back.

Homosexuality was decriminalised in Russia in 1993....the same year that it was decriminalised in Ireland.

It's still illegal, under punishment of death....that's DEATH in many of the countries that you stipulate would be model societies. Not only that but Russia, this bastion of anti-gay oppression, does not have the penalty of killing someone as punishment, a fact no doubt lost on you in your blinkered and spiteful approach to all things with which you are familiar and comfortable and being good, and all else negative, wretched and suspect.

Now roll the dice and take your chances regarding debating me about facts, the rule of law ...national and international....and where you think my sympathies lie.

If your mind boggles as to why I would celebrate this referendum result then it doesn't take much to boggle your shallow little mind.

In all fairness Russia is very anti gay.

http://www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/videos/all/hunted

MathDebater · 23-05-2015 9:34pm

that's DEATH, in many of the countries that you stipulate would be model societies.

I doubt anyone would consider countries where they execute homosexuals to be 'model societies'.

pablomakaveli · 23-05-2015 9:46pm

stefanovich wrote: »

In all fairness Russia is very anti gay.

http://www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/videos/all/hunted

Beat me to it but this documentary is a good starting point.

Egginacup wrote: »

Your little dig, I assume, is at my oft verbalised opinion regarding the barrage of propaganda aimed at the country of Russia.

You mention that this country brutally represses homosexuals. A loaded statement and one I'm sure you will backup with examples and evidence. Should you come up with some appallingly amateurish connect to someone at the World Health Organisation determining that transgenderism is a mental condition and then using that to flag Russia as anti-gay because there it is prohibited to drive a car if you have a mental condition (ergo connecting the two) then don't waste your time typing back.

Homosexuality was decriminalised in Russia in 1993....the same year that it was decriminalised in Ireland.

It's still illegal, under punishment of death....that's DEATH, in many of the countries that you stipulate would be model societies. Not only that but Russia, this bastion of anti-gay oppression, does not have the penalty of killing someone as punishment for anything... a fact, no doubt, lost on you in your blinkered and spiteful approach to all things with which you are familiar and comfortable as being good, and all else negative, wretched and suspect.

Now roll the dice and take your chances regarding debating me about facts, the rule of law ...national and international....and where you think my sympathies lie.

If your mind boggles as to why I would celebrate this referendum result then it doesn't take much to boggle your shallow little mind.

Where the **** did i stipulate a society that kills homosexuals for being gay is a model society?

Straight Talker · 23-05-2015 9:51pm

stefanovich wrote: »

What this referendum has highlighted even more clearly is the lack of security in our electoral system, how broken and open to abuse it is.

66,000 non-residents return to vote yes. Enda is overjoyed.

Non-Irish registered and voting and proud.

Because of today me my brother sister best friend etc and other people who have been bullied for their sexual orientation can declare their love for the person they love to their local community and the rest of the world through the most beautiful and special way possible.Ireland was a nasty horrible backwards country but it's not anymore and by god that was proved by the emphatic victory of the yes campaign.You guys took one hell of a beating.Ireland is now a country of love and tolerance and we proved that to the whole world with todays result.

stefanovich · 23-05-2015 9:53pm

Straight Talker wrote: »

Because of today me my brother sister best friend etc and other people who have been bullied for their sexual orientation can declare their love for the person they love to their local community and the rest of the world.Ireland was a nasty horrible backwards country but it's not anymore and by god that was proved by the emphatic victory of the yes campaign.You guys took one hell of a beating.Ireland is now a country of love and tolerance and we proved that to the whole world.

Sorry, so your entire family is gay? That's a bit mad isn't it? No one to continue your family line. That's sad.

mfceiling · 23-05-2015 9:57pm

stefanovich wrote: »

That is in fact incorrect. If they are out of the country more than 18 months they are breaking the law if they vote.

If you are not Irish and you voted yesterday you are also breaking the law.

I have a British passport and was born and raised in northern ireland yet I voted yesterday...should I hand myself into the garda immediately?

stefanovich · 23-05-2015 10:04pm

mfceiling wrote: »

I have a British passport and was born and raised in northern ireland yet I voted yesterday...should I hand myself into the garda immediately?

You are perhaps the one exception. Being born in the island of Ireland entitles you to vote as far as I know.

Not a NSA agent · 23-05-2015 10:08pm

stefanovich wrote: »

Sorry, so your entire family is gay? That's a bit mad isn't it? No one to continue your family line. That's sad.

Gay people can still have children

spurious · 23-05-2015 10:10pm

stefanovich wrote: »

Sorry, so your entire family is gay? That's a bit mad isn't it? No one to continue your family line. That's sad.

How would being gay stop someone having a child? (confused)

Not a NSA agent · 23-05-2015 10:14pm

spurious wrote: »

How would being gay stop someone having a child? (confused)

Probably adapting to our new situation. Gay people could only have children if there was a yes vote. Remember all that campaigning for voting no to prevent them having children?

spurious · 23-05-2015 10:17pm

Not a NSA agent wrote: »

Probably adapting to our new situation. Gay people could only have children if there was a yes vote. Remember all that campaigning for voting no to prevent them having children?

Timberrrrrrrr · 23-05-2015 10:23pm

stefanovich wrote: »

You are perhaps the one exception. Being born in the island of Ireland entitles you to vote as far as I know.

I was born in England and hold an English passport yet am able to vote too.

martingriff · 23-05-2015 10:27pm

stefanovich wrote: »

Sorry, so your entire family is gay? That's a bit mad isn't it? No one to continue your family line. That's sad.

He did not say his whole family only himself he said his bothers best friend. Why cant he continue his family line with surracacy when it is passed he could

martingriff · 23-05-2015 10:29pm

stefanovich wrote: »

You are perhaps the one exception. Being born in the island of Ireland entitles you to vote as far as I know.

I think people in Northern Ireland can vote in Referendums or could have

Eutow · 23-05-2015 10:30pm

For those unsure who can vote in what:

The right to vote is as follows:

Irish citizens may vote at every election and referendum;
British citizens may vote at Dáil elections, European elections and local elections;
Other European Union (EU) citizens may vote at European and local elections*
Non-EU citizens may vote at local elections only.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/moving_country/moving_to_ireland/introduction_to_the_irish_system/right_to_vote.html#l862a3

Egginacup · 24-05-2015 12:50am

stefanovich wrote: »

In all fairness Russia is very anti gay.

http://www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/videos/all/hunted

Now is that a video of Russian homosexuals being terrorised by Russian gay bashers or is it a video of Russian institutional persecution of homosexuals?

I could easily post footage of black people getting battered by cops or homeless people getting set on fire by utter scumbags in Missouri or Pennsylvania. Would that qualify as stating that America is "very anti-black" or "very anti-homeless"?

Hmm?

FrStone · 24-05-2015 12:54am

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I was born in England and hold an English passport yet am able to vote too.

Unless you have Irish citizenship or are from the North you can't vote in Irish referenda. You can vote in everything else though.

24-05-2015 3:25am

Grayson wrote: »

I saw a lot of posts on FB today from people who said in their polling station the officials had bibles on their desks.

There is always a Bible in every Polling Station, at EVERY Election.

Victory for electoral fraud

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