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Tipperary march October 2018

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    #32
    notharrypotter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,112 ✭✭✭notharrypotter


    digzy wrote: »
    What has Mattie mc grath and Seamus Healy done for tipp town?
    SFA:mad:


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    #33
    Purple Mountain
    Registered Users Posts: 13,012 ✭✭✭✭Purple Mountain


    Anyone go?

    To thine own self be true



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    #34
    The Lost Sheep
    Registered Users Posts: 14,967 ✭✭✭✭The Lost Sheep


    incentsitive wrote: »
    I knew it would be political point scoring of some sort at the root of it....

    These are the people who vote Michael Lowry, a man who typifies the corruption and brown envelope culture of this country, and Matty McGrath, a man who stands up and talks absolute JARGON at every opportunity in the Dail. Alan Kelly, a man whose legacy will be leaving us with the bloated quango that is Irish Water.

    What is killing all small towns is the lack of support from locals, online shopping, people going shopping in Dublin/Cork/Limerick/etc, and rates making starting businesses financially nonviable.

    But if you are voting for the above gombeens, you reap what you sow.
    i dont think Kelly is a gombeen. Actually is a very good politician and while he'll be forever linked to IW he shouldnt get the criticism over it that he does. Who exactly would you be voting for?
    Small towns do need support from locals but what are businesses doing to attract people in? Thurles/Nenagh/Clonmel all have those issues yet are are doing ok.
    cordangan wrote: »
    100% agree. These are the facts of what Tipp is up against. Do we stop voting, will that help, well we need a voice? Who can we rely on to make things happen? Do we vote with our conscience for the good of the country or vote for our town (parish pump politics) and be selfish to make things happen? A local native Dan Breen was once asked why did Tipp take it into their own hands to start a civil war and he declared that the people of Tipperary felt they were doing the 'right thing' for the people. I'm not inciting violence or anything of the sort but we do need a strong voice to air our requirements and make things happen. What I am asking is do we know what we want, what is the plan and how do we propose to implement this plan?
    Not voting doesnt help anyone. Im not sure people know what they want so cant plan.
    Expunge wrote: »
    I think a more robust approach is indeed an option! Let's call it 'direct action'.

    Tipp town has been f**ked over for generations now and is in an awful state. It has been ignored by all politicians, except it's own local ones and maybe Mattie McGrath, who has delivered nothing for Tipp really.

    Also, this is a fight that really should be played out in Nenagh and/or Clonmel where Tipp CO CO is headquartered. Tipp Town people need to get right in to the faces of those who actually run the council on a regular basis and make their lives very, very uncomfortable.

    If nothing much happens after this march except a letting off of steam, it'll be time to up the ante and take a few ideas from the Dan Breen playbook.

    This is a war for resources and Tipp Town is losing out badly. Time for a proper fight back.
    What is this proper fight back? Tipp town people can go to Nenagh/Clonmel and protest but the chamber of commerce etc and businesses in town themselves need to change/adapt things for real improvement to happen.


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    #35
    kurtainsider
    Registered Users Posts: 324 ✭✭kurtainsider


    Purple Mountain wrote: »
    Anyone go?

    I was there. There was a very good turnout but I wasn't impressed with the speaker. I felt that the pitch was for more handouts - deis/ dole etc and less emphasis on urging the gov/IDA to get some decent employment into the town.
    He lost me when he trotted out the lazy old "children going to school without a breakfast" line which is 100% the fault of negligent parenting and not something that any minister can be responsible for.

    100% for local support and turnout.
    10% for inter-cert debating level grasp of reality by the speaker. Just one more opportunity pissed away for poor old Tipp.


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    #36
    digzy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭digzy


    kurtainsider wrote: »
    I was there. There was a very good turnout but I wasn't impressed with the speaker. I felt that the pitch was for more handouts - deis/ dole etc and less emphasis on urging the gov/IDA to get some decent employment into the town.
    He lost me when he trotted out the lazy old "children going to school without a breakfast" line which is 100% the fault of negligent parenting and not something that any minister can be responsible for.

    100% for local support and turnout.
    10% for inter-cert debating level grasp of reality by the speaker. Just one more opportunity pissed away for poor old Tipp.

    Think that’s a bit harsh tbh. Thought Padraig spoke well. Very hard to see where things go from here though.
    It’s been outlined already how many of the ‘demands’ are achievable.

    It’s tough to call it. What exactly can the state do?
    I’d agree re the ‘no breakfast’ rubbish being down to poor parenting. Though I think that’s one of the benefits of deis status.

    Re the politicians, what exactly will they do now that they haven’t already done? They may be a lot of things but they’re not idiots. They know what’s required.

    Retail is challenging in any rural town. Especially so in tipp with the ‘social deprivation’ there.
    Think it’s a bit ‘chicken or egg’ regards what comes first, employment or lower Main Street commercial vacancies.

    Personally, I believe that there should be at least 1 hour free parking put in place. Free parking would be a disaster.


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    #37
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    kurtainsider wrote: »
    I was there. There was a very good turnout but I wasn't impressed with the speaker. I felt that the pitch was for more handouts - deis/ dole etc and less emphasis on urging the gov/IDA to get some decent employment into the town.
    He lost me when he trotted out the lazy old "children going to school without a breakfast" line which is 100% the fault of negligent parenting and not something that any minister can be responsible for.

    100% for local support and turnout.
    10% for inter-cert debating level grasp of reality by the speaker. Just one more opportunity pissed away for poor old Tipp.

    And -50% for making me miss half the match in Thomson’s Park 😾


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    #38
    by8auj6csd3ioq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,124 ✭✭✭by8auj6csd3ioq


    What is the comment about children going to school with no breakfast,how is it due to poor parenting? Are they saying they can't afford breakfast.

    i only know tipp to pass through mostly. What is the attitude of staff like. A man on Prime Time said about another town and his business you cannot expect people to go in just because you are there. He changed his approach and made new products available. I think it was a restaurant, he offered a different menu and was interested in his customers

    I do not say this of tipp town as i have very little experience but in a big city i bought something and needed to ask the girl on the till about it but she did not even get off the phone while i was paying her. She gave the impression i was interrupting her call. i see that a lot now in a lot of places , people leaning on the counter reading a phone and give the impression they are not interested. i would not go in somewhere like that

    Isn't there a free car park at lidl? And lidl is in the centre of town as i recall


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    #39
    kurtainsider
    Registered Users Posts: 324 ✭✭kurtainsider


    In my view the town started to sink when the council decided, in their wisdom, to pave over the Market Yard and draw lines on it and introduce paid parking some years ago. Before that the market yard was a large gravel area where you could just park the car and go about your business. Now you have to find the change, go to the machine etc. etc. It might appear trivial but it doesn't take a lot of this petty aggravation to drive people out to Tesco or Dunnes where you park your car and just go and do your shopping. Lidl introduced a bull**** barrier system for parking a few years ago but dropped it almost immediately when (presumably) they discovered that people just left them at it and did their shopping somewhere where all this docketry wasn't required. Of course the council persists with the paid parking as it's no skin off their nose when people vote with their feet and tell them to shove their pay and display. The local businesses are however devastated.


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    #40
    kurtainsider
    Registered Users Posts: 324 ✭✭kurtainsider


    digzy wrote: »
    Think that’s a bit harsh tbh. Thought Padraig spoke well. Very hard to see where things go from here though.
    It’s been outlined already how many of the ‘demands’ are achievable.

    It’s tough to call it. What exactly can the state do?
    I’d agree re the ‘no breakfast’ rubbish being down to poor parenting. Though I think that’s one of the benefits of deis status.

    Re the politicians, what exactly will they do now that they haven’t already done? They may be a lot of things but they’re not idiots. They know what’s required.

    Retail is challenging in any rural town. Especially so in tipp with the ‘social deprivation’ there.
    Think it’s a bit ‘chicken or egg’ regards what comes first, employment or lower Main Street commercial vacancies.

    Personally, I believe that there should be at least 1 hour free parking put in place. Free parking would be a disaster.

    Walking up the main street today just highlighted to me the level of vacancies in Tipperary. Would it be an exaggeration to say that for every premises conducting business that 4 or 5 are vacant?


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    #41
    Kitty6277
    Registered Users Posts: 6,204 ✭✭✭Kitty6277


    I think Tipp need a factory or some sort of industry. That way, when people are earning money, they'll have more money to spend in the town and we may not see the number of shops closing that we have in recent times. That'll be a start at least


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    #42
    digzy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭digzy


    Kitty6277 wrote: »
    I think Tipp need a factory or some sort of industry. That way, when people are earning money, they'll have more money to spend in the town and we may not see the number of shops closing that we have in recent times. That'll be a start at least

    That’s the crux of the issue.
    Unfortunately the days of ‘factories ‘ setting up in first world countries seem numbered. Need a higher end operation .... but is there a workforce there for that???


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    #43
    digzy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭digzy


    kurtainsider wrote: »
    Walking up the main street today just highlighted to me the level of vacancies in Tipperary. Would it be an exaggeration to say that for every premises conducting business that 4 or 5 are vacant?

    Dunno. I’d put it at 1 in 4 trading.... which is very bleak


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    #44
    Kitty6277
    Registered Users Posts: 6,204 ✭✭✭Kitty6277


    digzy wrote: »
    That’s the crux of the issue.
    Unfortunately the days of ‘factories ‘ setting up in first world countries seem numbered. Need a higher end operation .... but is there a workforce there for that???

    34% unemployment would make me think so.


    That's assuming that most of that 34% is people who are actually able to work.


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    #45
    digzy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭digzy


    Kitty6277 wrote: »
    34% unemployment would make me think so.


    That's assuming that most of that 34% is people who are actually able to work.

    There's a fair proportion of people there who will never work. It doesn't pay them given the state supports available.
    I know it's easy blame the 'gubberment' for everything, but they've created a situation where living on benefits is a viable way of life....but that's another days argument.


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    #46
    tipptown78
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4 ✭tipptown78


    Kitty6277 wrote: »
    34% unemployment would make me think so.


    That's assuming that most of that 34% is people who are actually able to work.

    Or assuming most of the 34% even want to work! (I'm not saying everyone doesn't want to work but you can be damn sure there's a nice chunk of that 34% have no interest in finding employment).

    There's plenty of work available, just because its not on your doorstep is no excuse.

    Amneal in Cashel, Boston Scientific and Abbot in Clonmel, Vistakon and Northern Trust in Limerick are all within a half hour of Tipperary Town and are all hiring at present, with buses going to Limerick and Cashel each morning before 9am.

    I don't buy all this tripe of pay parking causing all the problems. Aldi is free (for 2 hours) if you purchase something in store (don't know if this is enforced), Lidl is free (for 2 hours) if you purchase something in store (again I don't know if this is enforced), Supervalu is free, the car park at the Bansha Road roundabout is free for 2 hours at the front and all day at the back, the post office car park is free all day.

    When you drive through the town on any given day of the week, its virtually impossible get a (legal) on-street parking space on James Street, Main Street, Bank Place, Kickham Place and Bridge Street. If pay parking was such a big issue, wouldn't all these spaces be empty?

    It's time the retailers decided on some initiatives to encourage people into town. In recent years, either Cashel or Clonmel retailers decided to reimburse people their parking charge if they spent a certain amount in their stores. The town has a Chamber of Commerce which has run one promotion in my living memory (Let's Get Tipp Buzzing or something to that effect.


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    #47
    cordangan
    Registered Users Posts: 93 ✭✭cordangan


    The turnout for the march was very good and the weather helped. Not preparing for such a turnout was a mistake as this was a time to rouse the crowd and set the next march date with an even bigger march. The speech was reserved in my view with sporadic 'respectful' clapping of hands. The crowd were listening with intent at the start of the speech but the crowd were well distracted (chatting loudly among themselves) at the end of the speech. I thought the speaker spoke well but it was very much tongue in cheek and more like a festival speech than a rallying cry. I mean no disrespect this, I could do no better myself, this is constructive criticism.
    Points were made and repeated attacks on Joe McGrath in reference to road maintenance and traffic flow/parking decisions were well made. I spoke to people in the crowd who were not happy that some businesses remained open but this is what this march is about, keeping businesses open. Not all businesses have a staff that can run the business while the staff/bosses are marching. The 'bubble' that the decision makers in Dublin are enveloped in could have been elaborated upon where people feel that what is happening in Dublin is a form of bullying. Dublin make the decisions and Tipperary do as you are told.
    Local chamber of commerce and jobs for Tipp groups were mentioned. Most in the crowd do not know who are the people involved in these committees so get out there and introduce yourselves to the people, get on the ground and meet greet people with leaflets in the retail premises and stop them and talk to them. Very few people buying newspapers now, less and less going to mass and the pub meeting place for discussions is resigned to history. I have no doubt that they do great work but if they want the people's backing then go to the schools and businesses and walk the streets where you can thank them in person for shopping in our town and let them know how hard you work for the town. There are some great people in that crowd that are not on Facebook that could help your cause with a little encouragement.
    The 2 week ultimatum given (Town needs to see action in 2 weeks to the demands) was not what I was expecting and the crowd, in my opinion, did not seem to 'believe' that anything could be done in 2 weeks so interesting if the students in the town will see October 20th as a turning point for the town.
    Skeptical as all this may appear, did not a Kerry village with a community of 200 get the decision to close a post office overturned just last week by coming together and lobbying the politicians? This should have been said to give those at the march hope and assurance that what they are marching for can be achieved if we continue to stick together in all kinds of weather.


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    #48
    cordangan
    Registered Users Posts: 93 ✭✭cordangan


    tipptown78 wrote: »
    Or assuming most of the 34% even want to work! (I'm not saying everyone doesn't want to work but you can be damn sure there's a nice chunk of that 34% have no interest in finding employment).

    There's plenty of work available, just because its not on your doorstep is no excuse.

    Amneal in Cashel, Boston Scientific and Abbot in Clonmel, Vistakon and Northern Trust in Limerick are all within a half hour of Tipperary Town and are all hiring at present, with buses going to Limerick and Cashel each morning before 9am.

    I don't buy all this tripe of pay parking causing all the problems. Aldi is free (for 2 hours) if you purchase something in store (don't know if this is enforced), Lidl is free (for 2 hours) if you purchase something in store (again I don't know if this is enforced), Supervalu is free, the car park at the Bansha Road roundabout is free for 2 hours at the front and all day at the back, the post office car park is free all day.

    When you drive through the town on any given day of the week, its virtually impossible get a (legal) on-street parking space on James Street, Main Street, Bank Place, Kickham Place and Bridge Street. If pay parking was such a big issue, wouldn't all these spaces be empty?

    It's time the retailers decided on some initiatives to encourage people into town. In recent years, either Cashel or Clonmel retailers decided to reimburse people their parking charge if they spent a certain amount in their stores. The town has a Chamber of Commerce which has run one promotion in my living memory (Let's Get Tipp Buzzing or something to that effect.

    I agree there is plenty of work around, the question is why not in Tipperary town? Why do Tippeary people face these treks every morning?.
    Aldi do clamp cars and have done so. I do not know if Lidl have actually enforced the clamping but I do know they once put up barriers and lost loads of custom.
    Car parking would not be a problem if the bypass went ahead and closing lanes by council decisions on bridge street does not make it any easier. Why should the people parking on the main street beside shops suffer when the clear solution is a bypass? This is a town built in the middle of a hill where it is not possible for all elderly shoppers (probably our most loyal shoppers) to walk the hills to the parking spots.


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    #49
    Kitty6277
    Registered Users Posts: 6,204 ✭✭✭Kitty6277


    digzy wrote: »
    There's a fair proportion of people there who will never work. It doesn't pay them given the state supports available.
    I know it's easy blame the 'gubberment' for everything, but they've created a situation where living on benefits is a viable way of life....but that's another days argument.

    I see your point, we need to incentiveise people to work, to the point where sitting on your arse all day will earn you less than working, but that's a whole of Ireland problem rather than a specific Tipp town one.


    However, I can't believe that everyone who's unemployed in Tipp just couldn't be bothered working. From the people I know, they spent ages looking for work and couldn't get anything. A large amount of that 34% might be the type to never work a day in their life and be happy about it, but maybe if they had the option to work they'd go and try it? (Obviously they could travel to work as another poster said, but I think those kinds of people would need a job on their doorstep for them to consider it). Although that's probably just wishful thinking.


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    #50
    Paddico
    Registered Users Posts: 1,024 ✭✭✭Paddico


    Good interview on the Sky Innovation park in Tipp Town


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    #51
    Paddico
    Registered Users Posts: 1,024 ✭✭✭Paddico


    Good interview on the Sky Innovation park in Tipp Town



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    #52
    kurtainsider
    Registered Users Posts: 324 ✭✭kurtainsider


    I see on facebook that another march has been arranged for 24th Nov at 2pm. I'll go again if possible but I probably won't go a 3rd time if the speech is another ill prepared ramble about how the people want more deis and dole. They want jobs.

    And before anyone asks me for my ideas for providing jobs - sorry, I don't have any.


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    #53
    digzy
    Registered Users Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭digzy


    kurtainsider wrote: »
    I see on facebook that another march has been arranged for 24th Nov at 2pm. I'll go again if possible but I probably won't go a 3rd time if the speech is another ill prepared ramble about how the people want more deis and dole. They want jobs.

    And before anyone asks me for my ideas for providing jobs - sorry, I don't have any.

    There seems to be some movement. Will it amount to anything though? Mick Fitz was on radio this morning re the courthouse. There was a piece in the nationalist today regarding the roads/footpaths.
    I know a lad who works for a local tarmac company. He was with the council yesterday regarding pushing on with a few projects. Council seem anxious to address some of the groups concerns

    With the weather getting worse, you’d wonder what the crowds would be like.

    Given that the employment situation is the most urgent, it’s hard to see how this can be sorted to the groups satisfaction...


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    #54
    by8auj6csd3ioq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,124 ✭✭✭by8auj6csd3ioq


    They said on radio -in a vague way-they would step up their march protest. Maybe not be as fussy with the route or care if it caused obstructions


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    #55
    Paddico
    Registered Users Posts: 1,024 ✭✭✭Paddico


    Starting in the Plan on the Limerick Road and ending in the Market yard.
    The idea is that people will spend time (and money hopefully) in the center of town afterwards while waiting for the switching on of the Christmas lights at 4pm.

    Sensible idea


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    #56
    by8auj6csd3ioq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,124 ✭✭✭by8auj6csd3ioq


    See there is free parking from start to end December


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    #57
    tipptown78
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4 ✭tipptown78


    Anabelle Gigantic Underpass wrote: »
    See there is free parking from start to end December

    Don't think this has anything to do with the march. There's been free parking in most towns in Tipperary around xmas since as long as there has been parking charges.


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    #58
    by8auj6csd3ioq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,124 ✭✭✭by8auj6csd3ioq


    tipptown78 wrote: »
    Don't think this has anything to do with the march. There's been free parking in most towns in Tipperary around xmas since as long as there has been parking charges.
    but it is usually just the saturdays in December. Tipp is all December

    https://www.tipperarycoco.ie/sites/default/files/Christmas%202018%20Free%20Parking%20Tipp%20Town%20Advert_1.pdf


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    #59
    by8auj6csd3ioq
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,124 ✭✭✭by8auj6csd3ioq


    How did the march go today?


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    #60
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Anabelle Gigantic Underpass wrote: »
    How did the march go today?

    Organisers estimated 2,500 attended. http://tippfm.com/featured-2/second-march-4-tipp-demands-escalation/

    “Marchers returned to the streets on Saturday afternoon (November 24) and were informed of plans to escalate through the picket on Monday morning and in January a blockade will be placed on the N24 Waterford/Limerick thoroughfare running through the heart of the town.

    While the turnout for the march on Saturday was significantly down on the October march, understandably so given the proximity of the two events,it was still an enormous display of support for the march4tipp campaign.” https://www.tipperarylive.ie/news/home/349642/tipperary-town-marchers-to-escalate-protest.html


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    #61
    PacMan
    Registered Users Posts: 571 ✭✭✭PacMan


    tippChappie wrote: »
    Tipperary Town is often regarded as a "Horrible Place" and its rather lovely to see the natives highlight the issues their town is having. Bring it on I say, and lets be having You, said the Chappie.

    Unsure if I would agree totally, but the town does has a really bad reputation, and reading the stats here with 34% of the population on long term unemployment is shocking. Is this really the case ?

    With Limerick City up the road, and clonmel not too far away, are these people really saying they cannot find work ?

    I travel between Limerick City and Tipperary maybe four or five times per week,. It upsets me when I see the high amount of shops to let which is shocking. I can only assume that people of the town are in dismay.

    At the end of the day, Its some of the people of the town which is giving Tipp Town a really bad name.

    Hopefully these local demos will change the town for the better.
    Its stuck in the past and needs some radical thinking for it to get better.


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