Landlord packed our stuff up and threw it out

JJJackal · 10-05-2020 11:52am

What is the law if the landlord perceived the house was abandoned by the tenants ie vacant with no plan to return?

Ballso · 10-05-2020 11:54am

Mod Note.

Personal abuse and implied threatening posts will not be tolerated at all. Not one single bit.

lawred2 · 10-05-2020 11:57am

JayZeus wrote: »

You all moved ‘home’. Not in classes. Not in work. Already had a rent reduction. Nobody actually living there. Then a couple of days before you should have paid him reduced rent again you tell him it won’t be there. All the while you’re actually choosing to live somewhere else.

All 4 of you.

Sounds like you all moved out to me.

What sort of person "moves out" yet continues to pay rent after moving out?

OP; ignore this lad and open a case with the PRTB.

lawred2 · 10-05-2020 11:58am

JJJackal wrote: »

What is the law if the landlord perceived the house was abandoned by the tenants ie vacant with no plan to return?

He can perceive what he wants. Fact is that rent was paid for March and April.

JJJackal · 10-05-2020 12:01pm

lawred2 wrote: »

He can perceive what he wants. Fact is that rent was paid for March and April.

I am asking in general though. Not specifically related to this case

bucketybuck · 10-05-2020 12:05pm

expertrhino wrote: »

I sent a message to the landlord explaining the reason it with be late this month, and not next month, due to a few details. I did this on the 29th. He ignored me. I rang him on the 1st and 2nd, both times he didn't answer

The other told me they sent him a message on the 26/27th that rent would be late by a few days, they got no response.

Can I ask the reason that 4 different people all encountered the same scenario in which their rent would be a bit late for this month, but would be fine next month and in the future?

ted1 · 10-05-2020 12:08pm

Ballso wrote: »

You're some scumbag.

If this was my property and deposit I'd be round to this lads house with a baseball bat to retrieve.

The sooner the rest of these amateur landlords are driven out if the market the better, they are the absolute worst class of people in the country

Scumbag ? Baseball bat? You need to take a look in the mirror.

endofrainbow · 10-05-2020 12:09pm

send him a link to this thread.

10-05-2020 12:10pm

bucketybuck wrote: »

Can I ask the reason that 4 different people all encountered the same scenario in which their rent would be a bit late for this month, but would be fine next month and in the future?

The full rent might get paid from one account. And it really wouldn't be unusual for 4 people to be slightly delayed with a payment at the moment. It's not up to the landlord to foresee the situation in a month or two.

10-05-2020 12:11pm

bucketybuck wrote: »

Can I ask the reason that 4 different people all encountered the same scenario in which their rent would be a bit late for this month, but would be fine next month and in the future?

Don’t want to ask why a landlord thinks they can take the belongings of four people and steal their deposit though?

bucketybuck · 10-05-2020 12:13pm

Deleted User wrote: »

The full rent might get paid from one account. And it really wouldn't be unusual for 4 people to be slightly delayed with a payment at the moment. It's not up to the landlord to foresee the situation in a month or two.

If its from one account then only the account holder would be contacting him, not all 4 of them.

And while it wouldn't unusual for rent to be delayed, the OP says that next month it will be fine, that would suggest something more specific than just money troubles.

The landlord hasn't been paid this months rent, why should he believe that he would get next months?

bucketybuck · 10-05-2020 12:15pm

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

Don’t want to ask why a landlord thinks they can take the belongings of four people and steal their deposit though?

Why don't you want to ask that? Nobody is stopping you.

Minime2.5 · 10-05-2020 12:31pm

There are some very illogical people on here

1. A rent reduction was agreed upon

2. Mays rent was late by 1 week

3. The landlord doesn't want to engage with tenents because he refuses to reply to texts are answer his phone

4. He chooses to use communication in a 1 way fashion only. Doesn't want to communicate with the tenents but knew they were no longer there

You may not agree with the law but he's broken it. He's in for a very big bill . He'll have to pay back the deposit pay damages for the eviction and probably have to any outstanding elec/gas charges

By the way if the OP claims any of his property that the landlord removed from the premises has been damaged he will be looking at a bill for that too even if the OP lies about it

pbthevet · 10-05-2020 12:37pm

Id look at the positive here.

School is out and ye moved home so ....... ye kind of didn’t want the place or need it anymore and happy to not have to pay any more rent. Ye would technically still be contracted to pay the rent for the year otherwise.

Yea he took ur stuff and stored it. Bad landlord.

But on bright side ur able to walk away from place with little to no hastle. Grab the chance with both hands lads!

lawred2 · 10-05-2020 12:41pm

pbthevet wrote: »

Id look at the positive here.

School is out and ye moved home so ....... ye kind of didn’t want the place or need it anymore and happy to not have to pay any more rent. Ye would technically still be contracted to pay the rent for the year otherwise.

Yea he took ur stuff and stored it. Bad landlord.

But on bright side ur able to walk away from place with little to no hastle. Grab the chance with both hands lads!

He trousered a deposit.

And did I not read that the OP expects to be back at work shortly and now has no place in Dublin.

dubrov · 10-05-2020 12:41pm

pbthevet wrote:

But on bright side ur able to walk away from place with little to no hastle. Grab the chance with both hands lads!

Yeah, they should be grateful that the landlord illegally evicted them and removed their stuff without permission

They should be glad the landlord didn't throw in a beating as well

Akrasia · 10-05-2020 12:42pm

JayZeus wrote: »

You all moved ‘home’. Not in classes. Not in work. Already had a rent reduction. Nobody actually living there. Then a couple of days before you should have paid him reduced rent again you tell him it won’t be there. All the while you’re actually choosing to live somewhere else.

All 4 of you.

Sounds like you all moved out to me.

What difference would it make if they had all moved to mars, the lease was in place the proper procedures needed to be followed if the rent was overdue

ted1 · 10-05-2020 12:44pm

lawred2 wrote: »

He trousered a deposit.

And did I not read that the OP expects to be back at work shortly and now has no place in Dublin.

He legally can’t move back tilll at least July 20th.

pbthevet · 10-05-2020 12:44pm

lawred2 wrote: »

He trousered a deposit.

And did I not read that the OP expects to be back at work shortly and now has no place in Dublin.

I thought they were students. If they were living there .......... then ye no option but law.

If students and college 2020 and even 2021 being a big ? Id be glad to be rid of place till things settle. But if working thats a different kettle of fish. But if only one lad working ......... cud he not sort himself out and let the other lads just take easy way out of it

lawred2 · 10-05-2020 12:47pm

ted1 wrote: »

He legally can’t move back tilll at least July 20th.

Legally?

If you have to be somewhere for work there are no laws stopping you.

ted1 · 10-05-2020 12:55pm

lawred2 wrote: »

Legally?

If you have to be somewhere for work there are no laws stopping you.

“ 'It's now your place of residence': Garda commissioner says those in holiday homes must stay there”

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.thejournal.ie/gardai-covid19-powers-arrest-detain-5069615-Apr2020/%3famp=1

Graham · 10-05-2020 12:58pm

Mod Note

Take the Covid restriction debate to the appropriate forum please.

twowheelsonly · 10-05-2020 1:03pm

JayZeus wrote: »

...............
While it may well be decided that the landlord has to cough up, it’ll be better for him to have €2300 a month in rent from new tenants than to wait and see if this lot ever came back or would pay their rent. Better to have that than to have to chase after 4 students with SFA to their names who did a bunk and left out of pocket with a mortgage etc to pay each month.

Renters need to cop on to themselves at the moment too.

Where are these new tenants going to magically appear from ? It's a renters market at the moment given all that's going on and the number of vacant properties around. Going on the OPs' original description of the place it's not exactly a bargain so I can't imagine that people will be queuing around the block for it.

I hate to remind you as well BTW, but paying the mortgage is none of the tenants business.

10-05-2020 2:05pm

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

If the property is damaged we’ll soon see how much the landlord will deprive the tenants. You could be almost certain that someone who has already displayed such high levels of ignorance would not be too careful with someone else’s possessions.

That's still not theft though.

Panjandrums · 10-05-2020 2:06pm

OP, one of the biggest universitys in Dublin sent out an email last week stating that they will be running at 30% capacity come September and it appears that incoming undergraduates won't be arriving until later in the year.

I believe there will be a surplus of student accommodation come September, as it's highly likely that students may only be in 1/2 days a week, so they will commute.

Therefore you will be in a good position to secure cheaper and better accommodation.

It appears that the law is on your side but that doesn't mean you're better off. You're down 585 euro but you could have wasted alot more.

10-05-2020 2:09pm

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

That's still not theft though.

The theft of the deposit is.

lomb · 10-05-2020 2:20pm

Illegal eviction is upto 20k. I'd talk to landlord and tell him same and your coming back or your going to rtb.

Flavour Diaper · 10-05-2020 3:20pm

Scumbag behavior from your landlord and no surprise to see a few of the usual bottom feeding slaves and other parasites on this platform sticking up for him. I know several Spanish and Italian people who rent property and they have waived the rent or vastly reduced it under the circumstances. It's normal human decency and kindness to others, and their countries are hit much harder than ours. Take the prick for everything you can.

10-05-2020 4:52pm

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

The theft of the deposit is.

No. It falls under tort (contract law) and is for the civil courts, Ptb and solicitors to deal with

Any chance you could just accept you were wrong and we can move on? It's not a big deal really, you made a comment that was wrong, we all do but it's not conductive for the op to continue to suggest he try and make a criminal complaint.

OnYerPike · 11-05-2020 6:11pm

listermint wrote: »

What's very evident from a thread like this.

Ted and jayzues are in for some very expensive future lessons solely due to their grasp of the law.

I think either Ted or Jayzues could be the landlord in question.

Any update, OP?

ted1 · 11-05-2020 8:28pm

OnYerPike wrote: »

I think either Ted or Jayzues could be the landlord in question.

Any update, OP?

It’s amazing how wrong people can be.

No , not me. I would have dealt the Situation by dialogue. I also wouldn’t rent a place like the op described

overkill602 · 11-05-2020 9:43pm

wouldn't it be great if we could do a lefty board.ie job on them hang em high!!

the_syco · 11-05-2020 11:53pm

As has been asked; why were all four of you unable to pay the rent for the same amount of time?

Grumpypants · 12-05-2020 12:03am

He can't even start the eviction process until you hit the 14 day period of unpaid rent. If you are a week late (€600) then he can only take €600 from the deposit, not the whole €4600.

He can't enter the apartment, he can't touch your stuff.

Text him back, say he has to put back your stuff, ensure nothing has been damaged,

Eric Cartman · 12-05-2020 12:09am

I think we're missing part of the story here. Any time one of these stories starts with 'and the apartment was crap , and the heating was gone for ages' its usually little violin emotional generation to cover up something.

so heres our timeline , as I see it

march : 2300 paid, on time
april : 1900 paid, on time (arrears of 400)
may 1st : no rent, arrears of 2700 , arrears 30 days
may 7th : "we were just about to pay the rent(you weren't) , arrears 2700, 37 days , nobody has been in the apartment since mid march

so here we are , apartment vacant for 52 days, 37 days arrears on rent. You haven't contacted him since mid march till the 27th of April, one single text which may not have delivered explaining theres no even reduced rent for may. He texts you on the 7th (conveniently before you had paid) to say your stuff was in a shed

its abandoned, I can see how, if he didn't receive the text on the 27th that any landlord would conceive the apartment as abandoned. Especially with no college till September.

thankfully your landlord put your stuff in a storage locker, you say shed but both of us know its probably Locked, dry , self storage or a warehouse or container in a yard, safe and dry.

Also id talk to the other 3, if he sent a notice of arrears on April 1st to one of the 4 of you then you're also into part 7e

"Where the breach of the tenant’s obligations is a failure to pay the amount of rent due, a termination notice may only be served following the written notification by the landlord to the tenant of the amount owing and the rent still being owed 14 days after that notification is received." so 14 day arrears notice, a further 23 days have elapsed. If he's had no response at all to that and you all weren't planning on paying those arrears, it makes sense to claim its abandoned.

dubrov · 12-05-2020 12:50am

Eric Cartman wrote:

so heres our timeline , as I see it

You should write fiction. It was a great read

Dylan94 · 12-05-2020 12:55am

Eric Cartman wrote: »

I think we're missing part of the story here. Any time one of these stories starts with 'and the apartment was crap , and the heating was gone for ages' its usually little violin emotional generation to cover up something.

so heres our timeline , as I see it

march : 2300 paid, on time
april : 1900 paid, on time (arrears of 400)
may 1st : no rent, arrears of 2700 , arrears 30 days
may 7th : "we were just about to pay the rent(you weren't) , arrears 2700, 37 days , nobody has been in the apartment since mid march

so here we are , apartment vacant for 52 days, 37 days arrears on rent. You haven't contacted him since mid march till the 27th of April, one single text which may not have delivered explaining theres no even reduced rent for may. He texts you on the 7th (conveniently before you had paid) to say your stuff was in a shed

its abandoned, I can see how, if he didn't receive the text on the 27th that any landlord would conceive the apartment as abandoned. Especially with no college till September.

thankfully your landlord put your stuff in a storage locker, you say shed but both of us know its probably Locked, dry , self storage or a warehouse or container in a yard, safe and dry.

Also id talk to the other 3, if he sent a notice of arrears on April 1st to one of the 4 of you then you're also into part 7e

"Where the breach of the tenant’s obligations is a failure to pay the amount of rent due, a termination notice may only be served following the written notification by the landlord to the tenant of the amount owing and the rent still being owed 14 days after that notification is received." so 14 day arrears notice, a further 23 days have elapsed. If he's had no response at all to that and you all weren't planning on paying those arrears, it makes sense to claim its abandoned.

Its posts like these that make me wish you could post an eye roll emoji on boards.

Eric Cartman · 12-05-2020 1:02am

Dylan94 wrote: »

Its posts like these that make me wish you could post an eye roll emoji on boards.

:rolleyes:

Eric Cartman · 12-05-2020 1:03am

dubrov wrote: »

You should write fiction. It was a great read

Where have i faultered in the timeline ?

s1ippy · 12-05-2020 2:23am

twowheelsonly wrote: »

Where are these new tenants going to magically appear from ? It's a renters market at the moment given all that's going on and the number of vacant properties around. Going on the OPs' original description of the place it's not exactly a bargain so I can't imagine that people will be queuing around the block for it.

I hate to remind you as well BTW, but paying the mortgage is none of the tenants business.

Isn't it funny that some people have to pay other people's mortgages?

Not funny, sorry... Kafkaesque.

12-05-2020 5:25am

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Where have i faultered in the timeline ?

You’ve basically just made up a story. Basically calling the OP a liar just because they’re the OP, in long standing boards tradition, lends zero credibility either.

Sarn · 12-05-2020 7:32am

Eric Cartman wrote: »

I think we're missing part of the story...

You appear to be missing part of the story. Read the OPs other post for further clarification.

Eric Cartman · 12-05-2020 8:24am

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

You’ve basically just made up a story. Basically calling the OP a liar just because they’re the OP, in long standing boards tradition, lends zero credibility either.

Where was I incorrect in the timeline and what significance was talking about the apartment being small, the landlord not buying bunk beds or the plumber making excuses to this scenario , how those past evemts have any more significance than throwing shade on the landlord is beyond me.

dubrov · 12-05-2020 8:37am

Eric Cartman wrote:

Where have i faultered in the timeline ?

You've literally made the whole thing up.

E.g. line 2 talks about arrears when the OP said a new payment amount a was agreed.

You've magically converted 7 days later notice into 30 days arrears.

Somehow the OP is now uncontactable.

The list goes on

You can choose not to believe the OP but making up your own story based on nothing is just a waste of time for everyone

Grumpypants · 12-05-2020 8:38am

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Where have i faultered in the timeline ?

If they paid rent in April then April's rent was paid. May 1st to May 7th isn't 37 days. It's 7. You don't pay rent in arrears like a phone bill you pay in advance.

Anyway it's irrelevant If it's 7 or 37. If the landlord didn't text them until the 7th, then their notice period hasn't even started. It has to be written and even then it doesn't even start until the 8th. If they have been there since September then they get 90 days notice.

They have to be given 14 days from the 8th to get their rent up to date. After the 14 days you can proceed.

OP is prob being a bit liberal with the truth, these stories usually unravel to includes a bit more. It still doesn't void the law. All the landlord has done is screw himself.

OP can take a claim for an illegal eviction and for damage to their personal property. And will win anything from 5 to 20k.

theteal · 12-05-2020 9:43am

If all is as the OP describes (and I very much believe there's more to it) it would take some serious LL bias to side the way some of you have. You all know you can't enter the property and remove a tenants belongings for rent arrears of 7 days, even if there was no prior notification of the late rent from the tenant. I have no issue with the use of SMS/Whatsapp for communication (email even better) as this leaves a paper trail and when you suspect you may have a dodgy LL/tenant, it's always better to have a paper trail. If the LL has actually sent a message stating he's keeping deposit, that's just case closed - I'm sure you're not even allowed do that for rent arrears these days.

Anybody talking about abandoned property, insurance etc. just stop, there's a global pandemic going on, none of the normal rules apply.

OP, you will be getting an award from the PRTB, it may take a few years but if you stick at it, it's a slam dunk.

lion_bar · 12-05-2020 9:49am

I thought the covid regulations are more for people who remain in a property and can't pay rent rather than people can pay but who move home, leaving the property unoccupied.

Leaving a property unoccupied would certainly be an issue for the landlords insurance provider/policy which might be a risk for a property with dodgy heating/plumbing.
It might also be a breach of the rental agreement, but due to Covid there isn't much the landlord can do about that at the moment.

Has the property appeared on daft/airbnb/etc yet?

Hopefully the OP will keep us informed of his progress through PRTB process.

bucketybuck · 12-05-2020 9:50am

Maybe the OP could clarify what he meant by all tenants being unable to pay their rent in May but then having no issues going forward? What was different about May?

And has the OP confirmed that the other three tenants have been fully honest with him?

Eric Cartman · 12-05-2020 10:11am

Grumpypants wrote: »

If they paid rent in April then April's rent was paid. May 1st to May 7th isn't 37 days. It's 7. You don't pay rent in arrears like a phone bill you pay in advance.

Anyway it's irrelevant If it's 7 or 37. If the landlord didn't text them until the 7th, then their notice period hasn't even started. It has to be written and even then it doesn't even start until the 8th. If they have been there since September then they get 90 days notice.

They have to be given 14 days from the 8th to get their rent up to date. After the 14 days you can proceed.

OP is prob being a bit liberal with the truth, these stories usually unravel to includes a bit more. It still doesn't void the law. All the landlord has done is screw himself.

OP can take a claim for an illegal eviction and for damage to their personal property. And will win anything from 5 to 20k.

The landlord may have agreed to deffer the rent but they paid 1900 for april, thats 400 in arrears that carry over into may, on may 1st theyre 2700 in arrears and in arrears for 30 days

Dylan94 · 12-05-2020 10:18am

Eric Cartman wrote: »

The landlord may have agreed to deffer the rent but they paid 1900 for april, thats 400 in arrears that carry over into may, on may 1st theyre 2700 in arrears and in arrears for 30 days

Where does it say the landlord agreed to deffer the rent? They clearly said that the LL agreed to reduce the rent for the duration of the lockdown.

Landlord packed our stuff up and threw it out

Comments