Parking and traffic in Phoenix Park

19-06-2020 4:45pm

beauf wrote: »

Have an entrance fee for the park, for pedestrians, cyclists and cars.

Let people vote with their wallet of they want to be there.

For pedestrians????

Stark · 19-06-2020 4:56pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

For pedestrians????

It's to make up for them not paying"road tax"

Larbre34 · 19-06-2020 5:04pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Surely just make it paid parking. That would disincentivise the commuters and shoppers, who use it as a parking lot. Maybe free for an hour or two and then jack up the prices

I'd agree in principle but the place would be ruined with signage and in fairness to OPW they keep that kind of pollution to the absolute minimum in the Park.

19-06-2020 5:28pm

Larbre34 wrote: »

I'd agree in principle but the place would be ruined with signage and in fairness to OPW they keep that kind of pollution to the absolute minimum in the Park.

I think that a single big board at every entrance would be fine. Rather have some signage if it meant less parking

beauf · 19-06-2020 7:31pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

For pedestrians????

Pay for the upkeep of the park.
You use it. You pay for it.

19-06-2020 7:36pm

beauf wrote: »

Pay for the upkeep of the park.
You use it. You pay for it.

You’re right. There should also be a fee for walking on the pavement in the city

beauf · 19-06-2020 7:52pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

You’re right. There should also be a fee for walking on the pavement in the city

Who do think pays for them...

Larbre34 · 19-06-2020 8:44pm

beauf wrote: »

Have an entrance fee for the park, for pedestrians, cyclists and cars.

Let people vote with their wallet of they want to be there.

Ah would ya cop on to life.

Phoenix Park is the jewel in the crown of the OPW, they run it on behalf of the people of Ireland and they use our taxes to do it, pretty well overall. Would you dream of seeing a charge for pedestrian entry into Hyde Park or Richmond Park or the Tiergarten?! Let's be serious here.

19-06-2020 8:50pm

Larbre34 wrote: »

Ah would ya cop on to life.

Phoenix Park is the jewel in the crown of the OPW, they run it on behalf of the people of Ireland and they use our taxes to do it, pretty well overall. Would you dream of seeing a charge for pedestrian entry into Hyde Park or Richmond Park or the Tiergarten?! Let's be serious here.

It’s a wind up

Spanish Eyes · 19-06-2020 8:59pm

Doesn't matter, no one is listening, no one who can decide really cares.

North Road for through traffic, no parking ever on Chesterfield.

Paid parking everywhere else.

Pedestrians and cyclists free to enter. It is important to protect the fabric of this wonderful park. For everyone.

beauf · 19-06-2020 9:50pm

Be better and safer with no People.

Spanish Eyes · 19-06-2020 9:53pm

beauf wrote: »

Be better and safer with no People.

Are you feeling ok beauf? What are you really trying to say here. I don't get it.

d15ude · 20-06-2020 9:22am

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Are you feeling ok beauf? What are you really trying to say here. I don't get it.

don't feed the troll...

Phil.x · 20-06-2020 11:35pm

beauf is an old disillusioned cyclist who's now caught between the paddles of a bike and a car.

beauf · 20-06-2020 11:47pm

It's a vicious cycle. I've gone all cranky in old age.

beauf · 21-06-2020 12:02am

The lockdown has created a few interesting dilemmas
.
Before the lockdown I was planning on buying a new bike for commuting. My old one is worn out. Probably an eBike. Have to clear the old bikes first though. No space left! However we may end up working from home a lot more. So the bike maybe be only a 2 day week commuter. So it no longer needs to be an eBike. But even if it is. It can be something less sensible.

But I'm thinking of buying a cheap MTB in the interim to enjoy the rest of the summer. Almost bought it earlier. Might do it now.

I'm also wondering the same with the car and the train. I didn't renew the annual rail pass this year. I'm not likely to need it again I'm thinking.

So what this got to do with the Park I hear you not asking. Nothing. Though we've been exploring all over looking for trails locally within range of not driving. While researching that I found this...

https://youtu.be/Dj6yzO0Zf3k

21-06-2020 12:40am

It amazes me how many people go to the park and walk along the main road. Like what is the point in that!!!

There are so many wonderful little walk ways and trails etc.

For someone like me that was forced to move outside Dublin, I’d hate to think you can’t park your car in the park.

beauf · 21-06-2020 1:07am

Its just easier to access I assume. Or at least it was. Handy for a buggy, roller blades, balance bikes etc. Some people like a easy measurable distance. I suppose its a bit like road cycling vs mountain biking.

daymobrew · 21-06-2020 12:30pm

beauf wrote: »

While researching that I found this...

https://youtu.be/Dj6yzO0Zf3k

FYI: There are bee hives on the opposite side of the canal just before the 11th lock (before train station).
I didn't realise there were steps to the platform - I'd suggested such an entrance during the public consultation about the Ashtown/Castleknock greenway.

Back before where the video starts you can go over the footbridge. It's fun to watch the cars speeding down the off ramp from M50 southbound to N3 westbound. Or take the shortcut to Dunsink Lane. Then you can cycle up to Elm Green Golf Club or walk through this gate and explore area between the Tolka and Junction 6 (and it has a great view looking down on Junction 6 buildings and the N3.

Rosser · 21-06-2020 8:34pm

beauf wrote: »

So yes you don't understand the term unused space.

There's land at the back of Farmleigh they have used in the past as car parking just abandoned and derelict. There lots of areas on the fringe of the park that are pretty much dead ground, I've never seen deer or people anywhere near these areas in a lifetime of using the park. No one uses them because they are overgrown and/or inaccessible.

It would far better to have cars use those spaces than parked on the grass in the spaces that are used by people and animals.

You sound like Jeremy Clarkson.....

beauf · 21-06-2020 10:05pm

Rosser wrote: »

You sound like Jeremy Clarkson.....

..and you James May...?

beauf · 21-06-2020 10:06pm

Rosser wrote: »

You sound like Jeremy Clarkson.....

All I was suggesting was moving the parking from the middle of the park (and on the grass) to the fringes of it. As is the case with most other parks.

What followed was a lot of whataboutery about concreting the whole park and not allowed to charge anything because it's been unchanged since the pyramids. When it's had loads of changes through the years.

Every park is busy even the ones with no roads. I wonder why that is? Pandemic maybe, schools and work closed? Of course not. Lol.

Most of the traffic in the park and parking is caused by the opw and poor traffic management. They could stop it if they wished. They choose not to. Likewise the sorry state of the cycling facilities in the park.

Rosser · 22-06-2020 1:13am

beauf wrote: »

Most of the traffic in the park and parking is caused by the opw and poor traffic management..

Nope Jeremy most of the traffic in the park goes through it without stopping, some of the traffic stops and should have parking the rest should go other routes.

James

beauf · 22-06-2020 1:34am

No James I'm referring not referring to how it is normally.

I'm referring to the current plan which is causing massive traffic jams (traffic) far worse than normal with a fraction of the normal traffic volume.

If they didn't let it in the park, it wouldn't have to queue to get out.
Its normally dissipated (into much smaller jams) by having multiple exits. Now its bottle-necked into just one.
Once they saw that happening they should have closed the entrance.

I wouldn't call being stuck in a traffic jam for over an hour "not stopping". But then again James May is renown for his sedate pace.

zerosugarbuzz · 22-06-2020 7:16am

beauf wrote: »

No James I'm referring not referring to how it is normally.

I'm referring to the current plan which is causing massive traffic jams (traffic) far worse than normal with a fraction of the normal traffic volume.

If they didn't let it in the park, it wouldn't have to queue to get out.
Its normally dissipated (into much smaller jams) by having multiple exits. Now its bottle-necked into just one.
Once they saw that happening they should have closed the entrance.

I wouldn't call being stuck in a traffic jam for over an hour "not stopping". But then again James May is renown for his sedate pace.

I’ll correct you there. Once they saw this they should have reopened all the other gates. You’re welcome ðŸ˜‰

daymobrew · 22-06-2020 9:00am

Meanwhile in Castleknock village, the pedestrian lights were changed to reduce pedestrian waiting (and help them maintain social distancing).
Then the motorists complained and won. Boo!

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=677957889432705

beauf · 22-06-2020 9:24am

I think the best plan is to avoid going anywhere near these places in a car unless you've no choice.

22-06-2020 9:58am

No traffic jams to be seen in the Phoenix park this morning

beauf · 22-06-2020 10:16am

I don't think you've ever seen any problems with the park.

bubblypop wrote: »

Take it from someone who is in there everyday, there is no parking in grass on the north road. None at all.

bubblypop wrote: »

There is no traffic chaos at the moment.
Chesterfield Ave is much safer without cars parked either side.

I found a way of not seeing them also...

IngazZagni · 22-06-2020 1:55pm

daymobrew wrote: »

Meanwhile in Castleknock village, the pedestrian lights were changed to reduce pedestrian waiting (and help them maintain social distancing).
Then the motorists complained and won. Boo!

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=677957889432705

In fairness the lights were only allowing a handful of cars to go through at a time which was bonkers.

Hurrache · 22-06-2020 2:30pm

i think what was bonkers was cars driving through a living village were given priority over those going about their business on foot in it.

mcgragger · 22-06-2020 2:39pm

There is already a cycle lane in the park and like it or not the car park there takes away from the congestion in town.
They need to open the sides up again for parking/cyclists. I am a user of this method. My car gets left outside of the city and I cycle down to work. Its win win.

If they want to preserve cycling in the park why cant the exisitng lanes be slightly widened?

maxsmum · 22-06-2020 2:44pm

mcgragger wrote: »

There is already a cycle lane in the park and like it or not the car park there takes away from the congestion in town.
They need to open the sides up again for parking/cyclists. I am a user of this method. My car gets left outside of the city and I cycle down to work. Its win win.

If they want to preserve cycling in the park why cant the exisitng lanes be slightly widened?

But you can't possibly be in favour of parked cars lining the main road in the park all day just so commuters can get into town? If it eases congestion in town that's not the answer... a different conversation needs to happen then around traffic management.

beauf · 22-06-2020 2:47pm

Hurrache wrote: »

i think what was bonkers was cars driving through a living village were given priority over those going about their business on foot in it.

When they make a bottleneck worse (against local objections) by putting a huge supermarket in the middle of it, and an extra signal, and poorly design junction that the traffic will worse. You kinda expect they'll compound it by change the signalling.

Maybe they'll ban cars from the village next. That would certainly make it a nice walking experience.

What ever happened to the proposed cycle lane along Castleknock Road.

beauf · 22-06-2020 2:51pm

mcgragger wrote: »

There is already a cycle lane in the park and like it or not the car park there takes away from the congestion in town.
They need to open the sides up again for parking/cyclists. I am a user of this method. My car gets left outside of the city and I cycle down to work. Its win win.

If they want to preserve cycling in the park why cant the exisitng lanes be slightly widened?

The location of the current cycle lane caused problems with pedestrians.

Especially with Strava times.

beauf · 22-06-2020 2:59pm

maxsmum wrote: »

But you can't possibly be in favour of parked cars lining the main road in the park all day just so commuters can get into town? If it eases congestion in town that's not the answer... a different conversation needs to happen then around traffic management.

Well its debatable if the all the parking was commuters.
But people seem to have selective memories about it.

The OPW could clamp them, that would solve that. Or not open the gates till 9.30 in the morning. Close them again from 4 to 7pm. 7 days a week.

zerosugarbuzz · 22-06-2020 3:02pm

maxsmum wrote: »

But you can't possibly be in favour of parked cars lining the main road in the park all day just so commuters can get into town? If it eases congestion in town that's not the answer... a different conversation needs to happen then around traffic management.

Simple solution, put pay and display parking on Chesterfield Avenue. With a 3 hour max parking time it wouldn't be worth while for anyone going to the city.

22-06-2020 3:02pm

mcgragger wrote: »

There is already a cycle lane in the park and like it or not the car park there takes away from the congestion in town.
They need to open the sides up again for parking/cyclists. I am a user of this method. My car gets left outside of the city and I cycle down to work. Its win win.

If they want to preserve cycling in the park why cant the exisitng lanes be slightly widened?

completely disagree. The park shouldn't be for city parking. It should be for park users only. Hopefully a charge is implemented after a certain length of stay, at a level to strongly dissuade commuters from parking there.

Skylinehead · 22-06-2020 3:16pm

Hurrache wrote: »

i think what was bonkers was cars driving through a living village were given priority over those going about their business on foot in it.

Castleknock Village is a bit of a traffic disaster though, and I don't think having a constant traffic jam is in anyones interest.

As for the park, I actually think it's better this way. And I say that as someone who commutes through it, at least before the pandemic.

22-06-2020 3:19pm

zerosugarbuzz wrote: »

Simple solution, put pay and display parking on Chesterfield Avenue. With a 3 hour max parking time it wouldn't be worth while for anyone going to the city.

I would say free for three hours. And then a hefty charge per hour

beauf · 22-06-2020 4:17pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

completely disagree. The park shouldn't be for city parking. It should be for park users only. Hopefully a charge is implemented after a certain length of stay, at a level to strongly dissuade commuters from parking there.

The objective is to remove parking off the ave.

Charging for it won't help with that aim.

mcgragger · 22-06-2020 4:41pm

maxsmum wrote: »

But you can't possibly be in favour of parked cars lining the main road in the park all day just so commuters can get into town? If it eases congestion in town that's not the answer... a different conversation needs to happen then around traffic management.

If its not there I am going to drive into town and park in the office. My car is on the road and I would prefer to keep it out of the city so the park is ideal.
Chesterfield avenue is a prime route into the city. I know its unfortunate but thats the way of it. I have to drive.
There is no public transport where I live to get me to the city and if I was to drive to a Dublin 15 suburb I would be facing a 2 hour each way public transport journey.

Maybe we need carparks in the suburbs and cycle lanes from them into the city.

22-06-2020 4:45pm

mcgragger wrote: »

If its not there I am going to drive into town and park in the office. My car is on the road and I would prefer to keep it out of the city so the park is ideal.
Chesterfield avenue is a prime route into the city. I know its unfortunate but thats the way of it. I have to drive.
There is no public transport where I live to get me to the city and if I was to drive to a Dublin 15 suburb I would be facing a 2 hour each way public transport journey.

Maybe we need carparks in the suburbs and cycle lanes from them into the city.

Its not an ideal situation, and more parking is perhaps needed somewhere to facilitate parking & cycling, or parking & bussing. But the Phoenix Park should not be the answer to that

22-06-2020 4:47pm

beauf wrote: »

The objective is to remove parking off the ave.

Charging for it won't help with that aim.

I'm not convinced that we want to move parking off the ave. There is and always will be heavy traffic down the ave, so why not have the parking too. Keep as many of the cars in one place as possible. Then the remainder of the park becomes more car free. If parking was moved to other areas in the park (in addition to the various car parks that already exist), then it would just spread the traffic around more.

Paying for parking would at least make sure that commuters dont use it

zerosugarbuzz · 22-06-2020 4:48pm

There is also no hard shoulder now on chesterfield Avenue if you happen to have car trouble. That will create some traffic Jam when it happens.

Stark · 22-06-2020 4:53pm

zerosugarbuzz wrote: »

There is also no hard shoulder now on chesterfield Avenue if you happen to have car trouble. That will create some traffic Jam when it happens.

As if people won't simply kick the cones aside and park there when that happens. You already encounter OPW vans parked along the cycle lane/hard shoulder.

Larbre34 · 22-06-2020 5:20pm

Stark wrote: »

As if people won't simply kick the cones aside and park there when that happens. You already encounter OPW vans parked along the cycle lane/hard shoulder.

I'll be doing that to park anyway, try and start a bit of critical mass. As I've said before, they didn't change the bye-laws to install that cycle lane, its just a bit of paint and its unenforceable.

mcgragger · 22-06-2020 5:20pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Its not an ideal situation, and more parking is perhaps needed somewhere to facilitate parking & cycling, or parking & bussing. But the Phoenix Park should not be the answer to that

I agree overall but it is the answer for the last how ever many years. Alot of people rely on it for the same reason as me. I park by the Castleknock gate and its fairly empty at 7am when I get there. But down closer to the Zoo and its filling up.

The parking and Public transport is deplorable in Dublin. Had you seen or attempted to get on to a Luas at peak time pre Covid? Unreal.

liamog · 22-06-2020 5:28pm

I think it makes sense to remove the daily commuter parking, Phoenix park should not be a park and ride for the city centre. On the flip side however, the park is a destination itself where people need to park. The closure of the parking on Chesterfield Av now means I have to drive all the way to the Papal cross instead of just entering the park.

VonLuck · 22-06-2020 5:31pm

Larbre34 wrote: »

I'll be doing that to park anyway, try and start a bit of critical mass. As I've said before, they didn't change the bye-laws to install that cycle lane, its just a bit of paint and its unenforceable.

Wait until a cyclist crashes into the back of a parked car.

Parking and traffic in Phoenix Park

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