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READ SUMMARY IN POST 986 - Amazon.uk Post-Brexit

  • 30-11-2020 4:41pm
    #1
    SusanC10
    Registered Users Posts: 2,432 ✭✭✭SusanC10


    LINK TO POST 986

    Apologies if this question has already been asked and answered. I couldn't find anything.

    We have Amazon Prime with the .co.uk site.

    How will deliveries be affected after Jan 1st ?
    With the UK not being in the EU anymore.
    Customs Duties etc.

    Would we need to switch to Amazon Fr or De ?

    TIA
    Tagged:


«134567…36

Comments

  • #2
    Xterminator
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,758 ✭✭✭Xterminator


    well it depends on the deal. will there be a deal? what will it cover?

    We should know soon. but they are still negotiating. And nothing is agreed until everything is agreed!


  • #3
    SusanC10
    Registered Users Posts: 2,432 ✭✭✭SusanC10


    Xterminator wrote: »
    well it depends on the deal. will there be a deal? what will it cover?

    We should know soon. but they are still negotiating. And nothing is agreed until everything is agreed!

    Thanks for the reply. That makes sense.


  • #4
    Quackster
    Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 5,842 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quackster


    Xterminator wrote: »
    well it depends on the deal. will there be a deal? what will it cover?

    We should know soon. but they are still negotiating. And nothing is agreed until everything is agreed!
    Deal or no deal will make little to no difference as the UK is leaving the EU Customs Union either way. I expect Amazon UK will handle customs clearance in-house, charge estimated taxes at checkout and their parcels will continue to be delivered here in much the same manner.

    Purchasing products that Amazon UK won't deliver to Ireland via AddressPal etc will become a lot more messy and expensive though so it may no longer be a runner.


  • #5
    C3PO
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,773 ✭✭✭C3PO


    I’d be surprised if Amazon don’t set up an Amazon.ie


  • #6
    C3PO
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,773 ✭✭✭C3PO


    sugarman wrote: »
    I dunno, id be more surprised if they did tbh, the likes of Amazon UK, France, Germany, Spain, Italy etc.. are all catering to populations of over 60m people.

    With a population of just under 5m, our market share would be minuscule in comparison.

    Most of Europe use their neighboring countries Amazon just like we have up to now, I'd imagine an English language option on their French site will be added to accustom the Irish market. While the German site already has already had one added.

    The best we can probably hope for is the expansion of their own distribution centres throughout Ireland where items are forwarded on from their fulfillment centres around Europe. This has been whats really made prime delivery possible in Dublin region so far with their opening of their Greenogue site earlier this year.

    As for Prime video, thats already centralised via a .com domain with region specific content set by the registered accounts address. Ireland & UK already have different content even when registered through their UK site.

    It would be relatively easy for a company like Amazon to piggy-back a .ie site on the back of their .de or .fr set-ups? I imagine a lot of the stock is being warehoused in Holland or somewhere central anyway?


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  • #7
    Cabaal
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,510 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    C3PO wrote: »
    It would be relatively easy for a company like Amazon to piggy-back a .ie site on the back of their .de or .fr set-ups? I imagine a lot of the stock is being warehoused in Holland or somewhere central anyway?

    You'd be very wrong with that at assumption ,
    Amazon fulfillment centres are all over the place, there's no such thing as a central location. That would actually cause them big problems if one central location did exist.

    If you order from the UK site then they've about 8 plus large centres in the UK (each the size of several football pitches) and countless smaller centres that handle prime now orders.

    The bulk of UK orders ship from UK fulfillment centres, but orders can also ship from any of the countless mainland Europe centres now and then. If you order from de and live in Germany then odds are the order will ship from a mainland Europe fulfillment centre,

    Ireland by comparison has exactly zero fulfillment centres and only recently opened a amazon logistics delivery depot.

    For amazon to open just one fulfillment centre in Ireland would take massive investment which wouldnt really be worth it for a few reasons.
    - Ireland has a tiny population
    - that one fulfillment centre wouldn't even come close to holding all the stock needed to complete orders so they'd have to continue to use centers outside of Ireland
    - no existing premises exists in Ireland that is suitable size wise so it would be a brand new build.

    I'd wager amazon will simply continue to use the UK site for Irish customers and continue to ship items from UK and mainland Europe centres just like it does now.

    But it will likely expand on amazon logistics in Ireland to handle and reduce costs for last mile delivery.


  • #8
    C3PO
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,773 ✭✭✭C3PO


    Cabaal wrote: »
    I'd wager amazon will simply continue to use the UK site for Irish customers and continue to ship items from UK and mainland Europe centres just like it does now.

    But the whole premise of this thread is that post-Brexit, Amazon will not be able to ship from the UK to Ireland without all sorts of issues with Customs and tariffs? The assumption is that Amazon will have to ship from the European Mainland?


  • #9
    Quackster
    Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 5,842 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quackster


    C3PO wrote: »
    But the whole premise of this thread is that post-Brexit, Amazon will not be able to ship from the UK to Ireland without all sorts of issues with Customs and tariffs? The assumption is that Amazon will have to ship from the European Mainland?
    Amazon UK has the resources to handle customs formalities and ships sufficient volume here to make it worthwhile for them to do so.

    In any case, I-OSS from 1st July next year will make it a straightforward process.


  • #10
    Pinch Flat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,767 ✭✭✭Pinch Flat


    C3PO wrote: »
    I’d be surprised if Amazon don’t set up an Amazon.ie

    Agreed. They'll have a new warehouse open here in Sept 2021


  • #11
    mgbgt1978
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,245 ✭✭✭mgbgt1978


    It's unusual that Amazon UK have not come out with any meaningful statements regarding Brexit and Cross-Border Sales.
    So far they appear to have simply advised their 'fulfilled by Amazon' Sellers, and the 'fulfilled by seller' Sellers to split their stock between the UK and any Amazon EU Warehouse.
    That advice would seem to be aimed at Sellers who are selling to mainland Europe and the UK rather than Ireland.
    I suppose it just shows how small we are in Ireland in relation to overall Amazon European Sales, that Amazon have not released an Ireland-specific policy.


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  • #12
    Jim_Hodge
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,223 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge


    mgbgt1978 wrote: »
    It's unusual that Amazon UK have not come out with any meaningful statements regarding Brexit and Cross-Border Sales.
    So far they appear to have simply advised their 'fulfilled by Amazon' Sellers, and the 'fulfilled by seller' Sellers to split their stock between the UK and any Amazon EU Warehouse.
    That advice would seem to be aimed at Sellers who are selling to mainland Europe and the UK rather than Ireland.
    I suppose it just shows how small we are in Ireland in relation to overall Amazon European Sales, that Amazon have not released an Ireland-specific policy.

    They only needed to alert sellers to changes in the mainland Europe market as they have their own operations there. Ireland is too small fry to concern them.


  • #13
    km991148
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,277 ✭✭✭km991148


    I always assumed there was no motivation to open a .ie because UK is right on the doorstep (logistically Ireland is as good as a UK county) but also there was some kind of tax wrangle if they ran with a .ie and Irish fulfilment.


  • #14
    mgbgt1978
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,245 ✭✭✭mgbgt1978


    Jim_Hodge wrote: »
    They only needed to alert sellers to changes in the mainland Europe market as they have their own operations there. Ireland is too small fry to concern them.


    Is there an Echo in here ??? ;)


  • #15
    Quackster
    Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 5,842 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quackster


    km991148 wrote: »
    I always assumed there was no motivation to open a .ie because UK is right on the doorstep (logistically Ireland is as good as a UK county) but also there was some kind of tax wrangle if they ran with a .ie and Irish fulfilment.
    It's just the size of Ireland doesn't warrant our own Amazon. Every other small/medium European country is served by the Amazon of a neighbouring large European country and we'll continue to be served by Amazon UK after Brexit.


  • #16
    Oafley Jones
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,506 ✭✭✭Oafley Jones


    Quackster wrote: »
    It's just the size of Ireland doesn't warrant our own Amazon. Every other small/medium European country is served by the Amazon of a neighbouring large European country and we'll continue to be served by Amazon UK after Brexit.

    Those countries are still in a single customs Union.


  • #17
    Quackster
    Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 5,842 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quackster


    Oafley Jones wrote: »
    Those countries are still in a single customs Union.
    A good many European countries are not in the EU Customs Union. For instance, Norwegians tend to shop on Amazon UK & Amazon DE.


  • #18
    harmless
    Registered Users Posts: 980 ✭✭✭harmless


    Quackster wrote: »
    A good many European countries are not in the EU Customs Union. For instance, Norwegians tend to shop on Amazon UK & Amazon DE.


    If there is no strong trade deal(It's not looking good after today's news) with the UK both Norwegians and Irish will be ordering from Amazon DE and staying clear of UK customs charges and delays.


  • #19
    WHL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 538 ✭✭✭WHL


    No free delivery from Germany at present as far as I can see so I plan to drop Amazon Prime this month. Spending a mini-fortune first though :)


  • #20
    harmless
    Registered Users Posts: 980 ✭✭✭harmless


    WHL wrote: »
    No free delivery from Germany at present as far as I can see so I plan to drop Amazon Prime this month. Spending a mini-fortune first though :)


    I think if Amazon can offer prime shipping to Irish customers from .de even if it takes a bit longer than what we are used to from .co.uk that would keep the majority of Irish customers happy.


  • #21
    Quackster
    Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 5,842 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quackster


    harmless wrote: »
    If there is no strong trade deal(It's not looking good after today's news) with the UK both Norwegians and Irish will be ordering from Amazon DE and staying clear of UK customs charges and delays.
    Deal or no deal makes zero difference. The fact is that there will be a customs barrier between us and the UK either way.

    There is already a customs barrier between Norway and both the UK & Germany so Brexit will have absolutely no impact on their e-shopping habits.


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  • #22
    ED E
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,169 ✭✭✭✭ED E


    km991148 wrote: »
    I always assumed there was no motivation to open a .ie because UK is right on the doorstep (logistically Ireland is as good as a UK county) but also there was some kind of tax wrangle if they ran with a .ie and Irish fulfilment.

    All sellers over 30k pa in goods pay Irish VAT. They already were.

    The new DS will let them import, sort the duties/clearance, then sell Irish to Irish. I suspect that's what'll happen.


  • #23
    km991148
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,277 ✭✭✭km991148


    ED E wrote: »
    All sellers over 30k pa in goods pay Irish VAT. They already were.

    The new DS will let them import, sort the duties/clearance, then sell Irish to Irish. I suspect that's what'll happen.

    No, I meant - I wasn't sure if there was some restriction on how many goods they held in fulfillment centers in Ireland (For example) that would have to be exported and the effects of the tax on their own corporate structure.

    Amazon (I am sure) is a little bit more advanced than your average seller in terms of corporate structure and international corporation tax etc.


  • #24
    harmless
    Registered Users Posts: 980 ✭✭✭harmless


    Quackster wrote: »
    Deal or no deal makes zero difference. The fact is that there will be a customs barrier between us and the UK either way.

    There is already a customs barrier between Norway and both the UK & Germany so Brexit will have absolutely no impact on their e-shopping habits.


    That border has had time to stabalise in terms of shipping time. It's customs charges that customers and sellers worry about the most. Many sellers on the UK Amazon may not be able to compete on price anymore and will not sell outside the UK.

    This won't happen when it comes to sellers on the German site selling to EU and EFTA countries.


  • #25
    Thud
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,642 ✭✭✭Thud


    shipping costs on .de and.fr are currently a good bit more than .UK.
    Distance is obviously a factorbut I wonder if volumes being shipped from .de and .fr would push these costs down a bit


  • #26
    worlds goodest teecher
    Registered Users Posts: 1,126 ✭✭✭worlds goodest teecher


    I tweeted Amazon earlier this week asking if I would, as a Prime subscriber, get free delivery from Amazon DE.

    Their response:
    At the moment, delivery fee to Ireland is 7.50 EUR, if you order from AmazonDE. You can check International Delivery Rates & Times here: https://t.co/ZajbKeJFeM ^LL


  • #27
    harmless
    Registered Users Posts: 980 ✭✭✭harmless


    worlds goodest teecher wrote: »
    I tweeted Amazon earlier this week asking if I would, as a Prime subscriber, get free delivery from Amazon DE.

    Their response:
    At the moment, delivery fee to Ireland is 7.50 EUR, if you order from AmazonDE. You can check International Delivery Rates & Times here: https://t.co/ZajbKeJFeM ^LL


    It's to be expected, just like everyone else Amazon have no idea how trade talks will go with brexit.

    Most companies that can afford to hold off and not make any decisions until everything is clear will do so.


  • #28
    Heebie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,302 ✭✭✭Heebie


    I've switched to using amazon.de for things that I can't find from an Irish business.


  • #29
    kathleen37
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 813 ✭✭✭kathleen37


    Just got this email;

    Hello,

    As you have placed an order on Amazon.co.uk and selected an EU delivery address in the past, we wanted to let you know that from 1 January 2021, when the Brexit transition period ends, you’ll see some changes when you shop on Amazon.co.uk and select an EU delivery address. These changes could include:

    - VAT (or the regional equivalent, if applicable, https://www.amazon.co.uk/vatrates) being due in the country of delivery, or your package may be subject to customs duties, taxes and fees (“Import Fees”)
    - the collection of VAT, or an estimation of Import Fees (“Import Fee Deposit” https://www.amazon.co.uk/ifd), which may result in a price change at checkout.

    We will continue to accept eligible returns. If the reason for return is the result of an error (e.g. if the item is defective / damaged / incorrect), any costs incurred for the return will be paid by Amazon. Otherwise, any costs incurred for the return (including transport costs, as well as any associated import fees or customs where applicable) will be payable by the person returning the goods https://www.amazon.co.uk/returnshelp.

    We hope this helps and we see you again soon.

    Regards,

    Customer Services


  • #30
    listermint
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,105 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Jim_Hodge wrote: »
    They only needed to alert sellers to changes in the mainland Europe market as they have their own operations there. Ireland is too small fry to concern them.

    I hear this nonsense all the time. Ireland is a lucrative market . The end.


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  • #31
    kathleen37
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 813 ✭✭✭kathleen37


    Actually, just wondering - I use subscribe and save for mainly cat food.

    How do I know where it comes from if it says its "dispatched form and sold by Amazon"?

    Thanks

    *edit*

    Right - I think I'm stuffed - just seem this on the delivery due this week

    "Tuesday, 8 December
    8:02 AM
    Package arrived at an Amazon facility
    Saint Helens, Merseyside GB
    Package has shipped
    Ridgmont, Bedfordshire UK"


  • #32
    Jim_Hodge
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,223 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge


    listermint wrote: »
    I hear this nonsense all the time. Ireland is a lucrative market . The end.

    Not in the grand scheme of things within the turnover of Amazon.co.uk. 'The end' doesn't make a statement true.

    As an aside... From Amazon today
    As you have placed an order on Amazon.co.uk and selected an EU delivery address in the past, we wanted to let you know that from 1 January 2021, when the Brexit transition period ends, you’ll see some changes when you shop on Amazon.co.uk and select an EU delivery address. These changes could include:

    - VAT (or the regional equivalent, if applicable, https://www.amazon.co.uk/vatrates) being due in the country of delivery, or your package may be subject to customs duties, taxes and fees (“Import Fees”)
    - the collection of VAT, or an estimation of Import Fees (“Import Fee Deposit” https://www.amazon.co.uk/ifd), which may result in a price change at checkout.

    We will continue to accept eligible returns. If the reason for return is the result of an error (e.g. if the item is defective / damaged / incorrect), any costs incurred for the return will be paid by Amazon. Otherwise, any costs incurred for the return (including transport costs, as well as any associated import fees or customs where applicable) will be payable by the person returning the goods https://www.amazon.co.uk/returnshelp.


  • #33
    listermint
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,105 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Jim_Hodge wrote: »
    Not in the grand scheme of things within the turnover of Amazon.co.uk. 'The end' doesn't make a statement true.

    As an aside... From Amazon today

    Horse****.

    Do you know the value of Irish business in the context of Amazon UK ?

    I'd imagine you might find there's similar results as Tesco.

    It's a more important market than vast swathes of the UK. Due solely to wages and disposable income.


  • #34
    Jim_Hodge
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,223 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge


    listermint wrote: »
    Horse****.

    Do you know the value of Irish business in the context of Amazon UK ?

    I'd imagine you might find there's similar results as Tesco.

    It's a more important market than vast swathes of the UK. Due solely to wages and disposable income.

    You know, you can have your opinion without being abusive about it.


  • #35
    listermint
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,105 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Jim_Hodge wrote: »
    You know, you can have your opinion without being abusive about it.

    I can buy I'm waiting on figures to back up your original claim


  • #36
    sunbeam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,814 ✭✭✭sunbeam


    kathleen37 wrote: »
    Actually, just wondering - I use subscribe and save for mainly cat food.

    How do I know where it comes from if it says its "dispatched form and sold by Amazon"?

    Thanks

    *edit*

    Right - I think I'm stuffed - just seem this on the delivery due this week

    "Tuesday, 8 December
    8:02 AM
    Package arrived at an Amazon facility
    Saint Helens, Merseyside GB
    Package has shipped
    Ridgmont, Bedfordshire UK"

    I do too. A few of my deliveries came from France and Italy during the pandemic. I'm really hoping they find a way to supply Irish subscribe and save customers from the EU.


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  • #37
    harr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,485 ✭✭✭harr


    If Ireland was such a lucrative market for Amazon like some say , surely they would have set up a .ie website and would have set warehouses in Ireland ?
    The lack of an Irish site seems to me that Amazon aren’t to worried about us


  • #38
    Smiley012
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 304 ✭✭Smiley012


    My understanding is that they are setting or have set up a warehouse in Ireland . I am curious to understand how import/customs fees and taxes are going to be dealt with from an Amazon point of view.

    If they're shipping things to Irish based warehouses, we're using .co.uk to purchase, and then we're getting the items sent to us from an Irish based warehouse, do we have to pay the customs if the item originated in UK?

    I'm probably not understanding how this works.


  • #39
    TheAnalyst_
    Registered Users Posts: 1,371 ✭✭✭TheAnalyst_


    They've already setup a .nl which is not a huge market but bigger than Ireland granted. If there is money to be made I'm sure they will eventually.


  • #40
    harr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,485 ✭✭✭harr


    Smiley012 wrote: »
    My understanding is that they are setting or have set up a warehouse in Ireland . I am curious to understand how import/customs fees and taxes are going to be dealt with from an Amazon point of view.

    If they're shipping things to Irish based warehouses, we're using .co.uk to purchase, and then we're getting the items sent to us from an Irish based warehouse, do we have to pay the customs if the item originated in UK?

    I'm probably not understanding how this works.

    I can imagine charges are going to be added to order on checkout same as delivery from Amazon US or an post will collect the fees.
    This I am hoping will be only for a matter of months till they set up proper depots in Ireland.


  • #41
    PCeeeee
    Registered Users Posts: 1,489 ✭✭✭PCeeeee


    Almost 9 million people in wealthy Switzerland and there's no .ch


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  • #42
    harmless
    Registered Users Posts: 980 ✭✭✭harmless


    That warehouse in Ireland created 20 jobs, compare that to the ones in UK the size of football stadiums. It's not just about how many people
    but also the section of goods they can hold.
    How long until they would be up to capacity to fulfill the whole country?

    I'd say the best the can do from .co.uk is to check if the item is in stock somewhere in the EU and ship direct to the Irish Warehouse/s when they increase capacity here.
    There's nothing they can do about items that are only stored in the UK or that have to pass through it, the customer will have to pay any customs charges in these cases. Expect it to have the biggest impact on 3rd party sellers.


  • #43
    Jim_Hodge
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,223 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge


    Over £20billion in sales through the UK site last year and the only figure I can see for Ireland is an estimated £60 to 80 million in 2018.

    The email today doesn't suggest any plans for major changes in Ireland other that VAT and customs charges.


  • #44
    Charles Babbage
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,897 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage


    This Amazon email has to rank as one of the most uninformative emails ever sent out to several million people.
    Since I have used delivery addresses in ROI and NI, should I expect another equally opaque email re NI?


  • #45
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Might effect sales if its becomes on a par with B&M stores. But that would happen slowly.


  • #46
    Jim_Hodge
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,223 ✭✭✭✭Jim_Hodge


    TheAnalyst_ wrote: »
    They've already setup a .nl which is not a huge market but bigger than Ireland granted. If there is money to be made I'm sure they will eventually.

    Three times our population there and can utilise fulfilment centres and warehouses throughout the EU


  • #47
    Harry Palmr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 40,061 ✭✭✭✭Harry Palmr


    harr wrote: »
    If Ireland was such a lucrative market for Amazon like some say , surely they would have set up a .ie website and would have set warehouses in Ireland ?
    The lack of an Irish site seems to me that Amazon aren’t to worried about us

    They need to create a .ie front door for browsing and purchasing so Irish buyers have an interface which is familiar. Obviously the actual "fulfilled by amazon" orders will be sent from a central complex in Germany etc.

    The wider marketplace could still work directly from seller to buyer surely?


  • #48
    Full_Circle_81
    Registered Users Posts: 520 ✭✭✭Full_Circle_81


    I'm more-so thinking of lack of free shipping, which is one of the main reasons I have my Prime sub. Or would we still get free shipping, but then have to pay tax/import on top anyway? I don't think Prime subs in any other EU storefront gives you free shipping. And I like how my Prime sub with the UK covers my Prime Video subscription too.

    Also, one of the things I buy most on Amazon UK are blu-rays. Buying them from mainland Europe is a bit hit and miss. Most have an English track sure, but you run the risk of subtitles being burned in and of course the covers etc are not going to be in English.


  • #49
    ddubs
    Registered Users Posts: 116 ✭✭ddubs


    I would expect that the vast majority or products we all purchase from the amazon.co.uk aren’t of a UK origin or manufacturer.

    You would have to expect price increases across the board for our friends across the water on importing these goods in the first place before even further taxes and charges are levied for us to reexport to IRL.


  • #50
    Poncke
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 955 ✭✭✭Poncke


    TheAnalyst_ wrote: »
    They've already setup a .nl which is not a huge market but bigger than Ireland granted. If there is money to be made I'm sure they will eventually.

    Shipped from a DE warehouse I think. Plus NL has 17 million people.


  • #51
    Apogee
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,802 ✭✭✭Apogee


    Does anyone have experience of a German-based forwarding service (e.g. like ParcelMotel)?

    I've found several items in the past which wouldn't ship from amazon.de to Ireland.


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