Cross Country Training Thread

They need better tech people. Try: https://athleticsireland.entry4sports.com/

Entry lists for Inters/Masters are out. Masters entries are hard to follow, but the o35 category looks absolutely stacked, inters looks a little light in terms of numbers:

https://www.athleticsireland.ie/downloads/other/Inter_Masters_XC_31012019.pdf

youngrun wrote: »

Hard to see how many are in the masters alright...
Intermediates awful low. Have tried to get teams together here and nothing stirring , Indoors and excuses:D the reasons......... Not sure if this competition will survive. Plus the age profile of those doing Xc seems to be rising

I would love to see 3 county championship races in Dublin: 6k, 8k & 10k - each race with 3 age grades: u23 / senior / masters, and the same at National level.

Forget the Novice/Intermediate stuff - I don't think it would add much to the hassle of scoring and would hopefully increase numbers and quality. Get a league going and bring a bit more competition into it.

I'm thinking particularly of some of the young guys who come through from juniors, run away with the Novice and then are stuck doing 10k xc.

Eoin Strutt, Cathal Doyle and Sean O'Leary have been the last three winners of the Dublin Novice - I think it would be interesting if they could still compete against each other over 6k?

Any distinction between Novice and Intermediate is completely gone in Dublin. For whatever reason, the quality and depth of the field is higher in the Novice and that's the same at national level.

Particularly for Cork & Dublin athletes, you can have a middling run in the Inters and be struck out of both Novice and Intermediate for life by scoring on the winning county team unless you get regraded. There's plenty of guys in Dublin clubs who were unlucky enough to score on a winning Dublin county team in the National Intermediates who now have basically 3 cross-country races available to them every year: Dublin Senior, Leinster Senior & National Senior. I'm sure a lot just don't bother.

Presumably, everyone wants to increase participation (outside masters, who don't need much encouragement!) and, if so, then I'm not sure the Novice/Intermediate/Senior grading helps.

Duanington wrote: »

It's unfortunate to see the numbers on the Inters dropping, can't remember the Dublin Inter numbes but it seemed healthier than Leinster or indeed how the National Inters look now.

It really does fall off a cliff after Christmas for whatever reason - while the masters continues to thrive

Think Dublin numbers were pretty okay at Intermediate this year, but maybe there's something about the 'Intermediate' name that means a lot of guys who throw their hat at the Novice think it's more of a step-up than it is. Probably not a good look that Dublin masters is going to be the biggest xc race in the country this year.

Anywhere to view the results from Dundalk online yet?

Results from yesterday:

https://www.athleticsireland.ie/downloads/results/Masters_and_Intermediate.pdf

Some great racing - men's masters was an incredibly high standard at the front and the team competition in the men's intermediate was ridiculous - NB Harriers had 4 in the top 10, Clonliffe had 4 in the top 20.

Over the intermediate, masters and novice in the last few years, the NI teams are really raising the standard for the individual and team competitions.

I thought DKIT was a perfect venue for a national race, good access, lots of parking, seemed to be no problems with the numbers, etc. First time on their course, no big hills but lots of little very sharp up and downs that slowly take their toll. Good way to end the XC Championship season!

Might as well get this rolling again...add and amend as you see fit!

October 6th | Dublin Novice Cross Country | Phoenix Park
October 12th | Teachers BHAA | Castletown Estate, Co. Kildare
October 12th | Connacht XC League 1 |
October 20th | AAI Autumn Open | National XC Course, Abbotstown
October 20th | Munster Novice | Limerick Racecourse
October 26th | Leinster Novice & Masters Cross Country | Gowran, Kilkenny.
November 3rd | Dublin Senior Cross Country | Santry
November 3rd | Connacht XC League 2 |
November 9th | Leinster Intermediate Cross Country | Ferbane, Offaly.
November 10th | Connacht XC League 3 |
November 10th | Munster Senior | Killarney, Kerry.
November 16th | Irish Life BHAA | Santry
December 1st | Dublin Intermediate | Tymon Park
December 1st | Munster Intermediate | Two-Mile Borris, Tipperary.
December 8th | BHAA 5k XC | TBC
December 15th | All Ireland Novice Cross Country | TBC
February 8th |National Intermediate & Masters | St. Annes

Never been more unfit and demotivated heading into xc. Hopefully, do Dublin Novice and Autumn Open and, once the first couple of races are out of the way, will get the head down. Would also like to do the National Senior XC for the first time, always a brilliant race to watch and Abbotstown will be properly cut-up by the end of November!

Whatever shape I'm in, I'll be doing the National Novice - it is the best race in Ireland every year. The top 10 is an absolute savage standard but there's a very wide range of ability and a huge depth. It was won last year in 19:36 but once you get past the top 20, I don't think there is more than a couple of seconds between finishers right up to the 200s. Which means even if you're finishing 10 minutes behind the winner (and many people did), there will always be a lot of people around you. And lots of flailing and moaning in the last 100m as people try to desperately to make up a few positions.

Wubble Wubble wrote: »

Nice start to the season at the Dublin Novices.

In spite of all the rain, the ground was a lot firmer than I expected. Better finishing position (and faster time) than last year, so that's a win in my book. I've never run the Abbotstown course before - I believe it's tricky enough, even without the extra rain that's forecast.

I only found out about the BHAA switching the next race to Abbottstown on Sunday, so will hopefully give that a go. Brilliant idea to switch it to there.

It's a good, solid cross-country course. Good running on a lot of it, but still tricky to pace right and there's usually potential for a mudfest on the hills around the back, although it might be okay this time of year.

I think it'll get good numbers due to the location and event.

adrian522 wrote: »

BHAA is cancelled on Saturday.

That's really disappointing, the excuse cited by Sport Ireland Campus is also a bit odd.

As of yet, we have not confirmed your booking and unfortunately, it is unlikely to go ahead for 12/10/19 as there won’t be anyone rostered in to create an event management plan and the weather conditions may affect a race that was booked in a few months ago for the 20/10/19.

Not sure how weather conditions this weekend might affect next weekend's Autumn Open??

adrian522 wrote: »

Yeah, pretty bizarre.

Agreed. Very strange and disappointing as I was really looking forward to racing on that course.

Incidentally, is the Masters race at next weekend's Autumn Open actually open to non-affiliated runners, or is the Spar Xperience the only option for those not in a club?

I needed my athletics Ireland number to register online for it

MrSkinny wrote: »

Sounds good. I'm currently mid pack at BHAA races. I expect the standard here would be higher and be further down the field but would I feel completely out of my depth?

If you're not sure, you should have a go at the Spar Xperience - if winning it would be the worst that could happen, it's worth it! I'm sure you'll get a good race anyway. And, if you're not in a club, the Spar Xperience should be a nice opportunity to have a go at the National Cross Country Course.

If you run away with the race, you'll know you can come back next year and do the Open. Alternatively, if you don't mind finishing towards the back of the race, then the Autumn Open is a great race. However, the standard would be much higher than a BHAA race (and less variance in standard than a BHAA race too).

The masters' race is a selection race for the British & Irish Masters XC International, so most of the masters are competing for a spot on those teams. The standard in the senior men's race, run at the same time, is also really high because it's one of the few chances the top guys get at xc outside the National Senior. So, while the original intention of the Autumn Open was to encourage more people to try cross-country, I'm not sure that's possible in its current format.

Here are the results from last year (click on the relevant tabs for results of individual categories) - think men's senior & master races were 7500m:

https://www.myrunresults.com/events/athletics_ireland_autumn_open_cross_country_/2794/results

Aquals wrote: »

This is disgraceful from the AAI. If they're afraid of the BHAA making the course muddy before their event the following week, they should remember that this is cross country!!

Sport Ireland'a decision not AAI. someone with an axe to grind no doubt

Aquals wrote: »

As an aside, does anyone know the venue for the National Novice Cross Country this year?

Think it was announced towards the end of October last year. Would love to see it being held in Abbottstown.

Wubble Wubble wrote: »

According to Cork Athletics, it's in Navan again....

I could be wrong but I think that's just the Cork Athletics template copying it from last year (they have the 2020 Masters XC in DKIT, same as this year).

Navan would be great though, thought that and DKIT were good national courses.

Is the national novice in December a open race?

KSU wrote: »

Leinster is actually weaker than Dublin as team events more competitive so the big clubs usually field more depth

That applies to novice inter and senior

That definitely used to be the case but the last three years at least, the Men's Novice in Leinster has been better in terms of individual depth at the top (barring the winners in Dublin who rarely turn up for Leinster). But from positions 3 to 30, Leinster looks to be a lot deeper now. A few guys who are low 15mins for 5k in the top 10s in the last few years.

Men's is also strong because no one's noticed Crusaders keep on turning up with the same team to win the team title the last 3 years!! And then other clubs like Dunboyne, Mullingar and Ratoath have stronger squads than in the past too.

I don't know if we have a team this year - haven't heard anything about it, which suits me!

Wubble Wubble wrote: »

Entries for the Novice Men 6k are here (links to other categories from there).

Ah, that seems less strong than the last couple of years then for the men.

Women's novice looks pretty strong though!

Sacksian wrote: »

That definitely used to be the case but the last three years at least, the Men's Novice in Leinster has been better in terms of individual depth at the top (barring the winners in Dublin who rarely turn up for Leinster). But from positions 3 to 30, Leinster looks to be a lot deeper now. A few guys who are low 15mins for 5k in the top 10s in the last few years.

Men's is also strong because no one's noticed Crusaders keep on turning up with the same team to win the team title the last 3 years!! And then other clubs like Dunboyne, Mullingar and Ratoath have stronger squads than in the past too.

I don't know if we have a team this year - haven't heard anything about it, which suits me!

After I got absolutely blown outa it at the leinster novice, please tell me there was a decent standard in it and it wasn't just me haha.