Should ownership of cats be banned?

zerosugarbuzz · 30-12-2020 12:24pm

kildare lad wrote: »

It's not just feral cats doing that to wildlife , domestic cats do it too. Do you not understand that if it's YOUR cat in should be on your property ??? Even if you don't have feeders they still come in . So if I enjoy feeding birds in my garden I shouldn't complain if a neighbours cats kills a few of them . I'm sorry but that kind of attitude stinks . What ever happened to having a bit of responsibility and respect for people.

Are you serious or trying to wind people up? I can’t believe that a grown man wouldn’t have more to be troubling him than cats killing birds. I hope you’re at least a vegan yourself and not consuming chickens and battery produced eggs.

daniel_t1409 · 30-12-2020 12:24pm

Overwritten by user.

beauf · 30-12-2020 12:27pm

Where is the middle ground on this then?

There's been an explosion of pets and bird feeders since the lock down. Foot paths and parks are a minefield.
Some have turned gardens into meadows (diversity of habit etc). Seems perfect for cats hunting though.

Would you happy to coincide banning bird feeders for banning free roaming cats. Or banning feeders for large birds.

Another argument, is there are a lot of birds. So cats killing them isn't making that much of a difference.
The issue perhaps might not the number of birds, but the reduction of diversity in the bird population. Which seems to be more due to other things than cats.

beauf · 30-12-2020 12:34pm

daniel_t1409 wrote: »

No. Also those figures sound like BS to me. I love having cats, always have, they're great companions. Yes, they kill birds, but it's natural instinct.

The figures are disputed. But it says a lot when a thread provides little in the way of real stats, balance, then wants to ban anyone that disagrees with them. Maybe they should make the forum invite only like the soccer forums.

There obviously is an issue with cats, mainly feral in Ireland. Some studies suggest feral cats kill twice as many birds as domestic cats. Maybe more.

So if 2/3rd of Ireland cats are feral. How does that work out. Feral cars kill 5/6 of birds killed by cats? Someone better at math's might work it out. They say tall buildings and traffic kills a lot also. Much more than wind farms etc.

An Ri rua · 30-12-2020 12:35pm

Stihl waters wrote: »

I meant there's only 9 zeros in a billion :pac:

Yes and 1.3 is usually represented onscreen as 1.3, not 4....

Op, ban car ownership? ? How could you do that under current law when no one legally owns a cat under Irish law? Unlike a dog which is prescribed under law and therefore for whose actions the owner is responsible. Not so with the furry lads.
And as another poster pointed out, what about ferals?
Ive spent a lot of time with my 2 Tom's since lockdown and, while they worry and stalk the birds right now, it's only in Spring/early Summer that they might wreak havoc. Now it's mice. Almost daily.
Should we also ban various birds for when they decimate mayfly and insect populations? Eg sparrows gorging on flying ants. Appalling behaviour.
Lastly, do the Scots exterminate the Scottish Wildcat? That little b*stard clearly does lots of killing and in such a pristine environment?! Dirty little thug animal.
Down with the sparrowhawks and birds of prey too. We don't need their sort hovering over our gardens.

Edit: I confess to being an animal lover, wildlife lover, flora and fauna lover and oh, a longtime vegan. Every morning I feed my cat companions and the birds. The 2 lads stalk, no doubt, but I've only seen 2 dead birds in 18 months. Likely 100 dead mice and shrews in that time.
Certainly in an urban environment, cats could be problematic. Just as with people hard surfacing their gardens for parking, as an earlier poster noted, we have scant disregard (mostly ignorance of) our fellow creatures' needs). Cats need up to 500m radius territory. That's likely the problem. Yes, you can keep them in a house, just like a bird in a cage, but that is not ideal for them.
I get the Op's frustration. I spent a day trying to rehabilitate a house Martin who fell early when the nest fell apart. And I shed tears as I held the little perfect chap, dead. But I wouldn't go hard on another species over death. The solution is distraction /deflection not conflict. Trust me, conflict, particularly with cats, is a fool's errand.

zerosugarbuzz · 30-12-2020 12:42pm

beauf wrote: »

The figures are disputed. But it says a lot when a thread provides little in the way of real stats, balance, then wants to ban anyone that disagrees with them. Maybe they should make the forum invite only like the soccer forums.

There obviously is an issue with cats, mainly feral in Ireland. Some studies suggest feral cats kill twice as many birds as domestic cats. Maybe more.

So if 2/3rd of Ireland cats are feral. How does that work out. Feral cars kill 5/6 of birds killed by cats? Someone better at math's might work it out. They say tall buildings and traffic kills a lot also. Much more than wind farms etc.

Of course feral cats kill more birds, they have to eat and have no home that provides them with food. The will also kill more rodents and probably have much shorter lives than domestic cats due to lack of care and attention.

tjhook · 30-12-2020 1:20pm

The ideal solution might be to have the facility to capture roaming cats and bring them to a pound, where there's a cost for their release. But realistically, there won't be anything like that put in place.

Home owners will just be expected to put up with local cats crapping and killing in their property.

However, those selfish owners shouldn't be surprised if Fluffy "runs away".

touts · 30-12-2020 2:21pm

Ok. Job done. Put down chilli powder as some one suggested. Also got some really sharp needle like cuttings from a bush at a relatives house. Just handling them left my hands sore even with gloves. A few of those stuck in the cat will make it piss off. Scattered the cuttings of that around the bed and two of the routes I think the cat uses to get into my garden. Finally if it persists and gets into the beds I've set 3 mouse traps. Not the rat trap sort that will decapitate the cat. Just enough to make it know all about it if it steps on one. If that doesn't work then I'll upgrade to the rat trap and make the creature "disappear".

magicbastarder · 30-12-2020 2:28pm

An Ri rua wrote: »

Should we also ban various birds for when they decimate mayfly and insect populations? Eg sparrows gorging on flying ants. Appalling behaviour.

i give up.

beauf · 30-12-2020 2:48pm

I'm curious if the water scarecrow work.

AndrewJRenko · 30-12-2020 6:05pm

touts wrote: »

There is a neighbours cat who keeps ****ting in my veg garden. I've seen it do it and chased it off. I've said it to the neighbour who doesn't give a damn. Have tried netting, scent, ultrasonic etc. Bastard cat ignores it all. Every time I dig in the garden it's full of cat **** so I am very worried about the parasites in the vegetables. Very close to setting a few rat traps around my veg patch and letting it go back to the neighbour with a leg missing. I know that sounds awful but it's at the point where I see the neighbour not caring about the parasites my children could be picking up from his cat. Children vs cat. Well sorry but the cat loses that debate every time.

Have you any plans for stopping the rats, squirrels, foxes and other animals that are also crapping in your garden getting their parasites onto your vegtables?

Eddie B · 30-12-2020 6:27pm

tjhook wrote: »

The ideal solution might be to have the facility to capture roaming cats and bring them to a pound, where there's a cost for their release. But realistically, there won't be anything like that put in place.

Home owners will just be expected to put up with local cats crapping and killing in their property.

However, those selfish owners shouldn't be surprised if Fluffy "runs away".

O.k, firstly I think using something that might injure the cat is a no no. It is unnecessary, and may get you in big trouble. There are lots of options out there that you can try. How about one or two of those little water jets which you attach to a garden hose, that spreys water at the cat as it passes by? Laying cucumber around is meant to deter cats, but not sure how well they work. Another idea, is too use a live catch trap, and hand it into shelter. As far as your concerned, its a stray.

Eddie B · 30-12-2020 6:31pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Have you any plans for stopping the rats, squirrels, foxes and other animals that are also crapping in your garden getting their parasites onto your vegtables?

Well I presume nobody likes the idea of faeces in their salad.

AndrewJRenko · 30-12-2020 6:37pm

Eddie B wrote: »

Well I presume nobody likes the idea of faeces in their salad.

Which is probably why people generally wash all vegetables, even shop-bought vegetables before cooking. It's not really a great reason for turning your back garden into a scene from Vietnam, knowing that it really won't solve the problem anyway.

magicbastarder · 30-12-2020 6:46pm

Not sure what a fox can pass onto humans, but toxoplasmosis is something cats can pass on.

AndrewJRenko · 30-12-2020 6:59pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

Not sure what a fox can pass onto humans, but toxoplasmosis is something cats can pass on.

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/toxocariasis/

From http://www.foxolutions.co.uk/index.php?main_page=fox_problems

Toxocariasis
Weil’s disease (Leptospirosis)
Hydatid disease
Sarcoptic Mange
Fleas and ticks

tjhook · 30-12-2020 7:07pm

Eddie B wrote: »

There are lots of options out there that you can try. How about one or two of those little water jets which you attach to a garden hose, that spreys water at the cat as it passes by? Laying cucumber around is meant to deter cats, but not sure how well they work.

Is there anything to be said for saying another mass?

The other option you mentioned - (trapping and handing into a shelter) sounds fine, but I wouldn't think the staff there would be too interested in accepting regular deposits.

Eddie B · 30-12-2020 7:13pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Which is probably why people generally wash all vegetables, even shop-bought vegetables before cooking. It's not really a great reason for turning your back garden into a scene from Vietnam, knowing that it really won't solve the problem anyway.

Yes but if you went to the shop to buy some lettuce, and it smelt of cat p**s, or was smeared with faeces, you'd probably not buy it.

touts · 30-12-2020 7:17pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Which is probably why people generally wash all vegetables, even shop-bought vegetables before cooking. It's not really a great reason for turning your back garden into a scene from Vietnam, knowing that it really won't solve the problem anyway.

One dead cat is hardly a scene from Vietnam. Get real.

touts · 30-12-2020 7:19pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Have you any plans for stopping the rats, squirrels, foxes and other animals that are also crapping in your garden getting their parasites onto your vegtables?

A local farmers shoots foxes. I use rat poison in my shed.

beauf · 30-12-2020 7:22pm

touts wrote: »

A local farmers shoots foxes. I use rat poison in my shed.

Really need a sentry gun from aliens.

https://youtu.be/HQDy-5IQvuU

AutoTuning · 30-12-2020 8:33pm

Just get a dog or a very territorial tom cat and you'll have no issues with other cats.

beauf · 30-12-2020 8:36pm

AutoTuning wrote: »

Just get a dog or a very territorial tom cat and you'll have no issues with other cats.

You mean like Catzilla

https://youtu.be/S7kDs15jaQ0

beauf · 30-12-2020 8:37pm

AutoTuning wrote: »

Just get a dog or a very territorial tom cat and you'll have no issues with other cats.

You mean like Catzilla

https://youtu.be/S7kDs15jaQ0

AutoTuning · 30-12-2020 8:41pm

Well, cats in general are quite territorial and don't really like other cats wandering in very much. So, you'll typically have a very mono-cat garden if you've a cat.

I think though the main point is that you should try to avoid encouraging birds into dangerous or exposed situations like food on bird tables and maybe try to create habitat for insects, plant some edible, bird-friendly plants and so oninstead so they can feed naturally and safely.

My view of it is that domestic cats and humanity are very much part of the same package. Where there are humans you're going to have cats and where there are humans you're also going to have large numbers of rodents, odd changes to environment, availability of food that distorts species diversity, noise, pollution etc etc.

And, as pointed out above, you will have similar issues with contaminated soils from foxes and other animals, which is why you should always protect and wash vegetables anyway.

If you do own cats, the most important things are ensuring they're wormed, kept flea free which is extremely easy these days with drop-on products via the vet and also ensuring they're well fed. Most house cats tend to be extremely lazy and won't go out of their way to do much. My experience of them is they largely go after small rodents when they do go after anything and they do seem to worry rats which is no bad thing.

Feral cats are another issue entirely, as they are obviously eating wildlife to survive.

OpenYourEyes · 30-12-2020 8:51pm

Mod Note: Thread locked - a lot of reported comments, to be reviewed, at which point the thread may be reopened or may be deemed to have run its course.

Should ownership of cats be banned?

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