White Males Need Not Apply - British Police Ad

Ninthlife · 20-01-2019 11:22pm

Yer Da sells Avon wrote: »

If there was a shortage of white people or men in the police force, it would be equally sensible to make an effort to encourage them to join.

Jobs in the Police and other front line services arent generally careers people just fall into. Its a desire from a young age usually.

An ad showing a Sikh isnt really going to reach out to a Sikh to apply unless that person has had a desire to pursue a career in this case Transport Police.

This particular campaign just seems badly done and implying its only those of a particular minority or gender need apply.

Why cant they just say all genders, races and sexual orientations apply as we are an equal opportunities employer?

Citizen2011 · 20-01-2019 11:29pm

Airyfairy12 wrote: »

I dont see the problem with it, if the majority of their employees are white men then surely that creates a bias. The add is not suggesting that they dont want white men in the police force, theyre encouraging different types of people to join. Surely that's a positive thing?

I thought minorities were integrating seamlessly as we are continually told. You’ll have muslims insisting they only want to be dealt with by a Muslim policeman and so on. Utter ZpC typical British rubbish. It’s gone last point of no return.

AlphabetCards · 20-01-2019 11:30pm

Yer Da sells Avon wrote: »

They probably have no shortage of white males applying, and are simply attempting to encourage a larger number of people who aren't white and male to apply. I don't understand why people would have a problem with that.

Wrong wrong wrong.

This is an advert for a workshop. Not just another pointless media effort by the Met or BTP, this one actually advertises for a 'recruitment workshop', that is only open to females or BAME applicants. If you click on the link you will see this.

May I highlight something also - I've been through the recruitment process for the Police over here in the UK. It's bloody fair (even if it is a bit easy) and at no stage does it have any stage that needs to take race into account. There is not a single stage of the process that relies on the applicants previous knowledge - we all got the advance copies of the material we were to be quizzed on months in advance, and there are tons of websites available which provide other opportunities to research.

So this is a discriminatory practice. If female or BAME applicants are not applying then by all means, target them in advertising. Running workshops which prepare candidates for recruitment panels that only allow certain races, sexes or religions is discrimination. Plain and simple. People are entitled to complain about that.

No mention of skin colour, they require people from different ethnic backgrounds, and yes, for police safety and cooperation I'd imagine its very necessary. Otherwise they wouldn't do it. Try telling a few london yardies to get a grip and deal with a white policeman.

Utter tosh. It does mention colour - the B in BAME for example. It's on the BTP website that is linked to the advertisement. If yardies are not willing to listen to a police officer because of their skin colour, then they are the racists in the situation.

harry Bailey esq · 20-01-2019 11:44pm

splashuum wrote: »

An interesting job posting from the British police. I can see why this went viral.

https://www.facebook.com/britishtransportpolice/photos/a.323104971171991/1244843678998111/?type=3

What ever happened to hiring the best person for the job? :rolleyes:

Not very PC now that. And what about WPCs? The ones who prefer to shave rather than wax are known as cúnstubbles....

lbc2019 · 20-01-2019 11:47pm

AlphabetCards wrote: »

Wrong wrong wrong.

This is an advert for a workshop. Not just another pointless media effort by the Met or BTP, this one actually advertises for a 'recruitment workshop', that is only open to females or BAME applicants. If you click on the link you will see this.

May I highlight something also - I've been through the recruitment process for the Police over here in the UK. It's bloody fair (even if it is a bit easy) and at no stage does it have any stage that needs to take race into account. There is not a single stage of the process that relies on the applicants previous knowledge - we all got the advance copies of the material we were to be quizzed on months in advance, and there are tons of websites available which provide other opportunities to research.

So this is a discriminatory practice. If female or BAME applicants are not applying then by all means, target them in advertising. Running workshops which prepare candidates for recruitment panels that only allow certain races, sexes or religions is discrimination. Plain and simple. People are entitled to complain about that.

Utter tosh. It does mention colour - the B in BAME for example. It's on the BTP website that is linked to the advertisement. If yardies are not willing to listen to a police officer because of their skin colour, then they are the racists in the situation.

And lets ignore where the MET were found to be institutionally racist following the botched Stephen Lawrence investigation...

Augme · 20-01-2019 11:59pm

Folkstonian wrote: »

I expect so. They can scream it from the rooftops for all I care.

My whole point is that while there may be good intentions behind these positive discrimination exercises from services that genuinely want to make use of all available talent and experience in a country regardless of race, they are doomed to failure with these counter productive ad campaigns that are going to achieve nothing except alienate large numbers of people in their traditional recruitment bases

I wouldn't want anyone who feels alienated by the above ad to be in the police force.

wingsof daun · 21-01-2019 12:06am

punisher5112 wrote: »

There would be riots if it were the other way around to be honest so I have an issue with it.

Yes. If that happened it would just be more proof that the white natives have long ago lost control of their countries. European countries like ours are run, controlled by banks, corporations and mass media. The media runs the narrative and those who give their own opinions are shot down by the weight of numbers who are led by the media. It is a groupthink that is dangerous to democracy and more resembles something from Soviet Russia. White natives are never portrayed in a positive light, or even the narrative is blatantly anti-white.

Yer Da sells Avon · 21-01-2019 12:06am

AlphabetCards wrote: »

Wrong wrong wrong.

This is an advert for a workshop. Not just another pointless media effort by the Met or BTP, this one actually advertises for a 'recruitment workshop', that is only open to females or BAME applicants. If you click on the link you will see this.

May I highlight something also - I've been through the recruitment process for the Police over here in the UK. It's bloody fair (even if it is a bit easy) and at no stage does it have any stage that needs to take race into account. There is not a single stage of the process that relies on the applicants previous knowledge - we all got the advance copies of the material we were to be quizzed on months in advance, and there are tons of websites available which provide other opportunities to research.

So this is a discriminatory practice. If female or BAME applicants are not applying then by all means, target them in advertising. Running workshops which prepare candidates for recruitment panels that only allow certain races, sexes or religions is discrimination. Plain and simple. People are entitled to complain about that.

I'm afraid it's you who's wrong, not me.

It's primarily an opportunity for members of underrepresented groups to meet serving police officers and ask questions about the job. The whole point of it is to make people who might not feel that they 'belong' in the job comfortable enough to apply. They explain it here.

jackofalltrades · 21-01-2019 12:31am

Yer Da sells Avon wrote: »

I'm afraid it's you who's wrong, not me.

It's primarily an opportunity for members of underrepresented groups to meet serving police officers and ask questions about the job.
The whole point of it is to make people who might not feel that they 'belong' in the job comfortable enough to apply. They explain it here.

From the BTP's website.

What does the workshop consist of?

Most importantly, the workshop is a chance to meet operational Police Officers and ask questions about the reality of becoming a PC

The workshop will give you an overall understanding of the recruitment process
You will understand what is required in your application form and how best to prepare for the assessment centre
Ultimately, the workshop will alleviate any concerns about going through the recruitment process and becoming a Police Officer

Encouraging people from diverse backgrounds to apply is fine.
Giving them an unfair advantage isn't.

21-01-2019 12:38am

As long as they don't incorporate all this inclusive bullshít into allocating places in Eton, Harrow, Cantab, Oxon, corporate law, high finance and the like and just keep these ethnic and minority quotas to jobs affecting the native peasantry, the capitalist system is safe, old bean!

Oh, and don't forget: the EU/foreigners, and not the native English free market fundamentalists, is to blame for the native English lower classes having their economic position undermined like this!

woddensanta · 21-01-2019 2:08am

This is FINE! I am sure there are workshops and positive discrimination to get more males into female dominated industries like social care and teaching! Isn't there?

Junkyard Tom · 21-01-2019 2:28am

I don't think it's an unreasonable aspiration that public service jobs actually reflect the public they're purporting to serve.

inforfun · 21-01-2019 10:23am

I am not on facebook and every time i open a facebook link at work, this happens.

Sonics2k · 21-01-2019 10:29am

inforfun wrote: »

I am not on facebook and every time i open a facebook link at work, this happens.

You need to click the little Globe icon at the bottom, around the chat boxes. Looks like either you, or someone else, set it to Arabic.

AndrewJRenko · 21-01-2019 11:03am

woddensanta wrote: »

This is FINE! I am sure there are workshops and positive discrimination to get more males into female dominated industries like social care and teaching! Isn't there?

Like these initiatives?

https://www.dundee.ac.uk/news/2018/report-explores-ways-of-encouraging-men-into-nursing.php

http://www.malesinteaching.com/About_Us.aspx

inforfun · 21-01-2019 1:55pm

Sonics2k wrote: »

You need to click the little Globe icon at the bottom, around the chat boxes. Looks like either you, or someone else, set it to Arabic.

Cant be arsed with that site. Only there if there is a clip posted somewhere but it always does this at work.

Have changed it in the past 1 or 2 but always comes back in arabic.

GAA Beo · 21-01-2019 2:46pm

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

I don't think it's an unreasonable aspiration that public service jobs actually reflect the public they're purporting to serve.

What about the large Eastern European population in London? Not oppressed enough?

4068ac1elhodqr · 21-01-2019 2:53pm

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

I don't think it's an unreasonable aspiration that public service jobs actually reflect the public they're purporting to serve.

Agree, some specific minorities/religions are upto 'three times more likely' to commit crimes than a regular a regular Jim, John, Jane or Joe.

chrissb8 · 21-01-2019 4:46pm

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

Bit like your office or suburb then?

Why would a white woman or Chinese man (etc etc etc) be any better at policing a black area than a white man? Or should we police every ethnic group with its own police force.

Because there is a massive distrust of police in general. From brutality, corruption and massively, lack of understandment of communities they are dealing with.

There are plenty of reasons to get people from areas working as policemen in similar areas. As a popular example black people have great reason to distrust the police. I don't think I have to flesh that out anymore.

Making the police force more relatable by having just a few police officers of the same community or background operating in the areas in which they're affiliated is not a bad thing. It's just common sense.

By no means does it mean that if you're Chinese you have to work within the Chinese community but you'd have to be remiss to think it wouldn't have a positive effect If you had someone speaking the language and understands the norms better. Also in the process helping their partners/fellow police officers understand different communities/cultures through working side by side.

And I mean why not as well if it means that you are presenting one of the most important pillars of our society as being for everyone and acessible for all communities.

AllForIt · 21-01-2019 5:02pm

I don't get what's stopping anyone of any minority race from applying for the job so I don't see the logic of saying whites can't apply. It's not like if whites apply that stops any other minority racial demographic from applying. If the police force wish to adhere to quotas they they can just do that no matter who applies. It's absurd to think that a racial minority would be more inclined to apply because of this advert if they really wanted the bloody job in the first place. Unless they feel they may be less likely to work with white colleagues which is a pretty racist position to take.

AndrewJRenko · 21-01-2019 5:48pm

AllForIt wrote: »

I don't get what's stopping anyone of any minority race from applying for the job so I don't see the logic of saying whites can't apply. It's not like if whites apply that stops any other minority racial demographic from applying. If the police force wish to adhere to quotas they they can just do that no matter who applies. It's absurd to think that a racial minority would be more inclined to apply because of this advert if they really wanted the bloody job in the first place. Unless they feel they may be less likely to work with white colleagues which is a pretty racist position to take.

There may be 'nothing stopping' them from applying, but that doesn't change the reality that, in general, minority groups are not applying to join the police.

So if a little outreach programme like this gets a few such people to apply and hopefully qualify to join, isn't that a positive development?

AlphabetCards · 24-01-2019 1:00am

Andrew, just how can you justify a workshop for potential applicants thats excludes a group or race? There is no justification for it.

animaal · 24-01-2019 1:37pm

I think there are a number of separate issues being conflated here.

Targeted advertising to inform diverse populations that they're welcome to apply for a public role - I think that's ok.

Structuring the appointment process to give an advantage or disadvantage to some candidates based on the colour of their skin, or their genitalia - not on.

To be fair, the advertisement being discussed strays slightly into the latter in offering a workshop to minorities only. But I can't imagine them kicking a white guy out if he turned up? Or I suppose it's not too different from me popping across the road for some hints from my neighbour "Dave" who happens to be a policeman. The likelihood of having such a neighbour probably does depend on the community where where you live.

I do think it's very different to the BBC ad that somebody posted to this thread. That ad was a disgrace. I can't understand how it's legal at all.

eagle eye · 24-01-2019 1:46pm

AndrewJRenko wrote:

There may be 'nothing stopping' them from applying, but that doesn't change the reality that, in general, minority groups are not applying to join the police.

So if a little outreach programme like this gets a few such people to apply and hopefully qualify to join, isn't that a positive development?

No. You don't want to be picking up people just because of their skin colour if they are not going to be as good at the job as the white people who might apply to an open competition.
It should always be open to everyone and those deemed best get the job. There is nothing racist about that.

Chris_Heilong · 24-01-2019 2:06pm

lbc2019 wrote: »

Getting worked up about recruitment in a different country- do ye seek out shít to be offended by now?

People get worked up about injustice and unfairness no matter where it happens, It is annoying that some organisations lack common sense. In regards to the "we just want a diverse...whatever" this should not even be a thing, They are all British and should not be slicing up the cake IMO.

lbc2019 · 24-01-2019 2:13pm

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

lbc2019 wrote: »

Getting worked up about recruitment in a different country- do ye seek out shít to be offended by now?

People get worked up about injustice and unfairness no matter where it happens, It is annoying that some organisations lack common sense. In regards to the "we just want a diverse...whatever" this should not even be a thing, They are all British and should not be slicing up the cake IMO.

But there was no injustice- a misunderstanding and a rampage more like

Odhinn · 24-01-2019 5:35pm

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

People get worked up about injustice and unfairness no matter where it happens, It is annoying that some organisations lack common sense. In regards to the "we just want a diverse...whatever" this should not even be a thing, They are all British and should not be slicing up the cake IMO.

True, however there's a historic shortfall that needs to be addressed, hence the need for a 'more diverse' force.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 24-01-2019 5:50pm

Odhinn wrote: »

True, however there's a historic shortfall that needs to be addressed, hence the need for a 'more diverse' force.

I’m generally a meritocrat but I once read an article about a study that showed that job applicants with Middle Eastern- or African-sounding names are a good bit less likely to be called for interview, even with comparable qualifications and experience than the people invited to interview. Or just comparable qualifications in the case of new graduates.

It’s a long time since I read the article so I don’t know where to find the study but if there is some truth to it, it means that some people are being held back despite having the credentials. They are not even getting a chance to demonstrate whether or not they have the aptitude for the job. We don’t really operate in a true system of meritocracy if that’s the case.

It’s food for thought anyway.

Huntergonzo · 24-01-2019 6:02pm

Sure white males will have to apply in the end, someone has to fill the slots and they're the only ones who actually want to work :-)

El_Bee · 24-01-2019 6:22pm

How many of the people complaining about this actually want to be police officers?

lbc2019 · 24-01-2019 6:46pm

https://twitter.com/wazaux/status/1088127629939671042?s=21

eagle eye · 24-01-2019 9:16pm

El_Bee wrote:

How many of the people complaining about this actually want to be police officers?

What has that got to do with anything?

AndrewJRenko · 25-01-2019 11:23pm

AlphabetCards wrote: »

Andrew, just how can you justify a workshop for potential applicants thats excludes a group or race? There is no justification for it.

They have a problem with recruitment, in that black and Asian people aren't applying in significant numbers. So they're running a workshop to increase those numbers. Everybody can still apply for the posts, and the recruitment process will people the best applicants.

eagle eye wrote: »

No. You don't want to be picking up people just because of their skin colour if they are not going to be as good at the job as the white people who might apply to an open competition.
It should always be open to everyone and those deemed best get the job. There is nothing racist about that.

They're not picking people because of their skin colour. They're getting more applications from some groups that haven't traditionally taken part in recruitment, then they will pick the best candidates, regardless of skin colour.

TheValeyard · 23-02-2019 5:02pm

Well turns out white males are discriminated against for police jobs.

https://news.sky.com/story/cheshire-police-man-rejected-for-job-for-being-white-and-straight-tribunal-finds-11645525

"A man was denied his dream job in the police "simply because he was a white, heterosexual male", his lawyers said after Cheshire Police was found guilty of discrimination."

dxhound2005 · 23-02-2019 5:16pm

It could take 100 years for the Met Police to reflect the population of London.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/02/19/could-take-100-years-make-met-police-representative-london-force/

Only 14 per cent of police officers in the capital are from BAME (black and ethnic minority) communities, compared to 43 per cent of the London population.

White Males Need Not Apply - British Police Ad

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