Trevor Deely case - new witness

tdf7187 · 05-12-2019 9:48am #1

There was a previous lengthy thread on the case but it was locked for review and has yet to be reopened.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/new-witness-backs-up-gardas-theory-that-deely-killed-in-row-with-gang-38755889.html

Raconteuse · 05-12-2019 10:00am

It was actually deleted. At the request of Trevor's family I believe. People acting the gobshyte means not being able to have a grown up discussion.

Anyway, glad to read that there has been a development.

Beechwoodspark · 05-12-2019 10:02am

Bit strange this is reported all of a sudden coinciding around the time of year of his disappearance.

I’d be cautious on this.

Brock Turnpike · 05-12-2019 10:04am

"Dysfunctional crime family"

Any ideas?

TwoMonthsOff · 05-12-2019 10:06am

"Highly significant" like the searches they done in Chapelizod a year or two back?

Berserker5 · 05-12-2019 10:06am

'Sex not disclosed' means a female anyhow

0gac3yjefb5sv7 · 05-12-2019 10:07am

Anyone have the full article?

TwoMonthsOff · 05-12-2019 10:11am

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/trevor-deely-missing-man-dublin-20997593.amp

19 years this Sunday since he went missing.

tdf7187 · 05-12-2019 10:11am

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Bit strange this is reported all of a sudden coinciding around the time of year of his disappearance.

I’d be cautious on this.

True but personally I don't discount what the new witness is saying as the Lr Baggot Street area late at night was quite dodgy back then. The Spar used to be 24 hour or close to it and you'd get strange characters hanging around.

Beechwoodspark · 05-12-2019 10:18am

tdf7187 wrote: »

True but personally I don't discount what the new witness is saying as the Lr Baggot Street area late at night was quite dodgy back then. The Spar used to be 24 hour or close to it and you'd get strange characters hanging around.

Do you mean the spar that is still on the go there?

Not a native to dublin but would’ve thought that part of baggot st was fairly upmarket. Maybe different back then?

tdf7187 · 05-12-2019 10:25am

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Do you mean the spar that is still on the go there?

Not a native to dublin but would’ve thought that part of baggot st was fairly upmarket. Maybe different back then?

Yes, that Spar used to be open much later. I don't know if it was 24 hour but I remember it being open very late, after even the nightclubs had closed.

Baggot Street was and is upmarket, but as I say late at night it had a dodgy vibe. I remember going into the Abrekebabra that used to be there a few doors from the Spar with a mate after a night of boozing some time around 1996 or 1997 and there were four prostitutes in there shooting the breeze. They were not the type of prostitute that you'd take home to your mother, put it that way.

Beechwoodspark · 05-12-2019 10:30am

Yeh one thing about this incident is it happened very late night/early hours of morning - 3-4 am time of a wet and windy Friday night. Taxi strike was ongoing.

Beechwoodspark · 05-12-2019 10:33am

tdf7187 wrote: »

Yes, that Spar used to be open much later. I don't know if it was 24 hour but I remember it being open very late, after even the nightclubs had closed.

Baggot Street was and is upmarket, but as I say late at night it had a dodgy vibe. I remember going into the Abrekebabra that used to be there a few doors from the Spar with a mate after a night of boozing some time around 1996 or 1997 and there were four prostitutes in there shooting the breeze. They were not the type of prostitute that you'd take home to your mother, put it that way.

A red light district at night?

Dodge · 05-12-2019 10:34am

tdf7187 wrote: »

They were not the type of prostitute that you'd take home to your mother, put it that way.

What type of hookers do you normally bring home to you mother?

Stevieluvsye · 05-12-2019 10:37am

Berserker5 wrote: »

They'd likely have information if it was him, wasn't a BIL a witness in the case

My understanding is they have the info but lack of evidence.

Berserker5 · 05-12-2019 10:39am

Stevieluvsye wrote: »

My understanding is they have the info but lack of evidence.

Ya he's in jail

Same fella wouldn't think considering the circumstances of that girls abduction murder and disposal

Stevieluvsye · 05-12-2019 10:42am

Berserker5 wrote: »

Ya he's in jail

Same fella wouldn't think considering the circumstances of that girls abduction murder and disposal

I can't recall the exact info but i do recall another lad up for murder gave his name as who did it and apparently we was living not a hundred miles from where TD was last seen.

tdf7187 · 05-12-2019 10:43am

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

A red light district at night?

Oh yes, absolutely. I worked in an office on Waterloo Road in the 1990s and it was by no means unusual to see prostitutes on the street, not even particularly late, sometimes as early as six or seven in the evening. Waterloo Road/Burlington Road/Fitzwilliam Square was a red light district at night back then. I know it seems odd given it is as you say a posh area but that's what it was like.

Even as recently as 2014 still was if this article is correct:

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/midnight-on-baggot-street-every-girl-in-the-sex-trade-has-a-story-but-men-never-ask-30567428.html

TwoMonthsOff · 05-12-2019 10:43am

Down around the maxol garage on mespil road there was always dodgy people hanging around.

Boggles · 05-12-2019 10:44am

TwoMonthsOff wrote: »

Down around the maxol garage on mespil road there was always dodgy people hanging around.

You should go to the guards with that info.

TwoMonthsOff · 05-12-2019 10:46am

Boggles wrote: »

You should go to the guards with that info.

Why would you assume they wouldnt know that?

farmchoice · 05-12-2019 10:49am

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

A red light district at night?

ya i lived in and around there in 98/99 and it was dodgy as hell at night. along the canal was a red light district and the late night shops always had an eclectic mix of pros, pimps, dealers, junkies,, doormen, taxi drivers etc hanging around them, i know because i worked in one.
a prostitute was murdered between Baggot st bridge and Mount st bridge in the summer of 98.

you were liable to run in to some dodgy dodgy types anywhere along the canal from mount St bridge to Rathmines back then and not just drunks or gougers, proper dangerous men, the only thing was they rarely bothered the average Joe soap if he/she wasn't bothering them or their business, but it certainty would not have taken much to have pissed one of them off, like happening to look at them the wrong way.

TwoMonthsOff · 05-12-2019 10:54am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcYxruBEmFE

tdf7187 · 05-12-2019 10:56am

farmchoice wrote: »

ya i lived in and around there in 98/99 and it was dodgy as hell at night. along the canal was a red light district and the late night shops always had an eclectic mix of pros, pimps, dealers, junkies,, doormen, taxi drivers etc hanging around them, i know because i worked in one.
a prostitute was murdered between Baggot st bridge and Mount st bridge in the summer of 98.

you were liable to run in to some dodgy dodgy types anywhere along the canal from mount St bridge to Rathmines back then and not just drunks or gougers, proper dangerous men, the only thing was they rarely bothered the average Joe soap if he/she wasn't bothering them or their business, but it certainty would not have taken much to have pissed one of them off, like happening to look at them the wrong way.

Indeed. I never personally had any trouble but was certainly asked 'lookin for business love?' on plenty of occasions. Now that I think of it the mate I was on the session with that time we rounded the night off with kebabs was mugged on his way home from work another time.

begbysback · 05-12-2019 11:00am

tdf7187 wrote: »

Yes, that Spar used to be open much later. I don't know if it was 24 hour but I remember it being open very late, after even the nightclubs had closed.

Baggot Street was and is upmarket, but as I say late at night it had a dodgy vibe. I remember going into the Abrekebabra that used to be there a few doors from the Spar with a mate after a night of boozing some time around 1996 or 1997 and there were four prostitutes in there shooting the breeze. They were not the type of prostitute that you'd take home to your mother, put it that way.

There’s a type of prostitute you would take home to your mother?

TwoMonthsOff · 05-12-2019 11:02am

begbysback wrote: »

There’s a type of prostitute you would take home to your mother?

Maybe the non junkie type, but you wont find any of them around that area.

begbysback · 05-12-2019 11:06am

TwoMonthsOff wrote: »

Maybe the non junkie type, but you wont find any of them around that area.

And how would the introduction go? Mam meet sugar lips, sugar lips this is my mam - we’ll be upstairs for 30 mins mam, can’t afford any longer.

Raconteuse · 05-12-2019 11:14am

At the time also, the "westies" were in the news a bit. The area had such a buoyant "night time economy" due to senior bankers seeking out coke and hookers I suppose?

Stevieluvsye · 05-12-2019 11:17am

Raconteuse wrote: »

At the time also, the "westies" were in the news a bit. The area had such a buoyant "night time economy" due to bankers seeking out coke and hookers I suppose?

They were Blanch

Raconteuse · 05-12-2019 11:18am

Stevieluvsye wrote: »

They were Blanch

Oh right, thought they were Crumlin/Walkinstown.

sligojoek · 05-12-2019 11:18am

Dodge wrote: »

What type of hookers do you normally bring home to you mother?

Male ones.

Stevieluvsye · 05-12-2019 11:19am

Raconteuse wrote: »

Oh right, thought they were Crumlin/Walkinstown.

That's why they were called The Westies

Beechwoodspark · 05-12-2019 11:28am

tdf7187 wrote: »

Indeed. I never personally had any trouble but was certainly asked 'lookin for business love?' on plenty of occasions. Now that I think of it the mate I was on the session with that time we rounded the night off with kebabs was mugged on his way home from work another time.

Ok. Interesting. I didn’t realise that area was like that then.

Would they and their minders have been “at work” on a wet windy night in early December at 3/4am?

seamus · 05-12-2019 11:35am

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Bit strange this is reported all of a sudden coinciding around the time of year of his disappearance.

I’d be cautious on this.

Journalists go fishing for information around this time of year before they write a short piece about the anniversary of Trevor's disappearance.

The Gardai probably aren't going to journalists with every new piece of evidence; that is, they may have been working on this lead for the last six months.

That said, anniversaries also tend to focus the mind. Someone who knows something might be able to push it to the back of their mind for the rest of the year, but the anniversary brings it back, and sometimes people just crack and come forward.

I'd be amazed if anything definite ever comes of this, especially a conviction, but I would really hope for the Deely family that they can at least know what happened.

farmchoice · 05-12-2019 11:36am

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Ok. Interesting. I didn’t realise that area was like that then.

Would they and their minders have been “at work” on a wet windy night in early December at 3/4am?

by and large they were bad cases, junkies and the like so there were always a few around even that late but sure enough there would not have been many left at that time.

but it was more then the prostitutes. i used to walk from mount st to baggot st very regularly at night(along the canal) and often enough i would have cause to walk as far as rathmines and you would meet some strange characters just hanging around mooching behind trees etc.

now having said that i never had any hassle but there was always menace in the air around there late at night back then.
mind you that could have been said for a lot of the city then compared to now.

jay1988 · 05-12-2019 11:37am

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Ok. Interesting. I didn’t realise that area was like that then.

Would they and their minders have been “at work” on a wet windy night in early December at 3/4am?

Xmas party season in full swing, most definitely.

I worked around the area for a few years up until 2016, it was still like that at night then. Really weird vibe off the place after 11 o'clock or so.

Raconteuse · 05-12-2019 11:40am

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Ok. Interesting. I didn’t realise that area was like that then.

Would they and their minders have been “at work” on a wet windy night in early December at 3/4am?

Well consider the time of year and all the corporate parties. I think they were in the late bar Trevor was attending, and that the poor guy inadvertently said/did/heard/saw something that they didn't like, so he was followed later on.

EmmetSpiceland · 05-12-2019 11:51am

seamus wrote: »

That said, anniversaries also tend to focus the mind. Someone who knows something might be able to push it to the back of their mind for the rest of the year, but the anniversary brings it back, and sometimes people just crack and come forward.

What’s bothered me since the “cleaned up” footage was released is that they never mentioned how a man waited 30-40 minutes until Trevor Deely passes by and then he follows him around to the gate. All that was said was that he spoke with someone.

Even before that new footage they had the original of that guy looking in through the gate. Another bank worker goes in at this time while another waits for him. Just seemed like a lot of detail that was left out if they were trying to “jog” memories.

I remember that night because of the taxi strike and the fact I had to get a lift home from the boyfriend of a colleague I was “seeing” at the time. I wasn’t near that area of town but someone else might remember something strange if they were provided with a full description of what was known.

It was also stated at the time that Trevor Deely was supposed to meet a man and woman when he left the office but that wasn’t mentioned again.

Also, out of curiosity, does anyone know why the footage of the “person of interest” following Trevor on the Baggot St footage is never shown at normal speed, it’s always shown “sped up”?

Would be great if this case was finally solved.

Fr Tod Umptious · 05-12-2019 11:53am

The last thread was locked and deleted for good reason, it had really jumped the shark.

This week the body of a man missing from Dublin for 36 years was formally identified as being in a unknown grave in Wales.

In the last year or so two other people that were buried as unknown in Wales after being washed up have been identified.

Obviously this is all due to DNA matching.

To the best of my knowledge the Deely family have no submitted DNA to the investigation, for the obvious reason that they believe that Trevor is still alive.

There is a possibility that Trevor's body is in the grave of an unknown in Wales, but that cannot be clarified without DNA.

tdf7187 · 05-12-2019 12:02pm

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Ok. Interesting. I didn’t realise that area was like that then.

Would they and their minders have been “at work” on a wet windy night in early December at 3/4am?

Don't see why not. In spite of the weather, there were plenty of people out that night, as can been seen in the CCTV footage.

tdf7187 · 05-12-2019 12:04pm

begbysback wrote: »

There’s a type of prostitute you would take home to your mother?

Figure of speech. But let's move on from that rather facetious comment of mine, we don't want another of these threads locked.

Dodge · 05-12-2019 12:11pm

tdf7187 wrote: »

Figure of speech. But let's move on from that rather facetious comment of mine, we don't want another of these threads locked.

To be clear there is no figure of speech relating to bringing hookers back to your mother

20Wheel · 05-12-2019 1:17pm

Dodge wrote: »

To be clear there is no figure of speech relating to bringing hookers back to your mother

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAA1xgTTw9w

tdf7187 · 05-12-2019 1:32pm

I'll tell you guys something else, and this only just occured to me. I myself worked in banking at the time Trevor disappeared, not for BOI but another institution, and due to the nature of my role I had professional reasons to have contacts with the CAB. And I recall distinctly being made aware due to those contacts that a premises on Leeson Street a few doors up from the pub the Leeson Lounge which traded as a B&B was in reality a knocking shop. I am just making the point that that whole area had a kind of shabby genteel aspect to it, and while largely wealthy and respectable on the surface there was a lot of seediness going on underneath. Note, I am not trying to imply Trevor frequented such establishments, there is no evidence for that, I am just saying I do give credence to the theory that he had a chance encounter with a criminal which ended badly. And more importantly, apparently the AGS also do. I long assumed that he had accidentally fallen into the canal and drowned, but the other theory is just as plausible at this point.

20Wheel · 05-12-2019 1:41pm

tdf7187 wrote: »

I'll tell you guys something else, and this only just occured to me. I myself worked in banking at the time Trevor disappeared, not for BOI but another institution, and due to the nature of my role I had professional reasons to have contacts with the CAB. And I recall distinctly being made aware due to those contacts that a premises on Leeson Street a few doors up from the pub the Leeson Lounge which traded as a B&B was in reality a knocking shop. I am just making the point that that whole area had a kind of shabby genteel aspect to it, and while largely wealthy and respectable on the surface there was a lot of seediness going on underneath. Note, I am not trying to imply Trevor frequented such establishments, there is no evidence for that, I am just saying I do give credence to the theory that he had a chance encounter with a criminal which ended badly. And more importantly, apparently the AGS also do. I long assumed that he had accidentally fallen into the canal and drowned, but the other theory is just as plausible at this point.

Know of any on Haddington Rd?

Raconteuse · 05-12-2019 1:47pm

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

What’s bothered me since the “cleaned up” footage was released is that they never mentioned how a man waited 30-40 minutes until Trevor Deely passes by and then he follows him around to the gate. All that was said was that he spoke with someone.

Even before that new footage they had the original of that guy looking in through the gate. Another bank worker goes in at this time while another waits for him. Just seemed like a lot of detail that was left out if they were trying to “jog” memories.

I remember that night because of the taxi strike and the fact I had to get a lift home from the boyfriend of a colleague I was “seeing” at the time. I wasn’t near that area of town but someone else might remember something strange if they were provided with a full description of what was known.

It was also stated at the time that Trevor Deely was supposed to meet a man and woman when he left the office but that wasn’t mentioned again.

Also, out of curiosity, does anyone know why the footage of the “person of interest” following Trevor on the Baggot St footage is never shown at normal speed, it’s always shown “sped up”?

Would be great if this case was finally solved.

Probably just the way the security camera was. I don't see why there are grounds for believing that the guy behind him by the Haddington Road ATM was following him. And his build is totally different to the guy who was waiting at the bank gate for half an hour, whom I think must have been following him.

tdf7187 · 05-12-2019 1:48pm

20Wheel wrote: »

Know of any on Haddington Rd?

I don't. The ones on Haddington Rd I think are genuine - bear in mind plenty of demand due to rugby/soccer/music fans coming over - Aviva Stadium, RDS and Donnybrook ground all in the locality.

The Leeson St knocking shop I think (I'm relying on memory here, could be wrong) had a connection to Marie Bridgman. I'm 100% certain that there was a knocking shop posing as a B&B on Leeson St in or about May - December 2000, I just can't recall who the owners were. I was an MLRO with a bank so I had visibility of info most people wouldn't have. Not boasting or name-dropping, that's just how it was.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/midnight-on-baggot-street-every-girl-in-the-sex-trade-has-a-story-but-men-never-ask-30567428.html

Incidentally a well-known lap dancing joint in the, let's just say general D2 area, is owned by a notoriously dodgy individual who has a conviction for manslaughter.

tdf7187 · 05-12-2019 2:03pm

I was tipped off from another source (not CAB) that a female and then under-age member of a well-known crime family surname six letters, was basically being hired out by her own family to foreign paedophiles. Burlington Hotel was mentioned. Wealth Swiss doctor was allegedly party to it. The file allegedly was passed back and forth between AGS and DPP for years and then eventually 'no further action', I was told.

People will probably think I'm bull****ting, but I'm not.

farmchoice · 05-12-2019 2:07pm

going off topic here but there was a well known knocking shop on baggot st, the fella who ran it was a real wide boy, but not a dangerous type, you would see him in the tesco there on baggot st going around with trolly pilled high with toilet paper, wet wipes etc with a couple of bedraggled whores trailing along behind him he was blatant about it and got done afterwards and was in the papers.
the first generation of lap dancing joints on lesson st were rough and ready and were little more than knocking shops, the door staff were proper hard men too. there was one we used to frequent i cant recall the name now, not angels, it was up the street a bit further i think, it was some craic but i saw a good few ''patrons'' getting a few fairly serious clips off the door men as they were escorted off the premises.

Stevieluvsye · 05-12-2019 2:10pm

farmchoice wrote: »

going off topic here but there was a well known knocking shop on baggot st, the fella who ran it was a real wide boy, but not a dangerous type, you would see him in the tesco there on baggot st going around with trolly pilled high with toilet paper, wet wipes etc with a couple of bedraggled whores trailing along behind him he was blatant about it and got done afterwards and was in the papers.
the first generation of lap dancing joints on lesson st were rough and ready and were little more than knocking shops, the door staff were proper hard men too. there was one we used to frequent i cant recall the name now, not angels, it was up the street a bit further i think, it was some craic but i saw a good few ''patrons'' getting a few fairly serious clips off the door men as they were escorted off the premises.

Must have been strings. They were the only two on Leeson street

farmchoice · 05-12-2019 2:15pm

Stevieluvsye wrote: »

Must have been strings. They were the only two on Leeson street

ya that was it i think.

Trevor Deely case - new witness

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