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Peter McVerry Trust staff and wages

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12357…27

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    #122
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    BDI wrote: »
    37 k is skilled tradesman/skilled office type money not unskilled work. The average wage is 37k how many are on little and how many are on crazy money. Handy out chickens or cleaning bowls in a soup kitchen is hardly worth 37k a week.

    How many of these people on big money are religious/church people or part time people on another full wage sticking in an hour or two a week and heading home with the leftover(preselected) bread rolls and chickens?

    It’s soup kitchens they arnt building the houses or teaching the homeless how to build the houses. A vast majority of them staff seem like they wouldn’t be earning 37 and a half grand anywhere else with a pension.

    Do you get 37 and a half grand for standing at one of them little tables in the supermarket shaking a bucket?
    Obviously you don't. Nor do people who hand out soup and chicken dinners. In fact much of said work is done by volunteers.

    But you knew that.


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    #123
    Jimmy Bottlehead
    Registered Users Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭Jimmy Bottlehead


    HappyAsLarE wrote: »
    I’m so surprised you have to deal with all of that. The way people go on that all the homeless folk are salt of de earth fallin on hard times types.
    The Regime wrote: »
    If the homeless can't even be bothered to treat the people who are trying to help them with a bit of respect, then they should be fcuked back out onto the streets.

    The hostels will be much more pleasant and safe for the decent ones then.

    As someone who's been spit on, hit, threatened, verbally abused countless times... I'd love to say "yep, out they go, tough luck", but when I take my ego out of the equation, the fact of the matter is: homeless clients are generally deeply, deeply traumatised from early life experiences. Huge rates of mental illness, and exposure to drink and drugs as a child or teenager.
    So while they can be a pain in the ass today, they're trying to deal with the awful stuff they've gone through early in life. If I'd been sexually abused, or seen someone batter my mother, I might want to blot out that pain too, and maybe drug use or alcohol is the only answer. Maybe it caused me to spiral in terms of mental health, and I had to leave my home and sleep on the streets. Homeless, mental health issues... Who's gonna hire me?

    It's a real eye opener working in the job, in so many ways.


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    #124
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »
    Charity is just another industry

    Every street sleeper could live like kings for the rest of their lives if all money donated went directly to source
    And who'd be able to do all that work for free? You?


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    #125
    Jimmy Bottlehead
    Registered Users Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭Jimmy Bottlehead


    SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »
    Charity is just another industry

    Every street sleeper could live like kings for the rest of their lives if all money donated went directly to source

    Cool. Give a homeless client €10,000 and see what happens to it and them.


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    #126
    easypazz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,346 ✭✭✭easypazz


    Salary Negotiator wrote: »
    We have less than 11,000 homeless people and 500 employees in PMV, how many do the other vested interest charities employ?

    Seems to me that there are a lot of people whose job is dependent on the homeless.

    I wonder if these organisations are actually helping the issue.

    It would be in their interest to paint as grim a picture as possible.


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    #127
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    The Regime wrote: »
    If the homeless can't even be bothered to treat the people who are trying to help them with a bit of respect, then they should be fcuked back out onto the streets.

    The hostels will be much more pleasant and safe for the decent ones then.

    I think that’s why the gentle street people actually prefer to be on the street, they feel safer in a way, away from some violent types.


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    #128
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users Posts: 43,024 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    end of the road wrote: »
    it won't get to source without staff, who will need to be paid.

    Retired people who want to give something back or monied people who don’t need a wage

    10k homeless 120 million a year donated to charity’s

    Something is not adding up


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    #129
    anewme
    Registered Users Posts: 11,859 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    Raconteuse wrote: »
    Obviously you don't. Nor do people who hand out soup and chicken dinners. In fact much of said work is done by volunteers.

    But you knew that.

    Op has an issue with salaries of all professions that dont involve working on a building site.

    Teachers, Bus Drivers, office workers, IT people, Call centre workers, have all fallen foul of OP.


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    #130
    Logo
    Registered Users Posts: 700 ✭✭✭Logo


    Why can't charities just publish sums and sources of income, salaries and year end results from donations in simple terms. At the minute it's almost impossible to determine which charity is most effective. Personally I prefer to donate to those closest to the need - without having to feed the machine.


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    #131
    Raconteuse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,817 ✭✭✭Raconteuse


    I don't think the senior executives of a charity should be getting paid six-figure salaries tbh, but social workers, counsellors, event organisers, managers - it's not scandalous for them to be getting paid the 40k mark.


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    #132
    BDI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭BDI


    anewme wrote: »
    Op has an issue with salaries of all professions that dont involve working on a building site.

    Teachers, Bus Drivers, office workers, IT people, Call centre workers, have all fallen foul of OP.

    Who pours the soup and makes the soup in the soup kitchen?

    Are you telling me it’s people with degrees or are you telling me these people are on little to no money and then we have from the 500 staff maybe 20-30 absolutely coining it.

    Skewing the average?


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    #133
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,485 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    I wonder how much money altogether is given to homeless charities?
    There seems to be a lot of duplication of services and I wonder if we’re getting value for money?
    Are the same people being helped by more than one service and abusing the system because it seems like it.


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    #134
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »
    As someone who's been spit on, hit, threatened, verbally abused countless times... I'd love to say "yep, out they go, tough luck", but when I take my ego out of the equation, the fact of the matter is: homeless clients are generally deeply, deeply traumatised from early life experiences. Huge rates of mental illness, and exposure to drink and drugs as a child or teenager.
    So while they can be a pain in the ass today, they're trying to deal with the awful stuff they've gone through early in life. If I'd been sexually abused, or seen someone batter my mother, I might want to blot out that pain too, and maybe drug use or alcohol is the only answer. Maybe it caused me to spiral in terms of mental health, and I had to leave my home and sleep on the streets. Homeless, mental health issues... Who's gonna hire me?

    It's a real eye opener working in the job, in so many ways.

    Then the answer is to prevent children being born into and growing up in chaotic households, however that may be achieved. There’s no good to be achieved facilitating generation after generation going on like this. The problem is apparently not getting better. We give out hell, rightly so, about clergy having abused children, yet we wring our hands now when children abused emotionally, physically or neglected go on to have children raised in exactly the same circumstance.

    Maybe time for long-acting birth control to be part of a chaotic person’s life. It’s another argument. Throwing tons of charity resources at it is NOT apparently improving it or even dealing with it anywhere near adequately.


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    #135
    Jimmy Bottlehead
    Registered Users Posts: 10,118 ✭✭✭✭Jimmy Bottlehead


    BDI wrote: »
    Who pours the soup and makes the soup in the soup kitchen?

    Are you telling me it’s people with degrees or are you telling me these people are on little to no money and then we have from the 500 staff maybe 20-30 absolutely coining it.

    Skewing the average?

    Most soup runs use volunteers.

    Hostel and Street staff are mostly paid, with some volunteers lending extra support.

    And most back office staff (management, finance, communications, fundraising, all the usual business departments) are paid, again with some volunteers lending extra support.

    Facts.


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    #136
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    tayto lover wrote: »
    I wonder how much money altogether is given to homeless charities?
    There seems to be a lot of duplication of services and I wonder if we’re getting value for money?
    Are the same people being helped by more than one service and abusing the system because it seems like it.

    It’s what I wonder too, but I honestly don’t know enough to have an opinion on whether the multiplicity of services is making it actually worse by rendering helpless people even more apparently helpless. Greed tends to be a human condition whether we are rich or poor.


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    #137
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    Surprised it took so long for an attack on McVerry tbh. He lambasts the government for the behaviour of Murphy for claiming 51k yet not doing the job he was elected to do whilst Peter accompanied a teenager to court who was caught stealing a bar costing a euro.

    Anyone that believes the the DPP prosecuted a child for a €1 bottle of orange shouldn’t be allowed do anything without a carer watching over them.


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    #138
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Salary Negotiator wrote: »
    We have less than 11,000 homeless people and 500 employees in PMV, how many do the other vested interest charities employ?

    Seems to me that there are a lot of people whose job is dependent on the homeless.

    I wonder if these organisations are actually helping the issue.

    100% if they really cared they’d merge and save costs. Wouldn’t need to pay multiple CEOs, CFOs, COOs, but they won’t. It’s big business these days.


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    #139
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    EmmetSpiceland wrote: »
    37k isn’t, exactly, a “decent” wage either. Grand for basis admin type roles.

    If they were getting 70 or 80k it might raise a few “eyebrows”.

    I’m failing to see what the problem is, cranky OP getting his crank on, perhaps?

    37k is the average. There’ll be some on a lot less and some on an awful lot more.


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    #140
    griffin100
    Registered Users Posts: 4,768 ✭✭✭griffin100


    How many of the 10,000 plus ‘homeless’ utilise soup kitchens, hostels, etc? There are probably more people employed in the homeless sector than there are living in the streets or in homeless hostels.


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    #141
    Earthhorse
    Registered Users Posts: 14,715 ✭✭✭✭Earthhorse


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Then the answer is to prevent children being born into and growing up in chaotic households, however that may be achieved.

    It likely can’t be. At least not in at a level where you would wipe out homelessness.
    Maybe time for long-acting birth control to be part of a chaotic person’s life. It’s another argument.

    Completely impractical and unethical though. No way an idea like that would fly.
    Throwing tons of charity resources at it is NOT apparently improving it or even dealing with it anywhere near adequately.

    An alternative way of looking at that is if we weren’t throwing these resources at the problem it would be way worse. Far more people sleeping rough, dying on the streets and causing trouble on them because they have no support.

    I agree it’s not very satisfactory but it’s something lots of modern cities have to face and we haven’t got the real, workable solutions to it yet.


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    #142
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    I laud people who work in difficult situations, eg with people affected by serious addiction etc, I know a tiny bit of what such people can be like from my job working in the public service, from which I am retired. I didn’t cope well, I would nevr volunteer to do it in a million years. So when I make criticisms here on this thread, it is more to do with the leftist notion that it will all somehow improve when enough resources are thrown at it. Neither will market forces of any kind improve it. But whatever is being overall done now is never going to succeed in the long run. The wily Illegal Drug industry is behind much of the worst of it.

    And BTW I don’t think making heroin legal and freely available to everyone who feels like dosing themselves is a solution either. A society doped up to the eyeballs on legal or illegal drugs is a doped up society one way or the other. The only reduction in evil being less of gangs shooting each others’ members.


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    #143
    Earthhorse
    Registered Users Posts: 14,715 ✭✭✭✭Earthhorse


    Deleted User wrote: »
    So when I make criticisms here on this thread, it is more to do with the leftist notion that it will all somehow improve when enough resources are thrown at it.

    Do you really think that is what leftists believe? No one I know on the left believes that. They’re well aware it’s a complex situation.


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    #144
    BDI
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,005 ✭✭✭BDI


    Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »
    Most soup runs use volunteers.

    Hostel and Street staff are mostly paid, with some volunteers lending extra support.

    And most back office staff (management, finance, communications, fundraising, all the usual business departments) are paid, again with some volunteers lending extra support.

    Facts.

    So hostel and street staff are paid. Probably hostel and streets staff wages. Maybe a euro an hour more. 11 euro an hour.

    Then the boyos in the offices away from the homeless people must be absolutely coining it. Probably get a lot of charity owner families and friends in these positions.


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    #145
    markodaly
    Registered Users Posts: 13,952 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Ronin247 wrote: »
    There are 189,000 employees in the charity sector in Ireland. There are approximately 10,000 registered charities. There are 300,000 unpaid volunteers

    Homeless charities have approximately 2000 employees, even though there are only a few hundred sleeping rough nationwide.

    If the average salary for working in the homeless "industry " is €37,000 then considering there are a lot of families in the numbers, we could probably fund 3 homes at a rent of €1000 per month from each salary, 2000 x 3 homes is 6000 homes..... no more homeless people.

    Let me say there are a large number of very good people who work in these charities and I dont wish to tar them all with the same brush but it is an industry.

    This.

    It just seems that the whole 'charity' sector is hugely inefficient.
    Too much overlap, too much repetition.
    There are dozens of homeless charities, can we just not have a few of them? Each one needs its 'own' CEO being paid a 6 figure sum.

    Very wasteful and they do not build one house either.


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    #146
    Highroad12
    Registered Users Posts: 43 ✭Highroad12


    You think the profit from donations of clothes you make to Vincent's de Paul.....no!!

    Only around 10% of the PROFIT goes to the charity.

    I heard from a fella before that collected for charities that he was "great at getting donations and was going to set up his own one", as if it was a business!!! Gobsmacked!!


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    #147
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    It’s like a giant Ponzi scheme. There is a finite amount of money that people can donate. The more charities there are, the more CEOs etc there are, the more overheads there are, the less money available for the actual cause you are donating to. Sickening.

    The “charity” industry as it currently stands is the donating version of homeopathy. So diluted down that it’s useless.


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    #148
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    weldoninhio wrote: »
    Anyone that believes the the DPP prosecuted a child for a €1 bottle of orange shouldn’t be allowed do anything without a carer watching over them.

    Irish Times December 3rd. Contact the editor there chief if you think it's BS.
    https://m.independent.ie/opinion/comment/colette-browne-a-homeless-boy-in-court-over-1-drink-while-td-picks-up-51600-expenses-no-wonder-fg-is-on-the-ropes-38752301.html
    Also the Indo.


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    #149
    Jinglejangle69
    Registered Users Posts: 7,229 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    markodaly wrote: »
    This.

    It just seems that the whole 'charity' sector is hugely inefficient.
    Too much overlap, too much repetition.
    There are dozens of homeless charities, can we just not have a few of them? Each one needs its 'own' CEO being paid a 6 figure sum.

    Very wasteful and they do not build one house either.

    120,000 euro!!!!


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    #150
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Earthhorse wrote: »
    Do you really think that is what leftists believe? No one I know on the left believes that. They’re well aware it’s a complex situation.

    Well a certain media cohort purporting to have left or liberal views seems to speak as if to give the impression. I think most people really do know in their hearts it’s horribly complex. I am certainly the last to know any solutions.


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    #151
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    BDI wrote: »
    Who pours the soup and makes the soup in the soup kitchen?

    Are you telling me it’s people with degrees or are you telling me these people are on little to no money and then we have from the 500 staff maybe 20-30 absolutely coining it.

    Skewing the average?

    Speaking of people with degrees, having a PhD in the Fine Arts of 17th Century Japan would hardly be useful when organising a roster for hostel workers. One has to presume when talking about degrees it has to be one directly relevant for the job to be of consequence as far as financially rewarding a charity employee. No good imagining a graduate of Biblical Aramaic is worth a cent more for a job where no knowledge is not called for.


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