VW ID.3

Shefwedfan · 15-05-2019 10:17am

Irishjg wrote: »

I wonder will uncle Bjorn will get an opportunity to test the mid range launch spec in time before we are committed to purchase in January.

Doubt it.....he is up the rear end of Tesla too much.....

The main markets are UK and Germany. Fully Charged and Top Gear got access last time so I would expect them to get first bash. Similar programs in germany got access as well so expect it to be the same

Mike9832 · 15-05-2019 10:25am

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Doubt it.....he is up the rear end of Tesla too much.....

The main markets are UK and Germany. Fully Charged and Top Gear got access last time so I would expect them to get first bash. Similar programs in gerhttps://insideevs.com/news/345672/passenger-plug-in-electric-car-sales-in-europe-in-2018-by-country/#null/#4052533/many got access as well so expect it to be the same

Norway is the biggest market by far

You must not watch any Bjorn

The man is genuine and very unbiased, seems a top guy

[EMAIL="https://insideevs.com/news/345672/passenger-plug-in-electric-car-sales-in-europe-in-2018-by-country/#null/#4052533/"]https://insideevs.com/news/345672/passenger-plug-in-electric-car-sales-in-europe-in-2018-by-country/#null/#4052533/[/EMAIL]

tw0nk · 15-05-2019 10:34am

I registered and paid deposit a few days ago, and apologies if I have missed posts on this elsewhere but has there been a discussion on why people would prefer ID.3 over Tesla 3?

For me:
ID.3 reasons:
- Lower price (guess)
- I like being able to bring car to a local garage
- I think VW can't mess this up, it's their full entry into EV market

Model 3:
- Aesthetically nicer
- Longer range (by a little)
- Already proven (~100 produced now)

Question marks:
- Which will have better tech? I really like how Tesla do it, hoping VW can match or beat it
- Sexiness, I like the look of Model 3, the ID.3 looks very Golfy, I'm hoping final product is sexier
- Government incentives off price/home charger install
- Will golf clubs fit in the boot?

Shefwedfan · 15-05-2019 10:51am

New cars bought in 2018 in Norway : 147k

New cars bought in Germany in 2018: 3.4 million
New cars sold by VW in Germany in 2018: 640k

New cars bought in UK in 2018: 2.3 million
No breakdown of total vehicles sold by VW in UK but they did sell 65k Golf's......

Mike9832 · 15-05-2019 10:58am

Shefwedfan wrote: »

New cars bought in 2018 in Norway : 147k

New cars bought in Germany in 2018: 3.4 million
New cars sold by VW in Germany in 2018: 640k

New cars bought in UK in 2018: 2.3 million
No breakdown of total vehicles sold by VW in UK but they did sell 65k Golf's......

Electric

Phibsboro · 15-05-2019 12:43pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Doubt it.....he is up the rear end of Tesla too much.....

The main markets are UK and Germany. Fully Charged and Top Gear got access last time so I would expect them to get first bash. Similar programs in germany got access as well so expect it to be the same

Have to say I am surprised at you slagging off Bjorn. He definitely loves Tesla cars but he is not backwards in highlighting their issues. When he picked up his Model 3 recently the first thing he did was walk around it pointing out all the panel gaps and paint defects. I'd love him to get a good run in an ID and do a review.

Shefwedfan · 15-05-2019 12:51pm

Phibsboro wrote: »

Have to say I am surprised at you slagging off Bjorn. He definitely loves Tesla cars but he is not backwards in highlighting their issues. When he picked up his Model 3 recently the first thing he did was walk around it pointing out all the panel gaps and paint defects. I'd love him to get a good run in an ID and do a review.

I am not slagging off Bjorn.

They made it clear in the recent test drives in South Africa the main markets are UK and Germany. That is why only 2 reviewers from these countries got the chance to test the ID....no other countries in the World got the option....even VW at the test said that UK and Germany are the biggest market for VW .....

The point of the ID is to sell to general public. Ask anyone on the street who isnt a electric car owner and they will have no idea who Bjorn is. Ask anyone who Top Gear is and they will know...

VW have numerous times given Bjorn eGolf to test. He will get an ID. But for initial launch he is hardly going to cover the target customers which VW want to cover.....

I have Bjorn facebook and the constant youtube videos about Tesla is very annoying.....nearly daily he puts up one about tesla sentry mode....if you are a new user and you look at that then automatically you will think he is very biased towards Tesla

unkel · 15-05-2019 12:59pm

Phibsboro wrote: »

Have to say I am surprised at you slagging off Bjorn. He definitely loves Tesla cars but he is not backwards in highlighting their issues.

Only recently he was promoting independent Bosch accredited service centres to have your Tesla fixed as they were quicker and better value for money than the Tesla official service centres

He's got some free Teslas, but in my mind Nyland is 100% independent and honest. That's his USP and the reason he could chuck in the day job and become a full time youtuber

KCross · 15-05-2019 1:15pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

The main markets are UK and Germany. Fully Charged and Top Gear got access last time so I would expect them to get first bash. Similar programs in germany got access as well so expect it to be the same

Shefwedfan wrote: »

VW have numerous times given Bjorn eGolf to test. He will get an ID. But for initial launch he is hardly going to cover the target customers which VW want to cover.....

Stackmann referenced Germany and Norway as being the primary markets in europe with the largest volume of sales there.

Listen to the last 5mins of the press launch... he was fairly clear on it. He mentioned a few other markets as well but no mention of UK.

Shefwedfan · 15-05-2019 1:16pm

unkel wrote: »

Only recently he was promoting independent Bosch accredited service centres to have your Tesla fixed as they were quicker and better value for money than the Tesla official service centres

He's got some free Teslas, but in my mind Nyland is 100% independent and honest. That's his USP and the reason he could chuck in the day job and become a full time youtuber

All valid but limited audience outside the electric car community

KCross · 15-05-2019 1:31pm

I'd also guess that Fully Charged (and Top Gear too probably) got the nod because they're a global channel with a big following... nothing at all to do with being originally from the UK.

Shefwedfan · 15-05-2019 1:38pm

KCross wrote: »

I'd also guess that Fully Charged (and Top Gear too probably) got the nod because they're a global channel with a big following... nothing at all to do with being originally from the UK.

They had 4 shows at the test. 2 from UK and 2 from Germany....

KCross · 15-05-2019 1:43pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

They had 4 shows at the test. 2 from UK and 2 from Germany....

Right, whats your point?
They are global shows, not UK specific shows. They want to maximise their reach and they picked the shows/youtubers that would give them that max reach.

He clearly said Norway and Germany are the primary markets by volume.

Im sure that will change in time but for now its those two will lead the field.... according to him.

arch_stanton · 16-05-2019 9:13am

Has anyone had payment problems with the deposit? I had €1,000 pending in my account all week but now it’s disappeared, ie not pending and not charged. My order is still visible in My Volkswagen and I called customer care who also confirmed its valid but I’m worried something’s wrong. /insert Fry take my money gif

DrPhilG · 16-05-2019 9:21am

Mine went on May 9th

Shabre · 16-05-2019 8:46pm

Shaybre - Volkswagen Connolly Sligo

Have been following these ID3 threads, disappointed to read that likely price could be €40k+
I was ready to take plunge for Kona ev last year but baulked at €38.5k asking price (now €39.5k) from local Hyundai dealer. Was really hoping that VW would deliver 450 km range for €35k but this now looks very unlikely. Everyone I talk to says I would be crazy to pay €40k for an ev or for any car and to just hold on for a few more years till EVs become mainstream and affordable.

vidukasp · 16-05-2019 9:05pm

Joe Duffy Volkswagen Navan (Meath)

pdpmur · 16-05-2019 9:41pm

Shabre wrote: »

Shaybre - Volkswagen Connolly Sligo

Have been following these ID3 threads, disappointed to read that likely price could be €40k+
I was ready to take plunge for Kona ev last year but baulked at €38.5k asking price (now €39.5k) from local Hyundai dealer. Was really hoping that VW would deliver 450 km range for €35k but this now looks very unlikely. Everyone I talk to says I would be crazy to pay €40k for an ev or for any car and to just hold on for a few more years till EVs become mainstream and affordable.

I'd say hold on until real prices are announced, then make your decision. At the moment all the posts regarding price are just informed speculation.
By the time the ID is generally available it will have some fairly stiff competition in the shape of the Leaf62 alone and VW won't be able to price the ID too far above, even accounting for the supposed VW brand premium.
Don't forget the SEAI grant too (it won't last forever - probably will be tapered away quietly over time).

Silentreader · 17-05-2019 12:43am

Frank Keane - Liffey Valley

Shabre · 17-05-2019 5:59pm

pdpmur wrote: »

I'd say hold on until real prices are announced, then make your decision. At the moment all the posts regarding price are just informed speculation.
By the time the ID is generally available it will have some fairly stiff competition in the shape of the Leaf62 alone and VW won't be able to price the ID too far above, even accounting for the supposed VW brand premium.
Don't forget the SEAI grant too (it won't last forever - probably will be tapered away quietly over time).

Yes will definitely wait and see until prices announced in Sept,. Hope those prices include local dealership cut as well

ExcaliburRisen · 25-05-2019 3:37pm

A bit late to the party but reserved my ID.3 (and paid deposit) just now (Frank Keane, Deansgrange).
Was actually expecting to be told the reservations were full but I got a reservation number no problem.

Shefwedfan · 03-06-2019 8:07pm

Looks like VW are going to use PCP to sell off the eGolf but also push ID.3 into market....

From €35,995 or €359 per month*

with 0% APR PCP finance and a 3 Year Service Plan. *Monthly rate applies after Government Incentives are included.

New 24-month PCP contract available.
Zero Emission and now 0% PCP.

Volkswagen’s e-Golf is now available, for a limited period only, with 0% PCP Finance, making this car more affordable and more accessible than ever before. Plus, if you'd like to move from e-Golf to the new electric ID. you will be able to do so easily, thanks to a special new 2-year PCP solution. The 2-year PCP option costs from €399 per month on the e-Golf and €489 per month on the e-Golf Executive Edition.

McGiver · 03-06-2019 9:11pm

Shefwedfan wrote:

Volkswagenâ€™s e-Golf is now available, for a limited period only, with 0% PCP Finance, making this car more affordable and more accessible than ever before. Plus, if you'd like to move from e-Golf to the new electric ID. you will be able to do so easily, thanks to a special new 2-year PCP solution. The 2-year PCP option costs from â‚¬399 per month on the e-Golf and â‚¬489 per month on the e-Golf Executive Edition.

How exactly the move to the ID3 will be made easy?

Shefwedfan · 03-06-2019 9:15pm

McGiver wrote: »

How exactly the move to the ID3 will be made easy?

I would guess you swap out of your eGolf PCP into an ID PCP.....any more information you have to contact the dealers

September1 · 04-06-2019 8:32am

So realistically they expect ID to be available in Ireland in two years from now... that is quote a delay.

Shefwedfan · 04-06-2019 9:14am

September1 wrote: »

So realistically they expect ID to be available in Ireland in two years from now... that is quote a delay.

No, I don't think that is the point of this

What they are doing is getting rid of old eGolf stock. Nobody will buy eGolf now because the new model is coming out soon

This just allows you to buy an eGolf now and you know you have an option to move to ID in 2 years time instead of 3 years with standard PCP contracts.

Getting someone to sign up to a 3 year PCP now on eGolf would be fairly hard.

drunkmonkey · 04-06-2019 9:22am

You'd think 2yr would be a hard sell as well. They depreciation on them could be eye watering seen as we'll have the MK8 golf and the ID 3
You'd want to be guaranteed the future value on the pcp contact.

dmcg90 · 04-06-2019 2:35pm

Is it possible to put down a reservation for the max-range version?

Silent Running · 04-06-2019 3:00pm

No, the reservation is for the ID 1st. The other specs and battery sizes will be made available after (at the same time as?) the reservations are being built. Ordering will probably be as normal through your local dealer, with pretty swift delivery, depending on demand and availability, obviously.

CFC007 · 04-06-2019 6:44pm

Over 20,000 cars reserved already.

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/vw-id3-electric-car-reservations-ev/

Mike9832 · 04-06-2019 11:52pm

CFC007 wrote: »

Over 20,000 cars reserved already.

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/vw-id3-electric-car-reservations-ev/

Expected more, but VW will be happy with that

Just enough to make a dent in emission targets and just enough to not make a debt in ICE sales

Well played

September1 · 05-06-2019 8:46am

I think 20.000 is poor result, we can compare with Tesla which had significantly higher number. We do not know country breakdown but I would expect that in same area Tesla got at least twice as much reservations for M3. On top of that M3 was much less certain to be made, from much less respectful manufacturer and it was not that clear when it will be available.

Shefwedfan · 05-06-2019 8:51am

September1 wrote: »

I think 20.000 is poor result, we can compare with Tesla which had significantly higher number. We do not know country breakdown but I would expect that in same area Tesla got at least twice as much reservations for M3. On top of that M3 was much less certain to be made, from much less respectful manufacturer and it was not that clear when it will be available.

A huge percentage of Model 3 reservations where based on a 35k doller price. Even outside the US a massive amount of people expected the car to be a lot cheaper than it turned out to be. I bet nobody in Ireland expected it to start at 48k after the grants.

It would be interesting to see out of the number of people who reserved the car how many actually bought it.

Also VW have not launched the ID outside of Europe. Model 3 was Worldwide so that kind of makes a difference as a huge amount of reservations for Model 3 was in US, again by all account the uptake of those reservations is unknown

Fitz2011 · 05-06-2019 8:56am

September1 wrote: »

I think 20.000 is poor result, we can compare with Tesla which had significantly higher number. We do not know country breakdown but I would expect that in same area Tesla got at least twice as much reservations for M3. On top of that M3 was much less certain to be made, from much less respectful manufacturer and it was not that clear when it will be available.

Considering it’s only the reservations for Europe. I don’t think 20,000 is bad. They will definitely sell the 30,000 before we see the car in September. The really test will be turning them in to actual sales. If the spec isn’t great I’ll cancel my order and re order when I can choose my own spec.

sk8board · 05-06-2019 9:01pm

September1 wrote: »

I think 20.000 is poor result, we can compare with Tesla which had significantly higher number. We do not know country breakdown but I would expect that in same area Tesla got at least twice as much reservations for M3. On top of that M3 was much less certain to be made, from much less respectful manufacturer and it was not that clear when it will be available.

The facts don’t support that argument.
Firstly, Tesla have no production issues now and have cleared the backlog of orders - and clearly there’s no backlog now either if I can order one for delivery at my back door here in Ireland in July. The early adopters and fanboys have got their Tesla’s and the mass market isn’t biting at the ridiculous pricing.

Next, the monthly data for EV deliveries for the EU are usually collated by these guys: https://cleantechnica.com/2019/06/03/electric-vehicle-sales-up-70-in-europe-april-ev-sales-report/
The Zoe outsold the model 3 in April, and the m3 delivered just over 3000 units EU wide.
Like the US, it dropped significantly after the initial March deliveries to early adopters and fanboys - many of whom probably had deposits for 3 years.

I think VW have done a great job with the ID3, if and and only if, they can get the pricing right, and that would be the very first EV to do so, so I’m not exactly holding my breadth.
We have a golf coming out of pcp next year, and if the pricing is remotely sensible, I’d order one for sure.

September1 · 05-06-2019 9:06pm

sk8board wrote: »

The facts don’t support that argument.
Firstly, Tesla have no production issues now and have cleared the backlog of orders - and clearly there’s no backlog now either if I can order one for delivery at my back door here in Ireland in July. The early adopters and fanboys have got their Tesla’s and the mass market isn’t biting at the ridiculous pricing.

Next, the monthly data for EV deliveries for the EU are usually collated by these guys: https://cleantechnica.com/2019/06/03/electric-vehicle-sales-up-70-in-europe-april-ev-sales-report/
The Zoe outsold the model 3 in April, and the m3 delivered just over 3000 units EU wide.
Like the US, it dropped significantly after the initial March deliveries to early adopters and fanboys - many of whom probably had deposits for 3 years.

I think VW have done a great job with the ID3, if and and only if, they can get the pricing right, and that would be the very first EV to do so, so I’m not exactly holding my breadth.
We have a golf coming out of pcp next year, and if the pricing is remotely sensible, I’d order one for sure.

Which facts? Ones you mentioned were about delivery of model 3, not about reservations that were made much earlier. Are there any sources that confirm that European model 3 reservations after opening of reservations were in such low numbers as VW?

Shefwedfan · 05-06-2019 10:18pm

September1 wrote: »

Which facts? Ones you mentioned were about delivery of model 3, not about reservations that were made much earlier. Are there any sources that confirm that European model 3 reservations after opening of reservations were in such low numbers as VW?

20k is low?

As I said a huge percentage of Model 3 reservation got made on the back of low pricing

Getting correct numbers out of Tesla was always hard so doubt you would get anything realistically correct

unkel · 05-06-2019 11:30pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Getting correct numbers out of Tesla was always hard so doubt you would get anything realistically correct

Sure Volkswagen would never lie or cheat?

I too feel the 20k after all this time is quite low. And I'm one of that 20k. It is very unlikely that I will buy the car if it will be over €30k on the road.

catharsis · 05-06-2019 11:47pm

unkel wrote: »

Sure Volkswagen would never lie or cheat?

you mean like like stating that they had funding secured to take the company private at $420 ? :-)

I am surprised at the 20K number and regard it as somewhat low also.

unkel · 05-06-2019 11:50pm

catharsis wrote: »

you mean like like stating that they had funding secured to take the company private at $420 ? :-)

Emissions secured at 120g/km more like

McGiver · 06-06-2019 12:13am

unkel wrote:

I too feel the 20k after all this time is quite low. And I'm one of that 20k. It is very unlikely that I will buy the car if it will be over â‚¬30k on the road.

No way it's going to be 30k.

Didn't they say <40k (i.e. 39999) at the launch press conference?

39,990 incl. German VAT
41,334 incl. Irish VAT difference
47,211 incl. Irish VRT
- 5,000 VRT exemption
- 5,000 SEAI grant
37,211

Realistically 38k including delivery charge.
And that's before we get into extras for which VW charge fortune in Ireland.

unkel · 06-06-2019 12:26am

Yeah I know

I'm glad the world and his wife now know we will all be driving full EVs soon. That is new. This time last year that sense wasn't ubiquitous. The pace at which this is going is very disappointingly slow though...

timsey tiger · 06-06-2019 11:28am

timsey tiger - Blackwater Motors Cork

sk8board · 06-06-2019 12:30pm

McGiver wrote: »

No way it's going to be 30k.

Didn't they say <40k (i.e. 39999) at the launch press conference?

39,990 incl. German VAT
41,334 incl. Irish VAT difference
47,211 incl. Irish VRT
- 5,000 VRT exemption
- 5,000 SEAI grant
37,211

Realistically 38k including delivery charge.
And that's before we get into extras for which VW charge fortune in Ireland.

I would tend to agree with that pricing. The VRT and VAT calculator rarely lies, as we know with all existing EV's. the early adopters are paying over the odds completely, even after grants, just to save on 90% of their fuel bill.

There simply HAS to be financial incentives, just like in Norway, if we want adoption to improve here (2.4% of new registrations in 2019, 6-8 years after the leaf was released - and most of those Gen 1 leaf drivers are on their 2nd or 3rd EV - I'll bet there's plenty cannibalisation in those sales).

My fuel bill last year was about €1,100 (about 12,000km pa).
A €40k kona is quiet simply a really poor financial decision. The grants are going to the manufacturers, via the early adopters.

All the current crop of EV releases have one thing in common - EV-aware people are waiting for sometimes years for its arrival and buy it when its released - and then the sales drop off significantly.

Irish people don't care any less about the planet than Norwegians, but there's simply no economic reason for the Irish mass market to adopt to EV's.

unkel · 06-06-2019 12:47pm

Their was always a large stick in Norway against fossil cars, even before there were any EVs. So they removed the stick and held up a small carrot for EV owners and that was all it took

In Ireland there has never been much of a stick against diesel cars. In fact diesel owners got a large carrot with subsidied cars, subsidied fuel and subsidised motor tax after the VRT / VAT system went CO2 based in 2008. And diesel is the only car fuel in Ireland that a company can claim back VAT on. Absurd!

The stick is more effective than the carrot. Double the VRT on the purchase of a new diesel car in 2020, and nobody will buy one anymore, simples...

drunkmonkey · 06-06-2019 1:31pm

You can get the vat back on this as well as the free bik if I'm reading it right. That'll make it very appealing for business. Just need to be doing 60% business use. Accelerated capital payments back as well is it just 3k in the first year or 3k every year.
Never had a company car before as the bik was always off-putting for the kinda cars I drive.

sk8board · 06-06-2019 1:39pm

unkel wrote: »

In Ireland there has never been much of a stick against diesel cars. In fact diesel owners got a large carrot with subsidied cars, subsidied fuel and subsidised motor tax after the VRT / VAT system went CO2 based in 2008. And diesel is the only car fuel in Ireland that a company can claim back VAT on. Absurd!

The stick is more effective than the carrot. Double the VRT on the purchase of a new diesel car in 2020, and nobody will buy one anymore, simples...

completely and utterly agree - its a silly situation. I haven't a clue how much Co2 my car emits, but i know its €200 to tax and diesel is cheaper at the pump. Its the cheapest car I've ever run.

Change both of those 2 things, and offer something on the EV side to reduce the new EV price much closer to the equivalent ICE version of the same car, and hey presto I'm all in

Traditionally we've paid more for diesels models V petrol, for no obvious reason but the promise of lower running costs, but only by a few €k.

The EV to ICE price gap is simply too wide for the mass market to swallow.

CFC007 · 13-06-2019 1:39pm

Did anyone enter the competition for an all expenses trip to see the I.D. 3 at the home of VW? Hopefully some boardies get to go and report back

CFC007 · 15-06-2019 12:14pm

I found out yesterday from VW that I was picked to go over to Wolfsburg in July to see the pre production ID.3 all expensed by VW. Is anyone else here going?

Silent Running · 15-06-2019 12:16pm

Aww what a pity you can't go because you're working. I'll look after that for you... you're welcome.

:D

VW ID.3

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