Do you think nurses will get their payrise?

hurler32 · 09-01-2019 7:18pm

What % of the health budget goes on wages ??
What % of the Dutch or German health budget goes on wages ?

That’ll explain why we have a disaster of a set up

Twenty Grand · 09-01-2019 7:44pm

Mooooo wrote: »

As I said hire more nurses. If they are doing more hours than the standard week they are getting overtime or allowances for it. There are so many hours in the week, they all have to be covered so more nurses on a standard number of hours makes sense, particularly in a&e etc

The problem is there isn't enough nurses. Plenty of positions open but no one's applying because the conditions and pay is sh*t

Tell me how · 09-01-2019 7:46pm

Twenty Grand wrote: »

The problem is there isn't enough nurses. Plenty of positions open but no one's applying because the conditions and pay is sh*t

Is it not the case that Irish Nurses are amongst some of the best paid in Europe?

Wheeliebin30 · 09-01-2019 7:48pm

Twenty Grand wrote: »

The problem is there isn't enough nurses. Plenty of positions open but no one's applying because the conditions and pay is sh*t

We have more nurses per capita than most countries.

Wheeliebin30 · 09-01-2019 7:49pm

Tell me how wrote: »

Is it not the case that Irish Nurses are amongst some of the best paid in Europe?

It is but don’t underestimate how powerful the unions are and their media buddies.

MrMusician18 · 09-01-2019 7:51pm

Edgware wrote: »

We all think of the hard working nurses in the A and E who deserve to be paid well. But like all public service jobs there is a good share of handy numbers such as taking blood samples, assisting the specialist at clinic etc where they are not under pressure

When was the last time you were in A and E?

You might have a different opinion if you were in there recently.

Wanderer2010 · 09-01-2019 7:53pm

TheRiverman wrote: »

Finding a new career doesn't solve the problems for nurses staying within the HSE.It only solves the problem for the person(s) who leave or who decide not to go into nursing at all.Running away from this broken system is not going to fix it.We need our nurses happy and stress free at their job.

But that clearly doesn't seem to be on the cards anytime soon, go back years and nurses were stretched to breaking point dealing with people on trollies, wages etc, they always had it bad. My point is if you want to be a nurse, it simply isn't worth hanging around the potentially years or decades it may take to fix this broken system. Life is too short for that misery when there are other less stressful jobs around.

Tell me how · 09-01-2019 7:53pm

Twenty Grand wrote: »

The problem is there isn't enough nurses. Plenty of positions open but no one's applying because the conditions and pay is sh*t

Tell me how wrote: »

Is it not the case that Irish Nurses are amongst some of the best paid in Europe?

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

It is but don’t underestimate how powerful the unions are and their media buddies.

Not disrespecting your input Wheeliebin30 but I am interested in someone who maybe thinks Nurses deserve a payrise answering this.

Twenty Grand · 09-01-2019 7:53pm

Tell me how wrote: »

Is it not the case that Irish Nurses are amongst some of the best paid in Europe?

And as I said in previous post:

Are the conditions the same?
Is the cost of living the same?
Is the euro per hour worked the same?
Is the role and responsibility and the same?
How do the wages average over the working life or a nurse?

There's no point saying "they're the best paid" when every contributing factor that determines pay is different.

Tell me how · 09-01-2019 7:56pm

MrMusician18 wrote: »

When was the last time you were in A and E?

You might have a different opinion if you were in there recently.

Yeah but every nurse is not working in A&E.

In any walk of life and in any and every job there are going to be some who take it easy. My father spent time in hospital last year and he told me that on Sunday one of the nurses on the ward used to disappear to watch the GAA matches. She left the 12 bed ward to a single nurse and dropped back for a walkthrough between the games

The second nurse deserves to be well paid, the first, not so much.

Twenty Grand · 09-01-2019 7:57pm

Tell me how wrote: »

Yeah but every nurse is not working in A&E.

In any walk of life and in any and every job there are going to be some who take it easy. My father spent time in hospital last year and he told me that on Sunday one of the nurses on the ward used to disappear to watch the GAA matches. She left the 12 bed ward to a single nurse and dropped back for a walkthrough between the games

The second nurse deserves to be well paid, the first, not so much.

Good on you dad. We should base our entire health system on his Sunday afternoon observation :rolleyes:

Mooooo · 09-01-2019 7:58pm

mariaalice wrote: »

If only people only got sick 9 to 5 it just dose not work the way you think.

You don't seem to understand what I'm saying. Operate a better shift roster with more nurses. I mentioned nothing of 9 to 5. Majority of shift jobs do have allowances for shift work which is fine the way it shoukd be but if nurses are doing over time on top of this it's getting more costly. As I said more nurses with standard number of hours. Not 9 to 5 but 36 hours in the week.

blanch152 · 09-01-2019 7:58pm

Tell me how wrote: »

Is it not the case that Irish Nurses are amongst some of the best paid in Europe?

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

We have more nurses per capita than most countries.

Both of these statements are true.

The other problem is we have nurses both standing around waiting for consultants to move their arses and deal with their public patients rather than their private patients, and also nurses doing work that should be done by care assistants. Nurses in other countries also have more medical duties.

Tell me how · 09-01-2019 7:59pm

Twenty Grand wrote: »

And as I said in previous post:

Are the conditions the same?
Is the cost of living the same?
Is the euro per hour worked the same?
Is the role and responsibility and the same?
How do the wages average over the working life or a nurse?

There's no point saying "they're the best paid" when every contributing factor that determines pay is different.

So do you think conditions in Irish hospitals are significantly worse than most of Europe?
Do you think the cost of living in Ireland is greater than the UK and France for example?
Do you think the role and responsibility of Irish nurses is greater than those in the UK?

I'm not sure what point you are making in terms of the working life of a nurse.

Tell me how · 09-01-2019 8:00pm

Twenty Grand wrote: »

Good on you dad. We should base our entire health system on his Sunday afternoon observation :rolleyes:

Well, I see how you want to take part in a discussion.

Thanks for playing.

Twenty Grand · 09-01-2019 8:04pm

Tell me how wrote: »

So do you think conditions in Irish hospitals are significantly worse than most of Europe?
Do you think the cost of living in Ireland is greater than the UK and France for example?
Do you think the role and responsibility of Irish nurses is greater than those in the UK?

I'm not sure what point you are making in terms of the working life of a nurse.

Yes to all of those.

Tell me how wrote: »

Well, I see how you want to take part in a discussion.

Thanks for playing.

I call it like I see it.
Maybe the nurse watching the match was on her fifth 13 hour shift that week and a bit of time of her feet was needed to keep her sane.

If you want my anecdote; one of the lads is a guard, he pulled 3 drivers over around 10am one morning, all driving like they were drunk.

All were nurses, coming off shift and so tired they couldn't drive straight. It's a mad system where you sacrifice your own health to keep others healthy.

MrMusician18 · 09-01-2019 8:27pm

Twenty Grand wrote: »

Yes to all of those.

I call it like I see it.
Maybe the nurse watching the match was on her fifth 13 hour shift that week and a bit of time of her feet was needed to keep her sane.

If you want my anecdote; one of the lads is a guard, he pulled 3 drivers over around 10am one morning, all driving like they were drunk.

All were nurses, coming off shift and so tired they couldn't drive straight. It's a mad system where you sacrifice your own health to keep others healthy.

Maybe, but is it not more likely that that were just jaded/unmotivated and just phoning it in?

The majority of the nurses I met in my A and E experience weren't the Florence Nightingales the unions would have you believe they were. And the CNM, what an arsehole.

tonycascarino · 09-01-2019 8:45pm

To answer the OP, yes, I think nurses will get their payrise, they always do. Next after that will be teachers & the gardaí.

Rubberchikken · 09-01-2019 8:49pm

whats with the adoration for nurses?
they do a job. they dont perform miracles. yes they deserve a fair pay but so too does every othet worker.
the elevation of nurses and teachers in this country is inexplicable.

hawkelady · 09-01-2019 9:01pm

tonycascarino wrote: »

To answer the OP, yes, I think nurses will get their payrise, they always do. Next after that will be teachers & the gardaí.

Not the guards. They just threatened to go on strike a few months ago and pascal found 300 mil down the back of the couch ! So the guards won’t strike

Twenty Grand · 09-01-2019 9:12pm

hawkelady wrote: »

Not the guards. They just threatened to go on strike a few months ago and pascal found 300 mil down the back of the couch ! So the guards won’t strike

It's amazing the government has no problem finding a few hundred million when it suits them.

Wheeliebin30 · 09-01-2019 9:12pm

Rubberchikken wrote: »

whats with the adoration for nurses?
they do a job. they dont perform miracles. yes they deserve a fair pay but so too does every othet worker.
the elevation of nurses and teachers in this country is inexplicable.

They are put up on a pedestal even though there is many other professions just as important if not more than nurses.

James Brown · 09-01-2019 9:18pm

Next time youse are 'genuinely' not 'faking it' in the A&E and can find a nurse not watching GAA matches or on holidays, tell her her job is only as important as that of a Librarian, who has regular office hours and seldom has to put anything bar books on trolleys.

The blame game is completely f***ed in this country and tory Leo is a guru for it. It's about fairness and accountability not that any policy makers have to deal with such trivialities.

Wheeliebin30 · 09-01-2019 9:23pm

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Next time youse are 'genuinely' not 'faking it' in the A&E and can find a nurse not watching GAA matches or on holidays, tell her her job is only as important as that of a Librarian, who has regular office hours and seldom has to put anything bar books on trolleys.

The blame game is completely f***ed in this country and tory Leo is a guru for it. It's about fairness and accountability not that any policy makers have to deal with such trivialities.

Oh look your first post here is blaming Leo Varadkar.

You’re username is actually Leo Varadkars partners name.

Mate I’ve said it before, that is majorly creepy, you have an unhealthy obsession with Leo Varadkar.

road_high · 09-01-2019 9:38pm

Rubberchikken wrote: »

whats with the adoration for nurses?
they do a job. they dont perform miracles. yes they deserve a fair pay but so too does every othet worker.
the elevation of nurses and teachers in this country is inexplicable.

Never did either. Like any profession there’s amazing ones that go above and beyond and then there’s the dead weight with a terrible attitude and no sense of pride in what they do.
Comments like “they should be paid any amount...” are ridiculous and tragic in a state barely paying its way and a small open economy that could be hit with the next downturn anytime. Then with all these crazy pay demands we are back where we were in 2009, running a €10 billion euro deficit.

Sardonicat · 09-01-2019 9:38pm

TheRiverman wrote: »

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Why one earth would you want to be a nurse in this country? The odds are stacked against you from the off, between low wages, extremely high levels of stress and responsibility, working shifts and long hours. Internal politics and trying to contact the highers-up to make your case. It seems pure sadism to me- if you really want to do it and its your calling, head off to Dubai or even Britain where conditions are much better.

I can safely say im earning at least twice the average nurse wage and I don't have a fraction of their stress. There are lots of jobs out there where you can clock in, do your job and not feel like a shell when you clock out. Seriously, its a mess in the nursing profession, find a new career.

Finding a new career doesn't solve the problems for nurses staying within the HSE.It only solves the problem for the person(s) who leave or who decide not to go into nursing at all.Running away from this broken system is not going to fix it.We need our nurses happy and stress free at their job.

Throwing money at them will not fix the system.

James Brown · 09-01-2019 9:52pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Oh look your first post here is blaming Leo Varadkar.

You’re username is actually Leo Varadkars partners name.

Mate I’ve said it before, that is majorly creepy, you have an unhealthy obsession with Leo Varadkar.

Says my stalker

I see you dodge the points and go for the verbal wedgey, good man.
Leo was giving out about nurses in the times today. He's not a boy in school I don't like, he's the mouthpiece leading the country. Don't be so precious, he's a big boy.

You're obvious obsession with wheelie bins is a worry

...wait maybe it's just a name you picked for the craic??

Mad_maxx · 09-01-2019 10:02pm

Rubberchikken wrote: »

whats with the adoration for nurses?
they do a job. they dont perform miracles. yes they deserve a fair pay but so too does every othet worker.
the elevation of nurses and teachers in this country is inexplicable.

We produced a lot of nurses down the centuries in this country, a lot worked in England, almost everyone has an aunt or mother who was a nurse, my own mother was one aswell as two aunts

Veneration of nurses is a sort of sacred Irish tradition

road_high · 09-01-2019 10:05pm

Mad_maxx wrote: »

We produced a lot of nurses down the centuries in this country, a lot worked in England, almost everyone has an aunt or mother who was a nurse, my own mother was one aswell as two aunts

Veneration of nurses is a sort of sacred Irish tradition

Same. Loads of family nurses, but they get on/got on with it without the incessant whining.

byhookorbycrook · 09-01-2019 10:40pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

It is but don’t underestimate how powerful the unions are and their media buddies.

Can you back that up, please with actual facts?
https://www.careeraddict.com/top-5-countries-with-the-highest-paid-salaries-for-nurses

"The average pay for a Registered Nurse (RN) is €31,112 per year." a far cry from "your media buddy" Ivan Yate's figures of €57,000 per year today.
https://www.payscale.com/research/IE/Job=Registered_Nurse_(RN)/Salary

Corruptedmorals · 09-01-2019 10:43pm

Certainly the new entrants could do with a payrise. It would keep more nurses here, reduce how understaffed our hospitals are and massively improve nurses working conditions which is really the main problem here, that they are paid too little for what they are doing and the hours they are putting in.

I would just like to know what's happening as I book outpatient appointments and we haven't a clue what to do for those days...

Gringo180 · 09-01-2019 10:47pm

Mad_maxx wrote: »

37 hours, average salary is 55k per annum not including overtime

Lol.

Gringo180 · 09-01-2019 10:49pm

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Can you back that up, please with actual facts?
https://www.careeraddict.com/top-5-countries-with-the-highest-paid-salaries-for-nurses

"The average pay for a Registered Nurse (RN) is €31,112 per year." a far cry from "your media buddy" Ivan Yate's figures of €57,000 per year today.
https://www.payscale.com/research/IE/Job=Registered_Nurse_(RN)/Salary

So weekly about 500 - 480 after tax. Peanuts.

Wheeliebin30 · 09-01-2019 11:19pm

Gringo180 wrote: »

So weekly about 500 - 480 after tax. Peanuts.

Peanuts? Really?

That’s a starting rate.

Excluding overtime, shift allowance, pension and a job for life.

The public sector have never had it better.

But sure keep giving them more and hello, another recession.

Will we blame the nurses this time?

Twenty Grand · 09-01-2019 11:21pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Peanuts? Really?

That’s a starting rate.

Excluding overtime, shift allowance, pension and a job for life.

The public sector have never had it better.

But sure keep giving them more and hello, another recession.

Will we blame the nurses this time?

No that's the average rate. And it's not much higher than most starting salaries in other professions.

If you think that's good you should go on strike yourself.

Lemonposset · 09-01-2019 11:22pm

This is a nurses salary for 2 weeks work. She works in ICU and has 2 post-graduate qualifications. She averages a 36 hr a week shift comprised of 3 x 13hr shifts, these shifts can be day or night, and she works every 2nd weekend. She is about 6 years qualified. Luas drivers make more money & that's not to disparage Luas drivers but this nurse is infinitely more qualified & doing more complex work under more stressful conditions. I work with nurses who would be better off on the dole, they'd have more money & see their families more.

Nurses deserve this pay rise so much, and I hope they get it. You can go on about them 'endangering' patients with a strike but the truth is that we've failed them and are endangering patients more by driving them out of Ireland to places where their value is recognised.

Alrigghtythen · 09-01-2019 11:27pm

Lemonposset wrote: »

This is a nurses salary for 2 weeks work. She works in ICU and has 2 post-graduate qualifications. She averages a 36 hr a week shift comprised of 3 x 13hr shifts, these shifts can be day or night, and she works every 2nd weekend. She is about 6 years qualified. Luas drivers make more money & that's not to disparage Luas drivers but this nurse is infinitely more qualified & doing more complex work under more stressful conditions. I work with nurses who would be better off on the dole, they'd have more money & see their families more.

Nurses deserve this pay rise so much, and I hope they get it. You can go on about them 'endangering' patients with a strike but the truth is that we've failed them and are endangering patients more by driving them out of Ireland to places where their value is recognised.

1483/fortnight, 741.50/week

How much do they want?

Wheeliebin30 · 09-01-2019 11:30pm

Twenty Grand wrote: »

No that's the average rate. And it's not much higher than most starting salaries in other professions.

If you think that's good you should go on strike yourself.

I should go on strike myself?

I work for myself.

I have no job security.
Pension.
Union backing.
Job for life.
Guaranteed wage every week.
Lunch and breakfast breaks
Etc etc

I get on with it, but it seems PS workers need to be breastfed at every point of their lives.

Twenty Grand · 09-01-2019 11:35pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

I should go on strike myself?

I work for myself.

I have no job security.
Pension.
Union backing.
Job for life.
Guaranteed wage every week.
Lunch and breakfast breaks
Etc etc

I get on with it, but it seems PS workers need to be breastfed at every point of their lives.

The great thing about being self employed is that if you're good, none of those points matter

Mooooo · 09-01-2019 11:41pm

The public service unions sold out new graduates to save themselves . Also it doesn't matter what degree people graduate with a large portion leave to go travelling etc because they want to, over half my own course did when there was plenty jobs at home

Tell me how · 09-01-2019 11:45pm

Rubberchikken wrote: »

whats with the adoration for nurses?
they do a job. they dont perform miracles. yes they deserve a fair pay but so too does every othet worker.
the elevation of nurses and teachers in this country is inexplicable.

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

They are put up on a pedestal even though there is many other professions just as important if not more than nurses.

I think they do an incredibly difficult job and I feel that many of them who are dedicated really do deserve to be well paid.

Every nurse is not florence nightingale any more than every factory worker, trades person, solicitor, accountant or teacher is of an above average standard but the average nurse does an excellent and critical job in my opinion.

They are on their feet a large portion of the time if not all day, they have significant responsibility towards the experience of the patients, they serve an element in some degree of patient assessment and they must be empathetic when doing so.

But, if the average is currently €57K for this work and they have a guaranteed job, and pension then I feel it is just reward for what is expected of them.

If the average salary is wrong as it is skewed by numbers of nurses deemed as managers then that is a problem within the nurses own remit to address.

Ninthlife · 09-01-2019 11:48pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

I should go on strike myself?

I work for myself.

I have no job security.
Pension.
Union backing.
Job for life.
Guaranteed wage every week.
Lunch and breakfast breaks
Etc etc

I get on with it, but it seems PS workers need to be breastfed at every point of their lives.

So because you are self employed you dont take breaks..?

So nurses shouldnt be allowed breakfast or lunch

You chose self employment so you knew there was no guaranteed wage

Why bring these up as issues

TCM · 09-01-2019 11:50pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote:

Do you think throwing money at them will make them work harder?

Why? Do you think they don't work hard enough?

Wheeliebin30 · 09-01-2019 11:51pm

Ninthlife wrote: »

So because you are self employed you dont take breaks..?

So nurses shouldnt be allowed breakfast or lunch

You chose self employment so you knew there was no guaranteed wage

Why bring these up as issues

Nurses chose this job knowing what it’s like.

Why should they bring their issues up??????????

TCM · 09-01-2019 11:52pm

Mad_maxx wrote:

He's a tax payer

So what, every is.

road_high · 09-01-2019 11:53pm

Mooooo wrote: »

The public service unions sold out new graduates to save themselves . Also it doesn't matter what degree people graduate with a large portion leave to go travelling etc because they want to, over half my own course did when there was plenty jobs at home

Threw them under the bus in 2010 to save their own arses and salaries. Now using them as weapons against the state for pay rises. What a bunch of charlatans

TCM · 09-01-2019 11:54pm

Bubbaclaus wrote:

Unions have ruined this country. They used to serve a very necessary purpose, but these days its just constant calling of strikes in order to get paid more and more.

In fact not so - less strikes now than in the past.

Sardonicat · 09-01-2019 11:56pm

TCM wrote: »

Wheeliebin30 wrote:

Do you think throwing money at them will make them work harder?

Why? Do you think they don't work hard enough?

I don't think paying nurses more will do anything to im prove the health service. Some ( most) nurses work very, very hard indeed. Within an appallingly ran system.

Edgware · 09-01-2019 11:57pm

Twenty Grand wrote: »

Good on you dad. We should base our entire health system on his Sunday afternoon observation :rolleyes:

We shouldnt ignore this either. But then of course many people have swallowed the Florence Nightingale Nurse Vocation line.

Ninthlife · 09-01-2019 11:58pm

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Nurses chose this job knowing what it’s like.

Why should they bring their issues up??????????

We all chose jobs knowing to some degree of what they entailed. Nurses being unionised obviously feel based on their duties/conditions etc want better pay.

You stating im self employed i dont take breaks is bull, you could also have a pension if you wish, just pay into one as the nurses do.