Asylum Seekers Getting Apartments in Ballinamore - mod warning in OP (18/10)

Boggles · 25-10-2019 12:09pm

Gatling wrote: »

I didn't say that but the facts on asylum seekers and crimes speak for themselves and it's widely reported but for some reason certain media outlets seem to ignore /censor reports on it

Ah you did. Own your words lad.

Gatling wrote: »

Unfortunately Christianity doesn't have a say ,I'm sure when tourists complain of harrasment ,crime and likely serious assaults ,the islandslers will quickly about face

The meedja are not ignoring anything.

It's a narrative peddled largely by ne'er do wells who have zero proof to back up their racist nonsense.

25-10-2019 12:29pm

Gatling wrote: »

I didn't say that but the facts on asylum seekers and crimes speak for themselves and it's widely reported but for some reason certain media outlets seem to ignore /censor reports on it

What facts are they then?
That some asylum seekers commit crimes? That's true, some do.
Some Irish people also commit crimes.
Just FYI, crimes are committed by all types of people in all walks of life.

Gatling · 25-10-2019 12:32pm

bubblypop wrote: »

What facts are they then?
That some asylum seekers commit crimes? That's true,

Were agreed so .

25-10-2019 12:34pm

Gatling wrote: »

Were agreed so .

Way to edit my post, at least other posters can see what you're doing.

enricoh · 25-10-2019 12:42pm

The tánaiste wants no more tds sticking their head over the parapet and questioning the benefits of the asylum spoofer industry. Can all tds please sing off the same hymn sheet, the media have signed up, ta!

https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEEDjPMEA2fpp2XBG6omSja0qGAgEKg8IACoHCAowyNLTATDN-jUwjbOhAQ?hl=en-IE&gl=IE&ceid=IE%3Aen

Tánaiste Simon Coveney has now warned all public representatives that they have an obligation to speak out against “hysterical language” being used to describe people seeking asylum in Ireland.

Boggles · 25-10-2019 12:47pm

enricoh wrote: »

The tánaiste wants no more tds sticking their head over the parapet and questioning the benefits of the asylum spoofer industry. Can all tds please sing off the same hymn sheet, the media have signed up, ta!

https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEEDjPMEA2fpp2XBG6omSja0qGAgEKg8IACoHCAowyNLTATDN-jUwjbOhAQ?hl=en-IE&gl=IE&ceid=IE%3Aen

Tánaiste Simon Coveney has now warned all public representatives that they have an obligation to speak out against “hysterical language” being used to describe people seeking asylum in Ireland.

So an elected law maker has received a txt message stating he should be executed and you pull Coveney's perfectly reasonable response as the thing you have issue with in that article. You are further proof that he is spot on.

:pac:

alastair · 25-10-2019 12:48pm

Gatling wrote: »

I didn't say that but the facts on asylum seekers and crimes speak for themselves and it's widely reported but for some reason certain media outlets seem to ignore /censor reports on it

https://www.forbes.com/sites/freylindsay/2019/08/29/refugees-in-germany-did-not-bring-higher-risk-to-germans/

4068ac1elhodqr · 25-10-2019 12:50pm

bubblypop wrote: »

What facts are they then?
That some asylum seekers commit crimes? That's true, some do.
Some Irish people also commit crimes.
Just FYI, crimes are committed by all types of people in all walks of life.

Some enthicities and ideologies are more prone to criminal activities. Making false and misleading asylum applications is only the start of it, when rejected the oragnised crime, gang-related and black tax-free market likely beckons next for them.

Also, if you take a quick look at prison stats over in Eng&W you'll observe that the religion of peace has 300% over-representation. White natives are actually down 10%, in the decade upto 2016.

Now some other ethnicities excel even beyond white natives in earning potential, namely Chinese and Indian (usually arrive on Uni/student visas), who are a really great bunch of lads, for the most part. At the very, very bottom of earnings (p/hr) are both Pakistan and Bangladeshi nationals.

biko · 25-10-2019 12:50pm

alastair wrote: »

https://www.forbes.com/sites/freylindsay/2019/08/29/refugees-in-germany-did-not-bring-higher-risk-to-germans/

The report is somewhat at odds with other sporadic studies that have emerged in Germany since the migrant crisis, such as one from 2018 which seemed to suggest that a rise in crime in Lower Saxony during 2015 and 2016 could be mostly attributed to the large inflow of migrants.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-45419466

The claim: The deputy leader of the far-right party Alternative for Germany (AfD) said there had been "447 killings and murders" by illegal migrants in Germany last year.

Reality Check verdict: The German interior ministry says that in fact last year 27 illegal migrants either committed or attempted to commit murder or manslaughter. The 447 figure refers to killings or attempted killings by all asylum seekers and refugees, most of whom are in Germany legally. Overall crime in Germany has fallen to the lowest level since 1992, but there has been an increase in migrant crime.

Fun fact

Then, on 9 September, there were rival far-right and left-wing demonstrations in Köthen, also in eastern Germany, after a German man died in an incident involving Afghan men

Can you spot the bias?
Here it is again "rival far-right and left-wing demonstrations"
Let's reverse it

Then, on 9 September, there were rival right-wing and far-left demonstrations in Köthen

25-10-2019 12:55pm

Marianna Little Stinker wrote: »

Some enthicities and ideologies are more prone to criminal activities. Making false and misleading asylum applications is only the start of it, when rejected the oragnised crime, gang-related and black tax-free market likely beckons next for them.

Also, if you take a quick look at prison stats over in Eng&W you'll observe that the religion of peace has 300% over-representation. White natives are actually down 10%, in the decade upto 2016.

Now some other ethnicities excel even beyond white natives in earning potential, namely Chinese and Indian (usually arrive on Uni/student visas), who are a really great bunch of lads, for the most part. At the very, very bottom of earnings (p/hr) are both Pakistan and Bangladeshi nationals.

I would suggest that someone's socioeconomic status is far more of an indicator to whether or not they will become involved in crime.
So, if those statistics you listed could be like fat again, with the incomes, education etc if offenders listed, instead of lazy race &/or religion, I think we could find the real reasons.

Also, when asylum claims are rejected, most eventually leave Ireland themselves, some are subject of deportation orders. Some do try the appeals process, if unsuccessful, they are also subject to deportation orders.

alastair · 25-10-2019 1:00pm

bubblypop wrote: »

I would suggest that someone's socioeconomic status is far more of an indicator to whether or not they will become involved in crime.
So, if those statistics you listed could be like fat again, with the incomes, education etc if offenders listed, instead of lazy race &/or religion, I think we could find the real reasons.

Also, when asylum claims are rejected, most eventually leave Ireland themselves, some are subject of deportation orders. Some do try the appeals process, if unsuccessful, they are also subject to deportation orders.

Racial profiling plays it's role in UK sentencing too:

For every 100 white women given prison sentences at crown courts for drug offences, 227 black women were given the same.

For black men, it was 141 for every 100 white men.

4068ac1elhodqr · 25-10-2019 1:01pm

bubblypop wrote: »

I would suggest that someone's socioeconomic status is far more of an indicator to whether or not they will become involved in crime.
So, if those statistics you listed could be like fat again, with the incomes, education etc if offenders listed, instead of lazy race &/or religion, I think we could find the real reasons.

When certain ideologies don't allow females to attend Uni on their own, or have an independent work life, then yes, poverty will indeed become a perma-feature and self trapping event.

bubblypop wrote: »

Also, when asylum claims are rejected, most eventually leave Ireland themselves.

Yet no evidence has been provided to support this 'theory' (other than random google links to nothingness). The only facts we have at hand are that a small number/percentage were removed.

We could also theorise that many dissapear into the black market or criminal underworld. The recent 'operation: Vantage' exposed a shed load of sham marriges and illegal taxi-licences being obtained using fraudulent means.

4068ac1elhodqr · 25-10-2019 1:05pm

alastair wrote: »

Racial profiling plays it's role in UK sentencing too:

Random unfounded speculation. Courts tend to use something called 'evidence' these days. Hello?

Guess what, the majority of the victims and assailants of the London knifing carry-on, are black or mixed-ethnicities. That's because they're mostly involved in it, great surprise.

Boggles · 25-10-2019 1:10pm

bubblypop wrote: »

I would suggest that someone's socioeconomic status is far more of an indicator to whether or not they will become involved in crime.

Yes, The funny thing is he has proven the above with his own links about economic activity and crime stats.

But he is trying to shoe horn in the CT that certain large groups of people are just born bad.

It's carnage to watch.

biko · 25-10-2019 1:11pm

Marianna Little Stinker wrote: »

That's because they're mostly involved in it, great surprise.

Do you have a source for this? It sounds pretty racist.

alastair · 25-10-2019 1:11pm

Marianna Little Stinker wrote: »

Yet no evidence has been provided to support this 'theory' (other than random google links to nothingness). The only facts we have at hand are that a small number/percentage were removed.

We could also theorise that many dissapear into the black market or criminal underworld. The recent 'operation: Vantage' exposed a shed load of sham marriges and illegal taxi-licences being obtained using fraudulent means.

Did any of those sham marriages or taxi licences expose these supposed ex-asylum seekers? Nope. Because there's been zero evidence of any failed asylum seekers not leaving the country, let alone being involved in any criminality. The 'theory' that people served with deportation orders remain here is supported by precisely nothing.

alastair · 25-10-2019 1:13pm

Marianna Little Stinker wrote: »

Random unfounded speculation. Courts tend to use something called 'evidence' these days. Hello?

You seem to have managed to miss that everyone in my stats were found guilty. It's nothing to do with evidence, it's to do with sentencing bias.

25-10-2019 1:15pm

Some enthicities and ideologies are more prone to criminal activities.

If it is down to ethnicity or ideology (religion?) then maybe it applies to Irish Catholics :

Figures have shown that when this wave of Irish people got to the United States, a lot of them got involved in criminality.

In statistics listed in an article on news website Prado and taken from the book, Immigrant Life in New York City, 1825–1863, Irish people were shown to cause a lot of trouble in the city.

Some of the statistics listed are quite staggering.

More than half of all crime committed in New York in the 1850s was by Irish-born individuals.

In 1858 the Irish accounted for 35% of all of the prostitutes arrested in the city.

More than half of all those committed to NYC prison in 1858 were Irish-born.

In 1859, 74% of those convicted of drunk and disorderly conduct before the NY Court of Special Sessions were Irish-born. https://www.thejournal.ie/irish-united-states-commit-crime-fighting-dangerous-2004406-Mar2015/

Or just maybe there are other factors involved?

biko · 25-10-2019 1:24pm

bubblypop wrote: »

I would suggest that someone's socioeconomic status is far more of an indicator to whether or not they will become involved in crime.

So immigrants are poorer and thus more likely to commit crimes?

4068ac1elhodqr · 25-10-2019 1:27pm

biko wrote: »

Do you have a source for this? It sounds pretty racist.

It sounds pretty ignorant, even directly misleading not to acknowledge that.

..That the knifing epidemic in London doesn't have a certain race or mixed race factor attached to it.
It started off with the 'grime rap' scene and has since escilated to county-lines and gang activity, surely this is basic common knowledge by now.

4068ac1elhodqr · 25-10-2019 1:28pm

biko wrote: »

So immigrants are poorer and thus more likely to commit crimes?

Some immigrants elevate themselves, by themselves, up and beyond.

Others often due to cultural factors, tend not to.

4068ac1elhodqr · 25-10-2019 1:31pm

alastair wrote: »

It's nothing to do with evidence, it's to do with sentencing bias.

Sounds like you have a great big case for the UN and international courts of human right s('if') there is any truth to this 'Conspiracy Theory'.

alastair · 25-10-2019 1:34pm

Marianna Little Stinker wrote: »

Sounds like you have a great big case for the UN and international courts of human right s('if') there is any truth to this 'Conspiracy Theory'.

It’s not any conspiracy theory. It’s evidenced by the stats.

4068ac1elhodqr · 25-10-2019 1:37pm

alastair wrote: »

It’s not any conspiracy theory. It’s evidenced by the stats.

As said, take this 'theory of yours' to the UN or somewhere, where it can be addressed properly.

alastair · 25-10-2019 1:39pm

Marianna Little Stinker wrote: »

As said, take this 'theory of yours' to the UN or somewhere, where it can be addressed properly.

Nothing to do with the UN. It’s a domestic issue for the U.K.

SafeSurfer · 25-10-2019 1:42pm

alastair wrote: »

Did any of those sham marriages or taxi licences expose these supposed ex-asylum seekers? Nope. Because there's been zero evidence of any failed asylum seekers not leaving the country, let alone being involved in any criminality. The 'theory' that people served with deportation orders remain here is supported by precisely nothing.

Actually it is a fact that less than 20% of deportation orders are carried out.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/less-than-a-fifth-of-deportation-orders-carried-out-1.3680876%3fmode=amp

Boggles · 25-10-2019 1:44pm

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Actually it is a fact that less than 20% of deportation orders are carried out.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/less-than-a-fifth-of-deportation-orders-carried-out-1.3680876%3fmode=amp

Don't just read the head line lad.

Some 5,504 people facing deportation have been granted permission to remain following a re-examination of their case since 2011. Another 2,245 returned home voluntarily. So far this year, 174 people facing deportation have chosen to leave voluntarily.

Maths eh?

alastair · 25-10-2019 1:46pm

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Actually it is a fact that less than 20% of deportation orders are carried out.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/less-than-a-fifth-of-deportation-orders-carried-out-1.3680876%3fmode=amp

You’re confusing deportation order enforcement with deportation order compliance.

4068ac1elhodqr · 25-10-2019 1:46pm

alastair wrote: »

Nothing to do with the UN. It’s a domestic issue for the U.K.

Sounds like you've got a great 'story' that the like of the Guardian/BBC would only be too happy to publish, again if it has any foundation to it. Once it gets proper national exposure it will likely be addressed.

Again, if assuming it's not some 'unfounded CT' and you have accurate details on every single case, and 'clear evidence of bias' for every single case you claim it occured upon.

SafeSurfer · 25-10-2019 1:47pm

Boggles wrote: »

Don't just read the head line lad.

Maths eh?

Yes, maths the assertion was there was no evidence that people served with deportation orders remain in the state. Obviously this is not the case.

4068ac1elhodqr · 25-10-2019 1:48pm

alastair wrote: »

You’re confusing deportation order enforcement with deportation order compliance.

Also, it sounds like you're confusing a 'request of sorts', with actual 'verified completion' of the said request.

Boggles · 25-10-2019 1:48pm

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Yes, maths the assertion was there was no evidence that people served with deportation orders remain in the state. Obviously this is not the case.

Again it's in your link. I even highlighted it for you.

Some 5,504 people facing deportation have been granted permission to remain following a re-examination of their case

alastair · 25-10-2019 1:49pm

Marianna Little Stinker wrote: »

Sounds like you've got a great 'story' that the like of the Guardian/BBC would only be too happy to publish, again if it has any foundation to it. Once it gets proper national exposure it will likely be addressed.

Again, if assuming it's not some 'unfounded CT' and you have accurate details on every single case, and 'clear evidence of bias' for every single case you claim it occured upon.

Happily there’s already a govt review of the issue underway.

Gatling · 25-10-2019 1:50pm

bubblypop wrote: »

Way to edit my post, at least other posters can see what you're doing.

Lol

alastair · 25-10-2019 1:51pm

Marianna Little Stinker wrote: »

Also, it sounds like you're confusing a 'request of sorts', with actual 'verified completion' of the said request.

No - it’s pretty simple concept. Deportation orders can be complied with, or failing that, will have to be enforced. A small minority require enforcement.

Gatling · 25-10-2019 1:52pm

alastair wrote: »

No - it’s pretty simple concept. Deportation orders can be complied with, or failing that, will have to be enforced. A small minority require enforcement.

Can you back it up ,

It's a fact 7400 people have not been deported despite deportations orders been issued

4068ac1elhodqr · 25-10-2019 1:54pm

alastair wrote: »

No - it’s pretty simple concept. Deportation orders can be complied with, or failing that, will have to be enforced. A small minority require enforcement.

Unless actually escorted to the actual plane seat, compliance may be a rather loose term. It's an order that acts more like a request, hence the fuzzy 'voluntary' aspect, of relying on it actually being acted upon.

SafeSurfer · 25-10-2019 1:57pm

alastair wrote: »

No - it’s pretty simple concept. Deportation orders can be complied with, or failing that, will have to be enforced. A small minority require enforcement.

Are you suggesting that all individuals on whom deportation orders have been issued have either left voluntarily, been deported or are have been granted leave to stay/appeal?

Boggles · 25-10-2019 1:58pm

Any idea where all these supposed illegal failed asylum seekers are hiding?

The suggestion was there was 60,000+ of them, Leitrim?

Gatling · 25-10-2019 2:00pm

Marianna Little Stinker wrote: »

Also, it sounds like you're confusing a 'request of sorts', with actual 'verified completion' of the said request.

We've had this unvarfied claim across multiple threads and yet it isn't backed up with anything other than a personal opinion

alastair · 25-10-2019 2:00pm

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Yes, maths the assertion was there was no evidence that people served with deportation orders remain in the state. Obviously this is not the case.

It is the case. Asylum seekers are now only issued with deportation orders when their appeal options are exhausted. The only mechanisms remaining are a ministerial amnesty (quickly applied or dismissed) or if they have a close family member in DP awaiting a judgement, and consequently family reunification might apply. If a determination that the family member doesn’t achieve protected status, then deportation orders apply to both.

Otherwise, there’s no means of remaining in the State for failed asylum seekers. And which is why there’s zero evidence of any evading deportation.

Ballso · 25-10-2019 2:01pm

Dublin 8 mostly I'd say.

You're so virtuous boggles.

Gatling · 25-10-2019 2:01pm

Boggles wrote: »

Any idea where all these supposed illegal failed asylum seekers are hiding

Across 27 counties

SafeSurfer · 25-10-2019 2:01pm

alastair wrote: »

No - it’s pretty simple concept. Deportation orders can be complied with, or failing that, will have to be enforced. A small minority require enforcement.

Are you suggesting that all individuals on whom deportation orders have been issued have either left voluntarily, been deported or are have been granted leave to stay/appeal?

alastair · 25-10-2019 2:02pm

Gatling wrote: »

We've had this unvarfied claim across multiple threads and yet it isn't backed up with anything other than a personal opinion

And the absolute lack of evidence for any failed asylum seekers remaining in the country following deportation orders.

Boggles · 25-10-2019 2:03pm

Ballso wrote: »

Dublin 8 mostly I'd say.

You have evidence of 60,000 failed asylum seekers in Dublin 8? Handy enough in terms of rounding them up. Have you notified anyone?

Ballso wrote: »

You're so virtuous boggles.

Thank you.

Boggles · 25-10-2019 2:05pm

Gatling wrote: »

Across 27 counties

27? Really?

Of course you have proof?

In your own good time lad.

SafeSurfer · 25-10-2019 2:05pm

alastair wrote: »

And the absolute lack of evidence for any failed asylum seekers remaining in the country following deportation orders.

You have absolutely no evidence that the thousands of failed asylum seekers who have “gone missing” have not remained in ireland.

Boggles · 25-10-2019 2:05pm

SafeSurfer wrote: »

You have absolutely no evidence that the thousands of failed asylum seekers who have “gone missing” have not remained in ireland.

Have you proof they have?

Link it up if you do please.

Gatling · 25-10-2019 2:06pm

alastair wrote: »

And the absolute lack of evidence for any failed asylum seekers remaining in the country following deportation orders.

Even a government official said it and here you and only you are here denying it .

Asylum Seekers Getting Apartments in Ballinamore - mod warning in OP (18/10)

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