Suicide and men.

Middle Man · 27-03-2018 2:26am

iptba wrote: »

https://twitter.com/matthaig1/status/978251398914760704

In the current social climate, it’s a great idea. These are 84 people!

iptba · 03-05-2018 1:36am

As Verne Troyer dies aged 49, why we need to take male depression and suicide extremely seriously

http://metro.co.uk/2018/04/21/verne-troyer-dies-aged-49-need-take-male-depression-suicide-extremely-seriously-7486750/

ted1 · 28-08-2018 10:45am

Just checking , has anyone else received vile PMs from A Maggie Fehily?

Das Reich · 29-08-2018 1:56pm

ted1 wrote: »

Just checking , has anyone else received vile PMs from A Maggie Fehily?

Yes me. Saying I am an African shi* (i am South American she clearly doesn't know the difference) and racist insults hoping someone in my family dies.

Wibbs · 29-08-2018 2:57pm

They've been nuked from the site. And good riddance.

iptba · 30-08-2018 2:23am

https://imgur.com/a/HkxzyK8

iptba · 13-10-2018 5:48am

10 Surprising Facts About Men's Mental Health

Today is World Mental Health Day (Wednesday 10th October 2018) and to mark the day we've produced a list of 10 surprising facts about men and boys' mental health, some of which you may not know.

If you share our commitment to creating a healthier future for men and boys then we invite you to share this information with others. We'd also love to hear from you about any news, research, information, events or programs focused on men’s mental health that you think we should be promoting.

https://www.amhf.org.au/10_surprising_facts_about_men_s_mental_health

iptba · 18-11-2018 4:25am

https://www.cardiffstudents.com/your-voice/campaigns/alrightmate/

The ‘Alright Mate?’ campaign - launching on International Men’s day - is a response to the alarmingly high rate of male suicide in the UK. Suicide is the biggest killer of UK men under 45, and in Great Britain alone, an average of 84 men take their own life per week.

The AlrightMate campaign aims to:
Raise awareness and start important discussion around this topic
Improve visibility and access to support services
Break down the stigma people may face for opening up about their emotional wellbeing
Encourage every Cardiff University student regardless of gender or identity that they are entitled to support, and that speaking up and speaking out about mental health is a STRENGTH, and NOT a weakness.

For help and support you can click here to see all the services available to you. You can also check out the intranet for more information.
Warning: the following video contains some sensitive content.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYQSXYI6IPg

iptba · 19-11-2018 1:47am

https://twitter.com/MBCoalition/status/950671097283923968

iptba · 19-11-2018 3:31am

https://twitter.com/depressionnote/status/1064323172659531776

noubliezjamais · 24-02-2019 8:41pm

I've been suicidal myself and did encounter the "harsh/tough love" attitudes (which don't help at all in fairness) expressed in the thread in real life.

My dad was like the first poster but did it in an insiduous way. My guidance counsellor was less so, though he kind of made things worse. Remember coming to him when repeating 5th year and he said "I had students who heard their mothers were being beaten nearly every day and they didn't want to kill themselves".

So much for support. I don't know how that helps. Even if someone else has it worse, the fact is you still come back to your life and your problems. I'm from a third world country as one of these people says to visit and live there. I've gone on long breaks, came back, and only felt "better" for a few days. The Still suicidal but want to repeat and go to college.

iptba · 27-08-2019 1:06pm

https://www.jwatch.org/fw115754/2019/08/27/va-offers-suicide-prevention-guidelines-face-climbing

Current guidelines on suicide prevention from the Department of Veterans Affairs are "as good as one will now find," but "unlikely to dramatically reduce the burden of veteran suicide," according to separate commentaries in the Annals of Internal Medicine.

I thought this was interesting:

An editorialist, while praising the guidelines criticizes the underlying evidence, pointing out, for instance, that while trials of psychotherapy include mostly women, almost 80% of suicides are men. In addition, drug trials are often industry-sponsored. He invites the system "to ask questions and conduct research that we in the United States have avoided thus far."

iptba · 01-10-2019 10:49pm

I saw this today:

The annual report for 2018 for the HSE’s National Office for Suicide Prevention has just been published. There were 352 suicides in the year, down 40 on the previous year. 282 were male, 70 were female. The full report may be read here https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/list/4/mental-health-services/connecting-for-life/news/nosp-annual-report-2018.pdf

iptba · 08-01-2020 4:54pm

A US study so I'm not sure how relevant it is to Ireland:

https://www.jwatch.org/fw116219/2020/01/08/higher-minimum-wage-tied-lower-suicide-risk

Higher Minimum Wage Tied to Lower Suicide Risk

By Amy Orciari Herman

Edited by David G. Fairchild, MD, MPH, and Lorenzo Di Francesco, MD, FACP, FHM

Adults living in states with higher minimum wages might face lower risk for suicide, according to a study in the Journal of Epidemiology and Community Health.

U.S. researchers examined data on state minimum wages and suicide rates from 1990 through 2015. They estimated that among adults aged 18 to 64 with a high school diploma or less, each $1 increase in the minimum wage was associated with a 3.5% reduction in suicide risk. The association between higher minimum wage and lower risk was strongest when unemployment was high. No such association was seen among people with college degrees.

The researchers note: "Our findings are consistent with the notion that policies designed to improve the livelihoods of individuals with less education, who are more likely to work at lower wages and at higher risk for adverse mental health outcomes, can reduce the suicide risk in this group."

Sleepy · 08-01-2020 5:01pm

Hardly seems surprising that areas with lower levels of poverty experience lower suicide rates?

worded · 23-01-2020 2:28am

Ted talk on depression. 1 in 8 NZ on meds if I heard right.

https://youtu.be/3dqXHHCc5lA

Suicide, soneones permanent Sollution to a temporary problem

LoughNeagh2017 · 25-01-2020 5:56pm

I most likely will die via own hands in 30 years when i am in 50's. I cannot guarantee that though as who knows what pills will be on the market at that time. As things stand i only intend to live for as long as parents live as it would be a cruel thing to die whilst they are alive. I don't have the mental strength, personality or skills to survive in this world. Just think about it logically, I will be in my 50s, all alone and broken by the world and still faced with another 10-15 years of work, why should i have to suffer through that? I can understand why it would be wrong for a man with children to kill themselves but why would it be wrong for a loner? The funny thing is the neighbours will probably say "It was a rash decision" yet I would have had it planned for 30 years.

SCOOP 64 · 25-01-2020 6:06pm

i hope you look back at this post when you are in your fifty's with a partner and maybe surrounded with your own kids and happy and think what was i saying.

howamidifferent · 25-01-2020 6:42pm

LoughNeagh2017 wrote:

I most likely will die via own hands in 30 years when i am in 50's. I cannot guarantee that though as who knows what pills will be on the market at that time. As things stand i only intend to live for as long as parents live as it would be a cruel thing to die whilst they are alive. I don't have the mental strength, personality or skills to survive in this world. Just think about it logically, I will be in my 50s, all alone and broken by the world and still faced with another 10-15 years of work, why should i have to suffer through that? I can understand why it would be wrong for a man with children to kill themselves but why would it be wrong for a loner? The funny thing is the neighbours will probably say "It was a rash decision" yet I would have had it planned for 30 years.

If you are now only in your twenties and don't want to work after 55 then you have 30 years to plan for your retirement at 55. If you stay single with no kids then max out on contributions into a pension plan, there would be no reason you could not retire at 55 financially secure for another 30 years to enjoy life. You have all the time you need to put that plan in place and secure your financial future.

Pawwed Rig · 25-01-2020 9:40pm

Your outlook on life changes significantly as you get older. The me in my 20's 20 years ago is a completely different animal to the me in my mid 40's.
My teens and 20s were a rough time for me. I had little confidence and a very poor self image along with a tendency towards depression.
20 years on I am still the same me but without the confidence issues and the self image issues as tbh I stopped giving a crap what other people thought about me. The depression still comes and goes but I am better able to deal with it now by keeping busy etc.
I wish I could talk to my teenage self and give some advise.

statto25 · 03-02-2020 11:45am

LoughNeagh2017 wrote: »

I most likely will die via own hands in 30 years when i am in 50's. I cannot guarantee that though as who knows what pills will be on the market at that time. As things stand i only intend to live for as long as parents live as it would be a cruel thing to die whilst they are alive. I don't have the mental strength, personality or skills to survive in this world. Just think about it logically, I will be in my 50s, all alone and broken by the world and still faced with another 10-15 years of work, why should i have to suffer through that? I can understand why it would be wrong for a man with children to kill themselves but why would it be wrong for a loner? The funny thing is the neighbours will probably say "It was a rash decision" yet I would have had it planned for 30 years.

Pills are not the answer in my opinion, talking is. I think the importance of talking to a professional about what you're feeling is as important as taking medication. Medication is important as it can help with fatigue, irritability etc but in reality the depression or suicidal thoughts are still there but are being suppressed. The key to finding out why you feel this way is to talk and keep talking until you come to terms with it.

I myself are currently going through a very rough time and have suicidal thoughts almost every day. I have spent my life depressed going back to my childhood and this depression has taken on many forms and in some ways made worse by the actions of others to "help" me.

It is only in the last 12 months I have decided to do something about it after having a huge realisation which is probably the most dramatic step ill ever take. I have lost family and time with my child over it and while these steps have brought on these thoughts of self harm, I feel like a I am in control of my destiny to an extent. These thoughts are from my own actions rather than the input of others. I am trying to work towards a better life where my happiness is genuine rather than happiness through materialistic things or an imposed happiness. Life is there to be enjoyed and not to be enjoyed because you should.
Talking to a professional although expensive has helped me no end. Without that support and in my case this was my only support unfortunately I would be dead, i've no doubt of that.

iptba · 30-05-2020 4:53pm

The number of women dying by suicide increased by almost 50 per cent last year compared with 2018, new figures show.

The data from a Central Statistics Office (CSO) report published on Friday shows 104 females died by suicide in 2019, compared with 70 the year before - an increase of 48.5 per cent.

CSO figures show 80 women also died in 2017 and 81 died in 2016.

There were 421 deaths by suicide last year, of which 317 were among males - an increase of 12 per cent from 282 in 2018.

The number of suicides last year represents an almost 20 per cent increase on 2018, when 352 were recorded. That had represented a decline, after the 392 recorded in 2017 and 399 in 2016.

Among the 421 deaths by suicide were three in the five years to 14 years age-group, 90 among 35 to 44-year-olds and two among people aged 85 or older.

For help call: Samaritans Free Call 116 123 or Pieta House 1800 247 247

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/number-of-women-dying-by-suicide-increased-by-almost-50-last-year-1.4266162

iptba · 22-07-2021 2:30am

I'm a big fan of this blogger/independent researcher.

Here's a recent article they put together. Unfortunately the language in this summary might be a bit difficult to understand for some people, perhaps?

http://empathygap.uk/Male%20Suicide.pdf

Author: Dr Rick Bradford (independent, author of The Empathy Gap, Ref.[1])

Web sites: http://empathygap.uk (blog); http://rickbradford.co.uk (professional)

Title: Male Suicide (England & Wales)

Extract:

The Peculiar Narrative on Male Suicide

As an illustration of prevailing narratives on male suicide I use those sections of Ref.[6] which relate to psychology, sociological issues, and “masculinities” (i.e., the prevailing narrative on gender). I make no attempt at a complete review in these very brief notes. My aim is to illustrate how exogenous factors are re-interpreted as internal factors, a tendency which – though probably unconscious by the authors of Ref.[6] – serves the purpose of aligning the proffered causality with the dominant discourses on gender. This is achieved by “pretzel logic”: a willingness to yield to confirmation bias by contorting explanations or by using misleading nomenclature. Some examples are,

[1] A key psychological factor identified is described as “socially prescribed perfectionism”. Social perfectionism is defined as the perception that one must always meet the expectations of others, coupled with these prescribed standards being unrealistic. Note how the use of the word “perfectionism” in this context is inappropriate. What is actually being identified is “social obligation” or perhaps “socially imposed burden”. The distinction between “perfectionism” and “obligation” or “burden” is crucial and revealing. “Perfectionism” suggests the fault lies within the mind of the man in question: a character flaw or psychological weakness. In contrast, the words “obligation” or “burden”, which seem more apposite, indicate an imposition upon the man from society. The distinction is therefore between victim blaming and being victimised. Narratives surrounding male disadvantages almost always favour the former.

[2] We read “where children are involved…..relationship breakdowns are likely to have an impact on men’s identity as fathers”. But the problem is not “men’s identity as fathers”, an internal issue, but rather the external issue of men’s access to children. It is being permitted to be a father – by the ex-partner, by the courts and by the State - that is actually the issue. This is another example of how a form of words is used to make an exogenous factor seem like a psychological factor, and thus to facilitate its transmogrification into a failing of the man himself, rather than a socially imposed disadvantage.

[3] The approved narrative regarding the role of men’s stoicism appears repeatedly, for example in this quote,

“The inability to express distressing emotion has been viewed as a risk factor for suicide and the argument that some forms of masculinity position men as stoical and unwilling to seek help has meant that emotions talk by men has come under scrutiny.”

But the evidential support offered for this oft-repeated thesis is very weak. Psychologist Steven Pinker has poured scorn on this notion, Ref.[14], referring to the “dogma”…

“that repressing emotions is bad and expressing them is good - a folk theory with roots in romanticism, Freudian psychoanalysis, and Hollywood, but which is contradicted by a large literature showing that people with greater self-control, particularly those who repress anger rather than “venting,” lead healthier lives: they get better grades, have fewer eating disorders, drink less, have fewer psychosomatic aches and pains, are less depressed, anxious, phobic, and paranoid, have higher self-esteem, are more conscientious, have better relationships with their families, have more stable friendships, are less likely to have sex they regretted, and are less likely to imagine themselves cheating in a monogamous relationship.” Ref.[15] concurs, concluding that traditional masculine ideology is a protective factor, not the reverse.

In fairness to the authors of Ref.[6], there is much in their discussions which point to other factors, particularly socioeconomic and other exogenous factors. For example, the psychologists, despite their discipline, observe that, “This point (i.e., the significance of socioeconomics) has not been adequately recognised in suicide prevention strategies which tend to be dominated by psychiatric and mental health research.” In this context they ask a reasonable question, “Is it feasible or sensible for the Samaritans to alter their longstanding approach to callers by becoming more adept at helping people think through financial problems as well as emotional problems?”

[4] As a final example, in the discussion on “masculinities” the claim is made that men’s suicide might be related to the “failure to achieve hegemonic masculinity”. This position on hegemonic masculinity is yet another example of converting exogenous causes into internal causes by verbal legerdemain. Unemployment or separation from partner or children is recast as failure to achieve hegemonic masculinity. The failure to achieve hegemonic masculinity is then held to be the cause of increased suicide risk. But why not simply say that unemployment or separation causes increased suicide risk? Why bring the concept of hegemonic masculinity into the picture at all? I suggest the answer is because it reallocates blame from society back onto the man himself.

H3llR4iser · 24-08-2021 10:29am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117644842#Comment_117644842

Long story short, the issue is that general narrative wants to say that if you're unhappy/depressed/worse, it's your own fault - it's as old as the world, really. You see it everywhere - even on these very forums; "Relationship advice" - usually, the reaction to guys asking about something is "it's your own fault". There is, or at least there was, a private "online dating" forum, I had access to it for a while before losing interest, where the exact same would happen - guy asks why he can't get matches, what follows is not advice but a shower of mockery, accusations about having a bad "attitude" and most amusingly, "advice" about having to entirely changing who you are.

Heck, on occasion we see it even in this channel, it's so deeply ingrained into our culture that we don't even realize it happens.

youngblood · 04-02-2022 2:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117644842#Comment_117644842

Having lost 2 close friends to suicide, both male, 1 a member here, these narratives put words on the exact thing I would always try and describe which were the root cause of their suicides. Frighteningly accurate.

Bobtheman · 04-06-2022 5:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2056974955/suicide-and-men

Have you got therapy since? How are you now?

Bobtheman · 04-06-2022 5:51pm

There is a very good forum mentalhealthforum. Net

Practically every mental illnesses under the sun has a thread.

Remember life is insane and mental illness is in a way a sane response to the insanity.

auplant · 17-10-2022 7:51pm

Here is why I wouldn't go through with suicide. If you would go through with it, then some horrible person out there gets to live longer than you. Something about that simply bugs me too much. They live on laughing and smiling in the vein of your death.

iptba · 11-12-2023 12:19am

This isn't specific to suicide but I couldn't think of another thread that it fitted on

“Men won't CLAM up if you're male-friendly!” A brief guide to supporting men’s mental health.

Opinion

Clinical Health and Wellbeing

Nov 18

Written By John Barry

https://www.centreformalepsychology.com/male-psychology-magazine-listings/men-wont-clam-up-if-youre-male-friendly-a-brief-guide-to-supporting-mens-mental-health

Irishguy10 · 11-01-2024 2:34am

Kinda shocking to see the comments in here. Thought it would be support.

What to do when you’re in so much Physical pain and it seems to be permanent? I am angry/sad because of how it happened and how I’ve been treated by professionals. Is suicide ok then or do you still look down on it?

chops1990 · 13-01-2024 11:58pm

I think the amount of people who have suicidal thoughts or ideation is even greater than anyone suspects. I've had it myself. Comes and goes. On the other hand it's hard to tell if I'm not just being dramatic at those times because I know I'd never do it to myself. Young men glorify death, it's why young men are so easily led into wars.

Suicide is a permanent solution though, to temporary problems. Even if those problems feel permanent while enduring them.

DialecticAspirations · 15-05-2024 3:33pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121599967#Comment_121599967

Hope you're doing ok. Calling Samaritans as mentioned earlier is probably a good start. Reaching out to someone can only help.

Titanium11 · 18-07-2024 1:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121612930#Comment_121612930

I disagree with the phrase "suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem".

Most problems are not temporary.

In fact the people that commit suicide often do after years of struggle, or they commit suicide after experiencing a permanent problem.

For example one man I know that killed himself:

His father abandoned him as a child and wouldn't see him as an adult.

He killed himself over that.

His father abandoning him -was a permanent problem. Not a temporary one. It couldn't be changed.

Two other people that i know that killed themselves, did after experiencing a lifetime of mental illness. So that was a permanent problem not a temporary one, too

tohaltuwi · 18-07-2024 1:23pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122395603#Comment_122395603

Female voice here. Yes I agree, some problems can’t be reversed or solved, and are permanent or getting worse. I find my progressive MS seriously hard to cope with some days, other days when I feel a bit better I get Uber-defiant, write another blog post, create a cartoon, or complain t letter to health services 😁 Mental Health experts tell us we need to re-frame the situation in our minds and cha ge the way we think about it. Easier said than done.

My mental health is half driven by physical forces acting on my brain, and best rest & switching off, though I hate giving in, often brings about a positive change over a couple of days.

Titanium11 · 18-07-2024 1:27pm

As people point out,

If a dog was suffering for months, the vet would put the dog down.

If a human is suffering for years and years. I think there should be humane ways available to let that person end their life if they wish.

Titanium11 · 18-07-2024 1:30pm

Its hard because in one way I do absolutely see that if a person is suffering terribly, they should be allowed to end their own life.

And on the other hand, I do also see the terrible pain that suicide causes.

One of my close family members killed themselves , and we all suffered terribly for years over it, and we still do suffer now over it. I had to get therapy after it as I was so emotionally distraught

However ultimately it was his choice

iptba · 05-08-2024 4:23pm

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/suicide-toll-25pc-higher-than-officially-recorded-due-to-way-deaths-are-classified/a698554158.html

“Suicide toll 25pc ‘higher than officially recorded’ due to way deaths are classified

Most of those who died by suicide in 2021 were male.”

cj maxx · 03-09-2024 11:33pm

Those numbers are horrendous.

con___manx1 · 03-09-2024 11:58pm

Don't Think you undestand whst depression is with those comments. Its not feeling happy or sad its feeling nothing. Just an empty shell. Iv been there before a long time ago but never considered suicide but I can understand why people do it.

iptba · 06-09-2024 12:43pm

‘Men don’t talk enough’ – GAA and Samaritans mark 10-year partnership helping players with their mental health

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/men-dont-talk-enough-gaa-and-samaritans-mark-10-year-partnership-helping-players-with-their-mental-health/a1713559575.html

Suicide and men.

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