NEW 2020 Assistant Principal Officer Competition

Sarahlaois · 10-11-2020 5:26pm

Invitations are out for regional etray

Mervyn Skidmore · 10-11-2020 5:27pm

Sarahlaois wrote: »

Invitations are out for regional etray

Yep got mine. I didn't realise they were online, thought I'd get a day out in Dublin.

Pdbtsi · 10-11-2020 6:06pm

Just got this message:

As outlined to you previously Stage 3 of the selection process will comprise an online simulation exercise in the form of an e-tray.
Whereby you had been notified that you would be called in early January 2021, you are now being called to complete Stage 3 from the 17th November 2020.

Had gotten pretty comfortable with putting it out of my mind until January!

Irishder · 10-11-2020 7:22pm

Sarahlaois wrote: »

Invitations are out for regional etray

Yeah got that too.

Anyone have any tips on this, anywhere that i can practice?

Treetirty · 11-11-2020 7:36pm

Pdbtsi wrote: »

Just got this message:

As outlined to you previously Stage 3 of the selection process will comprise an online simulation exercise in the form of an e-tray.
Whereby you had been notified that you would be called in early January 2021, you are now being called to complete Stage 3 from the 17th November 2020.

Had gotten pretty comfortable with putting it out of my mind until January!

I'm the same, I had thought I could park it mentally until after Christmas but at least with e-trays you can't do much in terms of practice so it's just a matter of getting it done now!

Unless there are practice tests available online that I'm not aware of! As joptestprep.co.uk is great for the psychometric tests but I can't find any Civil Service Specific E-Trays for AP

Skaterpeemp · 12-11-2020 12:00pm

Hi does anyone know what is involved in this E-Tray? Is there a brief/report to write by a certain time while answering correspondence? or what? I've only ever done an E-tray for the EO role.

supersaint3 · 12-11-2020 12:05pm

Irishder wrote: »

Yeah got that too.

Anyone have any tips on this, anywhere that i can practice?

If I could give you one tip, have a super quiet house, be rested and do whatever focuses your mind (have a coffee, be fed and watered), turn off your phone and put it up under your pillow, no distractions whatsoever. Sit up straight, you'll definitely need a mouse, read everything carefully and maybe make a list on paper of your priority tasks if you have time - and time will be of the essence. Best of luck!

MOF Seat · 13-11-2020 4:29am

Has anyone that got through the final interview been called off the panel yet? And can I ask what number you were?

Thanks!

HannahR31 · 13-11-2020 10:29am

MOF Seat wrote: »

Has anyone that got through the final interview been called off the panel yet? And can I ask what number you were?

Thanks!

Hi! Yes I am starting on Monday week!

I was no 9 on interdepartmental and 20 on Open. I was called off the interdepartmental.

Sarahlaois · 13-11-2020 10:44am

HannahR31 wrote: »

Hi! Yes I am starting on Monday week!

I was no 9 on interdepartmental and 20 on Open. I was called off the interdepartmental.

Hi Hannah. Best of luck to you in your new job. Are the OOM's you quote regarding your original order of merit or the order of merit after you did your final interview? Thanks

HannahR31 · 13-11-2020 10:58am

Sarahlaois wrote: »

Hi Hannah. Best of luck to you in your new job. Are the OOM's you quote regarding your original order of merit or the order of merit after you did your final interview? Thanks

They were given after final interview. After stage 1 my oom was 80 on open and 47 on InterD. From what I can see there was no updated oom at any other stage until the end when I was put on the panel and was no. 9 on InterD panel and 18 on Open panel (I said 20 before but it was 18 I just checked).

supersaint3 · 13-11-2020 11:03am

HannahR31 wrote: »

They were given after final interview. After stage 1 my oom was 80 on open and 47 on InterD. From what I can see there was no updated oom at any other stage until the end when I was put on the panel and was no. 9 on InterD panel and 18 on Open panel (I said 20 before but it was 18 I just checked).

I was 20 on open and have accepted an offer and am going through clearance now if that helps anyone!

Sarahlaois · 13-11-2020 11:08am

supersaint3 wrote: »

I was 20 on open and have accepted an offer and am going through clearance now if that helps anyone!

Thanks Hannah ...thats really helpful. Best of luck on Monday

mojoviii · 13-11-2020 11:41am

For those asking for advice in the etray exercise, I believe from my own experience - and others' reported in this thread - that the format for etrays may have changed slightly.

In previous competitions I participated in, the format was to complete one large task, a scheduling rota, a Press Release draft, a formal letter responding to a query, etc. Something where you were given a decent amount of data to process and refine into a single document in the space of time allotted. Throughout the period, smaller tasks would be presented in the form of interruption "phone calls" (which were just a few lines of text where you had a multiple choice list of options to respond popping up in a box), other emails, and usually one minor task with a deadline about halfway through the process to force you to prioritise effectively.

On this occasion, my test involved only one, very minor interruption, and no big task. Instead, there was a lot of material to read through quickly at the start, and then a number of small tasks, decisions on work delegations to a team, that sort of thing. So it was more of a simulated work day as a high level manager than a specific task to do.

My approach would be similar in either scenario, if you're given it. Try to read everything and take brief notes before sending responses or beginning a big task, except where the answer to something is very obvious. There may be something further down your list of data that causes you to be double booked, contradicts your early assumptions, or gives evidence that a member of your team is unsuited to a certain type of work, so it's best to have read quickly through everything before making any major decisions.

Keep emails to your own team brief. They're not looking for you to have a super formal layout on internal emails, and you don't want to waste too much time formatting, laying out dates, or anything like that. If you're representing a new manager in your simulation, maybe immediately send a brief introduction to your whole team with a "I'll be in touch with you all shortly" type of message to save you having to write out who you are in every email you send after that!

I make a task list beside me as I read, with one word prompts to remind me of all the things I need to do, that I can strike out as I go for a little boost of motivation. I also write down a list of my team's names, and a couple of very short points about each one to have beside me for convenience. For example, I might have :

"Seamus, enthusiastic, forgetful, unexperienced" and "Mary, overworked, staying late, unhappy"

That would help me make sure I don't give anything super important to Seamus to complete on his own, and I don't assign Mary 5 annoying things to do.

The main thing is to be flexible, take very brief notes and breathe! Read through stuff and try move quickly, but don't panic if you're not going to get everything finished. The system is designed to put you under pressure, so you very likely won't get a perfect answer to everything sent off, and there may be tasks unfinished after the period. If you don't get everything done, you can still get a great score by prioritising which tasks you do complete, and leaving less urgent/important tasks to the end.

Hope that helps!

Skaterpeemp · 13-11-2020 12:52pm

Brilliant thanks a mill

mojoviii wrote: »

For those asking for advice in the etray exercise, I believe from my own experience - and others' reported in this thread - that the format for etrays may have changed slightly.

In previous competitions I participated in, the format was to complete one large task, a scheduling rota, a Press Release draft, a formal letter responding to a query, etc. Something where you were given a decent amount of data to process and refine into a single document in the space of time allotted. Throughout the period, smaller tasks would be presented in the form of interruption "phone calls" (which were just a few lines of text where you had a multiple choice list of options to respond popping up in a box), other emails, and usually one minor task with a deadline about halfway through the process to force you to prioritise effectively.

On this occasion, my test involved only one, very minor interruption, and no big task. Instead, there was a lot of material to read through quickly at the start, and then a number of small tasks, decisions on work delegations to a team, that sort of thing. So it was more of a simulated work day as a high level manager than a specific task to do.

My approach would be similar in either scenario, if you're given it. Try to read everything and take brief notes before sending responses or beginning a big task, except where the answer to something is very obvious. There may be something further down your list of data that causes you to be double booked, contradicts your early assumptions, or gives evidence that a member of your team is unsuited to a certain type of work, so it's best to have read quickly through everything before making any major decisions.

Keep emails to your own team brief. They're not looking for you to have a super formal layout on internal emails, and you don't want to waste too much time formatting, laying out dates, or anything like that. If you're representing a new manager in your simulation, maybe immediately send a brief introduction to your whole team with a "I'll be in touch with you all shortly" type of message to save you having to write out who you are in every email you send after that!

I make a task list beside me as I read, with one word prompts to remind me of all the things I need to do, that I can strike out as I go for a little boost of motivation. I also write down a list of my team's names, and a couple of very short points about each one to have beside me for convenience. For example, I might have :

"Seamus, enthusiastic, forgetful, unexperienced" and "Mary, overworked, staying late, unhappy"

That would help me make sure I don't give anything super important to Seamus to complete on his own, and I don't assign Mary 5 annoying things to do.

The main thing is to be flexible, take very brief notes and breathe! Read through stuff and try move quickly, but don't panic if you're not going to get everything finished. The system is designed to put you under pressure, so you very likely won't get a perfect answer to everything sent off, and there may be tasks unfinished after the period. If you don't get everything done, you can still get a great score by prioritising which tasks you do complete, and leaving less urgent/important tasks to the end.

Hope that helps!

Sarahlaois · 13-11-2020 1:08pm

Skaterpeemp wrote: »

Brilliant thanks a mill

Great advice ....thank you

MOF Seat · 13-11-2020 1:29pm

HannahR31 wrote: »

Hi! Yes I am starting on Monday week!

I was no 9 on interdepartmental and 20 on Open. I was called off the interdepartmental.

Excellent, thank you for letting me know and congratulations!

Nicole2020 · 13-11-2020 5:25pm

mojoviii wrote: »

For those asking for advice in the etray exercise, I believe from my own experience - and others' reported in this thread - that the format for etrays may have changed slightly.

In previous competitions I participated in, the format was to complete one large task, a scheduling rota, a Press Release draft, a formal letter responding to a query, etc. Something where you were given a decent amount of data to process and refine into a single document in the space of time allotted. Throughout the period, smaller tasks would be presented in the form of interruption "phone calls" (which were just a few lines of text where you had a multiple choice list of options to respond popping up in a box), other emails, and usually one minor task with a deadline about halfway through the process to force you to prioritise effectively.

On this occasion, my test involved only one, very minor interruption, and no big task. Instead, there was a lot of material to read through quickly at the start, and then a number of small tasks, decisions on work delegations to a team, that sort of thing. So it was more of a simulated work day as a high level manager than a specific task to do.

My approach would be similar in either scenario, if you're given it. Try to read everything and take brief notes before sending responses or beginning a big task, except where the answer to something is very obvious. There may be something further down your list of data that causes you to be double booked, contradicts your early assumptions, or gives evidence that a member of your team is unsuited to a certain type of work, so it's best to have read quickly through everything before making any major decisions.

Keep emails to your own team brief. They're not looking for you to have a super formal layout on internal emails, and you don't want to waste too much time formatting, laying out dates, or anything like that. If you're representing a new manager in your simulation, maybe immediately send a brief introduction to your whole team with a "I'll be in touch with you all shortly" type of message to save you having to write out who you are in every email you send after that!

I make a task list beside me as I read, with one word prompts to remind me of all the things I need to do, that I can strike out as I go for a little boost of motivation. I also write down a list of my team's names, and a couple of very short points about each one to have beside me for convenience. For example, I might have :

"Seamus, enthusiastic, forgetful, unexperienced" and "Mary, overworked, staying late, unhappy"

That would help me make sure I don't give anything super important to Seamus to complete on his own, and I don't assign Mary 5 annoying things to do.

The main thing is to be flexible, take very brief notes and breathe! Read through stuff and try move quickly, but don't panic if you're not going to get everything finished. The system is designed to put you under pressure, so you very likely won't get a perfect answer to everything sent off, and there may be tasks unfinished after the period. If you don't get everything done, you can still get a great score by prioritising which tasks you do complete, and leaving less urgent/important tasks to the end.

Hope that helps!

This is amazing advice, thank you so much!! Nervous for next week, first time doing an e-tray but everyone's tips on here have been so helpful, thank you all!

Sarahlaois · 17-11-2020 11:14am

Has anyone received the link for the etray yet?

griffid · 17-11-2020 2:20pm

Hiya,

I haven't looked at this thread in so long, not since the original online test results came out. I was OOM of 108 at that time. I'm paranoid that maybe I've missed my PAS message calling me to the next round?

Congratulations to those of you who have gotten through! Best of luck in your new positions.

I'm loving this working from home stuff. I intend to stay at this. They'll have to drag me back kicking and screaming "hell no I won't go!!".

MrsBean · 17-11-2020 2:25pm

Are you confusing your score with your OOM?

griffid · 17-11-2020 2:26pm

Yup. Found my email, 950 OOM. But at the time they were calling anyone with a score of 126 or higher and I haven't kept an eye on who that has changed/moved on since.

Irishder · 17-11-2020 2:34pm

Sarahlaois wrote: »

Has anyone received the link for the etray yet?

Just got mine now

Nicole2020 · 17-11-2020 11:48pm

I received mine too.

This might be a silly question but it mentions that we’ll get some background information and instructions before starting the exercise and then on the next line it says we have 90 mins to complete the exercise.
Would I be able to log in let’s say tomorrow morning and get the information, do the tutorial etc and then do the etray a day or 2 later if I wanted?

try_again · 18-11-2020 12:21am

I logged in earlier and went through the tutorial. It takes 10 minutes. I'll do the actual e-tray in a day or two.

MrsBean · 18-11-2020 12:39am

Just to clarify that the tutorial and the background information are two different things. The tutorial is separate and you can log in one day to do that, then log off and do the exercise another day. The tutorial gets you acquainted with the format, shows you how to click through emails etc.

The background information is specific to the exercise and once you are reading the background info you are in the exercise. It sets the scene so to speak. Tells you your role and describes the situation and context on the day. You can't look at this on a Monday, think about it and then come back to do the exercise on the Wednesday for example.

MrsBean · 18-11-2020 1:00am

Just my two cents - if you can block off two hours of your day at a time that you will be very mentally alert I would recommend it. Honestly if I could do it over I would have taken the morning off to do it. Its quite a draining exercise. I ended up getting up at 6am to do it before work and I was not very sharp!

I second the advice on note taking mentioned by a previous poster too. Best of luck to you all doing it!

Nicole2020 · 18-11-2020 1:27am

MrsBean wrote: »

Just to clarify that the tutorial and the background information are two different things. The tutorial is separate and you can log in one day to do that, then log off and do the exercise another day. The tutorial gets you acquainted with the format, shows you how to click through emails etc.

The background information is specific to the exercise and once you are reading the background info you are in the exercise. It sets the scene so to speak. Tells you your role and describes the situation and context on the day. You can't look at this on a Monday, think about it and then come back to do the exercise on the Wednesday for example.

That’s brilliant, thank you! I had a feeling this would be the case but when I got the information today, the wording made me question if it was possible. Thanks for clarifying.

Nicole2020 · 18-11-2020 1:29am

MrsBean wrote: »

Just my two cents - if you can block off two hours of your day at a time that you will be very mentally alert I would recommend it. Honestly if I could do it over I would have taken the morning off to do it. Its quite a draining exercise. I ended up getting up at 6am to do it before work and I was not very sharp!

I second the advice on note taking mentioned by a previous poster too. Best of luck to you all doing it!

Thank you, I’m hoping to do mine tomorrow afternoon, from reading what people have said here it seems quite mentally exhausting so if I’m not on top form tomorrow then Friday morning it is as I’m off! Thanks again.

Gickyk · 18-11-2020 2:48pm

Did the e-tray yesterday. It is very mentally exhausting and I found it a tough exercise! I didn't get all emails answered and am sure I left one main task to the end which I don't think I went back to but can't be sure! What I didn't expect was once the exercise finished a survey started immediately this too was timed (10 -15 mins I think) I'm sure it is mentioned in the pre-assessment info but I must have skipped over that part :L
Anyway just thought it was worth mentioning to be prepared to give answers on how you felt you did/what you would do differently/how you would approach the work if it was a real scenario etc.

I am confident I blew the e-tray but I am chuffed to have made it this far in the competition and delight to have gained some experience.

Best of luck to all

Sarahlaois · 18-11-2020 2:52pm

Completed mine too.... definitely mentally challenging and the time ticks by so quickly.

Best of luck to everyone....hopefully results will issue quickly

billyhead · 18-11-2020 2:55pm

Sorry to go a little off topic but what number after stage 1 have they called?

mojoviii · 18-11-2020 4:01pm

For those that found it very tough, I would say try not to stress too much about it once you've done it. I was 100% certain I had messed it up to the point that my evaluator would call his mates around to have a good laugh at my answers. I didn't complete every task, and was so drained that I did not explain myself well in the survey after the exercise, at all.

I passed, despite all that, and actually scored pretty well. It's really, really hard to know how you did, so don't worry about it until you get the message in your profile! Just having it done and over with is the main thing!

Ravelleman · 18-11-2020 7:24pm

mojoviii wrote: »

For those that found it very tough, I would say try not to stress too much about it once you've done it. I was 100% certain I had messed it up to the point that my evaluator would call his mates around to have a good laugh at my answers. I didn't complete every task, and was so drained that I did not explain myself well in the survey after the exercise, at all.

I passed, despite all that, and actually scored pretty well. It's really, really hard to know how you did, so don't worry about it until you get the message in your profile! Just having it done and over with is the main thing!

Similar experience, except that in the end I received the most mediocre scores possible while still passing.

MrsBean · 18-11-2020 8:48pm

Without wanting to derail the thread, I wonder does anyone know EOIs work? I got one today regarding this panel. I'm not interested in the role but wondering now does this position have to be filled before they continue with assigning anyone from the panel?
Thanks in advance for any insight!

Skaterpeemp · 18-11-2020 10:16pm

Hi I am planning on doing my E-tray tomorrow just wondering on the answering format are they a mix of multiple choice and written responses? or do you have to rate the answers with most / least effective? Thanks

Nicole2020 · 18-11-2020 11:59pm

Just finished the etray this evening. Like everyone said, it was mentally exhausting, a lot of information in a short space of time, a lot of it not relevant but still needs to be read. No real advice to give other than what’s already been said but you definitely won’t feel the hour and a half going. The advice here was very helpful though and I would recommend reading through beforehand! Also agree re. The questions at the end, I was so drained I couldn’t think straight!

Best of luck everyone, it’s a great achievement getting this far and if nothing else, the etray is fantastic experience to have!

Nicole2020 · 19-11-2020 12:01am

Skaterpeemp wrote: »

Hi I am planning on doing my E-tray tomorrow just wondering on the answering format are they a mix of multiple choice and written responses? or do you have to rate the answers with most / least effective? Thanks

You have to reply as you would in a normal scenario! Definitely read though the advice here beforehand, it gives you a great insight into how the process is laid out and some useful hints.

Ravelleman · 19-11-2020 9:53am

MrsBean wrote: »

Without wanting to derail the thread, I wonder does anyone know EOIs work? I got one today regarding this panel. I'm not interested in the role but wondering now does this position have to be filled before they continue with assigning anyone from the panel?
Thanks in advance for any insight!

AGS?

MrsBean · 19-11-2020 10:25am

Ravelleman wrote: »

AGS?

No, a Brexity role that involves travel and having your own transport which I currently do not have.

I've heard of panels being delayed until specific positions are filled via either an EOIs or secondment before but they were internal panels so not sure if the same applies to an open/interd.

billyhead · 19-11-2020 2:04pm

billyhead wrote: »

Sorry to go a little off topic but what number after stage 1 have they called?

Anyone?

Sarahlaois · 19-11-2020 2:10pm

billyhead wrote: »

Anyone?

Hi Billy,

There are 2 Dublin batches that have been called and 1 regional batch. These have (to my knowledge) gone to at least the etray stage and the first Dublin batch has had interviews and a panel formed.

Ravelleman · 19-11-2020 2:28pm

Sarahlaois wrote: »

Hi Billy,

There are 2 Dublin batches that have been called and 1 regional batch. These have (to my knowledge) gone to at least the etray stage and the first Dublin batch has had interviews and a panel formed.

To add to this, interviews for the first segment of Dublin batch 2 are starting on Monday 23rd and running until Friday 27th.

billyhead · 19-11-2020 4:21pm

Thanks folks. What number are they up to after stage 1?

FlexBrowne · 19-11-2020 4:23pm

Nicole2020 wrote: »

Just finished the etray this evening. Like everyone said, it was mentally exhausting, a lot of information in a short space of time, a lot of it not relevant but still needs to be read. No real advice to give other than what’s already been said but you definitely won’t feel the hour and a half going. The advice here was very helpful though and I would recommend reading through beforehand! Also agree re. The questions at the end, I was so drained I couldn’t think straight!

Best of luck everyone, it’s a great achievement getting this far and if nothing else, the etray is fantastic experience to have!

I felt confident before and during but a few glaring errors are popping up in my head. I honesty think I skimmed too much, assigned and delegated too much. How much did anyone else delve into attachments and start crunching numbers etc. Felt I glanced over all rather than in depth sorting. I dunno ðŸ˜•

FlexBrowne · 19-11-2020 4:28pm

Nicole2020 wrote: »

This is amazing advice, thank you so much!! Nervous for next week, first time doing an e-tray but everyone's tips on here have been so helpful, thank you all!

Cheers. I wish I had taken your advice before doing it. Ugh. The inevitable 'we regret etc on its way ðŸ¥º

KTuohy · 19-11-2020 4:40pm

This competition was a bit confusing. My understanding is that I was in batch 1.1/2.1. I reached the qualifying mark and interviewed probably about a month ago now.

I'm on the interdepartmental panel at 22 and the open at 34 (Dublin). If I think of it I'll update here when I get called so people can get a sense of how things are moving along.

Those of you who get to interview, be aware one board member may be slightly adversarial. This seems largely intended to test your composure. So be aware that it's nothing personal - they're prodding to see how you can cope with pressure.

Best of luck to you all.

Sarahlaois · 19-11-2020 4:51pm

billyhead wrote: »

Thanks folks. What number are they up to after stage 1?

Dublin and Regional are being dealt with separately. You might need to identify which one you are on so that you'll get a relevant answer

poundhound · 19-11-2020 5:36pm

Has anyone from Batch 1 that did the final interview, but was ultimately unsuccessful, received any feedback?

I have a major gripe in that the structure of the interview did not follow a traditional competency based interview. I fail to see how the quick fire question approach allowed the interview board assess my suitability as a candidate.

I would like the feedback to see where exactly I lost marks, but despite being interviewed 4 weeks ago and requesting feedback twice, I have received nothing as yet.

I can accept being unsuccessful if I know what to improve upon, but the lack of feedback has been a frustrating and a disappointing end to this competition.

TaurenDruid · 19-11-2020 10:07pm

poundhound wrote: »

Has anyone from Batch 1 that did the final interview, but was ultimately unsuccessful, received any feedback?

I have a major gripe in that the structure of the interview did not follow a traditional competency based interview. I fail to see how the quick fire question approach allowed the interview board assess my suitability as a candidate.

I would like the feedback to see where exactly I lost marks, but despite being interviewed 4 weeks ago and requesting feedback twice, I have received nothing as yet.

I can accept being unsuccessful if I know what to improve upon, but the lack of feedback has been a frustrating and a disappointing end to this competition.

This won't be any comfort, but welcome to Public Appointments Service "meaningful feedback". You might eventually get something along the lines of "Candidate did not demonstrate that they met the requirements of Competency X." My particular favourite in a past competition, where I requested feedback on the e-tray was "Your score is your feedback."

Hugely frustrating, as you say.

NEW 2020 Assistant Principal Officer Competition

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