Random Wrasslin' thoughts.....

Sirsok · 04-06-2013 7:31pm

gimmick wrote: »

It amazes me that it is takes the likes of him to be in WWE before people take any notice. Or at least, not dismiss him.

It is the wrestling equivalent of the EPL fan who deems anyone who has not played in England to either be not up to it, or has yet to prove himself.

No it's the equivalent of a footballer not playing in a European league, the standard and exposure wwe gets worldwide is ridiculous, it is the measuring stick of wrestling for me personally.... Now I think the likes of the Briscoes and colt etc as awesome talents and don't look down on them because they are not in wwe, I can recognise their talent just like I would do neymar for example, but until neymar proves himself in Europe I wouldn't place him up with the likes of messi and ronaldo....

Cream rises to the top and I believe wwe is the top.

ShagNastii · 04-06-2013 7:44pm

Sirsok wrote: »

Cream rises to the top and I believe wwe is the top.

As we're starting to see in the last few years in WWE. Ambrose, Bryan, Punk, Ohno.

Coutinho 10 · 04-06-2013 7:54pm

I would love to see wrestlers change up their move set and be brave enough to do something different.

Ando's Saggy Bottom · 04-06-2013 9:14pm

We had this debate before on here. Comparing competitive sports like soccer to staged wrestling is a crap comparison.

DM_7 · 05-06-2013 5:28pm

I would love to hear some of wrestlings best matches on the radio and commented on by good ol JM.

Jimmy Magee that is.

Reebrock · 05-06-2013 6:26pm

ShagNastii wrote: »

As we're starting to see in the last few years in WWE. Ambrose, Bryan, Punk, Ohno.

What do you mean last few years? What about Hart(s), Eddie, Michaels, Savage Benoit, Edge... talent has always found a way to rise to the top because the fans bond with that irrespective of office preference for larger chaps. You don't have to have worked for smart mark indy promotions to have "risen" to the top.

ShagNastii · 05-06-2013 8:51pm

Yeah sorry I just named the current crop of guys that aren't exactly cookie cutter but are probably too good for it to pass them by.

Bret/Owen/Benoit/Eddie/Edge et al all worthy of the same praise.

jaykhunter · 06-06-2013 2:00am

I hate Triple H for what he did for many years in the mid-2000s but since he's taken a more prominent role, lots of new talent has come in the door. Now if we could just get them to book people in the same stratosphere as the mighty John Cena we'd be set. Either way in 5 years when many of the wrestlers hit their peak (Sheamo, Del Rio etc) and Cena's body has given out, WWE will be much better.

GTR63 · 06-06-2013 2:33am

jaykhunter wrote: »

I hate Triple H for what he did for many years in the mid-2000s but since he's taken a more prominent role, lots of new talent has come in the door. Now if we could just get them to book people in the same stratosphere as the mighty John Cena we'd be set. Either way in 5 years when many of the wrestlers hit their peak (Sheamo, Del Rio etc) and Cena's body has given out, WWE will be much better.

Sheamo and ADR are in their mid 30's now so they'll want to mind themselves to maintain that peak.
I do think of what WWE will be when the big names don't return for Mania anymore and they have to adapt for that.
Exciting to look forward to that as a fan but it must be terrifying for WWE to be thinking about that now considering all the recent script rewrites.

bobby_says_hi · 06-06-2013 3:33am

Yeah Cena's been getting injured more and more regularly recently. Contrary to what they tell us on TV, he's not invincible. I think the day he hangs up his boots or else pulls an Undertaker and only returns for big matches is drawing closer. Though the word is that Sheamus is being groomed to take his spot so you never know. It's kind of the same anticipation as when a big star gets injured and someone new will have to be pushed to fill that void

Reebrock · 06-06-2013 7:47am

bobby_says_hi wrote: »

Though the word is that Sheamus is being groomed to take his spot

The word, eh.

Reebrock · 06-06-2013 7:51am

And Happy Birthday to the greatest wrestling commentator of all time... Art Donovan.

jaykhunter · 08-06-2013 7:44pm

Had a thought : What if people are booked badly intentionally for a couple of reasons besides idiocy?
(Keep CM Punk's years of tribulations, or Curtis Axel now)
1) Get people to rally behind pushing the guy due to this injustice (like how we want Axel to be booked better)
2) People will get behind the guy finally being booked right
3) See if he'll break with shítty booking instead of 'proving his loyalty' (Kaval, Batista/Umaga WM24)
4) To fill time: Booking a year's worth of crap means WWE've ran out the clock for a year.
5) Fans will forgive years of bad booking after a few weeks of stellar booking. (Like it didn't matter what WWE did with Punk for years, as soon as he cut that MITB2011 promo on RAW)

DM_7 · 08-06-2013 10:31pm

Point three mixed with serving the 'apprenticeship' in the WWE - proving themselves to the higher ups that they have the skills as well as willing to work hard because the guy at the top normally works harder than/as hard as anyone else.

Then point 5 is the thing that matters later on, take Cody Rhodes over the last couple of years, easily forgotten of they ever go to push him to the top.

SureYWouldntYa · 08-06-2013 10:39pm

WWE should really do something to start making heels heels again.

The best heels were the ones who were genuinely dislikeable, like Jericho in '08 or HHH in '05.

DM_7 · 08-06-2013 10:47pm

I now what you mean but fans that post here are too smart to hate anyone unless its Hunter or someone does something bad like the Edge Lita thing.

In general they do well with getting people to dislike the heels. I don't think anything else could possibly have been booked to make Punk more hated by fans in general since RAW 1000.

D.Q · 08-06-2013 11:09pm

i disliked punk more as a face.

DM_7 · 08-06-2013 11:12pm

D.Q wrote: »

i disliked punk more as a face.

I think that probably shows that WWE's bigger issue is the dull, uninteresting way they tend to book many face wrestlers.

D.Q · 08-06-2013 11:18pm

absolutely, as soon as they try to make something cool its instantly ruined. As soon as Jerry Lawlor endorses ANYTHING, its awful.

Mr.Saturn · 08-06-2013 11:47pm

It blows my mind sometimes that Edge was involved in every MitB cash-in somehow, 'til the concept was split between brands. They couldn't have planned that, right?

2005/6- Wins it, cashes in
2006- Interferes in RVD's cash-in
2007- Whips it off Kennedy; cashes-in.
2008- Edge on the wrong end of a cash-in.
2009- Loses WHC to Hardy at ER, only for Punk to cash-in immediately
2010- Decks Jericho enough to enable Swagger's cash-in

garhjw · 09-06-2013 1:55am

Mr.Saturn wrote: »

It blows my mind sometimes that Edge was involved in every MitB cash-in somehow, 'til the concept was split between brands. They couldn't have planned that, right?

2005/6- Wins it, cashes in
2006- Interferes in RVD's cash-in
2007- Whips it off Kennedy; cashes-in.
2008- Edge on the wrong end of a cash-in.
2009- Loses WHC to Hardy at ER, only for Punk to cash-in immediately
2010- Decks Jericho enough to enable Swagger's cash-in

He was just another waste of oxygen like hhh and punk

mrkiscool2 · 09-06-2013 2:26am

garhjw wrote: »

He was just another waste of oxygen like hhh and punk

Woah, woah woah, what? 3 of the greatest wrestlers in their respective eras (HHH-AE, Edge-RA, Punk-PG) are a waste of oxygen? What are you on and where can I get some?
I freaking loved Edge, whether he was part of The Brood, C&E or as a heel. He had some great rivalries in his time, and always brought out the best in whomever he was facing!

gnfnrhead · 09-06-2013 2:29am

Mr.Saturn wrote: »

It blows my mind sometimes that Edge was involved in every MitB cash-in somehow, 'til the concept was split between brands. They couldn't have planned that, right?

2005/6- Wins it, cashes in
2006- Interferes in RVD's cash-in
2007- Whips it off Kennedy; cashes-in.
2008- Edge on the wrong end of a cash-in.
2009- Loses WHC to Hardy at ER, only for Punk to cash-in immediately
2010- Decks Jericho enough to enable Swagger's cash-in

WWE rarely plan stuff like that. Undertaker's streak for example was an accident until he got to about 8 and someone realised he was unbeaten. Think number 10 was the first time they made it part of the story.

Likewise with Edge and Wrestlemania. They bent history (competed in MITB the year before but got injured so technically didnt lose) to make him also unbeaten for his WM match with Undertaker. If it was planned he'd have won instead.

Purely co-incidence that he was there or thereabout each time.

Omackeral · 09-06-2013 4:04am

Props must go to either Creative or the talent themselves when you consider that Nexus members Skip Sheffield, Husky Harris and (although it's only fresh) Michael McGillicutty are mere footnotes. Some brilliantly successful re-packaging IMO.

GTR63 · 11-06-2013 8:37pm

I don't know which current storyline I care less about the HHH and McMahons one or the Bully/Hulk/Brooke one. Disfunctional family crap is so 90's.

Riddle101 · 11-06-2013 8:40pm

Omackeral wrote: »

Props must go to either Creative or the talent themselves when you consider that Nexus members Skip Sheffield, Husky Harris and (although it's only fresh) Michael McGillicutty are mere footnotes. Some brilliantly successful re-packaging IMO.

Most wrestler usually repackaged before they take off, Stone Cold, The Rock, Triple H and Kane were all repackaged before they became successes. Many more too.

ShagNastii · 11-06-2013 9:33pm

Looking at Jay's OSWreview it's sort of mental when you think of the progress of the federation after Hulkamania.

The fact that it was Bret that emerged to fill the boots of Hulk, Macho and Warrior. You had these larger than life, almost superhero-like characters replaced by the understated excellence of execution.

Really sort of hit home that when you define "era"s you can link it so closely to the crop of characters that were about at the time.

krudler · 11-06-2013 11:57pm

garhjw wrote: »

He was just another waste of oxygen like hhh and punk

Whaat? Edge was brilliant.

I watch wrestling as much for the production/video packages/crowd reactions as the actual in ring action, possible even more so. The production side of it like the arenas is the part I've always enjoyed the most, the visual aspect.

ShagNastii · 12-06-2013 8:46am

krudler wrote: »

Whaat? Edge was brilliant.

I watch wrestling as much for the production/video packages/crowd reactions as the actual in ring action, possible even more so. The production side of it like the arenas is the part I've always enjoyed the most, the visual aspect.

Ditto. It's probably one of the reasons I never completely got sold on indie wrestling. Am a sucker for big F off sets, HD displays and pyro.

Some of the video packages produced in wrestling are so interesting, exciting, compelling and often touching.

Never really understood people saying they bawled and cried over Ric Flair's retirement and HBK's "I'm sorry. I love you" superkick. Never really understood anyone being moved so strongly by wrestling but I have to admit the packages for Eddie(and to a much lesser extent Edge) really pulled on the heart strings. I think it's cause it basically just showed them to be kids that had a dream and lived their dreams. Almost as if it was their destiny.

krudler · 12-06-2013 12:02pm

ShagNastii wrote: »

Ditto. It's probably one of the reasons I never completely got sold on indie wrestling. Am a sucker for big F off sets, HD displays and pyro.

Some of the video packages produced in wrestling are so interesting, exciting, compelling and often touching.

Never really understood people saying they bawled and cried over Ric Flair's retirement and HBK's "I'm sorry. I love you" superkick. Never really understood anyone being moved so strongly by wrestling but I have to admit the packages for Eddie(and to a much lesser extent Edge) really pulled on the heart strings. I think it's cause it basically just showed them to be kids that had a dream and lived their dreams. Almost as if it was their destiny.

Definitely, their video production department is the best in the world at what they do, they can make even mediocre feuds look epic, the opening Wrestlemania promos are always good, this is one of my favourites

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BKs2sUix7U

Jason Todd · 13-06-2013 1:06am

Just watching this weeks Raw and a few thoughts came to mind...

Steph is hotter than ever.

I love the way Ambrose uses the ropes. Instead of little steps or a run-up, he sort of takes a big stride and then leans on it to come off it.

Bryan must surely be the stiffest worker in the WWE.

Some of the best selling is happening at the mo, between Ziggler, Ambrose and Rollins.

Cesaro needs new ring gear, he's too like a porn star or something as is, and not in a funny way like Val Venis.

Sirsok · 14-06-2013 10:52pm

Was sitting in work today and I thought to myself the macho man is truly one of a kind....even think about the name, if you really think about it, it's horrible! Now adays wwe the macho man name would only work on a camp Rico type character but no, savage made it work. The crazy promos and the awesome ring gear....no one could pull of anything similar....growing up I was an ultimate diehard warrior fan but as I'm older I look back and relies warrior Hogan etc can be replicated but there will never be another macho man ever!.....I know I'm rambling but I can't get across how awesome I truly think he was!

downonthefarm · 15-06-2013 12:02am

at the mo aj is the only reasin to watch...and those two black birds wo come out with broadus

DEFTLEFTHAND · 15-06-2013 3:25am

Bully Ray is an asshole, typical ignorant blue collar New Yorker. I don't care if he lost weight he still looks out of shape, he just further emphases TNA's low notch on the totem pole. The whole Faux biker gang thing is just bloody ridiculous because a real 1&'er would beat Bully six ways to Sunday. No wonder the ratings are in the toilet, putting and keeping a supposed 'World' title on this guy.:rolleyes:

Curtis Axel sounds like a gay pornstar, horrible, the kid can wrestle though in fairness, he resembles more his grandfather than his Dad.

starviewadams · 15-06-2013 4:00am

Figured out how to get Hulu plus on the auld Xbox,has the last 3 seasons of Raw,last 6 seasons of Smackdown and every ep of NXT,Main Event and Superstars.Handy enough for me cos I don't have Sky Sports and it's near impossible to find a full episode of Raw on Youtube of a Tuesday morning these days.

ShagNastii · 15-06-2013 8:35am

On the topic of repackaging you'd wonder who else would be prime for an overhaul.

I personally would love to see Gabriel really tweak the fearless thrillseeker gimmick or even see Cody go back to the mask, maybe turn it up a notch. Monster him up a bit and get Sandow back in the loop as his evil mastermind.

Sirsok · 15-06-2013 9:38am

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Bully Ray is an asshole, typical ignorant blue collar New Yorker. I don't care if he lost weight he still looks out of shape, he just further emphases TNA's low notch on the totem pole. The whole Faux biker gang thing is just bloody ridiculous because a real 1&'er would beat Bully six ways to Sunday.

Yeah and a real dancer would totally outdance fandangoo, and a real undertaker I bet would definitely embalm better then wwes taker, don't get me started on the likes of tl hopper, papa shangoo, mountie, repoman etc

They are stealing an idea from a popular tv show that's main character jakks is not in the least bit intimidating, bit it's still a great show.... If you suspend your disbelief you may start enjoying tna more

Omackeral · 15-06-2013 2:21pm

Thanked Sirsok for the very mention of TL Hopper. Thanks are also up for grabs for the first person to give me the name of his beloved plunger.

My own thought for this morning: Always thought it was a nice convenience that Bret Hart and the Jim 'the Anvil' Neidhart had similar enough family names to come up with the cool moniker of the Hart Foundation. Ditto for the inclusion of Jimmy Hart!

jaykhunter · 15-06-2013 2:43pm

Maybe DEFTLEFTHAND doesn't find lumberjack shirts and camo shorts intimidating! That said he's lumbered with main event comedy jobbers Aces&Eights and a marriage angle with Brooke Hogan. He's done a great job considering what he's given. That said if you don't like Brother Ray's transformation you never will!

Hashtag_HEEL · 15-06-2013 7:55pm

Just watching through OSW today and I realised, Jake was a right cnut with Damien! He was always slapping him around or when he'd attack someone to choke them he'd land on him! I'm surprised that there wasn't ever peta protests at the shows!

DEFTLEFTHAND · 16-06-2013 7:47am

It's a sh1t gimmick that you can't pull off on National television, just like the Mafia influenced (ECW) Full Blooded Italians didn't work when they tried it in WWE, anything they'd do would always come off as tame in comparison to the real thing. The 1% MC scene stateside is similar in some respects. It's cringeworthy to watch some of TNAs antics at times.

Especially when they try and sell Bully as their main guy. An overweight forty something midcarder.

Omackeral · 16-06-2013 8:06am

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

It's a sh1t gimmick that you can't pull off on National television, just like the Mafia influenced (ECW) Full Blooded Italians didn't work when they tried it in WWE, anything they'd do would always come off as tame in comparison to the real thing. The 1% MC scene stateside is similar in some respects. It's cringeworthy to watch some of TNAs antics at times.

Especially when they try and sell Bully as their main guy.An overweight forty something midcarder.

This smacks of a vendetta. Overweight? Bully is buff these days. For a comparsion, check him out in 1996/97 in ECW, that's overweight. He's got into great nick. And 95% of talent is midcard until they are pushed, this is his breakout, and it was slowly and logically built up. What more do you want? Who should lead the group? Some punk kid?

DEFTLEFTHAND · 16-06-2013 8:19am

Omackeral wrote: »

This smacks of a vendetta. Overweight? Bully is buff these days. For a comparsion, check him out in 1996/97 in ECW, that's overweight. He's got into great nick. And 95% of talent is midcard until they are pushed, this is his breakout, and it was slowly and logically built up. What more do you want? Who should lead the group? Some punk kid?

He's not in good shape, he still looks as bad as he ever did, he offers nothing in the ring, he has a big loud mouth and massive opinion of himself that's got him somewhere in a small organisation. Do you think Vince would have elevated this guy to a maineventer?

gnfnrhead · 16-06-2013 8:25am

Bully Ray is one of the best things in wrestling. Anyone who doesnt give him the credit he deserves hasnt a clue.

Omackeral · 16-06-2013 9:26am

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

He's not in good shape, he still looks as bad as he ever did, he offers nothing in the ring, he has a big loud mouth and massive opinion of himself that's got him somewhere in a small organisation. Do you think Vince would have elevated this guy to a maineventer?

You're judging him on his out of ring merits by saying he's a load mouth and self publicist. So was Hogan. Besides, the squeaky wheel gets the oil. His heel work has been brilliant since the brief face run/rouse. Fans and experts alike would agree. As for pushing him as a main eventer. Few would've thought Bradshaw or Edge would've been main eventers when they were in the same spot as Bully. So who knows.

Also, laughable to say he looks as bad as ever. He sure is in awful shape!

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRjhwy4pccuvyq8VbV5qBZW5qkonqKnezy--OE6b6O-oPQ_Kn4PMg

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRjhwy4pccuvyq8VbV5qBZW5qkonqKnezy--OE6b6O-oPQ_Kn4PMg

jaykhunter · 16-06-2013 9:56am

Hashtag_HEEL wrote: »

Just watching through OSW today and I realised, Jake was a right cnut with Damien! [...] I'm surprised that there wasn't ever peta protests at the shows!

Ha! there probably would be if the gimmick was in the current era. jake was done in for animal cruelty in the early 2000s, one of his snakes died after forgetting to feed it for a while.

leggo · 16-06-2013 9:59am

Sorry to resurrect a dead debate, but I've just seen the PED/steroid discussion, it was very interesting and having wrestled and actually known lads who've juiced...I think I've something to add:

To compare and write off lads based on steroid use in wrestling is unfair. In wrestling, steroids are typically used to achieve an aesthetic look and for muscle repair (when you talk WWE guys because of how hectic their schedule is on their bodies). A lot of lads just use to keep up with the rest in certain areas, but it doesn't make you a better performer.

The reason for this, as opposed to the likes of Lance Armstrong etc, is because you don't judge wrestling based on competitive edges as you would sports stars. When you're comparing the best, you're judging it as you would art: the great matches they had, their body of work etc. So, at that level, the best is almost decided by what's in their mind as opposed to how hard they trained. Which is why to say 'Daniel Bryan is better than Benoit because Benoit was found to use steroids' is a bit harsh because:

1) We've no way to know what Daniel Bryan is or isn't putting into his body and,
2) Steroids wouldn't have been what made Benoit stand out.

Just thought it was worth throwing in there.

And, by the way, from what I've seen of him I think Bully Ray is phenomenal in his new gimmick. Someone mentioned JBL and, I completely agree with that comparison: it's a case of him being a talented midcarder for most of his career then finding his place in the autumn of his days, and only THEN people saw him for the main event talent he could be.

Ando's Saggy Bottom · 16-06-2013 10:06am

I'd say Bully is almost certainly juicing to have achieved such a dramatic change in body shape. Its not like TNA give a rats ass what he takes.

jaykhunter · 16-06-2013 10:17am

Triple H is a horrendous on-screen COO. Threatening to fire doctors so he can compete, always putting personal vendettas ahead of his job, having his employees (sorry, independent contractors) walk out on him, and putting down others like saying the world title (during feud w/Taker) and Curtis axel are beneath him. It's funny how his character is a selfish prick

DM_7 · 16-06-2013 10:57am

Like most WWE faces he is a complete dick!

Sheamus is a bully every week. Cena is always making childish insults, on Monday Del Rio attacked Ziggler from behind for no real reason, Jericho smacked Heyman in the face with an interviewers microphone on Smackdown.

Heels are straight up, they say they will beat you up and then they do it!

Random Wrasslin' thoughts.....

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