Drivers who don't give way when merging onto a M-way

BrianD3 · 10-11-2009 9:32pm #1

On a few occasions we have discussed the issue of drivers merging onto M-ways without giving way to traffic already on it and "courteous" drivers facilitating them.

I recently had a classic case of a driver who seemed to think he had priority when merging. I'm in the left lane of a dual carriageway doing an indicated and steady 100 km/h. There is at least 1 km of clear road in front of me and the same behind. At an interchange a car wants to join the mainline. He manages to time his "merge" so that he pulls directly alongside me, matching my speed exactly. I maintain my speed and position, he maintains his. This goes on for what seems like a long time. I'm pretty sure he wanted the exact piece of road I was on and expected me to
a) slow down to let him in front
or
b) move into the overtaking lane to facilitate him

Never mind the huge expanse of clear road *behind* me :rolleyes:

The outcome was that his acceleration lane was ending so he floored it (showing the impressive acceleration of his exec saloon) passed me on the left, nipped in front and zoomed off into the distance at probably 150+ km/h.

So who's the bigger bollox, me or him?

Berty · 10-11-2009 9:39pm

Lets see.

He matched the speed of the mainline traffic - Correct

He did not exceed any speed limits - Correct

Now, was it safe for you to pull into the overtaking lane? If yes, then you were wrong not to.

copacetic · 10-11-2009 9:40pm

you were more in the wrong than him imo. are you sure he even saw you?

JHMEG · 10-11-2009 9:46pm

That's the kind of pointless chicken playing that goes on in this country. You'd be no less of a man if you had pulled over to let him merge, and let the pr1ck off. No one has the moral high ground in this instance from what I can see.

bazzachazza · 10-11-2009 9:47pm

BrianD3 wrote: »

I maintain my speed and position

Would it have killed you to change lane ?!

As you say the road was clear in front and behind it wouldn't have hurt you to move over and let him merge. He is entitled to merge and you cannot prevent him from doing so by blocking him.

"courteous" drivers facilitating them.

Using your own words..... .Were you courteous to him ?

Yes it was stupid of him to match your speed and position seen as the road was clear.

I would have moved over at least and then waited to see what the idiot was going to do before either increasing or decreasing my speed.

Mr. Presentable · 10-11-2009 9:53pm

The proper thing, given the clear road, would have been for you to anticipate his merge and temporarily move over to the overtaking lane to facilitate him.

Alun · 10-11-2009 9:57pm

nipplenuts wrote: »

The proper thing, given the clear road, would have been for you to anticipate his merge and temporarily move over to the overtaking lane to facilitate him.

Well actually the proper thing, in the sense of following the RotR, would have been for the merger to have either slowed down or sped slightly up so as to come onto the motorway slightly behind or ahead of the OP, not the other way around.

In practice, however, seeing as 90% of Irish drivers haven't actually got a clue as to how to merge properly, in the interests of not colliding with the ignorant twats, I end up moving over as well, but it sticks in my throat every time I have to do it when it's absolutely unnecessary.

Seth Brundle · 10-11-2009 9:57pm

Berty wrote: »

Lets see.

He matched the speed of the mainline traffic - Correct

He did not exceed any speed limits - Correct

Now, was it safe for you to pull into the overtaking lane? If yes, then you were wrong not to.

copacetic wrote: »

you were more in the wrong than him imo. are you sure he even saw you?

There is no obligation for the driver on the mainline to give way to vehicles entering the motorway - its just courtesy!
Also IIRC some roads have solid white lines along these types of stretches so if one was present then the OP could not have changed lane.

copacetic · 10-11-2009 10:00pm

kbannon wrote: »

There is no obligation for the driver on the mainline to give way to vehicles entering the motorway - its just courtesy!
Also IIRC some roads have solid white lines along these types of stretches so if one was present then the OP could not have changed lane.

there is no obligation to ever let anyone in. Of course if we all did that stupid stare straight ahead driving there would be a even more crashes on the roads.

I wasn't talking about legal obligatons, I was talking about the difference between good and bad driving.

I've never seen a solid white line at a merge on a motorway, here or in any other country. It wouldn't make a lick of sense.

peasant · 10-11-2009 10:00pm

I would disagree with all most* of the above answers.

If your man is incapable of adjusting his speed in such a way that he can't join a motorway without discommoding the only other car on it ...then he'd better stop driving altogether.

*note to self ...learn to type faster

copacetic · 10-11-2009 10:03pm

peasant wrote: »

I would disagree with all most* of the above answers.

If your man is incapable of adjusting his speed in such a way that he can't join a motorway without discommoding the only other car on it ...then he'd better stop driving altogether.

*note to self ...learn to type faster

I think you misread a lot of them. Nobody said that guy was a good driver, you have two pretty bad drivers here. The judgement is which of them is worse than the other, which is saying very little.

peasant · 10-11-2009 10:06pm

copacetic wrote: »

you have two pretty bad drivers here.

I can only see one bad driver.

Keeping your lane (and your priority right of way) and keep on driving steadily so that the other guy can adjust his speed (up or down) is NOT bad driving, not at all.

IMO, changing lane in such a clear cut and easy situation like this is just misplaced courtesy

copacetic · 10-11-2009 10:09pm

peasant wrote: »

I can only see one bad driver.

Keeping your lane (and your priority right of way) and keep on driving steadily so that the other guy can adjust his speed (up or down) is NOT bad driving, not at all.

IMO, changing lane in such a clear cut and easy situation like this is just misplaced courtesy

So what, you just ignore him, assume he has seen you and if he crashes into you say it was his fault?

Berty · 10-11-2009 10:13pm

There is a lot of "Its my road" attitude going on here.

Causing other drivers difficulty merging is no way to act on the road.

Common courtesy should prevail.

peasant · 10-11-2009 10:13pm

copacetic wrote: »

So what, you just ignore him, assume he has seen you and if he crashes into you say it was his fault?

If he crashed into me it WOULD be his fault

(not that i would let this happen)

Yes, I would assume that he has seen me, I would further assume that he knows how to drive and how to merge on a motorway and I would also assume that he would be polite enough not to force me to change lane and rather merge properly and safely.

But then ...I learned how to drive on a motorway and how to merge so in this country my assumptions aren't always correct

peasant · 10-11-2009 10:16pm

Berty wrote: »

Causing other drivers difficulty merging is no way to act on the road.

I fully agree.

However, there isn't the minutest degree of difficulty in merging when there is only one other car already on the motorway and that car is driving at a constant speed.

doolox · 10-11-2009 10:20pm

It is totally ignorant of the merger not to adjust his speed either up or down to occupy an different piece of road than you. It happens that you need to slow down or speed up to make space for these people a lot on our Motorways because a lot of Irish people are not trained to use motorways properly.

Bluetonic · 10-11-2009 10:23pm

The big problem here is the idiots who pull out into the overtaking lane in some attempt to let a motorist merge when there is absolutely no need too. They pull out without no comprehension of how fast a car travelling at 120km+ can make ground.

Back on the main point there should be absolutely no need to pull into the overtaking lane to allow a motorist to merge. The merging motorists should simply slowing down or speeding up a little to move into the gap you are of course leaving between you and other vehicles.

xabi · 10-11-2009 10:27pm

From the rules of the road:

On a two-lane motorway, use this for overtaking only and move back into lane 1 when you have finished. You may also use this lane to accommodate traffic merging from the left.

I always move into the overtaking lane to let cars merge, makes life so much easier for everyone.

10-11-2009 10:46pm

I always move into the overtaking lane when I see traffic merging ahead staying in the lane and interfering with the flow of traffic is just acting the bo**ocks imo.

Y2J_MUFC · 10-11-2009 11:01pm

Berty wrote: »

There is a lot of "Its my road" attitude going on here.

Causing other drivers difficulty merging is no way to act on the road.

Common courtesy should prevail.

Nail on the head there.

It would have caused you no inconvenience whatsoever to temporarily move to the overtaking lane, but you actively tried to inconvenience him by making it as difficult as possible for him to merge, without any valid need to.

Why doesn't common sense and common courtesy prevail? You move over without inconvenience to you or anyone else, he joins the motorway without any inconvenience, instead of making it difficult for the person. Its hardly rocket science to figure out that that makes life easier for both of you.

Why would you want to make it difficult to merge on an otherwise clear road? I don't understand. It sounds like you were ignorant not to give him common courtesy and use a bit of common sense.

testarossa40 · 10-11-2009 11:05pm

I've a well-honed routine that takes care of this very situation. Whenever I'm in the left lane approaching on on-merge and see any sign of cars about to join, I check my mirrors & blind-spot, and, when safe to so change into the overtaking lane (at not less than 120kph*) well in advance of said cars merging then slot back into left once clear. Such a simple, easy routine it's practically a reflex reaction on my part. It's well within the ROTR, and frankly, it's the correct, courteous, and MATURE thing to do.

And if it's that congested that I can't pull out right in time, then I adjust my speed facilitate merging in turn.

So none of this "C'mon I DARE ya to invade MY space and merge into MY lane while I'm here" nonsense.

And posters on these threads complain about the standard of Irish motorway driving... :rolleyes:

*where legally permitted

MagicMarker · 10-11-2009 11:10pm

I can't see how the OP was an inconvenience to the other driver, if anything it's the other way round!! The driver that was merging made life difficult for himself.

peasant · 10-11-2009 11:16pm

Y2J_MUFC wrote: »

Nail on the head there.

It would have caused you no inconvenience whatsoever to temporarily move to the overtaking lane, but you actively tried to inconvenience him by making it as difficult as possible for him to merge, without any valid need to.

Why doesn't common sense and common courtesy prevail? You move over without inconvenience to you or anyone else, he joins the motorway without any inconvenience, instead of making it difficult for the person. Its hardly rocket science to figure out that that makes life easier for both of you.

Why would you want to make it difficult to merge on an otherwise clear road? I don't understand. It sounds like you were ignorant not to give him common courtesy.

"Common courtesy" is the new political correctness.:rolleyes:

1) It is not difficult to merge onto a motorway when there is only one other car on it doing a constant speed. If you find it difficult, you should consider taking public transport

2) no-one is inconveniencing anyone in the above scenario (once both parties know how to drive properly)

3) in the above scenario, moving over is neither courteous nor necessary ... it is a superflous gesture of "look at me and how nice I am"

4) how will anyone ever learn to merge correctly if everyone just moves over ?

5) this misplaced courtesy will lead to an expectation that everybody will move over (and that (learning how) to merge properly is not necessary)

6) there are situations where it is indeed courteous (and necessary) to move over ..the above scenario is not one of them

7) lastly, there are situations when it is not possible/safe to move over ...what do those that have never learned to merge do then?

Voodoomelon · 10-11-2009 11:20pm

nipplenuts wrote: »

The proper thing, given the clear road, would have been for you to anticipate his merge and temporarily move over to the overtaking lane to facilitate him.

As much as I agree with you and do the same myself when I see someone about to merge, its a pain in the nuts when you move out to the overtaking lane, only for the person thats merging to speed up all of a sudden meaning that they're ahead of you anyway and you moved out for no reason.

And you have to sheepishly move back into the left lane. :P

Depending on the motorway and the merge, I usually make sure i'm doing 120kph when I join, pretty much puts you ahead of most drivers.

O.A.P · 10-11-2009 11:20pm

testarossa40 wrote: »

I've a well-honed routine that takes care of this very situation. Whenever I'm in the left lane approaching on on-merge and see any sign of cars about to join, I check my mirrors & blind-spot, and, when safe to so change into the overtaking lane (at not less than 120kph*) well in advance of said cars merging then slot back into left once clear. Such a simple, easy routine it's practically a reflex reaction on my part. It's well within the ROTR, and frankly, it's the correct, courteous, and MATURE thing to do.

And if it's that congested that I can't pull out right in time, then I adjust my speed facilitate merging in turn.

So none of this "C'mon I DARE ya to invade MY space and merge into MY lane while I'm here" nonsense.

And posters on these threads complain about the standard of Irish motorway driving... :rolleyes:

*where legally permitted

Thats they way I drive too but you said it better.;)

peasant · 10-11-2009 11:23pm

testarossa40 wrote: »

and, when safe to so change into the overtaking lane (at not less than 120kph*)

question:

What do you do when you can't change lanes and/or you can't speed up to the limit ?

2qk4u · 10-11-2009 11:24pm

Traffic on the motorway should adjust their drive to allow the merging traffic to join the motorway. The traffic joining the motorway is building up speed or has matched the speed of the cars on the motorway, they have nowhere left to go when they reach the end of the slip lane, they cannot slow down as the traffic following is building up speed on its way down the slip lane.

dellas1979 · 10-11-2009 11:24pm

Well, seeing as you asked (your words), I think you are the bigger bollock.

Is safety not high on your priorities?

What part of the road do you own? Cause Im pretty sure the other driver has claims too - actually come to think of it about 4 million of us in Ireland do. Sorry. to. burst. your. bubble.

Henry Ford III · 10-11-2009 11:28pm

2qk4u wrote: »

Traffic on the motorway should adjust their drive to allow the merging traffic to join the motorway. The traffic joining the motorway is building up speed or has matched the speed of the cars on the motorway, they have nowhere left to go when they reach the end of the slip lane, they cannot slow down as the traffic following is building up speed on its way down the slip lane.

That's precisely wrong.

MagicMarker · 10-11-2009 11:30pm

2qk4u wrote: »

Traffic on the motorway should adjust their drive to allow the merging traffic to join the motorway. The traffic joining the motorway is building up speed or has matched the speed of the cars on the motorway, they have nowhere left to go when they reach the end of the slip lane, they cannot slow down as the traffic following is building up speed on its way down the slip lane.

I understand what you're saying, but it's doesn't exactly apply to the case at hand, which I find analogous to someone sitting next to me on an empty bus, i.e, pointless.

Oh yeah, and wrong, merging traffic have to adjust their speed according to the flow of traffic on the motorway.

Drivers who don't give way when merging onto a M-way

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