Why the north outside EU changes everything for the island

FrancieBrady · 16-09-2018 2:59pm

timthumbni wrote: »

Jaysus. That post is just a load of gibberish even for you francie... lol.

Quelle suprise, Tim has no answer.

timthumbni · 16-09-2018 3:22pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

timthumbni wrote: »

Jaysus. That post is just a load of gibberish even for you francie... lol.

Quelle suprise, Tim has no answer.

But you didn’t ask a question francie... you just had a bout of verbal diarrhoea....

FrancieBrady · 16-09-2018 3:25pm

timthumbni wrote: »

But you didn’t ask a question francie... you just had a bout of verbal diarrhoea....

Says the guy that has been flailing all around him in spite of the actual evidence presented to him.

You'll be alright Tim, Brexit away, you'll be fine.

timthumbni · 16-09-2018 3:34pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

timthumbni wrote: »

But you didn’t ask a question francie... you just had a bout of verbal diarrhoea....

Says the guy that has been flailing all around him in spite of the actual evidence presented to him.

You'll be alright Tim, Brexit away, you'll be fine.

I’ve already said that I don’t care much about brexit. I voted to leave but I don’t really care. The reason is because small guys like me won’t be effected much either way. I live my life francie. Being in an overpriced country club like the Eu means feck all to me. Life will go on after brexit believe me. You do realise that SF was against the Eu unTIL quite recently and a lot of the NI workers unions campaigned for an exit too.

And these trivial things like the eu charging uk holiday makers a tenner to go to Ibiza make me laugh. Go ahead if they want. The brits are their main moneymakers. I hope they raise it to 5 grand a time.

FrancieBrady · 16-09-2018 3:38pm

timthumbni wrote: »

I’ve already said that I don’t care much about brexit. I voted to leave but I don’t really care. The reason is because small guys like me won’t be effected much either way. I live my life francie. Being in an overpriced country club like the Eu means feck all to me. Life will go on after brexit believe me. You do realise that SF was against the Eu unTIL quite recently and a lot of the NI workers unions campaigned for an exit too.

And these trivial things like the eu charging uk holiday makers a tenner to go to Ibiza make me laugh. Go ahead if they want. The brits are their main moneymakers. I hope they raise it to 5 grand a time.

I think I am speaking for most people here when I say 'oh dear' in response to that.

timthumbni · 16-09-2018 3:40pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

timthumbni wrote: »

I’ve already said that I don’t care much about brexit. I voted to leave but I don’t really care. The reason is because small guys like me won’t be effected much either way. I live my life francie. Being in an overpriced country club like the Eu means feck all to me. Life will go on after brexit believe me. You do realise that SF was against the Eu unTIL quite recently and a lot of the NI workers unions campaigned for an exit too.

And these trivial things like the eu charging uk holiday makers a tenner to go to Ibiza make me laugh. Go ahead if they want. The brits are their main moneymakers. I hope they raise it to 5 grand a time.

I think I am speaking for most people here when I say 'oh dear' in response to that.

There's probably not many people interested francie tbh. As I said earlier it’s like Gerry offering his brother as baby sitter. Not many takers...... lol...

FrancieBrady · 16-09-2018 3:45pm

timthumbni wrote: »

There's probably not many people interested francie tbh.

When you see a unionist take to bile, you can be sure a cage has been rattled. White knuckle time approaching fast it seems.

You remind me of Arlene in so many ways.

timthumbni · 16-09-2018 3:53pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

timthumbni wrote: »

There's probably not many people interested francie tbh.

When you see a unionist take to bile, you can be sure a cage has been rattled. White knuckle time approaching fast it seems.

You remind me of Arlene in so many ways.

Lol francie. ....... lol......

The Rape of Lucretia · 21-09-2018 1:41pm

Big, unplanned, game changer statement imminent from Theresa on the steps of No. 10.

Is it,

1) Announcement of her agreement with Leo that Eire rejoining the Union is the best step for evsrybody, and a referrendum on Breunion will be held in Ireland on it, with all parties, North and South backing Breunion.

or

2) She is coming clean with the UK, sayin Brexit is national suicide and must be reversed, that she will hold a new referrendum there, and that all UK parties, bar UKIP and The JRM Fan Club, will support Remain.

In 5 mins......

swampgas · 21-09-2018 2:06pm

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Big, unplanned, game changer statement imminent from Theresa on the steps of No. 10.

Is it,

1) Announcement of her agreement with Leo that Eire rejoining the Union is the best step for evsrybody, and a referrendum on Breunion will be held in Ireland on it, with all parties, North and South backing Breunion.

or

2) She is coming clean with the UK, sayin Brexit is national suicide and must be reversed, that she will hold a new referrendum there, and that all UK parties, bar UKIP and The JRM Fan Club, will support Remain.

In 5 mins......

The very definition of "false dichotomy" there ... well done

Kermit.de.frog · 26-09-2018 12:25am

Have they left yet?

The Rape of Lucretia · 30-09-2018 6:14pm

Certainly changes everything if things go according to Boris' plans : advocating a bridge between the north and Scotland. Interesting. And long a dream. Not a fan of Boris' buffoonery, but this could be a real Brexit dividend for everyone on the island, whether in the Breunion scenario, or in the case of the north joining Eire.
Smarter that the air he likes to affect sometimes, B.

Zebra3 · 30-09-2018 8:46pm

A bridge between the north and Scotland is not economically viable.

So that'll be the DUP all over it so.

Capt'n Midnight · 30-09-2018 9:37pm

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Certainly changes everything if things go according to Boris' plans : advocating a bridge between the north and Scotland. Interesting. And long a dream. Not a fan of Boris' buffoonery, but this could be a real Brexit dividend for everyone on the island, whether in the Breunion scenario, or in the case of the north joining Eire.
Smarter that the air he likes to affect sometimes, B.

Since the proposals are for a bridge on the north side of Belfast it's not much use to us down here. Dublin to anywhere north of Newcastle upon Tyne is faster through Wales. So for us this bridge would only link Scotland to Ulster.

From Belfast anything south of Nottingham is quicker via Dublin, though that may change post-Brexit.

Also ferries count as breaks for drivers. Driving across a bridge doesn't. This also limits the hinterland each side of a bridge. Note that half the trailer traffic into Ireland is unaccompanied, so you don't have to pay the driver during the ferry trip or pay to ferry the tractor across either.

The Chunnel hasn't killed off the Dover ferries because it costs more. An Irish Sea bridge won't be viable unless it can charge enough to pay it's way, and it won't attract the volume of traffic unless it can charge low enough to compete with the ferries.

Junkyard Tom · 30-09-2018 9:58pm

The Channel Tunnel was built between a continent with hundreds of millions of people and an island with over 60m inhabitants. There are direct train services, through the Channel Tunnel, between two of the world's great capitals with a combined population of approximately 20m people. The Channel Tunnel's debt had to be restructured not long after its opening.

Do the DUP, and associated crackpots, really believe a project on a similar scale between the wrong end of an island of six million people and the wrong end of Britain would be viable?

If someone had written a comedy about this clown-show called Brexit five years ago it would have been dismissed as being too silly.

Capt'n Midnight · 30-09-2018 10:08pm

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

The Channel Tunnel was built between a continent with hundreds of millions of people and an island with over 60m inhabitants. There are direct train services, through the Channel Tunnel, between two of the world's great capitals with a combined population of approximately 20m people. The Channel Tunnel's debt had to be restructured not long after its opening.

Do the DUP, and associated crackpots, really believe a project on a similar scale between the wrong end of an island of six million people and the wrong end of Britain would be viable?

If someone had written a comedy about this clown-show called Brexit five years ago it would have been dismissed as being too silly.

Very roughly speaking linking Ireland to Great Britain is like liking Japan to Russia via Sakhalin, similar distances so similar costs. Except there's 127 million people on one side and 4.6 billion on the other. Japan exported $688B and imported $575B, Northern Ireland even doesn't get close to 1% of those volumes, nevermind what % of that trade choose to go on a bridge.

The Rape of Lucretia · 30-09-2018 10:19pm

Population isnt really the issue. Its the uniting of island nations.
Look at Denmark for example.

Or the options already considered when no one's wildest dream included Brexit. Yet here we are. And must look at ways to make the best of it.

Chambers of Commerce of Ireland are already backing it :
https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-23672538

Capt'n Midnight · 30-09-2018 11:05pm

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Population isnt really the issue. Its the uniting of island nations.
Look at Denmark for example.

Like tunnels the cost of bridges rises exponentially with distance and/or depth.

Ignore any article that compares an Irish Sea bridge or tunnel with something done in shallow water. Adams bridge to Sri Lanka or the bridges in the Florida Keys or Chinese bays or on lakes are trivial compared to deep water.

An estimated 1.17 million tonnes of conventional weapons and chemical weapons have been deposited in Beaufort Dyke.

Hiroshima was equivalent to 0.015 million tonnes of conventional explosives.

Just saying.

Peregrinus · 01-10-2018 2:54am

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Population isnt really the issue. Its the uniting of island nations.
Look at Denmark for example.

Or the options already considered when no one's wildest dream included Brexit. Yet here we are. And must look at ways to make the best of it.

Brexit makes the economics of a fixed link more challenging, not less so. People who are interested in "the uniting of island nations" would not be supporters of Brexit, the whole point of which is to separate an island nation.

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Chambers of Commerce of Ireland are already backing it :
https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-23672538

You're quoting an article from 13 years ago in which CCI called for a rail link from Wexford to Pembrokeshire and claiming that this means they "already back" Johnson's suggestion of a road bridge from NI to Scotland?

ancapailldorcha · 01-10-2018 9:33am

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

The Channel Tunnel was built between a continent with hundreds of millions of people and an island with over 60m inhabitants. There are direct train services, through the Channel Tunnel, between two of the world's great capitals with a combined population of approximately 20m people. The Channel Tunnel's debt had to be restructured not long after its opening.

Do the DUP, and associated crackpots, really believe a project on a similar scale between the wrong end of an island of six million people and the wrong end of Britain would be viable?

If someone had written a comedy about this clown-show called Brexit five years ago it would have been dismissed as being too silly.

I once watched an interview with Armando Iannucci who said that he wasn't going to satirise Brexit because he has no idea how.

Zebra3 · 01-10-2018 3:51pm

If the Brits wanna pay for it, good luck to them.

The Rape of Lucretia · 01-10-2018 5:49pm

Zebra3 wrote: »

If the Brits wanna pay for it, good luck to them.

With will, commitment, and imagination from both sides, I am sure the means could be found to put concrete to what would be the ultimate bridge building exercise between the two-isles-as-one.
A foundation pillar ceremony in 2022, marking one hundred years, and coinciding with the Festival of Britain, would be a terrific point to launch a Breunion process.

Zebra3 · 01-10-2018 5:53pm

Commitments from both sides for internal UK infrastructure?

Aye.....

Imreoir2 · 01-10-2018 9:50pm

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

With will, commitment, and imagination from both sides, I am sure the means could be found to put concrete to what would be the ultimate bridge building exercise between the two-isles-as-one.
A foundation pillar ceremony in 2022, marking one hundred years, and coinciding with the Festival of Britain, would be a terrific point to launch a Breunion process.

Why would Ireland want to joint Brexit Britain?

And the festivle of Britain thing is a disgraceful idea, imagine having a festivle aimed at celebrating a union that has caused so much harm to so many people in the North. Having a big flag waiving piss up in Belfast is not going to end in any kind of trouble, or provoke one side of the community at all... :rolleyes:

Capt'n Midnight · 01-10-2018 10:22pm

Imreoir2 wrote: »

And the festivle of Britain thing is a disgraceful idea

Another day with parades and people waving Union Jacks all over place

What could possibly go wrong ?

Capt'n Midnight · 01-10-2018 10:35pm

Imreoir2 wrote: »

And the festivle of Britain thing is a disgraceful idea, imagine having a festivle aimed at celebrating a union

The Act Of Union took effect in 1801.

2022 is of course the centenary of when 26 counties left the UK.

Methinks they might not have thought this one through.

The Rape of Lucretia · 01-10-2018 10:43pm

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Another day with parades and people waving Union Jacks all over place

What could possibly go wrong ?

Nothing. Its a celebration. We need creative and flexible solutions on this issue, and obviously the point is that everyone on the island would be on board with a reconfigured relationship amongst all on these islands. Whats wrong with a Union Jack ? Nothing if your mind is closed to the new possibilities, and buys into the longer term vision. Some of the high horse attitude looking down on little Englander Brexiteers is really the same thing writ small from some in Eire. And to their loss.