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Pro12 Semi-Final 2: Connacht vs Glasgow, Galway 21 May 18.30. Live Sky, TG4, BBC Alba

1235

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,186 ✭✭✭domrush


    Hagz wrote: »
    Ronan Loughney - international
    Finlay Bealham - international
    Ultan Dillane - international
    John Muldoon - international
    Jake Heenan - would be international if he were eligible
    Tom McCartney would be international if he were eligible
    Kieran Marmion - international
    AJ MacGinty - international
    Bundee Aki - would be international if he were eligible
    Robbie Henshaw - international

    The difference being Robbie is the only one there with caps in the double digits.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,536 ✭✭✭former total


    Glasgow
    Zebre and Treviso have huge numbers of internationals. They must surely be favourites to win the Pro12 next season.

    Jaysus lads. This is Lam playing the game in the build up to a big match, a bit of harmless cute hoorism. Zero value in analysing it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,257 ✭✭✭Hagz


    domrush wrote: »
    The difference being Robbie is the only one there with caps in the double digits.

    It's just harmless banter.

    The honest point is that painting out the Leinster team to be the Irish team fosters this notion that should Connacht win, then the Irish selection needs to be seriously re-considered. But in reality, very few of the Leinster team that Connacht will play make the Irish XV. There's McGrath, Ross, Toner, Heaslip and Sexton. That's it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭its_phil


    connachta wrote: »
    McGrath = international
    Cronin/Strauss = international
    Ross/Furlong = international
    Toner = international
    VdF/Murphy = international
    Ruddock = international
    Heaslip = international
    Reddan = international
    Sexton = international
    Rob K = international
    Fitz = international
    Ringrose = about to be international
    Teo'o Kirchner Nacewa = would be international or close to be if they were playing in their country

    Ah You - International
    Bealham - International
    White - International
    Dillane - International
    Loughney - International
    Muldoon - International
    Marmion - International
    MacGinty - International
    Henshaw - International


    There's Internationals in all the teams. Point is Connacht are not playing Ireland next week.

    Put those international caps side by side. It's not even comparable, why are you downplaying the side Leinster have? They provided 14/23 of the players for the France game and 13/23 of the players for Argentina game. Impressive really.

    It's not the whole Ireland team but it's a more than decent chunk!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,974 ✭✭✭connachta


    Glasgow
    Buer wrote: »
    connachta wrote: »
    McGrath = international
    Cronin/Strauss = international
    Ross/Furlong = international
    Toner = international
    VdF/Murphy = international
    Ruddock = international
    Heaslip = international
    Reddan = international
    Sexton = international
    Rob K = international
    Fitz = international
    Ringrose = about to be international
    Teo'o Kirchner Nacewa = would be international or close to be if they were playing in their country

    International caps in Ireland mean the square root of f*ck all.

    Ronan Loughney, Rodney Ah You, Finlay Bealham, Muldoon, Ultan Dillane...all internationals. Muldowney would be if he had come here when he was younger as would McCartney. Heenan will be an international.

    It's a wonder that Connacht don't crush all opposition with nearly an entire test pack on the field as well as their international halfbacks.

    In my list I Quoted 15 Leinster guys regular in the current Irish 1st team (the 23). Connacht just have Henshaw and probably Dillane. No comparison (yet)


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 23,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭TICKLE_ME_ELMO


    Dan McFarland and Dan Parks
    its_phil wrote: »
    Put those international caps side by side. It's not even comparable, why are you downplaying the side Leinster have? They provided 14/23 of the players for the France game and 13/23 of the players for Argentina game. Impressive really.

    It's not the whole Ireland team but it's a more than decent chunk!!

    I'm not downplaying the side that Leinster have. I'm saying Connacht will not be facing Ireland next week.

    I'm also saying Pat Lam's habit of pointing out how many internationals each side they face have is starting to annoy me.

    That's it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,974 ✭✭✭connachta


    Glasgow
    its_phil wrote: »
    Put those international caps side by side. It's not even comparable, why are you downplaying the side Leinster have? They provided 14/23 of the players for the France game and 13/23 of the players for Argentina game. Impressive really.

    It's not the whole Ireland team but it's a more than decent chunk!!

    I'm not downplaying the side that Leinster have. I'm saying Connacht will not be facing Ireland next week.

    I'm also saying Pat Lam's habit of pointing out how many internationals each side they face have is starting to annoy me.

    That's it.

    All right 14/23, 60% of the Irish team, + 3 southern hemisphere backs. Let's say 30% of the Leinster team is not up to the best international standard (not Italy's one). Lam is right overall


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 23,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭TICKLE_ME_ELMO


    Dan McFarland and Dan Parks
    connachta wrote: »
    In my list I Quoted 15 Leinster guys regular in the current Irish 1st team (the 23). Connacht just have Henshaw and probably Dillane. No comparison (yet)

    Pat Lam isn't getting specific with numbers, why should we? He says Internationals, what does that mean? Players with International caps.

    Also, on your list, 1 has 2 caps (VDF), 1 has 5 caps (Furlong) and 1 (Ringrose) hasn't been capped at all.

    If you want to list players who might get capped you could add at least 4, if not more, to Connacht's list.


  • Site Banned Posts: 2,055 ✭✭✭Adbrowne


    I'm not downplaying the side that Leinster have. I'm saying Connacht will not be facing Ireland next week.

    I'm also saying Pat Lam's habit of pointing out how many internationals each side they face have is starting to annoy me.

    That's it.

    If they believe in what they put out in the initiative for the next 5 years then they need to stop seeing themselves as the poor relation.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,536 ✭✭✭former total


    Glasgow
    Is there an actual quote from Lam anywhere?

    Like, I know I'm outraged, I'm just not sure why.

    Also need to find the right pitch of shrill indignation. Should I leave it at Alan Quinlan or go full Ferris?


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 23,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭TICKLE_ME_ELMO


    Dan McFarland and Dan Parks
    Adbrowne wrote: »
    If they believe in what they put out in the initiative for the next 5 years then they need to stop seeing themselves as the poor relation.

    It's obvious that this notion of them being the poor relation and the "us vs them" attitude is being fostered this season for a reason, and it's working.

    If you want to get into the nitty gritty of how international players impact a team have a look at how many players Leinster were missing 2-3 months at the start of the season and over the 6 Nations. How many internationals were they playing with in August, September, October? Same for Glasgow, same for Ulster, same for Munster.

    Let me just be clear here... I am delighted for Connacht, they've been a pleasure to watch this year, I pretty much want them to win next week, I hope it's not a one off and they can carry on next season. But I will be interested to see how things pan out when the other Provinces and teams have a full preseason with their players and have a full squad to select from from week 1.


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 23,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭TICKLE_ME_ELMO


    Dan McFarland and Dan Parks
    Is there an actual quote from Lam anywhere?

    Like, I know I'm outraged, I'm just not sure why.

    Also need to find the right pitch of shrill indignation. Should I leave it at Alan Quinlan or go full Ferris?

    It was in the post match interview on TG4. He mentioned something about Leinster being favourites and then said they're basically playing Ireland next week.

    I'm not outraged about it. I just think that notion is wearing a bit thin at this point.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,536 ✭✭✭former total


    Glasgow
    It was in the post match interview on TG4. He mentioned something about Leinster being favourites and then said they're basically playing Ireland next week.

    I'm not outraged about it. I just think that notion is wearing a bit thin at this point.

    Ah yeah I'm only messing, I agree he's been banging this drum a bit too much.


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 23,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭TICKLE_ME_ELMO


    Dan McFarland and Dan Parks
    Ah yeah I'm only messing, I agree he's been banging this drum a bit too much.

    That is all I'm saying.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,974 ✭✭✭connachta


    Glasgow
    We're not the poor relation anymore, neither are Leinster-Ireland yet.

    Glasgow games were 50/50, this is 60/40. We've a full 23 unavailable, including Buckley. Leinster may have Teo'o and Isa absent added to SOB. They're favourite. Accept your status guys


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  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 23,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭TICKLE_ME_ELMO


    Dan McFarland and Dan Parks
    connachta wrote: »
    We're not the poor relation anymore, neither are Leinster-Ireland yet.

    Glasgow games were 50/50, this is 60/40. We've a full 23 unavailable, including Buckley. Leinster may have Teo'o and Isa absent added to SOB. They're favourite. Accept your status guys

    Nobody is denying Leinster are favourites.

    I'm denying that Connacht are playing Ireland next week.

    p.s. Munster are clearly the poor relation now ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,974 ✭✭✭connachta


    Glasgow
    14 Irish + 3 Southern hem + Ringrose who should be in S.A, that's 18 out of 23 with high international level in Leinster. Lam is basically right. He omits to point out the Connacht international, the 3 other in the making + our own + Southern hemisphere gems. But it's still 7 vs 18.
    Hopefully rugby is not just individualities, but a team-build sport, and Connacht team has huge confidence


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,974 ✭✭✭connachta


    Glasgow
    14 Irish + 3 Southern hem + Ringrose who should be in S.A, that's 18 out of 23 with high international level in Leinster. Lam is basically right. He omits to point out the Connacht international, the 3 others in the making + our own Southern hemisphere gems. But it's still 7 vs 18.
    Hopefully rugby is not just individualities, but a team-build sport, and Connacht team has huge confidence


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 23,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭TICKLE_ME_ELMO


    Dan McFarland and Dan Parks
    connachta wrote: »
    14 Irish + 3 Southern hem + Ringrose who should be in S.A, that's 18 out of 23 with high international level in Leinster. Lam is basically right. He omits to point out the Connacht international, the 3 other in the making + our own + Southern hemisphere gems. But it's still 7 vs 18.
    Hopefully rugby is not just individualities, but a team-build sport, and Connacht team has huge confidence

    Unless Leinster field 18 players, some of them in the same position, it's not.

    Leinster have more players that are usually involved with Ireland. That's a fact.

    The default Ireland side at the moment does not include all of these players. That is also a fact.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,551 ✭✭✭FACECUTTR


    Glasgow
    Repetitive muck if you don't like what Lam says don't watch the interviews.


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  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 23,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭TICKLE_ME_ELMO


    Dan McFarland and Dan Parks
    FACECUTTR wrote: »
    Repetitive muck if you don't like what Lam says don't watch the interviews.

    How can I know if I like what he says if I don't watch them?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,245 ✭✭✭ClanofLams


    Cullen, Foley, Kiss, Schmidt etc hardly veer much from their scripts week to week. Complaining for the sake of it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭its_phil


    connachta wrote: »
    14 Irish + 3 Southern hem + Ringrose who should be in S.A, that's 18 out of 23 with high international level in Leinster. Lam is basically right. He omits to point out the Connacht international, the 3 other in the making + our own + Southern hemisphere gems. But it's still 7 vs 18.
    Hopefully rugby is not just individualities, but a team-build sport, and Connacht team has huge confidence

    Unless Leinster field 18 players, some of them in the same position, it's not.

    Leinster have more players that are usually involved with Ireland. That's a fact.

    The default Ireland side at the moment does not include all of these players. That is also a fact.

    Just to put some context on what the Ireland comment, it was tongue in cheek and you can see that by the way he said it.

    He did not literally mean all XV are Ireland.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,196 ✭✭✭OldRio


    Right, any more mountains to be made from molehills?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,449 ✭✭✭evil_seed


    What Lam said was basically this... we won the coin toss, so we've the home dressing room. We're Scotland playing ireland in murrayfield. Tongue firmly in cheek boys

    Paraphrased but that's all.


    Back to.the match, I'll watch it again shortly. Everyone of them deserve a new watch for player of the month. Everything was left out on the pitch and you can't ask for more. So proud


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,047 ✭✭✭Bazzo


    Glasgow
    He's been in Ireland since he was about 15, hasn't he? Can't see why he wouldn't be eligible.

    I think he was 7 or something when he moved over.


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 23,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭TICKLE_ME_ELMO


    Dan McFarland and Dan Parks
    Bazzo wrote: »
    I think he was 7 or something when he moved over.

    I looked it up this morning, he was 10 when they moved over, 25 now. Think that's where I was getting the 15 from.

    Either way he'd be eligible to play for Ireland now, right?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,047 ✭✭✭Bazzo


    Glasgow
    I looked it up this morning, he was 10 when they moved over, 25 now. Think that's where I was getting the 15 from.

    Either way he'd be eligible to play for Ireland now, right?

    Yep. In all likelihood he's an Irish citzen, and even if he wasn't he would have been eligible from the age of 21 through residency.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 15,238 ✭✭✭✭Diabhal Beag


    https://twitter.com/Rossgarvey/status/734430751119298561

    Print media (the purest of all news sources) confirms earlier speculation that nearly 4000 more punters witnessed Niyi clearouts than were present to see Hulk Hogan slam Andre the Giant.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,154 ✭✭✭✭Neil3030


    Bundee Aki. Just. Wow.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 10 Mrreliable


    its_phil wrote: »
    Just to put some context on what the Ireland comment, it was tongue in cheek and you can see that by the way he said it.

    He did not literally mean all XV are Ireland.

    I agree. Lam likes to have fun with the Media


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,166 ✭✭✭✭Zzippy


    Pat Lam makes me laugh with his constant mentions of how many internationals are in the other sides. I know why he does it but it's wearing a bit thin. Talking about the final he said "we're basically playing Ireland next week".

    Looking at the 6 Nations Sexton was the only Leinster back to play regularly in the 15. There were a varying number in the forwards but never more than 4 or 5.

    Professional team coach in bigging up the opposition shocker!

    Opposition fan in over reaction shocker!

    It's obvious that this notion of them being the poor relation and the "us vs them" attitude is being fostered this season for a reason, and it's working.

    If you want to get into the nitty gritty of how international players impact a team have a look at how many players Leinster were missing 2-3 months at the start of the season and over the 6 Nations. How many internationals were they playing with in August, September, October? Same for Glasgow, same for Ulster, same for Munster.

    Let me just be clear here... I am delighted for Connacht, they've been a pleasure to watch this year, I pretty much want them to win next week, I hope it's not a one off and they can carry on next season. But I will be interested to see how things pan out when the other Provinces and teams have a full preseason with their players and have a full squad to select from from week 1.

    I will be interested to see how things pan out when everything is equal - full preseasons, etc. and the unimportant things, like IRFU funding... ;)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,551 ✭✭✭FACECUTTR


    Glasgow
    Zzippy wrote: »
    Professional team coach in bigging up the opposition shocker!

    Opposition fan in over reaction shocker!




    I will be interested to see how things pan out when everything is equal - full preseasons, etc. and the unimportant things, like IRFU funding... ;)

    And Dennis O'Brien


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 23,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭TICKLE_ME_ELMO


    Dan McFarland and Dan Parks
    Zzippy wrote: »
    I will be interested to see how things pan out when everything is equal - full preseasons, etc. and the unimportant things, like IRFU funding... ;)

    Obviously things aren't equal. My point was that if we're going to talk about how much better the other provinces are because they've got x number of internationals then we also need to talk about the disadvantages that has led to this season, disadvantages Connacht were mostly able to avoid.

    Also, I didn't over react to anything. I said it was starting to get on my nerves. If anything the reaction to my reaction has been the overreaction.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,166 ✭✭✭✭Zzippy


    Obviously things aren't equal. My point was that if we're going to talk about how much better the other provinces are because they've got x number of internationals then we also need to talk about the disadvantages that has led to this season, disadvantages Connacht were mostly able to avoid.

    Also, I didn't over react to anything. I said it was starting to get on my nerves. If anything the reaction to my reaction has been the overreaction.

    If an opposition coach giving a cliched sound bite to big up the other team and reduce the pressure on his own gets on your nerves so much you should probably not listen to any coaches interviews... ever. Or are you just annoyed because it might work? ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,767 ✭✭✭✭molloyjh


    Zzippy wrote: »
    If an opposition coach giving a cliched sound bite to big up the other team and reduce the pressure on his own gets on your nerves so much you should probably not listen to any coaches interviews... ever. Or are you just annoyed because it might work? ;)

    I'm sure if Leo was constantly saying that Connacht were made up of former Leinster players who want to get one over on their former province you'd see a few Connacht fans getting a little perturbed by it.

    I get where TME is coming from. It doesn't really bother me personally but I can see the point. Connacht have been at the top end of the Pro12 table for some time now and have had a bloody good season. Playing David to Leinsters Goliath after the season they've had is pretty shrewd, but also a bit disingenuous. They just beat Glasgow twice in a row after all. That a few here have made TMEs point out to be something completely different to what it was has ensured this has grown legs though.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,903 ✭✭✭ionadnapokot


    Glasgow
    Neil3030 wrote: »
    Bundee Aki. Just. Wow.

    Any more word on his injury?
    That lad would play on one foot. What a smasher.
    Counting down the day's until he plays for Ireland.....


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,301 ✭✭✭gordongekko


    Any more word on his injury?
    That lad would play on one foot. What a smasher.
    Counting down the day's until he plays for Ireland.....

    So how many days are left until he is Irish qualified


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,903 ✭✭✭ionadnapokot


    Glasgow
    So how many days are left until he is Irish qualified

    .....Nov 2017
    No fixtures arranged yet


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  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 23,937 Mod ✭✭✭✭TICKLE_ME_ELMO


    Dan McFarland and Dan Parks
    Zzippy wrote: »
    If an opposition coach giving a cliched sound bite to big up the other team and reduce the pressure on his own gets on your nerves so much you should probably not listen to any coaches interviews... ever. Or are you just annoyed because it might work? ;)

    This is the last thing I'm going to say on this....

    Here is my original post.
    Pat Lam makes me laugh with his constant mentions of how many internationals are in the other sides. I know why he does it but it's wearing a bit thin. Talking about the final he said "we're basically playing Ireland next week".

    Looking at the 6 Nations Sexton was the only Leinster back to play regularly in the 15. There were a varying number in the forwards but never more than 4 or 5.

    I said he makes me laugh, and his shtick is wearing a bit thin. That's all.

    What followed was a series of posts 1)overreacting to what I said 2)vehemently defending Pat Lam with STATS!! and 3)basically accusing me of being a put out die hard Leinster fan. (despite the number of times I've literally said I'll probably be leaning toward Connacht, support wise, next week)

    I did get into some discussion about the relevance of internationals and what the definition of an international is, how Connacht actually benefited from not having to send 20 odd players off to the WC/6N etc. etc. I engaged in this conversation because others kept bringing it up as part of their defence case for Mr. Lam. For me it had nothing to do with my original post that Lam's soundbites are getting stale.

    So, there you are.... not annoyed, not afraid of Connacht winning, not a "D4 LET'S SHUT CONNACHT DOWN!!!" Trevor Francis Jamie Heaslip" sort of person. I simply find that particular cliche of Lam's has run it's course. THE END.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    But why do you hate Connacht?


  • Site Banned Posts: 2,055 ✭✭✭Adbrowne


    what is the time frame for citings with the pro12?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,551 ✭✭✭FACECUTTR


    Glasgow
    Adbrowne wrote: »
    what is the time frame for citings with the pro12?

    I think we are better off without Rodney with the frame of mind he is in.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,695 ✭✭✭BrokenMan


    FACECUTTR wrote: »
    I think we are better off without Rodney with the frame of mind he is in.

    Should be cited for not giving a toss about the team paying his wages


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,820 ✭✭✭b.gud


    FACECUTTR wrote: »
    I think we are better off without Rodney with the frame of mind he is in.

    If one of Buckley, White or O'Donnell were available I'd 100% agree


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,551 ✭✭✭FACECUTTR


    Glasgow
    b.gud wrote: »
    If one of Buckley, White or O'Donnell were available I'd 100% agree

    He is not reliable. McGrath will take him apart in the scrum and he offers nothing but knock ons and penalties in the loose. Unless he has a few sports psychology sessions this week he is better off at home in Belfast because that's where his head is at the moment.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,154 ✭✭✭✭Neil3030


    When Mr. Aki wants you to dance, you dance:



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,974 ✭✭✭connachta


    Glasgow
    Well Nacewua Teo'o and Rob Kearney are fit. 13 if not 14 out of 15 are recent international player (with Teo'o and Ringrose very soon to be, this summer). Lam is tongue in cheek but right. If you want to compare just those who are in the starting XV yeah it's "only" 7-8 Leinster boys, but in this case only 1 Connacht player (Henshaw). The ratio is worse than the 18/7 of extended squads (including the 3 south hemisphere gems of both teams)


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,820 ✭✭✭b.gud


    FACECUTTR wrote: »
    He is not reliable. McGrath will take him apart in the scrum and he offers nothing but knock ons and penalties in the loose. Unless he has a few sports psychology sessions this week he is better off at home in Belfast because that's where his head is at the moment.

    Bealham will be starting so he'll be the one that will be dealing with McGrath. I'm not talking about starting him. Just he's the best bench option we have atm


  • Site Banned Posts: 2,055 ✭✭✭Adbrowne


    http://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/36371264

    Finn Russellout of scotlands tour. Still in hospital


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