Ukrainians mark the 73rd anniversary of the formation of their SS division.

Jimmy Garlic · 30-04-2016 02:31AM

Gatling wrote: »

If Ukraine are hiding the tapes as accused by several posters past and present,
Why are the transcripts readily available, the Dutch investigation had them too .
They also have the black box recorders also with transcripts available to the public .

So what are Ukraine supposedly hiding again because it seems some people stick to the Kremlin lines

Ukraine has to give the green light to release the tapes. Transcripts. Easily falsified. The Dutch had a dog in the race as they actively supported the coup, their position as ''independent investigators'' is debatable. If the actual recordings correspond with the so called transcripts then there is no reason not to release them. Wouldn't you agree?

darkpagandeath · 30-04-2016 06:12AM

I'm sure RT will be along soon to show us all the very very far right groups in the Old USSR and Neo Nazis ??

30-04-2016 07:46AM

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

The Dutch had a dog in the race as they actively supported the coup...

And they also snuck a lot of their people onto the flight, the nasty so and sos. Almost 200. Now. Add that to your conspiracy theory.

arayess · 30-04-2016 09:10AM

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Stalins genocidal collectivisation policy and his purges affected Russians too you know. Especially southern Russians. Ukrainians weren't specifically singled out.

why does this matter?

the ukraine aren't allowed hate stalin because others suffered too?
I don't get you..

gandalf · 30-04-2016 09:57AM

There must be a report that's critical of Russia due out soon if the putinbots are resurfacing.

Jimmy Garlic · 30-04-2016 04:31PM

gandalf wrote: »

There must be a report that's critical of Russia due out soon if the putinbots are resurfacing.

Of course, here I am with my brand new ushanka on, counting the rubles that Putin paid me, waiting for my next order from my handler ''Siberian Fox'' who operates out of the Kremlin. Whatever fulfills your fantasies.

Have you any opinion on why the tapes are withheld from scrutiny? Is there a logical explanation why? Surely if the tapes confirm what was printed on the transcripts then releasing them shouldn't be an issue? Looking forward to your answer.

PopePalpatine · 30-04-2016 05:22PM

gandalf wrote: »

There must be a report that's critical of Russia due out soon if the putinbots are resurfacing.

Well, the team who released the Panama Papers are planning to open up a searchable database of 20,000 shell companies for the public soon.

Jimmy Garlic · 30-04-2016 06:11PM

PopePalpatine wrote: »

Well, the team who released the Panama Papers are planning to open up a searchable database of 20,000 shell companies for the public soon.

Haha. Putin must be shaking in his boots. Or maybe i'm mixing him up with David Cameron, who pocketed cash from his from his fathers shell company.

Lurkio · 30-04-2016 06:28PM

gandalf wrote: »

There must be a report that's critical of Russia due out soon if the putinbots are resurfacing.

Not Putinbots, noble souls inspired by unbreakable spirit of Russian people and great leader, Vladmir Putin.

Jimmy Garlic · 30-04-2016 08:54PM

Any chance you might answer the question I put to you about the tapes Gandalf? Or will you, like the rest of the ''Russia is evil'' crowd, just ignore things that don't jive with your bias?

gandalf · 30-04-2016 08:59PM

I thought the topic was about Ukrainian Nazis? Uncomfortable now people are showing the Russians have a problem that at least is on the same scale if not bigger with National Socialists?

Even worse Putins Russia is funding alot of the extremist political parties in Europe.

Jimmy Garlic · 30-04-2016 09:23PM

gandalf wrote: »

I thought the topic was about Ukrainian Nazis? Uncomfortable now people are showing the Russians have a problem that at least is on the same scale if not bigger with National Socialists?

Even worse Putins Russia is funding alot of the extremist political parties in Europe.

Right so. You won't answer the question. Fair enough. Back on topic. Is it acceptable that the countries within the EU, the EU itself, and the US are supporting a country which has a large element of neo-nazi vermin incorporated into its armed forces?

gandalf · 30-04-2016 09:31PM

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Right so. You won't answer the question. Fair enough. Back on topic. Is it acceptable that the countries within the EU, the EU itself, and the US are supporting a country which has a large element of neo-nazi vermin incorporated into its armed forces?

Is it acceptable for a country to be funding far right and far left political parties all over Europe then?

I'll give you a clue, that country isn't Ukraine. The country in questions leader is of quite short stature and reeks of corruption.

BoJack Horseman · 30-04-2016 09:41PM

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

here I am with my brand new ushanka on, counting the rubles that Putin paid me

Who wears a ushanka in this weather?

So, you forgot to answer....
What in your opinion brought down MH17?
SAM or AAM?

Jimmy Garlic · 30-04-2016 09:44PM

gandalf wrote: »

Is it acceptable for a country to be funding far right and far left political parties all over Europe then?

I'll give you a clue, that country isn't Ukraine. The country in questions leader is of quite short stature and reeks of corruption.

You are a slippery one Gandalf. I agree that it is not appropriate for Russia to interfere with the political process in other countries, but maybe since various ''NGOs'' have been interfering heavily in Russia Putin feels like it is fair game. Now, do you think it is appropriate for the US, EU and friends to support a country that has incorporated neo-nazi units into its armed forces?

Gatling · 30-04-2016 10:00PM

Rants of another plastic vladi

gandalf · 30-04-2016 10:19PM

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

You are a slippery one Gandalf. I agree that it is not appropriate for Russia to interfere with the political process in other countries, but maybe since various ''NGOs'' have been interfering heavily in Russia Putin feels like it is fair game.

Bollix Putin and Russia have been interfering with European countries for years. In my opinion Russia under Putins rule is the biggest danger to European peace and stability.

Now, do you think it is appropriate for the US, EU and friends to support a country that has incorporated neo-nazi units into its armed forces?

It's not ideal and yes I think in an ideal world we shouldn't be supporting a country that has done this. But it's not an ideal world and the Ukraine has come under attack by it's larger nationalist militaristic neighbour so desperate times necessitate desperate measures.

gandalf · 01-05-2016 10:24AM

Happy May Day comrade Garlic

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yDrtNEr_5M

Jimmy Garlic · 01-05-2016 05:22PM

gandalf wrote: »

Happy May Day comrade Garlic

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yDrtNEr_5M

You're a very funny boy. This one is for you, enjoy..

BoJack Horseman · 01-05-2016 08:08PM

What do you think brought down MH17 Jimmy?

SAM or AAM?

Lurkio · 01-05-2016 08:25PM

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

What do you think brought down MH17 Jimmy?

SAM or AAM?

Or a BEAR thrown by a man with no shirt on.

BoJack Horseman · 01-05-2016 08:43PM

Lurkio wrote: »

Or a BEAR thrown by a man with no shirt on.

Bears are impressive, transport & munition all rolled into one!

Lurkio · 02-05-2016 05:39AM

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

Bears are impressive, transport & munition all rolled into one!

It's like a big sexy oppressive sex tank, that might accidentally end up on the wrong side of a border fighting alongside "rebels".

Dohnjoe · 02-05-2016 09:07AM

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

With a torch light procession no less. I think that we all owe the Dutch a BIG thank you for saying no to ushering Ukraine into the EU. This kind of stuff is way too popular there -

Moscow sees itself engaged in an information war with Kiev (and the Western world) and has been focusing on any far-right groups in Ukraine

It would be like RTE news constantly reporting every EDL/BNP rally and march in the UK

There are far-right groups and neo-nazis in every country, (ironically including Russia, who are estimated to have half the world's total of neo-Nazis)

Not to say these groups aren't completely insignificant, and directly after the uprising some far-right politicians were given positions in the interim gov, however since then the far-right candidates got less than 2% of the vote in the elections in Ukraine. It's also common for the far-right to enjoy a resurgence of support during harsh economic times - Golden Dawn in Greece is a strong example

An increasing number of the main media outlets in Russia are influenced/controlled by the Kremlin and disinformation is commonplace

HensVassal · 02-05-2016 09:32AM

suicide_circus wrote: »

They can't abide it so much they had to shoot a passing passenger airliner out of the sky killing all on board.

Why would they shoot down a Malaysian airliner with not a single Ukrainian on board if they hated Ukrainians so much

Dohnjoe · 02-05-2016 10:32AM

HensVassal wrote: »

Why would they shoot down a Malaysian airliner with not a single Ukrainian on board if they hated Ukrainians so much

They were targeting all Ukrainian military aircraft

It's likely they mistook it for a Ukrainian transport (they had shot one down recently before)

HensVassal · 02-05-2016 11:27AM

Dohnjoe wrote: »

They were targeting all Ukrainian military aircraft

It's likely they mistook it for a Ukrainian transport (they had shot one down recently before)

Sounds a bit far fetched

Dohnjoe · 02-05-2016 11:41AM

HensVassal wrote: »

Sounds a bit far fetched

??

Investigations have shown MH17 was almost certainly shot down by a BUK launcher. It's unlikely they deliberately targeted an international airliner. Such airliners look similar to Ukrainian transports which can cruise at the same altitudes - transports which were being targeted with one being shot down just shortly before

What plausible alternative do you suggest happened?

HensVassal · 02-05-2016 04:18PM

Sand wrote: »

Neither am I. I wasn't there. It might have been shot down by a regular Russian military unit on 'holidays' or it might have been shot down by irregular Russian militias supplied with state level weaponry by Russia. But it certainly wasn't shot down by the Ukrainians, the US, the Jews, the Lizard people or whatever conspiracy theory your flowchart is pointing you to.

As for armchair generals...with you not able to tell the implications of an SAM vs. an AAM...I wouldn't be using your own lack of knowledge to discredit others views.

Given the thread has so easily derailed into (another) debate about Putins crimes in Ukraine, doesn't it highlight the shallow propaganda effort of the OP?

How do you know?

Gatling · 02-05-2016 05:49PM

It was the gay Butler with a cricket bat

Ukrainians mark the 73rd anniversary of the formation of their SS division.

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