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Garda, nurses, teachers and doctor's pay

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Comments

  • #572
    legocrazy505
    Closed Accounts Posts: 691 ✭✭✭legocrazy505


    Martypants1 wrote: »
    doireannod wrote: »
    8 hours is a standard day. Most of us work more than that. Everyday. Right through the summer. Every year. Not optional. Not paid extra. The idea that someone considers an 8 hour day arduous and commendable is ridiculous.

    Teachers are so detached from the real world it's unreal.
    So why don't you both do their job for the week and see how you get on? Honestly people like the both of you need to be shown the reality of these jobs. It's the exact same as people claiming nurses and gardai have it easy.


  • #573
    Caoimhgh1n
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,499 ✭✭✭✭Caoimhgh1n


    mulbot wrote: »
    The link showed 31,009.that's not a bad starting wage

    As I said, it may have changed slightly.


  • #574
    mulbot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,643 ✭✭✭mulbot


    Caoimhgh1n wrote: »
    As I said, it may have changed slightly.

    So why the complaining? That's a decent starting wage,especially when you consider the fact that they are indeed starting, with definite raises a certainty


  • #575
    Inspector Coptoor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,818 ✭✭✭Inspector Coptoor


    mulbot wrote: »
    In fairness,starting wage of 31,000 is fair

    Fairness?

    What's fair about it?

    3 or 4 year degree plus a now obligatory 2 years Progessional Masters in Education and you start on €31k that goes to €59,940 after 25 years with very small prospects of promotion.

    If we want good teachers we need to pay good wages.

    €31k might be a fair starting wage for some people but I don't think it's is for teachers and nurses.


  • #576
    Caoimhgh1n
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,499 ✭✭✭✭Caoimhgh1n


    mulbot wrote: »
    So why the complaining? That's a decent starting wage,especially when you consider the fact that they are indeed starting, with definite raises a certainty

    They shouldn't have to wait. It costs a lot to spend 6 years in university.


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  • #577
    doireannod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 176 ✭✭doireannod


    mulbot wrote: »
    In fairness,starting wage of 31,000 is fair

    Doctors start on less (30k a year). This represents 12 months work. Not 9 months. I don't think 31k for 9 months work is fair.


  • #578
    doireannod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 176 ✭✭doireannod


    Caoimhgh1n wrote: »
    They shouldn't have to wait. It costs a lot to spend 6 years in university.

    Teaching is a 6 year course?


  • #579
    mulbot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,643 ✭✭✭mulbot


    Inspector Coptoor wrote: »
    Fairness?

    What's fair about it?

    3 or 4 year degree plus a now obligatory 2 years Progessional Masters in Education and you start on €31k that goes to €59,940 after 25 years with very small prospects of promotion.

    If we want good teachers we need to pay good wages.

    €31k might be a fair starting wage for some people but I don't think it's is for teachers and nurses.

    So basically the value of the wage determines the talent of a teacher? I think nurses should be paid twice what a teacher gets by the way,their jobs are much more difficult


  • #580
    Caoimhgh1n
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,499 ✭✭✭✭Caoimhgh1n


    doireannod wrote: »
    Teaching is a 6 year course?

    For secondary, 6 years is the average.


  • #581
    mulbot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,643 ✭✭✭mulbot


    doireannod wrote: »
    Doctors start on less (30k a year). This represents 12 months work. Not 9 months. I don't think 31k for 9 months work is fair.

    Doctors should be starting on much higher levels of pay,as should Nurses-31000 for a starting teacher is a decent wage,


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  • #582
    KatW4
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,495 ✭✭✭KatW4


    mulbot wrote:
    So basically the value of the wage determines the talent of a teacher? I think nurses should be paid twice what a teacher gets by the way,their jobs are much more difficult


    I agree with that. Nurses definitely deserve to be paid more.


  • #583
    Caoimhgh1n
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,499 ✭✭✭✭Caoimhgh1n


    mulbot wrote: »
    So basically the value of the wage determines the talent of a teacher? I think nurses should be paid twice what a teacher gets by the way,their jobs are much more difficult

    How is a nurses job twice as difficult? I am not judging nurses or the importance of their jobs, but that statement interests me.


  • #584
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,925 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    KatW4 wrote: »
    .........I have a child with behaviour issues which means at least once a day, he runs around the classroom and pulls down displays, scares the other children, rip books and kicks or hits me. Then I have the children who don't have a stable home environment who have to have my lunch sometimes and who follow me around because they need an adult to comfort them. .............just the same as other teachers.

    Wow, that bit about giving kids your lunch does bring home the awful things teachers deal with. It must be heartbreaking to be seeing neglected kids struggle through their formative years.

    The 2nd bolded piece.... it's an awful system that has useless gnomes on big money doing the "same" job as yourself but not anywhere near as well and you not being rewarded adequately for your endeavours. It's equally awful that teachers who do their job well are getting lots more wages than you.

    The solution is beyond me, I sincerely hope in a few years you are full time and better rewarded.


  • #585
    Martypants1
    Site Banned Posts: 806 ✭✭✭Martypants1


    Inspector Coptoor wrote: »
    Fairness?

    What's fair about it?

    3 or 4 year degree plus a now obligatory 2 years Progessional Masters in Education and you start on €31k that goes to €59,940 after 25 years with very small prospects of promotion.

    If we want good teachers we need to pay good wages.

    €31k might be a fair starting wage for some people but I don't think it's is for teachers and nurses.

    Most professionals would have to work 5/6 years to get to 31k and you have the cheek to expect more starting off because you're a teacher. WHY?

    Generation entitlement is here guys.


  • #586
    rubadub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,387 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    tayto lover wrote: »
    Addressing almost 500 delegates at the union's annual conference in Killarney, TUI General Secretary John MacGabhann accused the government of treating new-entrant teachers as "galley slaves".

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2016/0329/777992-teacher-conferences/
    That is a despicable comment, he is in effect saying a huge portion of society here are slaves, those on similar wages and glad of it.

    And fancy that, a union who think they should be paid more, well I never...:rolleyes:

    Has there ever been a union in history that refused a pay rise saying "ah sure we're grand".


  • #587
    doireannod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 176 ✭✭doireannod


    Caoimhgh1n wrote: »
    For secondary, 6 years is the average.

    What does that 6 years entail?


  • #588
    Martypants1
    Site Banned Posts: 806 ✭✭✭Martypants1


    doireannod wrote: »
    Teaching is a 6 year course?

    They get an honours degree in 3 years when everyone else does 4 in college. Some cheek.


  • #589
    Caoimhgh1n
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,499 ✭✭✭✭Caoimhgh1n


    doireannod wrote: »
    What does that 6 years entail?

    4 years studying the subject/s they want to teach, and 2 years learning about education.


  • #590
    Inspector Coptoor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,818 ✭✭✭Inspector Coptoor


    mulbot wrote: »
    So basically the value of the wage determines the talent of a teacher? I think nurses should be paid twice what a teacher gets by the way,their jobs are much more difficult

    I never said the value of the wage determines the talent of the teacher - you did.

    My point is that while some people may view teaching and or nursing as a vocation, they are still jobs.

    Good wages attract a higher calibre of applicant.


  • #591
    doireannod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 176 ✭✭doireannod


    Martypants1 wrote: »
    Most professionals would have to work 5/6 years to get to 31k and you have the cheek to expect more starting off because you're a teacher. WHY?

    Generation entitlement is here guys.

    I fully agree. Medicine is 5 years and you start on 30k. Why do teachers think they should start on more?


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  • #592
    mulbot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,643 ✭✭✭mulbot


    Caoimhgh1n wrote: »
    How is a nurses job twice as difficult? I am not judging nurses or the importance of their jobs, but that statement interests me.

    The hours worked for a Nurse/junior Doctor would be a good starting point..


    ( I just want to say,I was going to teach when I came out of School,I deferred the first year,and ended up doing other things,still have regrets at times)


  • #593
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 57,077 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    rubadub wrote: »
    That is a despicable comment, he is in effect saying a huge portion of society here are slaves, those on similar wages and glad of it.

    And fancy that, a union who think they should be paid more, well I never...:rolleyes:

    Has there ever been a union in history that refused a pay rise saying "ah sure we're grand".

    Yeah there was a hell of a riot because of it. Thousands killed :pac:


  • #594
    Caoimhgh1n
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,499 ✭✭✭✭Caoimhgh1n


    mulbot wrote: »
    The hours worked for a Nurse/junior Doctor would be a good starting point..


    Fair enough, each job has its challenges though. Nothing more important than a good nurse/teacher.


  • #595
    Inspector Coptoor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,818 ✭✭✭Inspector Coptoor


    doireannod wrote: »
    What does that 6 years entail?

    Will vary from person to person.

    Science degree is a 4 year course in ireland to get an honors degree.
    The H Dip used to be a one year course but is now a 2 year Masters.

    There are some courses in Science Teaching, Home EC teaching, woodwork/dcg that can be done in 4 years but the majority of teachers I know have an honors degree and H Dip minimum and some I work with have Masters in their field of study and some even have PhDs


  • #596
    cena
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,397 ✭✭✭✭cena


    KatW4 wrote: »
    I'm a teacher and guess how much I made in 2015? 18 thousand euro. Thankfully I don't have to pay rent or I don't know what I'd do.

    We don't have the same holidays as the children because we have to go on courses, set our classrooms up, make plans and fill in forms.

    I am so sick and tired of people telling me that I don't deserve to be paid like a normal person, or teachers who have worked for a few more years than me, because I have more holidays than others. It makes me so bloody angry that people who aren't in the profession can make judgements like this.

    I'm sorry for the angry post but I'm fed up of reading this sort of thing all of the time.
    Why become a teacher if you know what the pay was like before you started. A teachers job shouldn't be about the money but about the kids


  • #597
    mulbot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,643 ✭✭✭mulbot


    Inspector Coptoor wrote: »
    I never said the value of the wage determines the talent of the teacher - you did.

    My point is that while some people may view teaching and or nursing as a vocation, they are still jobs.

    Good wages attract a higher calibre of applicant.

    No I didn't,I had a question mark there,so I was asking you was that the case.

    Good wages also attract people who just want that-good wages,It does not in any way suggest the person is going to be good at the job


  • #598
    Jimmy Iovine
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,416 ✭✭✭Jimmy Iovine


    Martypants1 wrote:
    Once again dealing with brats is part of the job. You don't mention the bits they have to do (talking about primary here) where it's glorified childminding like painting.


    I've read some great posts on here before but that is the best. Keep on hating.

    As for the pay - pay 'parity' not a pay rise is what is being sought here. It's unfair that young teachers are being paid unequally due to the faults of the government and bank officials and quite possibly the INTO themselves (in not seeking a better deal in the original talks).


  • #599
    doireannod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 176 ✭✭doireannod


    Caoimhgh1n wrote: »
    Fair enough, each job has its challenges though. Nothing more important than a good nurse/teacher.

    What about a good doctor eh?


  • #600
    Caoimhgh1n
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,499 ✭✭✭✭Caoimhgh1n


    cena wrote: »
    Why become a teacher if you know what the pay was like before you started. A teachers job shouldn't be about the money but about the kids

    Not when the money is unfair and low, like this teacher's. Teachers go beyond their call of duty for the children, and regularly.


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  • #601
    mulbot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,643 ✭✭✭mulbot


    cena wrote: »
    Why become a teacher if you know what the pay was like before you started. A teachers job shouldn't be about the money but about the kids

    According to Inspector Cooptor it's about money!!!!:eek:


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