Golf at the Olympics

Seve OB · 28-07-2015 5:31pm #1

So with just over a year to go before the world descends on Rio to witness the return of golf after a hundred and something year absence I was just wondering what you thoughts are. I know this will create heated discussion about who should play for who and all that, but lets stay away from that.

Instead I want to know what are your thoughts on golf's place at the olympics? Does it belong there? What about the qualifying standards? Is it necessary? Do the players actually really want it? Do they need it?

My thoughts are it would be a wonderful addition to the games and be a great thing for our sport.................. BUT................... they are doing it all wrong.

Professional golf has a hectic schedule week in and week out for both the ladies and men. Multiple major championships and world golf championships all in and around the Olympic schedule, so I expect the tours will have some juggling to do next year.... or will they bother? Then there is the run up to the Fed Ex Cup, will this be shifted to accommodate the Olympics?

Adam Scott has already said it is pretty much just an exhibition match for the Professional golfers and I couldn't agree more. So why not ditch the Pro's. They get enough high profile golf events during the year with bucket loads of prize money so do they really need another one every 4 years.... for a medal!!!:eek:

My opinion is they should ban the pro's and bring in the amateurs. We all know there are some amateurs out there around the world who have the potential to be superstars, but most of us don't know who they are. So give them this event to showcase their talent. After all, when we watch the Olympics, a lot of the time new names are brought to our screen, and we all love to see the young las from Bray who we have never heard of, doing well at the badminton! So wouldn't it be nice to see the young lad from Greystones doing well at the golf

Most of the amateurs are playing golf every bit as much as the Pro's, and golf is their life, their career. Some are planning to turn pro and others plan to stay amateur forever. They do have some great events to play for, but the Olympics would be special for them and a medal would mean an awful lot to them and it would not be the exhibition match it will be for the Pro's.

We all know some of the up an coming superstars choose to hold of on turning pro in order to play the likes of the Walker cup first. Maybe the Olympics should be another platform, an even bigger platform, for those young (and not so young) amateurs to become household names.

slave1 · 28-07-2015 5:47pm

PGA, European, Web, Asian, Jap, Seniors, Amateurs, Legends, Ladies, LPGA, Solheim, Ryder Cup, Walker Cup etc. etc. I don't care once it's golf...
I just want more on TV so Olympic golf is fine by me and I'm indifferent to the Amateur/Pro debate, the way I look at it is I don't want to see amateur tennis players as the interest levels would drop so pros all the way is grand.

unattendedbag · 28-07-2015 7:04pm

will it be a straightforward stroke play tournament? Better to play matchplay as more neutrals would watch, more excitement and generally the better competitor will rise to the top.

My biggest problem with golf at the Olympics is that it's a one in 4 year tournament and not representative of the best golfer out there. Some unknown player could walk away as Olympic champion after a once in a lifetime round. Form throughout the season rises and dips massively with pros. At least the winner of the 100m sprint will probably the best in his field

MikeSD · 28-07-2015 7:22pm

I don't get why everybody harps on about Olympic golf having no place for pros. Nobody cares about the Olympic soccer because it's mostly u23 players that didn't play at the Euros. It would be great for the game to showcase the very best players to a wider audience.

PARlance · 28-07-2015 7:43pm

I find it strange that the "Pro" debate comes into things these days.
The Olympics is a Pro event, no doubt about that.
I think boxing is the only real true amateur aspect left in it. Afaik, it's the only real sport that has a strong pro offering that isn't allowed in.
There are other amateur events and amateurs competing but that's only because their sport isn't popular enough to have a pro element or the athlete isn't good enough to turn pro.

Practically all the track and field'ers are Pro (bar maybe a few power walkers), basketball, tennis, football, cycling, swimming etc etc are all pro. It would be doing a disservice to golf to have it only for amateurs imo.

Golf needs to grow in its emerging markets and the Olympics is a perfect platform. While it mighn't be the highlight of the year for the Pro's themselves, they are Pro's and they will be out to win it...if they fit it into their schedule... that would my only worry as it may be diminished by withdrawals.

PARlance · 28-07-2015 7:50pm

And don't tell me we wont go bananas when Paddy has that gold medal wedged in that crazy smirk of his

rrpc · 29-07-2015 8:19am

If the Olympics is the showcase of the best in sports then it has to be the Pros. Boxing is a bad example because of the fractured professional game and the multiple 'world' championships.

Adam Scott's comments remind me of Rory McIlroy's about the Ryder Cup before he took part in it.

Roger_007 · 29-07-2015 8:33am

I think that golf has more claim to be an Olympic than many of the sports and events which are now included. The Olympic spirit has become diluted by allowing many team sports in. Team sports have no place on the Olympics because the fundamental principle should be individual athletes competing against each other.
Golf fulfils this principle whereas sports like football, hockey, volleyball etc do not.
I'm not sure if the pro v amateur argument holds any water in the Olympics anymore. Most participants are professional sportspeople.

pistol_75 · 29-07-2015 9:53am

PARlance wrote: »

And don't tell me we wont go bananas when Paddy has that gold medal wedged in that crazy smirk of his

He won't be playing in it

Russman · 29-07-2015 10:47am

Personally I agree with Adam Scott.
I don't think any sport should be there if the Olympic gold isn't the highest honour for that sport. With 4 established majors in the pro game, the Olympics are a distant 5th (at best). You could even argue a pro would rather win a WGC event rather than the Olympics, placing the Olympics just about in the top 10.

By all means have it for the amateurs, similar to the Eisenhower Trophy etc. I think that would make a much better spectacle and top amateurs might hold off turning pro for a year or two to have a chance at going to an Olympics.

irelandrover · 29-07-2015 10:52am

Russman wrote: »

Personally I agree with Adam Scott.
I don't think any sport should be there if the Olympic gold isn't the highest honour for that sport. With 4 established majors in the pro game, the Olympics are a distant 5th (at best). You could even argue a pro would rather win a WGC event rather than the Olympics, placing the Olympics just about in the top 10.

By all means have it for the amateurs, similar to the Eisenhower Trophy etc. I think that would make a much better spectacle and top amateurs might hold off turning pro for a year or two to have a chance at going to an Olympics.

I'd compare it to tennis in the Olympics. Tennis also has 4 majors but yet an Olympic medal is still seen as one of the top honours.

Jawgap · 29-07-2015 11:00am

Why not have both?

Qualifying countries get to enter two, two person teams - at least one player on each team must be U21 or U23. Teams can swap the pairings during the competition.

Then play the tournament as fourball matchplay.

Dbu · 29-07-2015 11:01am

Personally I would rather see Paul Dunne going for a gold than Rory McIlroy

Russman · 29-07-2015 11:01am

irelandrover wrote: »

I'd compare it to tennis in the Olympics. Tennis also has 4 majors but yet an Olympic medal is still seen as one of the top honours.

True, but its not THE top honour. I reckon the guys would swap an Olympic medal for a Wimbledon title, or for an Open Championship.
Just IMO of course.

rrpc · 29-07-2015 11:23am

Russman wrote: »

Personally I agree with Adam Scott.
I don't think any sport should be there if the Olympic gold isn't the highest honour for that sport. With 4 established majors in the pro game, the Olympics are a distant 5th (at best). You could even argue a pro would rather win a WGC event rather than the Olympics, placing the Olympics just about in the top 10.

By all means have it for the amateurs, similar to the Eisenhower Trophy etc. I think that would make a much better spectacle and top amateurs might hold off turning pro for a year or two to have a chance at going to an Olympics.

Is that not more of a factor of how long Golf has been off the Olympic charter? If Golf was in the Olympics since 1904, isn't it likely that it would have a much higher honour rating relative to the majors? Especially since it would have predated two of them: The Masters and the USPGA.

What differentiates the Olympics from other tournaments is its amateur ethos; no prize money is awarded, just the honour of an Olympic medal. Yet for all that, professional sportspeople compete vigorously for that honour; probably as much or more than they would for one of their professional tournaments.

Let's see how much jockeying goes on for selection as the cut off date approaches before we decide that Adam Scott is right.

MikeSD · 29-07-2015 11:39am

rrpc wrote: »

Paul Dunne would not be eligible to play for GB. And currently not eligible to play for Ireland either.

Yeah I was joking. Even if amateurs were involved, you couldn't root for Dunne as he's going pro after the Walker Cup.

Russman · 29-07-2015 11:55am

rrpc wrote: »

Is that not more of a factor of how long Golf has been off the Olympic charter? If Golf was in the Olympics since 1904, isn't it likely that it would have a much higher honour rating relative to the majors? Especially since it would have predated two of them: The Masters and the USPGA.

What differentiates the Olympics from other tournaments is its amateur ethos; no prize money is awarded, just the honour of an Olympic medal. Yet for all that, professional sportspeople compete vigorously for that honour; probably as much or more than they would for one of their professional tournaments.

Let's see how much jockeying goes on for selection as the cut off date approaches before we decide that Adam Scott is right.

Agree. Quite possibly had it been in the Olympics all along it would be huge now, like any Olympic title should be IMO. But, arguably it would, like boxing, still be for amateurs. Who knows.

There's no right or wrong. I'm sure they'll mostly all want to play, and say the right things, but I genuinely think if you said to any of the top players, "you can have a Green Jacket or an Olympic gold medal", they'd mostly all opt for the jacket.

charlieIRL · 29-07-2015 12:29pm

Guys, ye know the story with discussing players nationalities, lets keep the debate going without mentioning them please?

Seve OB · 29-07-2015 12:43pm

unattendedbag wrote: »

will it be a straightforward stroke play tournament? Better to play matchplay as more neutrals would watch, more excitement and generally the better competitor will rise to the top.

My biggest problem with golf at the Olympics is that it's a one in 4 year tournament and not representative of the best golfer out there. Some unknown player could walk away as Olympic champion after a once in a lifetime round. Form throughout the season rises and dips massively with pros. At least the winner of the 100m sprint will probably the best in his field

yea as far as I know it will be stroke play. I agree with you, matchplay would be better. There probably should be both, and also a team event, foresomes, fourball, mixed, to hell with it.... a scramble!

I also agree that it could very likely be a winner from the lower ranks, that's just the way golf works, but I'm sure there are other sports like that also. At any rate, you have to have the relevant skill to be there in the first place, so whoever wins, will deserve it.

I agree that the resurrection of golf as new to the Olympics is likely clouding my judgement that it should be for amateurs and maybe if it had been around for the last 100 years it would be more of an established and sought after prize...... but it hasn't!

I think everyone who is eligible will be delighted to play in it and will of course want to win. But I bet if you told every single touring pro out there, that it was going to be for amateurs only, I will go out on a limb to say, there would be very very very few that would be against that decision.

rrpc · 29-07-2015 1:09pm

Seve OB wrote: »

I agree that the resurrection of golf as new to the Olympics is likely clouding my judgement that it should be for amateurs and maybe if it had been around for the last 100 years it would be more of an established and sought after prize...... but it hasn't!

We are where we are...

. Tennis is quite a good example of an established sport re-joining the Olympic movement and developing its status over time. There's no doubting how happy Andy Murray was to have won the gold medal in 2012 or the Williams sisters with their haul of 4 golds each. It's not just the individual honour that marks it out but the fact of winning for your nation that almost counts as high. Ireland has very few Olympic gold medals, so imagine the fuss if we won one in Golf.

Seve OB wrote: »

I think everyone who is eligible will be delighted to play in it and will of course want to win. But I bet if you told every single touring pro out there, that it was going to be for amateurs only, I will go out on a limb to say, there would be very very very few that would be against that decision.

I would suspect otherwise. The minute you tell somebody that they can't have something is the very minute it becomes the most important goal in their lives.

Seve OB · 29-07-2015 1:15pm

rrpc wrote: »

I would suspect otherwise. The minute you tell somebody that they can't have something is the very minute it becomes the most important goal in their lives.

I mean if it had never been on the table for the pro's in the first instance

brick tamland · 29-07-2015 1:30pm

Is there such thing as Amateur in the Olympics anymore? Most amateur boxers live off grants and sponsorship these days so they would be pretty much full time sportsmen/women. As for golf, I don’t know how bothered I’m going to be watching it ( like Tennis and Football at Olympics I suppose ), but saying that, if Speith a Rory are joint leaders in the last round I’m sure we’ll all be glued to it

I wonder how much coverage it will get. We wont get wall to wall coverage like a major. Maybe 30 mins here and there I reckon as it will be competing with so much else. Unless there is some sort of red button/online option

Seve OB · 29-07-2015 1:36pm

brick tamland wrote: »

Most amateur boxers live off grants and sponsorship these days so they would be pretty much full time sportsmen/women.

as would the top amateur golfers be

brick tamland · 29-07-2015 1:41pm

Seve OB wrote: »

as would the top amateur golfers be

I know, somebody above gave boxing as an example of a true amatuer event at olympins. I dont think it really is

Kevinmarkham · 28-03-2016 6:03pm

Any more Boardsies want to vote in this? I'm writing an Olympics-Focused article and want to include the 'general golfing public's' point of view.

Some great answers in here already - I wonder if anyone has changed their mind since the start of last year.

Senecio · 28-03-2016 6:51pm

Just voted then. I'm not for it. For no other reason than when I watch the olympics I like to watch those sports that don't get a great deal of air time. I can watch the worlds best golfers every 2nd weekend between the Euro and US tours. It's only every fours years that I get to watch the best in fencing, archery, discuss, hammer throw etc.....

CMOTDibbler · 28-03-2016 7:14pm

Senecio wrote: »

Just voted then. I'm not for it. For no other reason than when I watch the olympics I like to watch those sports that don't get a great deal of air time. I can watch the worlds best golfers every 2nd weekend between the Euro and US tours. It's only every fours years that I get to watch the best in fencing, archery, discuss, hammer throw etc.....

That's not the aim of the Olympics. Sure you can take an interest in minority sports and absolutely support them, but the Olympic Games are for all sports and golf was originally in the modern Olympics in 1900 and 1904.

The European and World athletic Championships are usually shown live on TV so you can watch the javelin and discus etc. every year.

Dirty Dingus McGee · 28-03-2016 8:12pm

If an Olympic medal is not the top honour for the sport the sport should not be in the Olympics.

It is the top honour for Athletics,Swimming,Gymnastics,Track Cycling and numerous others however having Golf,Soccer,Tennis,Road Cycling in it demeans the Olympics as it becomes a glorified exhibition event for those sports.

I doubt any Tennis player wold want to win an Olympic medal over a grand Slam, I doubt any Golfer would want one over a major championship and basically the real reason players will want to win is just to have it ticked off their list and not really as their number one goal.

I'm sure any soccer players who play is the World Club Final wants to win it for but they know right well that it means nothing as effectively the UEFA Champions League winners are the real world champions and they would want to win it just to say they won it the same would apply to Golf in the Olympics I would imagine.

CMOTDibbler · 28-03-2016 8:36pm

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

If an Olympic medal is not the top honour for the sport the sport should not be in the Olympics.

It is the top honour for Athletics,Swimming,Gymnastics,Track Cycling and numerous others however having Golf,Soccer,Tennis,Road Cycling in it demeans the Olympics as it becomes a glorified exhibition event for those sports.

I doubt any Tennis player wold want to win an Olympic medal over a grand Slam, I doubt any Golfer would want one over a major championship and basically the real reason players will want to win is just to have it ticked off their list and not really as their number one goal.

I think you need to ask that question of the players in question before you can say with any certainty what they would want. Some might agree with you but I doubt you'd be knocked off your feet by athletes rushing to give back their Olympic medals for something else. Andy Murray is extremely proud of his Olympic Gold Medal for one.

There are golfers who are already training for the Olympics and fighting to be part of it. Padraig Harrington (himself a multiple major winner) would take your arm off for a place there.

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

I'm sure any soccer players who play is the World Club Final wants to win it for but they know right well that it means nothing as effectively the UEFA Champions League winners are the real world champions and they would want to win it just to say they won it the same would apply to Golf in the Olympics I would imagine.

Not sure where to start with this one tbh

Dirty Dingus McGee · 28-03-2016 8:55pm

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

I think you need to ask that question of the players in question before you can say with any certainty what they would want. Some might agree with you but I doubt you'd be knocked off your feet by athletes rushing to give back their Olympic medals for something else. Andy Murray is extremely proud of his Olympic Gold Medal for one.

There are golfers who are already training for the Olympics and fighting to be part of it. Padraig Harrington (himself a multiple major winner) would take your arm off for a place there.

Not sure where to start with this one tbh

The point I'm making is that the majors in golf are main prize in the sport, just like the Champions League is the main prize in club soccer.

However once you add another prize on top of the real prize human instinct means the participants will want to win it even though it doesn't really mean anything and really doesn't increase/decrease the status of the players/team.

CMOTDibbler · 28-03-2016 9:05pm

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

The point I'm making is that the majors in golf are main prize in the sport, just like the Champions League is the main prize in club soccer.

You compared the Champions League to the World Cup. One is for the clubs in Europe and the other is for all national teams in the world.

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

However once you add another prize on top of the real prize human instinct means the participants will want to win it even though it doesn't really mean anything and really doesn't increase/decrease the status of the players/team.

So you say. I would say the opposite. An Olympic medal has a rarity and therefore a value regardless of the sport it's awarded for.

Dirty Dingus McGee · 28-03-2016 9:16pm

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

You compared the Champions League to the World Cup. One is for the clubs in Europe and the other is for all national teams in the world.

So you say. I would say the opposite. An Olympic medal has a rarity and therefore a value regardless of the sport it's awarded for.

I was talking about the Club World Cup.

CMOTDibbler · 28-03-2016 9:19pm

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

I was talking about the Club World Cup.

Sorry my bad. Misread your post.

Senecio · 28-03-2016 9:32pm

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

That's not the aim of the Olympics..

Never said it was the aim. Just that professional golfers get more than their fair share of the spotlight. They don't "need" the olympics like other athletes do.

CMOTDibbler · 28-03-2016 10:04pm

Senecio wrote: »

Never said it was the aim. Just that professional golfers get more than their fair share of the spotlight. They don't "need" the olympics like other athletes do.

The Olympics is the pinnacle of sports. All sports. Maybe golfers individually don't 'need' the Olympics, but the Olympics needs golf. If it didn't, you can bet your house that it would never have been voted back into the charter.

Senecio · 28-03-2016 10:12pm

Why does the olympics need golf?

CMOTDibbler · 28-03-2016 10:18pm

Senecio wrote: »

Why does the olympics need golf?

Because it's a major sport with a huge worldwide following and participation levels in the stratosphere. It's a no brainer.

Dirty Dingus McGee · 28-03-2016 10:32pm

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Because it's a major sport with a huge worldwide following and participation levels in the stratosphere. It's a no brainer.

I'd say Golf needs the Olympics more as the sport clearly wants it to be a part of the Olympics because the Chinese throw huge amounts of money at Olympic sports.

CMOTDibbler · 28-03-2016 10:54pm

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

I'd say Golf needs the Olympics more as the sport clearly wants it to be a part of the Olympics because the Chinese throw huge amounts of money at Olympic sports.

Well the Communist party in China (the only party really :rolleyes:) have banned membership of golf clubs to all party members.

That's only in the last six months or so and Golf was voted an Olympic sport in 2009, so that didn't help really.

Rikand · 28-03-2016 11:07pm

I like that golf is going to be at it. I dislike the method for qualification. There should be like there is for other events, an individual qualifying standard. Like a time for track and field events, that has to be achieved at certain national/international events. A score, say 64, at certain courses at certain times and open to everyone pros and amateurs to attempt to compete for. Whoever hits the qualifying time gets to compete for a medal. Whoever doesn't, doesn't.

Like a few years ago where top sprinters from jamaica and the USA missed out. They missed the time or they missed their slot and they missed the Olympics. Even though they were top 10/20 sprinters in the world

Rikand · 28-03-2016 11:09pm

I think there should be an "Other " option in the poll

BrownTrout · 28-03-2016 11:31pm

Originally the Olympics were a way for Greek warriors to hone their battlefield skills.

I think the lark of Olympic soccer and Basketball and other team sports where the Olympics is not the top honour has diverted the games too far off course from their original purpose.

I think only sports where an Olympic medal is undisputedly the the best one can achieve in that sport should be in the games

Montgolfier · 28-03-2016 11:34pm

Jawgap wrote: »

Why not have both?

Qualifying countries get to enter two, two person teams - at least one player on each team must be U21 or U23. Teams can swap the pairings during the competition.

Then play the tournament as fourball matchplay.

Even a pro am tournament with top pro and am from each country

CMOTDibbler · 28-03-2016 11:38pm

Montgolfier wrote: »

Even a pro am tournament with top pro and am from each country

How do countries qualify?

Senecio · 29-03-2016 7:11am

CMOTDibbler wrote: »

Because it's a major sport with a huge worldwide following and participation levels in the stratosphere. It's a no brainer.

So it comes down to money then? Golf can bring money to the olympics that other sports can't.

As others have said, it's about competing at the pinnacle of one's chosen sport. Some athletes train their whole life and they peak for one olympic year and if their lucky they may get to compete in a 2nd, 3rd etc.... Golf already has 4 pinnacles a year (+ WGC events, Ryder Cup).

I think it just comes down to greed on the part of both parties.

I just know that if I miss the men's badminton final because the telly are showing Rory, Speith, Scott I'll be pretty pissed off. We can watch these guys week in week out but I rarely get to see badminton played by the best in the world.

CMOTDibbler · 29-03-2016 10:11am

Senecio wrote: »

So it comes down to money then? Golf can bring money to the olympics that other sports can't.

As others have said, it's about competing at the pinnacle of one's chosen sport. Some athletes train their whole life and they peak for one olympic year and if their lucky they may get to compete in a 2nd, 3rd etc.... Golf already has 4 pinnacles a year (+ WGC events, Ryder Cup).

I think it just comes down to greed on the part of both parties.

I just know that if I miss the men's badminton final because the telly are showing Rory, Speith, Scott I'll be pretty pissed off. We can watch these guys week in week out but I rarely get to see badminton played by the best in the world.

It's because golf brings money to the Olympics that other sports can participate. What broadcasters show is a different issue. The 2012 Olympics was extremely well showcased on the BBC. There were so many options available to viewers. What was also notable from 2012 was the hige coverage that the Paralympics got.

LuckyGent88 · 20-04-2016 11:51am

Adam Scott has announced that he won't be competing in rio anyway. Says it doesn't fit in his schedule and will be concentrating on the majors. Fair enough I suppose.
Big blow to organisers though.

CMOTDibbler · 20-04-2016 11:57am

LuckyGent88 wrote: »

Adam Scott has announced that he won't be competing in rio anyway. Says it doesn't fit in his schedule and will be concentrating on the majors. Fair enough I suppose.
Big blow to organisers though.

Marc Leishman likes this

bustercherry · 20-04-2016 12:15pm

LuckyGent88 wrote: »

Adam Scott has announced that he won't be competing in rio anyway. Says it doesn't fit in his schedule and will be concentrating on the majors. Fair enough I suppose.
Big blow to organisers though.

Who the IOC? I'm sure they couldn't give 2 fcuks as it won't impact the games in any way.

Aesop · 20-04-2016 12:47pm

“Money, it’s gonna ruin sports” - O.B. Keeler

Tom.D.BJJ · 20-04-2016 2:55pm

Is there also a ladies golf event at the Olympics?

EDit: According to google there is. Will we have an Irish competing? Stephanie Meadow, Leona/Lisa McGuire?

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