Shootings in Paris - MOD NOTE UPDATED - READ OP

RobertKK · 14-11-2015 03:47PM

Saipanne wrote: »

Mohammed did all the same stuff, buddy.

So where are these aggressive Muslims in Indonesia? The ost populous Muslim country.
People can post BS if they want but is Indonesia spreading Islamic extremism?
The Indonesian governmet - Muslim - last year declared Islamic State were a banned group.
Are they doing it wrong?

Rabo Karabekian · 14-11-2015 03:47PM

MS1962 wrote: »

I would propose that what we are seeing in France is indeed the true face of Islam.

During the first 7 centuries of Christendom, there was peace, and the advancement of education, culture, and healthcare.

7 centuries of peace? Do you just make this stuff up as you go along or have you read any kind of history book?

Very Bored · 14-11-2015 03:48PM

Fuhrer wrote: »

Its the first point I made, id ill make it to you over and over and over if I have to.

What about being a Muslim made Zidane a great footballer?

What about being a Muslim made the Murderers from last night, viscous, savage murderers?

The answer to those two questions are absolutely nothing and absolutely everything.

If you actually bothered to read what I wrote you'd perhaps be able to see that I didn't say Zidane was a great footballer because he was Muslim, I said he was an icon who happened to be Muslim and that not all Muslims are dangerous and evil lunatics. If you want to believe that Zidane is liable at any moment to run out on the pitch and start firing at spectators whilst screaming Allahu Akbar simply because he is a Muslim then work away but most will see your argument for what it is, racist and ignorant. Equally, you still haven't explained your own sick homage to Adolf Hitler via your choice of username.

MS1962 · 14-11-2015 03:49PM

RobertKK wrote: »

We cannot allow evil people in a terrorist organistion to generalise all Muslims. This same group have in Iraq and Syris, burned Muslims alive, buried Muslims alive and killed many Muslims.
We should not judge good people of a religion with the very worst people who proclaim they are Muslim.
We have to support the good people, not isolate them.

I think it has to begin with education. Do the 'nice Muslims' really know the background of their founder? Really? I'd love to use a couple of short words to describe the man, but really, how can anyone say this man was the greatest who ever lived?

I look at the life of Jesus and I come up short - I am selfish, greedy, etc... But when I look at Muhamoud, I can tell you I am a saint in comparison! We need to put it to them to explain this.

I would say that Islam is anti-Christ, and Muhamoud is their anti-Christ. He is the polar opposite of Jesus. And yet the Muslims tell us he is the greatest man who ever lived: a murdering rapist warmonger.

Fuhrer · 14-11-2015 03:49PM

RobertKK wrote: »

So where are these aggressive Muslims in Indonesia? The ost populous Muslim country.
People can post BS if they want but is Indonesia spreading Islamic extremism?
The Indonesian governmet - Muslim - last year declared Islamic State were a banned group.
Are they doing it wrong?

The Indonesian government is Secular by order of the constitution.

MS1962 · 14-11-2015 03:49PM

RobertKK wrote: »

We cannot allow evil people in a terrorist organistion to generalise all Muslims. This same group have in Iraq and Syris, burned Muslims alive, buried Muslims alive and killed many Muslims.
We should not judge good people of a religion with the very worst people who proclaim they are Muslim.
We have to support the good people, not isolate them.

I think it has to begin with education. Do the 'nice Muslims' really know the background of their founder? Really? I'd love to use a couple of short words to describe the man, but really, how can anyone say this man was the greatest who ever lived?

I look at the life of Jesus and I come up short - I am selfish, greedy, etc... But when I look at Muhamoud, I can tell you I am a saint in comparison! We need to put it to them to explain this.

I would say that Islam is anti-Christ, and Muhamoud is their anti-Christ. He is the polar opposite of Jesus. And yet the Muslims tell us he is the greatest man who ever lived: a nasty SOB.

Saipanne · 14-11-2015 03:49PM

Wibbs wrote: »

I really dunno what books you've been reading. The western Roman empire fell for a start kicking off all sorts of local power grabs and wars. Slavery continued on apace and was not regarded by the Church as particularly problematic. Again that's some cracker of a history book you have. After Rome fell and the Byzantines were weakened one of those local power grabs that kicked off was Islam and it in many ways filled the void of the lost Rome. Yep there were battles and land grabs, but many were remarkably peaceful, certainly to civilians. The Islamic take over of Jerusalem for example. Local Jews were pleasantly surprised that the new Islamic rulers were far more accommodating of their faith and places of worship compared to the Christian Romans and Greeks previously. That first caliphate, the utopia many of the current radicals hanker after wistfully was a golden age. They advanced science and medicine and law, gathered up "lost" Greek texts, formed some of the first universities and had remarkably tolerant attitudes to other religions, at least "people of the book". You were in a far better place as a Jew in the Muslim empire, than you were as a Jew in the Christian lands. Interestingly and somewhat ironically the Muslims of that time were not nearly so "medieval" as those radicals today.

How did I miss what that guy (not Wibbs) said? The most wrong statements ever.

MS1962 · 14-11-2015 03:51PM

RobertKK wrote: »

We cannot allow evil people in a terrorist organistion to generalise all Muslims. This same group have in Iraq and Syris, burned Muslims alive, buried Muslims alive and killed many Muslims.
We should not judge good people of a religion with the very worst people who proclaim they are Muslim.
We have to support the good people, not isolate them.

I think it has to begin with education. Do the 'nice Muslims' really know the background of their founder? Really? I'd love to use a couple of short words to describe the man, but really, how can anyone say this man was the greatest who ever lived?

I look at the life of Jesus and I come up short - I am selfish, greedy, etc... But when I look at Muhamoud, I can tell you I am a saint in comparison! We need to put it to them to explain this.

I would say that Islam is anti-Christ, and Muhamoud is their anti-Christ. He is the polar opposite of Jesus. And yet the Muslims tell us he is the greatest man who ever lived: a nasty _____.

Fuhrer · 14-11-2015 03:51PM

Very Bored wrote: »

If you actually bothered to read what I wrote you'd perhaps be able to see that I didn't say Zidane was a great footballer because he was Muslim, I said he was an icon who happened to be Muslim and that not all Muslims are dangerous and evil lunatics. If you want to believe that Zidane is liable at any moment to run out on the pitch and start firing at spectators whilst screaming Allahu Akbar simply because he is a Muslim then work away but most will see your argument for what it is, racist and ignorant. Equally, you still haven't explained your own sick homage to Adolf Hitler via your choice of username.

You really are quite slow on the uptake, aren't you?

You want me to explain it to you again? Because I can go all day if you need me to.

Nodin · 14-11-2015 03:51PM

MS1962 wrote: »

It also need(..........)assertion begins.

Utter nonsense

Fuhrer wrote: »

It also teaches Muslims to lie about their believes to non-believers.

....and more of the same.

Saipanne · 14-11-2015 03:51PM

MS1962 wrote: »

I think it has to begin with education. Do the 'nice Muslims' really know the background of their founder? Really? I'd love to use a couple of short words to describe the man, but really, how can anyone say this man was the greatest who ever lived?

I look at the life of Jesus and I come up short - I am selfish, greedy, etc... But when I look at Muhamoud, I can tell you I am a saint in comparison! We need to put it to them to explain this.

I would say that Islam is anti-Christ, and Muhamoud is their anti-Christ. He is the polar opposite of Jesus. And yet the Muslims tell us he is the greatest man who ever lived: a murdering rapist warmonger.

I consider myself morally and ethically superior to both. But I win by default since I'm a fairly liberal guy in 2015. It's no major achievement for me.

It's a victory for the Enlightenment and Western Civilisation.

Fuhrer · 14-11-2015 03:52PM

Nodin wrote: »

Utter nonsense

....and more of the same.

Delusional.

Pocoyo · 14-11-2015 03:53PM

DamagedTrax wrote: »

No question on that. Israel, through various avenues, has managed to amass a frighteningly powerful army and intelligence.

And they dont seem the type to be shy about using it to its fullest power.

Without western help i doubt they would their army is too small and so are their nukes a few hundred jets carrying chemical weapons would wipe them off the map the population density would make it even easier. So id envisage mutual destruction.

RobertKK · 14-11-2015 03:54PM

Fuhrer wrote: »

The Indonesian government is Secular by order of the constitution.

...and we know secular Muslim countries are what we want and need.

Not people like stupid Hillary Clinton thinking Libya, Egypt and Syria are better off without their secular dictators.
I am not saying any of them are great, Gaddafi was under control, Mubarak was an ally and they eventually had to return to the army as the Muslim brotherhood were very questionable and Syria under Assad was much better than the mess they have now.

K.Flyer · 14-11-2015 03:55PM

Sunflower 27 wrote: »

Muslims in Ireland have condemned ISIS, back in July

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/irish-muslims-to-hold-protest-condemning-islamic-state-1.2296009

That was organised by the Imam in the Blanchardstown Centre, Dr Umar Al-Qadri, who today is the first, and so far only, Imam to speak out against ISIS after the Paris killings.

Imam of the al-Mustafa Islamic Centre and Chair of the Irish Muslim Peace and Integration Council Shaykh Dr Umar Al-Qadri condemned the attacks.

He said: "My thoughts and prayers are with the people of Paris and every other place on earth plagued by sick men with weapons and bombs.

"Terrorists have no religion whatsoever. Their religion is intolerance hatred for Peace. The news from Paris is very frightening.

"May God be with us all against all types of extremism and terrorism."

TrueIt · 14-11-2015 03:55PM

Hard to fight against people who don't value their own lives

c_man · 14-11-2015 03:56PM

Very Bored wrote: »

Anyway, its absolutely laughable that you believe that Zidane was great because he became a non practising Muslim. When you've worked out a way to explain Muhammad Ali's greatness in this instance let me know. I'll be waiting.

Of all the people to pick... You do know that Ali was a member of the Nation of Islam (proper racist, hateful nutjobs) for most of his time at the top? Only converted to Sunni in 1975.

Very Bored · 14-11-2015 03:57PM

Fuhrer wrote: »

You really are quite slow on the uptake, aren't you?

You want me to explain it to you again? Because I can go all day if you need me to.

You do your argument no favours by resorting to personal insult. You want to paint a picture that all Muslims are evil. I showed Zidane and Ali as cases in point that they are not. All you're doing is twisting the argument because you know you can't refute the fact that Zidane and Ali, both followers of Islam, are not vicious murdering animals.

However, I'll ask you once again on the other issue, please can you explain why you chose a username in honour of the most evil c**t the world has every seen?

Pocoyo · 14-11-2015 03:57PM

K.Flyer wrote: »

That was organised by the Imam in the Blanchardstown Centre, Dr Umar Al-Qadri, who today is the first, and so far only, Imam to speak out against ISIS after the Paris killings.

He should probably keep his gob shut,I dont want him bringing any of those wacko's our way.

A_Sober_Paddy · 14-11-2015 03:57PM

Wraponised small pox, in the right hands

Turtwig · 14-11-2015 03:57PM

K.Flyer wrote: »

That was organised by the Imam in the Blanchardstown Centre, Dr Umar Al-Qadri, who today is the first, and so far only, Imam to speak out against ISIS after the Paris killings.

Have you spoken out publicly against ISIS?

Stinicker · 14-11-2015 03:58PM

Pocoyo wrote: »

The easiest solution to this is allow them to war with israel without the threat of western interference by the end of it two evil barbaric groups of backwards religious fundamentalists will be no more.

The western world backed israel ISIS have nothing on the israeli's when it comes to war crimes.

I actually really hope Islamic State do try to attack Israel, I would reach for the popcorn and watch the Israelis absolutely wipe them off the Map. Israel is the only Democracy in the Middle-East, the majority of Israelis are our own kith and kin, white Europeans, they are Jewish but Judaism is a Religion but these people are ethnically European by and large.

Israel is surrounded by enemies and they have been invaded and attacked countless times but always came out on top. Israelis will kick ass if they are given half a chance. Israel gives more human rights to Muslims in Israel than they enjoy in their own countries. How do they repay the Israelis? By blowing themselves up and killing the Israelis at every given opportunity.

I never saw any Israeli or Jew for that matter killing the innocents in Europe like we have seen umpteen times with Islamic Jihadists.

Dkinn · 14-11-2015 03:59PM

Pocoyo wrote: »

He should probably keep his gob shut,I dont want him bringing any of those wacko's our way.

What? He spoke out against them...

Fuhrer · 14-11-2015 04:00PM

Very Bored wrote: »

You do your argument no favours by resorting to personal insult. You want to paint a picture that all Muslims are evil. I showed Zidane and Ali as cases in point that they are not. All you're doing is twisting the argument because you know you can't refute the fact that Zidane and Ali, both followers of Islam, are not vicious murdering animals.

However, I'll ask you once again on the other issue, please can you explain why you chose a username in honour of the most evil c**t the world has every seen?

Ill make my arguments thanks, I dont need any advice from someone who thinks like you do.

Your point, why it looks to be twisted is because it was so stupid to begin with was that you should look as Zidane as an example of a Muslim. An utterly puerile and worthless statement, what does Islam contribute to Zidane as a footballer? Absolutely nothing, what does Islam contribute to the people who murdered all those innocent people in France last night? Absolutely everything.

walshyn93 · 14-11-2015 04:01PM

Sunflower 27 wrote: »

I think you missed the point of his comment.

The point of his comment was to do the absolute minimum that was expected of him.

Until Muslim leaders do something to fight against islamism or jihadists to their detriment I don't care what nice things they tell us to sooth us before going back to facilitating extremism under their noses.

IrishTrajan · 14-11-2015 04:01PM

Stinicker wrote: »

I actually really hope Islamic State do try to attack Israel, I would reach for the popcorn and watch the Israelis absolutely wipe them off the Map. Israel is the only Democracy in the Middle-East, the majority of Israelis are our own kith and kin, white Europeans, they are Jewish but Judaism is a Religion but these people are ethnically European by and large.

Judaism is ethno-religious, and the Ashkenazi are Europeans. However, most Israelis are not.

Stinicker wrote: »

Israel is surrounded by enemies and they have been invaded and attacked countless times but always came out on top. Israelis will kick ass if they are given half a chance. Israel gives more human rights to Muslims in Israel than they enjoy in their own countries. How do they repay the Israelis? By blowing themselves up and killing the Israelis at every given opportunity.

This we agree on.

Stinicker wrote: »

I never saw any Israeli or Jew for that matter killing the innocents in Europe like we have seen umpteen times with Islamic Jihadists.

Didn't Israel kill people in Bulgaria a few years ago with magnetic car bombs? Let's not get ahead of ourselves, Israel does a lot of evil shít.

I'd still choose Israel over any Middle Eastern country, though.

Very Bored · 14-11-2015 04:01PM

c_man wrote: »

Of all the people to pick... You do know that Ali was a member of the Nation of Islam (proper racist, hateful nutjobs) for most of his time at the top? Only converted to Sunni in 1975.

Was Ali himself a racist, hateful nutjob? No.

Bannasidhe · 14-11-2015 04:02PM

IrishTrajan wrote: »

Then you need to phrase your arguments more concisely.

You're right, the Republicans were a minority in the UK... And we've seen the damage they wrought. To say a huge minority/majority of Irish people didn't offer at least tacit support would be farcical.

The UK would have been entirely right to do that. And they actually interred a lot of Irish people, my own grandparents and uncles being among them. Do I hate the British for that? Do my uncles and grandparents? Nope. They regret being locked up, but they don't hate the English for doing it.

Of course there were gross miscarriages of justice (like Guildford) but that doesn't mean steps shouldn't be taken at all.

Yeah, when you can't back up any argument or guilt trip someone into believing your crock of bullshít, just be facetious. It works amazingly well

My last word on this as, if memory serves, the Mods have requested discussion of the IRA etc is not for this thread.

You might think the UK would have been justified but I doubt the vast majority of Irish people would agree with you - particularly those Irish people who fled conservative Catholic Ireland for the liberal UK.

And no - it would not have been justified because one of the founding principles of our shared legal system is innocent until proven guilty- miscarriages of justice notwithstanding - to deny entry to ALL Irish people because some Irish people were murdering for a cause would have been to turn that principle on it's head.

You say factious - I say Al Capone has feck all to do with this

Fuhrer · 14-11-2015 04:02PM

Very Bored wrote: »

Was Ali himself a racist, hateful nutjob? No.

If Ali was a follower of the Nation of Islam, he was by definition a racist, anti-Semitic nutjob.

Saipanne · 14-11-2015 04:03PM

Very Bored wrote: »

Was Ali himself a racist, hateful nutjob? No.

And yet he was a member of a racist group.

Very odd.

I don't like eating peas. I think I'll join the Pea Eating Appreciation Society.

Shootings in Paris - MOD NOTE UPDATED - READ OP

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