"Haunting Image Of Drowned Boy Sums Up Consequences Of 'The Syrian War'"

MonkeyTennis · 04-09-2015 08:54AM

So you are assuming that young muslim men are a bit rapey. Lovely stuff. Honestly

Streetwalker · 04-09-2015 08:56AM

FelineOverLord wrote: »

Lets see how happy the German people are in a years time when they have had a year of unemployed young men wandering the streets in groups. When crime is up dramatically because the 'refugees' need money. When there's an increase in rape and when there are tented shanty villages scattered around. That's before we even factor in the neo Nazi element. I'd also question Germanys rational for taking in 800 thousand of them. What exactly are they proposing to do with them and where will the money come from to accomodate, feed, clothe, educate and provide medical care for them?

The Germans are happy out. They have an aging population and need a million young people for jobs going forward. They will pick the cream of these fugees and Ireland and the rest will get the ones they consider unsuitable. All the while Enda sits back like a nodding dog and excepts it just like he did with the bank debts.

handlemaster · 04-09-2015 08:57AM

Ireland should be able to take in 10 to 40 thousand refugees . When the eastern european countries borders were opened it was the same BS from the doom sayers our jobs houses etc etc. People Forget that refugees have éducation to engineers doctors etc etc of anything it will benefit ireland. But more importantly its helping your fellow human.

BoJack Horseman · 04-09-2015 09:02AM

handlemaster wrote: »

Ireland should be able to take in 10 to 40 thousand refugees . When the eastern european countries borders were opened it was the same BS from the doom sayers our jobs houses etc etc. People Forget that refugees have éducation to engineers doctors etc etc of anything it will benefit ireland.

Can asylum seekers work freely?

And given the choice, I'd prefer my doctor to attain his work permit legally, with verified qualification & vetting.
.... As many doctors do, every year..... legally

A better system than an asylum seeker with unverifiable credentials.

asteroids over berlin · 04-09-2015 09:03AM

handlemaster wrote: »

Ireland should be able to take in 10 to 40 thousand refugees . When the eastern european countries borders were opened it was the same BS from the doom sayers our jobs houses etc etc. People Forget that refugees have éducation to engineers doctors etc etc of anything it will benefit ireland. But more importantly its helping your fellow human.

i disagree, Ireland is so far behind the times, it is not even funny. Lets sort out our health system first (Germany has)!

You do realise supporting 40k asylum seekers a week equates to circa 10million

OZ: http://www.news.com.au/national/australia-will-be-paying-70000-for-each-asylum-seeker-that-arrives/story-fncynjr2-1226655532914

BoJack Horseman · 04-09-2015 09:04AM

MonkeyTennis wrote: »

So you are assuming that young muslim men are a bit rapey. Lovely stuff. Honestly

Well, there is a lot of data out there showing a dispproportionate propensity for sexual crime to be committed by people from Muslim backgrounds.

I know.... I know... I'm a racist... etc etc.

Wibbs · 04-09-2015 09:05AM

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

the wider context has to be considered rather than letting emotive arguments bulldoze discussion.

This, so much this. The individual tragedy and tragedy it is has to be separated from the practicalities, or it will keep happening, or we'll be storing up real problems for the future. I'm not holding my breath mind you. Then again the emotive stuff these days has a very rapid cycling in the western public mind. Last month it was a transsexual on a magazine cover, next month it'll be something else.

foggy_lad · 04-09-2015 09:05AM

efb wrote: »

How many are on the housing list soley to qualify for Rent Allowance?

Oh well that is easy to answer! You can't claim rent allowance without being in need of housing and all community welfare areas use being on a council housing list as proof of that need.

foggy_lad · 04-09-2015 09:09AM

efb wrote: »

Out of sight is out of mind, eh? Australia now accepts 0 refugees - it houses them elsewhere

It accepts most of them but never allows them enter Australia!

Same as if we started housing all refugees and asylum seekers on the inisowen peninsula and barrewd them from ever entering the rest of the country they are safe and housed but can't screw up our fragile economy.

MonkeyTennis · 04-09-2015 09:11AM

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

Well, there is a lot of data out there showing a dispproportionate propensity for sexual crime to be committed by people from Muslim backgrounds.

I know.... I know... I'm a racist... etc etc.

Well if you judge people on a preconceived notion what would you call it?

foggy_lad · 04-09-2015 09:14AM

asteroids over berlin wrote: »

Whilst i sympathise with these people, i have got to ask, why do they not seek asylum in the "wealthy" Arab countries which they share the same religion with, it would appear their fellow muslim brethren do not want them and push them over to us in Europe - bit bizarre.
The world needs to arm up against ISIS and take them out - easier said than done but a lot more can be done than what is being done now, which in turn is causing this mass migration!

Sincere wishes to these people but this mass migration is going to cause a whole lot more problems for europe in the future, particularly Germany with such high numbers of Asylum seekers - neonazism returns etc

They have better prospects in western Europe and can make more money as well as live here as part of the underground/black economy even if their applications fail. They can make money here from benefits as well as using European countries as a stepping stone to other places.

BoJack Horseman · 04-09-2015 09:18AM

MonkeyTennis wrote: »

Well if you judge people on a preconceived notion what would you call it?

An ability to separate emotion from data.

I'm done posting info ... You can educate this vile racist that I am by proving me wrong in that per capita, sexual crimes are committed to the same or lower rate by men of muslim background compared to the general population.

foggy_lad · 04-09-2015 09:24AM

MonkeyTennis wrote: »

Well if you judge people on a preconceived notion what would you call it?

How about judging them on all the cases in the UK where aisan men have been convicted of crimes against young women of all ethnicities. It is not as one poster put it that they are rapey, it has so much more to do with how they see women and more importantly how they treat women!

Just look at the footage of the man woman and child on the railway tracks in Hungarian town yesterday and the man clearly throws the woman and child to the ground regardless she may hit the tracks and be injured. He displayed a level of frantic violence towards women which our western cultures are not used to seeing.

04-09-2015 09:26AM

fyfe79 wrote: »

...if RTE simply decide they do not favour your argument then you're not getting air time.

I am enjoying the idea that RTE is some bastion of left wing liberal thinking.

Because in recent years it has been pretty much labelled Pravda for toeing the right wing capitalist "pay the bank debt and your water charge" line!

foggy_lad · 04-09-2015 09:31AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I am enjoying the idea that RTE is some bastion of left wing liberal thinking.

Because in recent years it has been pretty much labelled Pravda for toeing the right wing capitalist "pay the bank debt and your water charge" line!

I rekon Joe will have the no side on today. Having both sides to this on the same show would only lead to a shouting and mud slinging match!

He should know to represent both sides or fall foul of the broadcasting commission!

conorhal · 04-09-2015 09:32AM

handlemaster wrote: »

Ireland should be able to take in 10 to 40 thousand refugees . When the eastern european countries borders were opened it was the same BS from the doom sayers our jobs houses etc etc. People Forget that refugees have éducation to engineers doctors etc etc of anything it will benefit ireland. But more importantly its helping your fellow human.

BS?

Explain please on what you base your figure of 10 to 40 thousand exactly, or are you plucking fugures out of your arse like the rest of Europe?

We have a housing crisis at the moment, that I'm sure you can't deny. Also undeniable is the fact that over 50% of social housing in Dublin is allocated to foreign nationals and asylum seekers. The figure nationally is one third of all social housing. So pretending tha jobs, wages and housing weren't effected is the BS.

We have 400 asylum seekers that have been given leave to remain in direct provision because housing can't be found for them but we have a minister on this morning telling us that we will be taking more who seems to share you sunny optimism and utter lack of joined up thinking. If we can't house them where are we going to put an aditional 40,000?
And ask yourself this, what kind of housing crisis would there be if we weren't handing out gaffs to all commers?

Finally, the numbers being spat out are lies. We agreed to 400, we added an aditional 600 so we agreeed to a thousand, now that's two thousand. Of course nobody wants to mention the expected 4,000 that will appear out of thin air to apply this year, so really we are talking about 6,000 asylum seekers. It's not quite the hights of 11,000 a year at the hight of the boom, but then again we had an economy at the time. Lets not forget of course that after family reunfication rights are excercised the numbers will rise quite a bit. On average family reunification admits 3 family members for each asylum seeker, so we're actually talking 24,000 people.

I wonder what next years numbers will look like

BoJack Horseman · 04-09-2015 09:35AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I am enjoying the idea that RTE is some bastion of left wing liberal thinking.

Because in recent years it has been pretty much labelled Pravda for toeing the right wing capitalist "pay the bank debt and your water charge" line!

The main point is, that all media has their agendas.
Viewers just need to remain healthily sceptical.

An example was a Sky correspondant in a Hungarian train platform..... He passed scores of male immigrants in order to stick his microphone in front of the only women in the area.

old_aussie · 04-09-2015 09:41AM

It's sad but who knows how he ended up drowning.

Even though migrants have one thing in commom, they want to escape the hell holes that they have been part of in their countries, they still carry on their religious ****. And they're bringing that **** to the EU

Migrants killed in 'religious clash' on Mediterranean boat.

Italian police say they have arrested 15 Muslim migrants after they allegedly threw 12 Christians overboard following a row on a boat heading to Italy.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-32337725

kunst nugget · 04-09-2015 09:46AM

foggy_lad wrote: »

He should know to represent both sides or fall foul of the broadcasting commission!

Are we having a referendum on taking in refugees? I must have missed that…

04-09-2015 09:48AM

old_aussie wrote: »

It's sad but who knows how he ended up drowning.

Even though migrants have one thing in commom, they want to escape the hell holes that they have been part of in their countries, they still carry on their religious ****. And they're bringing that **** to the EU

It would be foolish to say there will be no problems whatsoever.

On the other hand, my position would be save their lives first, worry about their religion after.

orubiru · 04-09-2015 09:53AM

handlemaster wrote: »

Ireland should be able to take in 10 to 40 thousand refugees . When the eastern european countries borders were opened it was the same BS from the doom sayers our jobs houses etc etc. People Forget that refugees have éducation to engineers doctors etc etc of anything it will benefit ireland. But more importantly its helping your fellow human.

The thing I don't understand here is that the people of Ireland don't want to pay the money required to have a clean and safe water network but suddenly we are prepared to pay out the money required to accommodate up to 40,000 refugees?

I agree with you that it's important to help our fellow humans but there is surely a limit on what we can reasonably do to help? There must also be a limit on what people are actually willing to do to help?

Let's say you were going to be super helpful here and let a couple of these refugees live in your house. You might be able to accommodate 2 or 3? What happens if 100 show up on your doorstep? Should I accuse you of "not caring about your fellow human" when you obviously can't let them all in?

I'm feeling like the problem here is that there is no transparency at all regarding how immigration etc works in Ireland? How many refugees could Ireland reasonably accommodate? What would be the short and long term consequences?

In a perfect world sure we'd be able to rescue every one of these poor people. In reality though, what can people really do besides posting a photograph on Facebook and Tweeting about how we should never allow this to happen?

Personally, I am fine with letting the refugees into the country. It won't affect my job or my life in general. I'm even happy to let the government raise taxes and use the money to help the refugees out.

I'm not sure that everyone in the country would agree with me and, to be honest, their objections would be perfectly valid. It's grossly unfair to say that people who don't want to be accommodating to refugees are refusing to help their fellow humans. Maybe they just feel that they can't help.

How do we feel about someone who says we shouldn't help?

conorhal · 04-09-2015 09:54AM

Deleted User wrote: »

It would be foolish to say there will be no problems whatsoever.

On the other hand, my position would be save their lives first, worry about their religion after.

Well that approach worked out well in Rotherham and Paris......

JustTheOne · 04-09-2015 10:03AM

We have people sleeping rough we should look after our own first.

Has to be one of the most uneducated, ridiculous idiotic comments to come out of this situation.

People sleeping rough have options to be put up in hostels or b and bs.

Most of the time they refuse help through addiction etc .

They choose that life.

Do kids drowning choose that life?

JustTheOne · 04-09-2015 10:05AM

conorhal wrote: »

Well that approach worked out well in Rotherham and Paris......

Believe me your ear more likely to be killed or raped by an Irish person in this country than a foreign national.

We have the highest gangland gun crime murders in Europe.

Guess what, their all Irish people doing the killing.

WakeUp · 04-09-2015 10:08AM

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

The main point is, that all media has their agendas.
Viewers just need to remain healthily sceptical.

An example was a Sky correspondant in a Hungarian train platform..... He passed scores of male immigrants in order to stick his microphone in front of the only women in the area.

speaking of the Hungarians..

Migration crisis: Hungary PM says Europe in grip of madness

Viktor Orbán, has claimed Europe is in the grip of madness over immigration and refugees, and argued that he was defending European Christianity against a Muslim influx.

“Everything which is now taking place before our eyes threatens to have explosive consequences for the whole of Europe,” Orbán wrote in Germany’s Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung. “Europe’s response is madness. We must acknowledge that the European Union’s misguided immigration policy is responsible for this situation.

“Irresponsibility is the mark of every European politician who holds out the promise of a better life to immigrants and encourages them to leave everything behind and risk their lives in setting out for Europe. If Europe does not return to the path of common sense, it will find itself laid low in a battle for its fate.”

Those arriving have been raised in another religion, and represent a radically different culture. Most of them are not Christians, but Muslims,” he said. “This is an important question, because Europe and European identity is rooted in Christianity.

“Is it not worrying in itself that European Christianity is now barely able to keep Europe Christian? There is no alternative, and we have no option but to defend our borders.”

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/03/migration-crisis-hungary-pm-victor-orban-europe-response-madness?

BoJack Horseman · 04-09-2015 10:09AM

JustTheOne wrote: »

Believe me your ear more likely to be killed or raped by an Irish person in this country than a foreign national.

I'd like to see the per-capita breakdown of that.

If you could, thanks.

04-09-2015 10:11AM

conorhal wrote: »

Well that approach worked out well in Rotherham and Paris......

Sorry, forgive my ignorance...whose lives were saved in Rotherham and Paris?

NIMAN · 04-09-2015 10:16AM

The media and the Facebook brigade didn't seem to tell the full story on this poor child's drowning.

I watched Sky News and BBC News for many hours yesterday, and not once did they mention that this family was already in Turkey for 3 years. I came away from all the viewing with the impression they had just left Syria and had drowned on the crossing. But when you have news people trying to get the biggest reaction to a story, sometimes it helps not to tell the public the full story. Even listening to the father himself, saying he held all his family together in the water before seeing that they were all dead. Not wanting to sound callous but did it really happen like that? If a boat capsized in rough waters as he said, all people would be separated. So in choppy water he was able to swim around and gather up his wife and 2 kids? Doesn't sound plausible to me. Plus there was no mention of him having the only life jacket. If I was in his situation, I would put the lives of my family in front of my own, but looking at how it seems to be men first, women and kids last when it comes to getting on trains etc, it looks like it's survival of the fittest.

Also, little or no discussion on the media outlets of how the vast majority of people are young single men.

I'm getting the feeling already that this situation has been hijacked by economic migrants who are simply trying to get to the rich western countries (they aren't interested in poorer western countries it seems). Of course there are genuine cases in among it all, but when a train arrives, it looks like the fit young males will get into the carriages ahead of any small kids and their mums.

BoJack Horseman · 04-09-2015 10:22AM

WakeUp wrote: »

speaking of the Hungarians..

Hungary are being royally shafted by Germany.

Merkel can fix this today & help Hungary via the Luftwaffe.

Had a check & dilapidated though it is, Germany's air force could airlift 6,000+ people on any given day to/from anywhere in Europe.

Germany wants these men, they can transport them causing minimal fuss to poorer eastern states.

04-09-2015 10:30AM

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

Hungary are being royally shafted by Germany.

It's hardly Germany's fault that Hungary is located nearer Turkey and the Med.

The suggestion that, in offering to take 800,000 but not actually flying them in Germany is not doing enough must be the lamest effort here yet.

I presume your logic is at least consistent and you are arguing that we too should welcome them in huge numbers and fly them in.

"Haunting Image Of Drowned Boy Sums Up Consequences Of 'The Syrian War'"

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