Cheating in Airsoft/ Not taking you hits

Fianna88 · 31-03-2015 12:48am #1

Sorry about this guys but I had a really bad game on Sunday a lot of people not taking there hits and I just need to vent a bit.

I just don't understand why you would play airsoft which is supposed to be a game of honor and not take your hits! I was giving people the benefit of the doubt at the beginning of the day but as time went on and I could see BBs bouncing of certain players I got angry and at one point I shot a guy 3 feet from me and he just turned around shot me and continued on his way!! I called over a marshal who just said we are both hit go and respawn at which point I grabbed my gear and left.

I have been Skirmishing for 8 years and I'm finding this is getting more and more common when it should be getting stamped out. Every site I have ever gone to the marshals give a big lecture saying if you are repeatedly cheating you will be banned but in 8 years I have never heard of this happening!? My experience on Sunday has me considering leaving airsoft behind completely.

Is there anyone else in the same boat as me? Or has anyone ever heard of someone being banned from a site?

K.Flyer · 31-03-2015 2:10am

I have to say in over 5 years I haven't seen anyone banned for not taking hits.
I think the next worse thing to someone not taking hits, its the player who keeps firing at you long after you have raised your hand and called hit.
It's a total game spoiler when marshals don't appear to be dealing with these situations and you probably did the best thing by leaving as you may have blown up on someone and then regretted it.
As I always say,"... hopefully they will either learn or leave."
Keep the faith..

An Cigire · 31-03-2015 10:28am

I'm new to airsoft and game in Red Barn, as a new member of the sport I find the Marshall's to be fair and firm.. have seen several examples of marshals responding to gamer complaints and beino a fair referee and actively monitoring and mentoring player that have alleged or indeed caused infractions.

"If you think your hit , then take the hit.." is the rule in the barn

Half the reason I like redbarn is the Marshall's are proactive and interested in developing the sport.

It's is a sport after all and I agree with the original poster, if you don't respect the rules of our spoft don't play.. all actions like the above do is ruin everyone's game.

As a player our honour is all we have..

d.one · 01-04-2015 6:22am

Over the last 2 I have seen an increase in cheating on most sites I have played on ,with the exception of one or two ,it was really bad on one site one day ,when the head marshal shouted at a guy we were playing against " for **** sake take your hits " but didn't remove him from the game , friends of mine have gone further when their complaints fell on deaf ears the packed up and went home ,I myself have only walked off a site once because of cheating but have felt like it a few times ,
Wining or loosing dosent bother me I couldn't care less , some think it's the only thing that matters and how they get there dose not matter ,Airsoft when played with like minded players is amazing but unfortunately it only takes the actions of a few to ruin it for the majority ,and if the site for what ever reason is either unwilling or not able to stamp out cheating ,my advise would be try another site

TheDoc · 01-04-2015 1:45pm

It's been a hot issue for as long as I'm playing. I get the issues that Marshalls have in trusting someone enough to approach another player and say " You are cheating", there has to be 100% confidence there, as its a small community and reputations can incorrectly be tarnished.

If your experiencing regular enough issues on the same site, and after airing the issues with marshalls and owners and you feel it's not being dealt with, look into another site. In cases where there has been serious cheating rampant on sites in the past I've just moved on and gone elsewhere for a period.

Have to say in recent times havn't really encountered it, although most of the games I'm going to are private days, or events. But I'm comfortable in knowing the site I visit for skirmishes is pro-active in terms of dealing with cheaters and has a history of banning players from the site where issues arise.

Fianna88 · 01-04-2015 4:37pm

Ive tried a lot of sites and I go to as many Milsims/events as I can but I can just see it getting worse and worse as time goes on and it is just ruining the sport for me. Sundays game was the first time I ever actually left a site because it was so bad and that was an event not a normal skirmish day. Although there have been many occasions I felt like leaving but did not and I will never aggressively confront someone,as much as I would like to sometimes, I will always talk to a marshal.

I just think that the Marshals need to take a stronger stance on the issue for example if someone is repeatedly not taking hits and the marshals are receiving constant complaints about them then practice what you preach and either ask them to leave the game or ban them from the site they would soon get the message.

Lemming · 01-04-2015 6:32pm

Fianna88 wrote: »

I just think that the Marshals need to take a stronger stance on the issue for example if someone is repeatedly not taking hits and the marshals are receiving constant complaints about them then practice what you preach and either ask them to leave the game or ban them from the site they would soon get the message.

Now here is the thing; I've been in - and seen - the situation where there are repeated complaints about someone, ranging from "not taking hits" to "not going back to their regen point". In the majority of cases the accuser is wrong.

Why?

Most of the time, the complaints have either heard mumblings from teammates, which then spreads like chinese whispers, or (almost always) it's a classic case of "the BBs were heading towards him when I ducked into cover so must have hit him". I've actually had someone try to suggest that because they were scoped (this was a "sniper" of course ... ) that the target wasn't taking his hits. So a fellow marshal stood right beside the other guy and radioed back to me that the rounds were falling well short ...

The other typical scenario is honest mistake of not hearing/feeling a hit because there's either a lot of noise going on around them or they're sprinting or some such and the rounds bounce off a crease in clothing or some such.

It is extremely difficult to marshal and do it well/right. Most people wont complain until back in the safe zone/end of day at which point complaining is f*ck all use. But even when they do, the best that can be done for certain at that point in time is that either a marshal reminds them of the rules (never ever mention complaints against them because it's a guaruanteed argument)or for a marshal to be assigned to shadow said-player. In both scenarios above, the players typically become aware that a marshal is nearby or that they are under scrutiny and will start to play by the rules.

Until a marshal actually catches someone out and it's deliberate (as opposed to an honest mistake), they cannot be formally warned without causing a lot of ill-feeling, which may in fact be unwarranted and down to other people getting it wrong.

Once caught, most sites I've played at (and where I marshal included) tend to operate on some sort of 'three strikes' premise. It is also typically not the marshals authority to ask someone to leave, but the owner/person in authority on-site. In all of my time marshalling I can only thing of a handful of times where I have had to pull someone up for deliberate behaviour or mind-boggling stupidity. Most of the time a simple reminder does the job where one cannot be sure. I have also seen people ejected from site and/or turned away for having guns above the legal limit despite having travelled some distance to come to events.

Fianna88 · 01-04-2015 7:18pm

Lemming wrote: »

Now here is the thing; I've been in - and seen - the situation where there are repeated complaints about someone, ranging from "not taking hits" to "not going back to their regen point". In the majority of cases the accuser is wrong.

Why?

Most of the time, the complaints have either heard mumblings from teammates, which then spreads like chinese whispers, or (almost always) it's a classic case of "the BBs were heading towards him when I ducked into cover so must have hit him". I've actually had someone try to suggest that because they were scoped (this was a "sniper" of course ... ) that the target wasn't taking his hits. So a fellow marshal stood right beside the other guy and radioed back to me that the rounds were falling well short ...

The other typical scenario is honest mistake of not hearing/feeling a hit because there's either a lot of noise going on around them or they're sprinting or some such and the rounds bounce off a crease in clothing or some such.

It is extremely difficult to marshal and do it well/right. Most people wont complain until back in the safe zone/end of day at which point complaining is f*ck all use. But even when they do, the best that can be done for certain at that point in time is that either a marshal reminds them of the rules (never ever mention complaints against them because it's a guaruanteed argument)or for a marshal to be assigned to shadow said-player. In both scenarios above, the players typically become aware that a marshal is nearby or that they are under scrutiny and will start to play by the rules.

Until a marshal actually catches someone out and it's deliberate (as opposed to an honest mistake), they cannot be formally warned without causing a lot of ill-feeling, which may in fact be unwarranted and down to other people getting it wrong.

Once caught, most sites I've played at (and where I marshal included) tend to operate on some sort of 'three strikes' premise. It is also typically not the marshals authority to ask someone to leave, but the owner/person in authority on-site. In all of my time marshalling I can only thing of a handful of times where I have had to pull someone up for deliberate behaviour or mind-boggling stupidity. Most of the time a simple reminder does the job where one cannot be sure. I have also seen people ejected from site and/or turned away for having guns above the legal limit despite having travelled some distance to come to events.

Please don't get me wrong I'm not on here to complain about marshals I know its not an easy job and I always give players the benefit of the doubt but when I can actually see the BBs hitting a player and them flinching from the hit and they are not calling it that is when I get angry. I never assume I have hit a player. I told marshals 3 times about players not taking their hits straight away on Sunday before I left and I wasn't the only person who left that day because of it. Like I said in my previous posts in 8 years I have never seen anyone disciplined for cheating that's what annoys me.

Look I'm an honest player and cheating just really boils my blood.

Lemming · 01-04-2015 7:28pm

Cheating boils everyone's blood. There'll always be someone who *has* to win no matter the cost, or considers themselves to be better and more deserving because they've spent 'n' amount of cash on the kit they're wearing/using and therefore "it's alright", or the person who thinks nobody saw the hit and because they can't see who shot them it's ok.

All that you can do is keep doing what you're doing. Don't wait to moan amongst your team-mates about it, call a marshal and give as good and accurate a description of the player & incident as you can give during game-play.

A tip for all: when making a complaint, don't give a description similar to this: "he was wearing camo" ...

mudger · 02-04-2015 10:14am

totally agree that cheating is more common place now that it used to be.

We tell players to check each other when playing. if your own team is telling you your hit, its another way of curbing it.

Like any site Predator CG has had its fair share of this issue. We employ also honesty shots with marshals. If you call it you are told to stay in place and play on. If not the marshal goes directly to the player and sends him tot he re spawn.

Another tactic for this is to stand over them ALL DAY. it annoys them. lol. Ties up a staff member sometimes but worth it. they soon change their tune.

Also aggressive shooting is a problem. Especially with high rate of fire. When we see this we act immediately. Players are told not to. Also to keep their distance with high rate of fire weapons.

Its not just a sites problem is everyones. As mentioned it can result in a bad skirmish experience. No-one wants that!

Play fair and clean fokls!

ShRT · 02-04-2015 5:53pm

People not taking hits is definitely up there amongst the most annoying aspects of airsoft.
I usually give people the benefit of the doubt unless they are up close or I have seen it bounce off them. For those I am certain of, I usually give them the pleasure of a burst or two (I normally use multiple single shots).

To twist it around, I have been on the accused side of not taking my hits. There was only a few of us left in the game and the person I was trying to hit was in cover behind some metal sheeting. I was in the open but had been edging towards him as I could see the bb's dropping a few feet in front of me. On the other hand I was easily able to ping their cover (good old marui magic!)
I could see them getting mad as they thought I was not taking hits - lots of hand waving and shouting. I promptly informed him that they were dropping in front of me and pointed out each bb as it dropped.

I have also used a tree to range in the gun at the start of a game so I was pretty confident that I was hitting the person who was standing in front of it. Esp when you see them jump and look around! Didn't bother telling the marshal at the time (they are often a marshal themselves) so I made them my main target for the rest of the game. Wasted my bb's and was probably out of the game earlier than usual but it was very satisfying to take them out!

Gatling · 02-04-2015 6:06pm

Try having to listen to 3 players argue with a marshal why they shouldn't have to take respective hits because I had distracted them first .
They walked in to a room tap ,tap ,tap
Marshalllllll we were distracted by him .
Or while in a fairly good position holding a corridor getting hits only to hear marshal I lost me mag can I walk over there to get it (my position ) then walked over to his mates to tell them exactly where and how I was positioned

Fianna88 · 02-04-2015 11:08pm

Gatling wrote: »

Try having to listen to 3 players argue with a marshal why they shouldn't have to take respective hits because I had distracted them first .
They walked in to a room tap ,tap ,tap
Marshalllllll we were distracted by him .
Or while in a fairly good position holding a corridor getting hits only to hear marshal I lost me mag can I walk over there to get it (my position ) then walked over to his mates to tell them exactly where and how I was positioned

I have experienced very similar situations as well it is bloody infuriating!! I have actually put all my gear up for sale I cant put up with it any more as I think its only a matter of time before I really lose it with someone.

Lemming · 03-04-2015 4:27pm

Fianna88 wrote: »

I have experienced very similar situations as well it is bloody infuriating!! I have actually put all my gear up for sale I cant put up with it any more as I think its only a matter of time before I really lose it with someone.

TBH, throwing your arms up and storming off is only spiting yourself if you like playing airsoft. You'll find people cheating in every sport/game you can think of, either because they think they can get away with it or simply "because". Plenty of on-the-ball/off-the-ball incidents in football (to use an easy example), doesn't mean you see people selling off their boots and walking away. Just accept that some people are dicks, deal with the matter, and game-on.

MRnotlob606 · 03-04-2015 4:28pm

I sometimes don't take hits.

Lemming · 03-04-2015 4:32pm

MRnotlob606 wrote: »

I sometimes don't take hits.

Why?

Fianna88 · 03-04-2015 7:34pm

Lemming wrote: »

TBH, throwing your arms up and storming off is only spiting yourself if you like playing airsoft. You'll find people cheating in every sport/game you can think of, either because they think they can get away with it or simply "because". Plenty of on-the-ball/off-the-ball incidents in football (to use an easy example), doesn't mean you see people selling off their boots and walking away. Just accept that some people are dicks, deal with the matter, and game-on.

Yes but at least people actually get disciplined in football eg Red card, Yellow card, banned for 6 months or 10 games etc and I know players can still get away with cheating sometimes but at least there is a real system there to deal with them when they are caught. If there actually was a disciplinary system on airsoft sites I could deal with people occasionally getting away with it as I know marshals cannot be everywhere at once but there is just no system to deal with cheaters in airsoft even when they are repeatedly caught!

Lemming · 04-04-2015 1:16am

Fianna88 wrote: »

Yes but at least people actually get disciplined in football eg Red card, Yellow card, banned for 6 months or 10 games etc and I know players can still get away with cheating sometimes but at least there is a real system there to deal with them when they are caught. If there actually was a disciplinary system on airsoft sites I could deal with people occasionally getting away with it as I know marshals cannot be everywhere at once but there is just no system to deal with cheaters in airsoft even when they are repeatedly caught!

Any decent site will have a disciplinary system. It's called three strikes (or similar) at which point you'll have your bags packed and told to be on your way, sometimes being asked never to return depending on the severity of the issue at hand.

Regards everything else, take it or leave it as it's your choice at the end of the day. The only person stopping you playing airsoft is yourself.

Fianna88 · 04-04-2015 5:45am

Lemming wrote: »

Any decent site will have a disciplinary system. It's called three strikes (or similar) at which point you'll have your bags packed and told to be on your way, sometimes being asked never to return depending on the severity of the issue at hand.

Regards everything else, take it or leave it as it's your choice at the end of the day. The only person stopping you playing airsoft is yourself.

In 8 years ive never seen or heard of anyone getting disciplined in anyway. There are threats constantly thrown around by marshals but nothing ever comes of it, and i can tell you ive seen guys get up to 7 warnings in a day on sites that supposedly operate the 3 strike system and geuss what? Nothing happens they are allowed to continue playing all day and are back the very next week doing the same thing.

I know its my choice to play or not and ive made the choice to give up the sport as I know a lot of people have done in recent times for the same reasons.

ElSniperino · 04-04-2015 2:29pm

I'm sort of glad that I go to a site that actually deals with cheaters most of the time (The marshall typically needs to see it to act on it, but when they do, they bring the hammer down). More than one person has been taken out of the game/asked to leave for it.

I know that sometimes I'm hit in the dump pouch or something thick from far away while I'm moving and don't feel it. Typically a marshall or teammate tells me I was hit, and I take it.

Though what does sort of get to me (and this should maybe be in the annoyances thread) are those people that assume they have hit you and call you a cheater for not taking hits. Last day out I was at, twice this person shot at me. First time he hit the person in front of me and not me, the second time he just missed. He went yelling at the marshall about me cheating. I just went to the marshall, explained my side, and was sent on playing.

Fianna88 · 06-04-2015 11:45pm

ElSniperino wrote: »

I'm sort of glad that I go to a site that actually deals with cheaters most of the time (The marshall typically needs to see it to act on it, but when they do, they bring the hammer down). More than one person has been taken out of the game/asked to leave for it.

I know that sometimes I'm hit in the dump pouch or something thick from far away while I'm moving and don't feel it. Typically a marshall or teammate tells me I was hit, and I take it.

Though what does sort of get to me (and this should maybe be in the annoyances thread) are those people that assume they have hit you and call you a cheater for not taking hits. Last day out I was at, twice this person shot at me. First time he hit the person in front of me and not me, the second time he just missed. He went yelling at the marshall about me cheating. I just went to the marshall, explained my side, and was sent on playing.

I know what you mean I get that too, I would never assume I hit someone only time I would go to a marshal was if I was 100% sure I had hit the person eg. I can see the BBs bouncing of their face mask! :-)

K.Flyer · 06-04-2015 11:50pm

If I am fairly sure and I have the chance of a clean shot, I aim for the hands. Not many can feel a clean shot to their knuckles or the fingers without flinching.

ElSniperino · 07-04-2015 2:27pm

I just go for centre mass, or whatever is poking out of cover. I don't aim for a sore spot on purpose.

Also, trying to get a specific part lowers the chance of getting a hit, with waiting/aiming/the part moving.

I only go for the more exposed parts if, without a doubt, the other person has been ignoring hits on purpose.

New thing of cheating that I came across on Sunday; if you have 5 lives, you have 5 lives. Not 70. Stop respawning.

K.Flyer · 07-04-2015 7:47pm

ElSniperino wrote: »

...
New thing of cheating that I came across on Sunday; if you have 5 lives, you have 5 lives. Not 70. Stop respawning.

HAHAHA, yep seen that one enough times as well.
The usual lads back at the safe zone after using up lives, whilst "The Invincibles" carry on.

d.one · 08-04-2015 2:43am

K.Flyer wrote: »

If I am fairly sure and I have the chance of a clean shot, I aim for the hands. Not many can feel a clean shot to their knuckles or the fingers without flinching.

Lol I go centre mass ,but if I know a player that is a poor hit taker I double tap the head or groin and tighs ,unfortunately it's the only way to deal with cheats

mudger · 09-04-2015 9:09am

MRnotlob606 wrote: »

I sometimes don't take hits.

There is no justification for this my friend. even if others are not doesn't mean you be as bad as them. BUT at least your honest and there's hope for you lol.

Do other sites carry out honesty shots like us (Predator Combat Games)? Marshals with guns taking sneaky shots to make sure of hit taking. If you call it your told to stay in game if not, sin binned.

It is all our responsibility to make sure of fair play. If you see your own team getting hit call them out. embarrass them into it if need be. we have to clean the sport up. that's why competitions are also a problem with this issue.

Fianna88 · 09-04-2015 2:15pm

mudger wrote: »

There is no justification for this my friend. even if others are not doesn't mean you be as bad as them. BUT at least your honest and there's hope for you lol.

Do other sites carry out honesty shots like us (Predator Combat Games)? Marshals with guns taking sneaky shots to make sure of hit taking. If you call it your told to stay in game if not, sin binned.

It is all our responsibility to make sure of fair play. If you see your own team getting hit call them out. embarrass them into it if need be. we have to clean the sport up. that's why competitions are also a problem with this issue.

Never heard of these honesty shots thats a great idea,

ElSniperino · 09-04-2015 2:39pm

I know some players will take offense to the honesty shots, thinking that the marshalls consider them to be cheating and such, that some marshalls are being unfair, etc.

No solution is perfect, unfortunately.

Fianna88 · 09-04-2015 5:20pm

ElSniperino wrote: »

I know some players will take offense to the honesty shots, thinking that the marshalls consider them to be cheating and such, that some marshalls are being unfair, etc.

No solution is perfect, unfortunately.

Your right no solution is perfect but I wouldnt take offense to it I would be happy the marshals were actively weeding out cheaters, one of the easiest and most effective solutions I have heard of,

K.Flyer · 09-04-2015 5:28pm

Fianna88 wrote: »

Never heard of these honesty shots thats a great idea,

I have had marshals borrow my pistol for this, but they have to be careful how they carry out the cheater check.
It wouldn't be fair of a marshal to creep up on some very well hidden player, tap him twice, the player shouts hit, everyone now knows where he is, only for a marshal to say to him to play on.
It's a tricky one to do, but can be done well to rule out doubts.

andy_g · 09-04-2015 5:52pm

Only site that used to do this was hrta

K.Flyer · 09-04-2015 6:52pm

andy_g wrote: »

Only site that used to do this was hrta

Two other sites, Vacant in Naas (closed) and Hilltop in Wicklow (closed also)

mudger · 09-04-2015 6:53pm

ElSniperino wrote: »

I know some players will take offense to the honesty shots, thinking that the marshalls consider them to be cheating and such, that some marshalls are being unfair, etc.

No solution is perfect, unfortunately.

I agree but we have found that if players know marshals are out with weapons to perform honesty shots, you have less cheating. We have used it since the beginning 11 years ago and it does work. You only target those who are questionable anyway. I don't mean just shooting anyone you feel like. I would be annoyed if that happened to me if there was no issue with my hit taking.

mudger · 09-04-2015 6:55pm

Of course theres no point in honesty shots with pistol. Too obvious. Need to use (in my experience) AEG (single shot on soft parts.

Of course you need a good aim lol. Shooting from a predictable angle and not seen by player.

the_syco · 09-04-2015 8:19pm

I only play airsoft with work crowd, and although most will take their hits, some don't. I'll tell them to take their hits, and then shoot a couple of bursts of full auto that bounce off them at about 6 meters away until they do :P

=-=

From talking to a few people playing there, I think mostly it's the randomers/joe public that don't take their shots, but the clans generally do.

d.one · 10-04-2015 2:15am

Redhills Airsoft in kildare cheater check all the time , they used to be really strict and had zero tolerance for cheating which was great but the last 2 times I was there they seemed to be more lax with their approach which is a pity ,still a great site to visit though

Lemming · 10-04-2015 6:17pm

I disagree with honesty shots as a marshal for three reasons ;

1. It tells a player I suspect them of cheating even if it's entirely random and may causes unnecessary ill will.

2. More importantly, it broadcasts a players position potentially giving other players and unfair advantage.

3. Most importantly, it means marshals are wandering around strapped. Marshals should not ever be carrying whilst marshaling imo. Whilst you're messing about with a gun, you're not watching.

In any case, I have a pair of eyeballs, a marshal vest, a radio, and a loud voice when I need it. What do I need a pistol for to keep players honest?

TerrenceAnth · 11-04-2015 11:35am

You should have been round when i was head marshal at fingel. I went on a wave of kicking people off site in the summer.

Domane · 11-04-2015 1:54pm

I used to be a regular skirmisher but I've had so many "bad" days due to other guys cheating that I haven't gone airsofting since last July. I just target shoot in my back garden these days as the targets take their hits!!!

I was a regular at Redbarn as their marshals kept a close eye on players and I was the recipient of a silver "honor patch" as I played fair. However a new group of players started turning up and they cheated like mad. They would go "out of bounds" and shoot from the flank to get their kills. Calls to marshals about this went unheeded. They would spray an entire mag in your general direction and scream "take your hits" on the basis that they "must" have hit you with at least one of their 300 bbs. In CQB, they would disregard the single shot rule and fire full auto. They would blind fire around corners and it was only for the fact that I pushed one guys muzzle out of my face just in time that I narrowly escaped getting a full auto burst into my face from about 10 inches away. And naturally they wouldn't take their hits. Not boasting here or anything but I'm an excellent shot both at airsoft and using real steel firearms. If I see you, I'll hit you but those guys must have had an invisible force shield as bbs bounced off them whether I was 30 metres away or up close at 5 metres with my pistol. Now I am not the type to scream take your hits or to run to marshals every five minutes but it just got so farcical that I headed back to the safe zone and packed up. As I was leaving, the site owner asked me why I was leaving early and when I told him why, he said that he'd had no complaints. I told him I'd said it to the marshals and he called one of them in. He said that the new guys had reported me for shoving one guys gun away from me (as he was about to fire full auto into my face) and that I had called him a f-ing ar$ehole. This was true tbh but it had been the last straw and I narrowly avoided losing teeth. However to have this turned round on me, a player of good standing as evident by their awarding of silver honor patch for my fair play, was too much and I ripped their honor patch off my bdu, handed it back and said goodbye. Haven't been skirmishing since. I miss it like hell but what's the point when there are so many cheating gob****es infesting sites these days and the owners turning a blind eye in case they lose their new customers.

Rant over.

Jsmurff · 11-04-2015 2:37pm

I would have thought that with a comunity as small as ours people behaving like this would gain a reputation for doing so.

It's my experience that these groups flare up in waves every now and again but usually dissipate as most of them will loose interest due to having attention spans of a squirrel on speed.

When I was out skirmishing I got to know the good from the bad and would only turn up on the same days as them that way we all had fun and if some Rambo jackass showed up they got hell.

It also made the game more interesting as we all knew each other well enough to guess what each other would do in given surcumstances

ibstar · 27-04-2015 4:26pm

still haven't played airsoft, but played paintball and seen similar things happening there.
Last time a 2 man rambo team were camping a small lodge and wouldn't take hits and wouldn't go back to respawn.
I sneaked around and shot both of them from about 5 meteres in their behinds until they lifted up their guns.

nastros · 29-04-2015 10:54am

One of the big issue I find is the gear we all wear. I have noticed times where If I am shot in the chest rig in the back for example I dont notice it. Luckily other players around me point it out and I will walk away. But I have been in games where players will have helmets on and the bbs bouncing off there heads all day and they will not notice. So I just aim for there legs and then they genuinely put up there hand. The other side of this is bb deflection any little obstruction between me and you will cause the bb to deflect majorly this is something people seem to ignore in woodland games and assume because they could see you they can hit you ignoring the briars and other stuff in there way. But I still think a big culprit is the tac gear everyone wears. Im really surprised that no one has come up with a better hit indication method. I am not saying by the way cheating doesnt exist it totally does. But there are also people out there who are so arrogant they believe they cant miss and seem to think bbs are super accurate especially into the wind which is always hilarious to watch. I think it is a very difficult thing to do marshaling a game. As you have 2 groups cheaters and players who think they never miss. Personally I do my best to take my hits in some cases I will take a hit even if im not 100% sure I was hit. But there have also been times that I was hit and didn't notice.

Lemming · 29-04-2015 12:22pm

TBH; you can hear BBs bouncing off your kit more often than not if you cannot feel them; ESPECIALLY helmets

nastros · 29-04-2015 12:33pm

Oh helmets ya but again really down to the situation like in an area with a lot of noise people shouting its easy to miss the sound. I also am talking about on rare occasion not all of the time. Its just the unfortunate fact that in a game based on honesty you will always have the dishonest.

K.Flyer · 29-04-2015 2:10pm

To be fair, I imagine every single player has been hit at least once and not known about it, it happens.
I was once hit on the sole of my boot as I ran for cover. Only for the marshal was watching my game plan, he saw it bounce of the boot. He waved to me and pointed at his boot, I understood and the hand went up. I had no idea that I was hit at all, and quite possibly the shooter may not of realised it either, but it was all good. And if I was the shooter in that scenarios I would give someone the benefit of the doubt, it happens.
It's very different though when BBs are literally bouncing off someone in more than one situation, then it's Marshall time.

D_murph · 01-05-2015 11:59pm

I have been playing this game for over a year and a half now and Ive seen a lot of non hit taking and theres lots of reasons for it alright.

I always take my hits but there has admittedly been a few times where I didnt know it had happened due to the amount of gear I carry at cqb and possibly more times than that.

Outdoors one day, I only knew they were shooting at me cos the bbs were hitting the (steel) ammo box I was running away with. I had to have been hit otherwise but I certainly didnt feel it. Sneaking into an enemy base and robbing their ammo box and legging it definitely had my adrenaline running high too so I did drop the box once I heard the bbs rattling off it. Hopefully in time.

At CQB, Ive definitely missed a few hits on my tac vest with mag pouches full of mags taking the hit but it was pretty close and the player called to me that I was hit so I took it. Hopefully there was not more but theres no way to know.

However tho, I have been playing as a sniper at outdoor games for over a year now and I have had numerous occasions where I have seen players feel the hit and look around for a bit but then play on cos they think nobody saw it. BS cos I saw them flinch and the bbs defo tracked right up to them til it disappeared into them.

Ive also seen one or 2 guys take a shot to the side or the rear from me and then jump and run for cover only to fire back at where they think it came from. Now thats just taking the pi$$ :mad:.

One particular player at my local site has been on the other half of what should have been a 50/50 with me several times lately. He still manages to fire back at me after I fire at him but he doesnt get hit when I often nail guys much further away with my highly upgraded TM G Spec. If youre that close on my scope, youre toast basically!!

Again, I call BS and he has gloated to me once that he shot me "3 times in a row now" when I defo got him twice out of that 3 but he didnt take it :rolleyes:.

There was another lad banned around a year ago cos he was just unreal tho. Blatantly not taking hits and Im talking full mags worth of them while out in the open or in cover but not even trying to take cover tho and yet giving out to other players for not taking theirs ironically :rolleyes:. He got caught lovely by a marshal/player one day while verbally abusing someone for this and, well it was coming to him lol.

These are the bad eggs tho and I certainly wouldnt have stayed at this game so long now if it was like that all the time and definitely not as a sniper either. Thats how you really know who is the honest person and the cheater alike and Ive spent a damn fortune on my rifle so I know when that .3bb has made its mark. Sometimes, you just miss, other times, at long range they just dont feel it but when they flinch and have a look around, then you know :rolleyes:.

On a good note tho, most players do take even that single bb hit. They might be startled by it and even have a look to know where the feck it came from but they do take it tho.

Unless it got really bad, I certainly wouldnt quit this wonderful and unique sport because of a few cheaters tho. The loss would be too much for me lol :P

d.one · 02-05-2015 4:26pm

I personally don't buy the helmet and tack vest excuse,bbs make a very distinctive sound when hitting a helmet ,and if a Tac vest is stopping you taking your hits because you can't hear or feel them hitting you it's time to stop wearing it ,just saying

Gatling · 02-05-2015 4:49pm

d.one wrote: »

I personally don't buy the helmet and tack vest excuse,bbs make a very distinctive sound when hitting a helmet ,and if a Tac vest is stopping you taking your hits because you can't hear or feel them hitting you it's time to stop wearing it ,just saying

Sorry but I had it out in sim tac recently while running back to enter a vehicle I didn't feel several hits to the back of my chest rig .no hydration pouch or small back pack on it .
I wad literally in the back of a jeep when a non player opened my door G you were hit several times in the back .
Jumped out apologised to the lad who had got Me shook his hand .
And carried on while I counted down my respawn time .

At times and in bad conditions you might not hear or feel a hit .
It's pretty common while it's not blantant cheating all you can do is inform the player or marshal

shooterjay · 02-05-2015 6:25pm

im a newbie and i was very aware of takeing my hits, but sometimes i just didnt feel it, so i guessed and pup myself out in case. i was so freeking paranoid. i only got into one arguement caus a veteran said i got hit on the brim of my cap and i didnt call it. whats up with that ? if a bullet grazed your hat it wouldnt kill ye ?

d.one · 02-05-2015 8:01pm

Gatling wrote: »

Sorry but I had it out in sim tac recently while running back to enter a vehicle I didn't feel several hits to the back of my chest rig .no hydration pouch or small back pack on it .
I wad literally in the back of a jeep when a non player opened my door G you were hit several times in the back .
Jumped out apologised to the lad who had got Me shook his hand .
And carried on while I counted down my respawn time .

At times and in bad conditions you might not hear or feel a hit .
It's pretty common while it's not blantant cheating all you can do is inform the player or marshal

Not having a go here mate I'm sure your an honest player and I'm sure it was an honest mistake ,but may be you shouldn't wear a tack vest to avoid similar situations ,case in point ,that said real solders storm real building in real situations when the adrenaline is pumping and don't feel grazes from real bullets ,I understand there are times like this also
That said there are times you have a guy dead to rights you hit him he looks up so see where you are so you know he has been hit and Carrys on regardless ,those are the times that frustrates the sh1t out of me

Lemming · 03-05-2015 3:19pm

d.one wrote: »

Not having a go here mate I'm sure your an honest player and I'm sure it was an honest mistake ,but may be you shouldn't wear a tack vest to avoid similar situations

The same thing happens with folds and creases of clothing sometimes too; does that mean airsofters should stop wearing clothes too? I'm not sure if my sanity could survive the sight of that.

Accidents DO happen, it's how you as a player handle them when observed or pointed out to you.

,case in point ,that said real solders storm real building in real situations when the adrenaline is pumping and don't feel grazes from real bullets ,I understand there are times like this also

I cannot believe you just tried to do that ....

... have you considered that in real life there is - to state the captain obvious, captain - a real risk to life from bullets, so a soldier (or anyone else for that matter) will do whatever they have to to get the f*ck out of harms way when lead is getting chucked at them.

That said there are times you have a guy dead to rights you hit him he looks up so see where you are so you know he has been hit and Carrys on regardless ,those are the times that frustrates the sh1t out of me

See my first comment above about how you as a player handle such situations.

Also, are you 100% certrain you hit him. Did you see the BB strike? Or are you following the logical fallacy of "I pointed that way therefore it MUST have hit him".

I've been in situations where I've had BBs fly mere millimetres from my face and I've flinched to get out of the way (by pure chance), or I've had BBs impact walls/trees/whatever right beside me and I've looked to see where it's coming from, but I've never actually been hit. I've had a crazy moment in CQB where I breached a room with a pistol and engaged a player (also with a pistol) and neither of us actually managed to hit one another. We had a good laugh about that whilst wondering how on earth neither of us hit each other, agreed to take a hit each and went on our seperate ways back to regen.

As a marshal I've seen all manner of scenarios where someone has not actually been hit despite howling accusations to the contrary. I'm not defending non-hit taking, but I am pointing out that often it's players thinking they've hit someone when they haven't that is the real root cause of "that b@*stards not taking his f*cking hits".

Cheating in Airsoft/ Not taking you hits

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