Will you vote in the gay marriage referendum?

The Masculinist wrote: »

I will be voting no for two reasons;

1. A protest vote. I disagree how people who have a different viewpoint are labelled as biggots, hate filled and soforth. Surely in a free society we can listen to eachothers views and debate in a civil, logical manner.
2. I have a very different view on marriage. Depending on how mature posters are here I may elaborate on this later. I think that it is pretty controvertial and certainly unconventional.

I have no issue with homosexuals being in relationships, forming civil partnerships and soforth. I do have a problem how debate is stiffled in relation to this topic and it is making me veer towards the no side as a result.

We've been trying but when people refuse to back up what the say with any facts it gets difficult.

You dont mind them having marriage as long as they just dont use the word marriage?

mickstupp wrote: »

So in this 'free' society, you're going to go out of your way to try and deny other people rights. Well done, you.

Firstly, can you tell me why you believe that this is a right? What are you basing this on? The UN charter of human rights? What is your basis? I am not saying gay marriage is not a right, I was just unaware. I am open to persuasion!

Secondly, we are being asked to amend the constitution in relation to allowing gay marriage by way of referendum. If one believes that the debate surrounding this topic is flawed, which I do, then surely one is entitled to vote whichever way they choose as a "protest vote"? Remember Lisbon and Nice referenda?

Paddy Power are going 1/12 for it to pass, looks to be a shoo-in.

One eyed Jack wrote: »

You implied that their age somehow "explained a lot". The point I was making is that you were dismissing their opinion because of their age, not because they were simply talking out their arse holes.

No, I had dismissed and mocked their opinions previously on the assumption they were immature arse holes with a very narrow, unexposed view of the world. Their ages fully explained the immaturity part, hence it "explained a lot".

I'm aware of what they posted. They posted as much wind-up material as they thought they could safely get away with that could almost look like a legitimately held opinion. NONE of it made sense, and yet even though you knew none of it made sense, you and other posters still chose to rise to the bait instead of ignoring them, leading to one vital 'yes' campaigner also earning themselves some time out. The wind up posters aten't interested in a discussion, and are even less interested in your opinion. They wanted to illicit a reaction, and they achieved that. What did anyone who engaged with them achieve? Nothing anyone didn't know already.

There's a fair point there, but at the end of the day this is an AH thread - if someone says something that deserves to get the p!ss taken out of it, they will get the p!ss taken out of them. Also a lot of their points such as it being "unnatural" are actually brought up in full seriousness numerous times (and have been throughout the thread), so - right or wrong - I feel a need to point out how wrong that actually is. It's a weird thing, but if people keep shouting a blatant lie over and over and over without it being challenged it becomes somewhat 'true' to a lot of people on the fence. The 'no' side has been so filled with this same nonsense, over and over and over again, that if everyone were turning the other cheek this thread would be nothing but a circle jerk of gay bashing.

If I were a Jew whose future depended on it, I'd be choosing my words carefully and making sure I didn't come off like a knob, especially when I would consider that what's at stake is bigger than just getting one up on a bunch of neo-nazis, and when I knew I had 80% support, I wouldn't want to do anything that would turn that support into apathy.

It wouldn't matter how carefully those words were chosen or not, at the end of the day all the neo Nazi is going to do is spew hatred. For that, they deserve to be mocked and/or ignored, simple as. If a thread on such a situation existed and nobody in support of the Jewish side responded, it would turn into a miniature Stormfront before long.

By the way, where have you got the 80% support figure from?

The immature thing to do is to celebrate thinking you've given wind-up merchants an Internet smackdown as if you've actually achieved anything significant. You haven't. They're still going to vote the same way they always were, and all you've done is ignored the people you should be supporting, the people you need to come out and vote.

Look at how much of a clusterfcuk this thread has been already, with the few remaining die-hards and the wind-up merchants. Can you imagine what this crap for the next six months in the run up to the referendum is going to do to people? It's going to wear people out, physically, mentally and emotionally, there's going to be nobody left feeling positive about going to the voting booths come referendum day.

Actually in terms of overall run up to the referendum, there is an importance in a) partaking in actual constructive debate with those looking to do so which I have done, and b) questioning those who rely on baseless and incorrect talking points like "traditional", "unnatural", etc to actually substantiate what they mean, because without doing so these continually repeated falsehoods and lies do indeed become reality in the eyes of undecideds.

The onus isn't on anyone who is opposed to marriage equality to justify themselves to anyone else. That is the default position of the State already. If nobody turns up on referendum day, then society will remain governed by the same laws that currently offer a sub-standard level of protection to LGBT couples in relationships, and the children of those couples in LGBT relationships. If those people who said they would support marriage equality are too exhausted to turn up, or simply don't care any more, or become complacent that the vote will be carried in their absence, then the discriminatory laws stay as they are.

The onus is actually on both sides. If nobody shows up then it stays as is... but then only one person in favour needs to cast a vote and the referendum will pass. One side has the default base of the lgbt community, the other has the default base of the far religious right and of homophobes. If one side is allowed to shout lies and falsehoods from the rooftops unchallenged throughout, it would actually do a lot to help their cause rather than hinder it. Of course there is an importance to be open to actual constructive discussion, but the problem there is the utter dearth of it on display from the no side in this thread.

The onus is on anyone who advocates for marriage equality to ensure that this doesn't happen. The only way to achieve that is to support each other, not to get distracted from that by arguing with people who you know are only on a wind-up! It's a waste of time and energy and it's taking your attention away from people who really need your support.

The problem there is that I don't think there has been any lack of support from me amongst the yes side or undecideds. If you feel I am wrong here, please feel free to point out where.