Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - See Mod Warning in OP, 09/11

Rayne Wooney · 26-11-2014 01:27PM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Last thing I'm going to say on Nani.

His best season was 4+ years ago.
Some here are under the presumption that in 2014 / 2015 he's going to deliver consistently if he's now given a full run in the team for the rest of the season.

This generalisation that because a player hasn't been given 20+ games of a run in the team then he hasn't been given a chance.

If he's good enough and if he's at the standard that we should expect at UTD then he will do something to cement his place in one or two games and make himself un-droppable. The same for Kagawa etc..

Nani is one of the most frustrating players ever to wear a Utd shirt and a lot of Utd fans would share the same feeling.

Opinion / Rant over. On to the next.

Well it does have precedent that he will deliver given a run in the team, he has missed 37 games over the past 3 seasons through injury

This was my problem with people saying Welbeck would deliver given a run up front, there was really nothing to show that he would, Nani has a history of performing when given a long run in the team so it's more likely to happen than not

Backstreet Moyes · 26-11-2014 01:31PM

If Nani comes back he would be taking Janjuaz's place. Why the hell are people comparing him to Di Maria.

Pro. F · 26-11-2014 01:32PM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Last thing I'm going to say on Nani.

His best season was 4+ years ago.
Some here are under the presumption that in 2014 / 2015 he's going to deliver consistently if he's now given a full run in the team for the rest of the season.

This generalisation that because a player hasn't been given 20+ games of a run in the team then he hasn't been given a chance.

If he's good enough and if he's at the standard that we should expect at UTD then he will do something to cement his place in one or two games and make himself un-droppable. The same for Kagawa etc..

Nani is one of the most frustrating players ever to wear a Utd shirt and a lot of Utd fans would share the same feeling.

Opinion / Rant over. On to the next.

Nobody has said that Nani needs a run of 20 games to prove himself. Rooney, RVP and the like rarely make themselves undroppable within in two or three games of coming back, but I assume you are happy with them being given time to find form.

bucketybuck · 26-11-2014 01:33PM

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Nani has a history of performing when given a long run in the team so it's more likely to happen than not

And in fact is happening right now, just not for the team that owns him.

Will I Amnt · 26-11-2014 01:35PM

If United get a consistent good run of form I'd be fine with Nani coming back, he's not the kind of player you want when you're trying to find your feet as a team IMO.

Liam McPoyle · 26-11-2014 01:36PM

Nani me bollox tbh.

He was proven time and again to be staggeringly inconsistent.

He is playing in a decidedly average team in Sporting.

He would be a decent squad player for is but with the massive salary he is on it would be a waste to bring him back.

Much like Wellbeck and Kag's, Nani is in the past and should be left there IMO.

Pro. F · 26-11-2014 01:41PM

Business Cat wrote: »

Nani me bollox tbh.

He was proven time and again to be staggeringly inconsistent.

He is playing in a decidedly average team in Sporting.

He would be a decent squad player for is but with the massive salary he is on it would be a waste to bring him back.

Much like Wellbeck and Kag's, Nani is in the past and should be left there IMO.

When was it that Nani proved to be staggeringly inconsistent?

26-11-2014 01:44PM

Pro. F wrote: »

Nobody has said that Nani needs a run of 20 games to prove himself. Rooney, RVP and the like rarely make themselves undroppable within in two or three games of coming back, but I assume you are happy with them being given time to find form.

Plenty have said that Nani needs a good run in the team, do I have to read through the whole thread to prove this to you?

I have discussed that RVP be dropped and replaced with Falcoa for weeks now because of poor form. A goal against Chelsea in the last minute doesn't excuse this.

But Falcoa has now become unavailable because of injury.

Again don't assume you know what I'm thinking.

Rayne Wooney · 26-11-2014 01:45PM

Pro. F wrote: »

When was it that Nani proved to be staggeringly inconsistent?

When he was played inconsistently probably

SpuddMurphy · 26-11-2014 01:47PM

I really don't see where the sudden love for Nani has come from, what he's performing in a bad league and against bad teams in CL? He's 28, get's ridiculous wages, I'd rather him just leave now. I know for a fact he could play all season and get like 8 assists and 4 goals at most probably, all being against little teams. Although I would be curious to see how he'd play the Robben role ST in 3-5-2, but I really don't like when we play that formation.

The Moldy Gowl · 26-11-2014 01:52PM

SpuddMurphy wrote: »

I really don't see where the sudden love for Nani has come from, what he's performing in a bad league and against bad teams in CL? He's 28, get's ridiculous wages, I'd rather him just leave now. I know for a fact he could play all season and get like 8 assists and 4 goals at most probably, all being against little teams. Although I would be curious to see how he'd play the Robben role ST in 3-5-2, but I really don't like when we play that formation.

This nani love in has been ongoing for a long long time. It's nothing new and nothing good ever comes of it.

Lucas Hood · 26-11-2014 01:55PM

Is all this talk about Nani coming after that goal last night? You only need to watch that to see how frustrating he is , Fair enough he scored but he had a better option to pass to his team mates 2 or 3 times.

Thing that always annoyed me about him was he passed when he should be shooting & shot when he should be passing.

SpuddMurphy · 26-11-2014 01:55PM

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

This nani love in has been ongoing for a long long time. It's nothing new and nothing good ever comes of it.

It's a bit ridiculous tbh, we all know he can be a great player on his day but so can any player. He's been at United a long time and if he was anywhere was good as people are saying he is in here then he would of forced his way into the teams and played all those games you lot are saying he needs to show consistency. Fact is the best players convince the manager to play them by performing when given the chance.

eagle eye · 26-11-2014 02:04PM

People regularly talk about what a player did as regards goals and assists. That is not all the game is about though, you need to have players who can get back and dig in when required. Its often the reason that a player who is good as an attacker is not starting games. Most managers feel there is only room for one player in a team who doesn't fall back when you lose possession these days.

bucketybuck · 26-11-2014 02:07PM

eagle eye wrote: »

People regularly talk about what a player did as regards goals and assists. That is not all the game is about though, you need to have players who can get back and dig in when required. Its often the reason that a player who is good as an attacker is not starting games. Most managers feel there is only room for one player in a team who doesn't fall back when you lose possession these days.

We need Valencia back on the right wing as soon as possible!

The Moldy Gowl · 26-11-2014 02:10PM

SpuddMurphy wrote: »

It's a bit ridiculous tbh, we all know he can be a great player on his day but so can any player. He's been at United a long time and if he was anywhere was good as people are saying he is in here then he would of forced his way into the teams and played all those games you lot are saying he needs to show consistency. Fact is the best players convince the manager to play them by performing when given the chance.

No one is right and no one is wrong.

If you are on the fence- wrong
Want him to play - wrong
Don't want him - wrong.

It will never finish

The_Kew_Tour · 26-11-2014 02:11PM

Just one thing on Nani that i read earlier about him only been good against weaker teams.

Don't think that is true at all. I can remember him been excellent against Arsenal, Liverpool and Chelsea come to mind.

Would be one of first names on team sheet if he was at club now for me.

Donnielighto · 26-11-2014 02:13PM

Signing a five year contract and then not playing him doesn't really increase his value. Teams will see we get nothing for our contribution and therefore the pressure is on us to sell. His contract indicates he was in the long term plan at that stage. I'd also wager that the flub signed off on it in the knowledge that Moyes was walking.

Donnielighto · 26-11-2014 02:16PM

Nani is a good defensively as you'd expect a winger to be honestly. If you want full backs on the wing play full backs.

Pro. F · 26-11-2014 02:22PM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Plenty have said that Nani needs a good run in the team, do I have to read through the whole thread to prove this to you?

I have discussed that RVP be dropped and replaced with Falcoa for weeks now because of poor form. A goal against Chelsea in the last minute doesn't excuse this.

But Falcoa has now become unavailable because of injury.

Again don't assume you know what I'm thinking.

A good run in the team does not mean 20 games. Maybe you will be able to find the very occasional post saying Nani needs 20 games to find form, but that is not representative of the general argument, made by the majority, that he needs a good run in the team to show form. You are using the outlandish figure to try to discredit the argument.

Calling for RVP to be dropped now after he has played so many bad games does not mean you are treating Nani the same as other players. Would you call for RVP, Rooney, etc to be dropped after one or two quiet games when they come into the team?

26-11-2014 02:26PM

Donnielighto wrote: »

Nani is a good defensively as you'd expect a winger to be honestly. If you want full backs on the wing play full backs.

Nah sure he's exactly like Ronaldo just not as good right. I mean he's Portuguese so that means he must be a goalscoring winger who doesn't defend.

Also replacing RVP with Falcao is a little bit different to replacing Januzaj who's been decent in one game this season with Nani who's been a standout in many.

Mantis Toboggan · 26-11-2014 02:37PM

Liam O wrote: »

Nani has just as good a workrate as Valencia. Just because Valencia doesn't attack makes no difference.

This simply isn't true, and of course Valencia attacks also, how did you think we got the goal against Arsenal?

Anyway il have to call around to your house with a few beers and watch a few old games and I'll explain it to you.

26-11-2014 02:43PM

Pro. F wrote: »

A good run in the team does not mean 20 games. Maybe you will be able to find the very occasional post saying Nani needs 20 games to find form, but that is not representative of the general argument, made by the majority, that he needs a good run in the team to show form. You are using the outlandish figure to try to discredit the argument.

Calling for RVP to be dropped now after he has played so many bad games does not mean you are treating Nani the same as other players. Would you call for RVP, Rooney, etc to be dropped after one or two quiet games when they come into the team?

A number that I used is in turn giving you the space for an argument. If I turned the figure of 20 into a 'solid run in team' what would a solid run consist of in your opinion?

bucketybuck · 26-11-2014 02:45PM

Buddy Holly wrote: »

This simply isn't true, and of course Valencia attacks also, how did you think we got the goal against Arsenal?

By scuffing his shot and getting lucky? How did you think he got it?

Antonio Valencia, 2 league goals in 29 games last season, 1 from 30 the season before, he is indeed an attacking phenom.

ElChe32 · 26-11-2014 02:48PM

Antonio Valencia is disgracefully one footed for a winger. Defenders have sussed him out over the past few years, he can't cross (No blasting the ball as hard as you can from one side of the box to the other doesn't count). His one-footedness slows our attacks to no end. Grand squad player but needs replacing.

Nalz · 26-11-2014 02:50PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

By scuffing his shot and getting lucky? How did you think he got it?

Antonio Valencia, 2 league goals in 29 games last season, 1 from 30 the season before, he is indeed an attacking phenom.

Chelsea are top of the league, Oscar has played in all but 2 games (one was vs City) and has got 3 goals. Willian has 1 and has not played in 2 (he got 4 from 20 games or so last season). Are they not attacking then by that logic?

The question was does he attack no? Course he does if that was the question.

He's a great squad player and an average\poor first XI player. The fact he can play wingback is a plus

bucketybuck · 26-11-2014 02:52PM

Trilla wrote: »

Chelsea are top of the league, Oscar has played in all but 2 games and has got 3 goals. Willian has 1 and has not played in 2 (he got 4 from 20 games or so last season). Are they not attacking then by that logic?

The question was does he attack no? Course he does if that was the question

Let me check something, am I really responding to somebody who thinks Antonio Valencia has been anything but pure pishwater for the last three seasons? Because I'm not sure I want to bother.

Nalz · 26-11-2014 02:55PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

Let me check something, am I really responding to somebody who thinks Antonio Valencia has been anything but pure pishwater for the last three seasons? Because I'm not sure I want to bother.

Yet you bothered to reply to others with irrelevant stats, which somehow prove he's attacking or not.

He's been poor the last 3 seasons of course. Only showed tiny glimpses of the Valencia we've seen before. In fact I'd go as far to say he's had 1 season and another half season where he's been in good\great form. Worth keeping for squad purposes I think.

26-11-2014 02:56PM

When Rafael plays behind Valencia he is more of an offensive threat than Valencia. Name one other winger at a top club you could say the same about? I can't believe people don't seem to notice his inability to get forward anymore. Do people not notice his passes back to the right back every game?

Cantona's Collars · 26-11-2014 03:09PM

Liam O wrote: »

When Rafael plays behind Valencia he is more of an offensive threat than Valencia. Name one other winger at a top club you could say the same about? I can't believe people don't seem to notice his inability to get forward anymore. Do people not notice his passes back to the right back every game?

Been saying this every time Val plays on the wing,the name Turn Back Tony has been so apt.

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - See Mod Warning in OP, 09/11

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