Local Thug Died

Chunners wrote: »

mean are funerals not held in churches and are churches not the house of god

You're just rambling at this stage.

I can't type this any more times, nor any clearer. Funerals are for the survivors.

For survivors, read: bereaved.

I couldn't give a rats if a eulogy is economical with the truth. Why do you care? If you know what was said, why did you concern yourself with attending in the first place, or reading the coverage in the first place?

Perhaps you should ask yourself why exactly this annoys you. Perhaps your reaction says more about yourself than anything else.

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Without giving away to much, you know The Ten Commandments?

Well, he broke every single one of them.

You shall have no other gods before Me.
You shall not make idols.
You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain.
Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Honor your father and your mother.
You shall not murder.
You shall not commit adultery.
You shall not steal.
You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
You shall not covet.

Easy enough to break 90% of them!

Barely There wrote: »

I remember when a local thug was gunned down in a park near where I lived.
For weeks afterwards the railings of the park were festooned with bouquets of flowers, cards, photographs even teddy bears (seriously WTF - the guy was an out and out scumbag).

I remember thinking at the time that I wouldn't get half as much stuff in tribute if it had been me who was shot instead.

Scumbags tend to have big families.

Michael Weston wrote: »

I think this thread is going to be good craic , have seen this happen in my own town, absolute skank died in prison from an overdose. He's in for dealing and assault and the local rag prints the headline such and such was a gentle giant!!! He was not he was a Robbin prickquote]

Would that be Robin Thicke's even less subtle brother?

I have to say it baffles me how when one of these gangland/druggie figures dies there is this sudden outpouring of grief and demands to respect the dead etc.

I'm certainly not saying anyone should go out of their way to show contempt nor rubbish the person's family for grieving but I do wish people wouldn't try to pretend these people are all goodness and light when they are anything but.

They wouldn't show you that kind of courtesy if you died.

GSF wrote: »

The country sent a sympathy card when Hitler topped himself. How was this guy any worse?

This guy stayed up playing jungle music till 4 in the morning

That is very harsh MrsByrne.

Would you be surprised to hear that if I pulled you and your kids out of where you raised them, or any of your family, friends or people you know, and put you into socioeconomic disadvantage- that your children would very much turn out the exact same way as this chap. Because they would. Trust me, they would. Go experience it. Go speak to sociologists and people who know what they are talking about.

If you are making comments like that, you really don't understand the issue. It is an abhorrent attitude and shows no respect for human life. I dare not refer back to Irish attitudes on the Magdalene launderies and cheap-labour state contracts to wash to clothes of the better off.

All children cry the same when they are born, all children, it is what happens after that that shapes and moulds them.
If you were born in a group of headhunters in the Amazon, you would grow up to be a headhunter.
If you were born into Nazi Germany, you'd likely have grown up to be a Nazi. Yes people have to take responsibility for their actions and choices, 100%, but you are asking very impoverished and dysfunctional children to be a hero and beat the system; to overcome disadvantage by themselves while you ride high on the back of an overpaid civil service, pensioned up to your eyeballs for a job you are useless at (not you personally).

Whether you agree with the morality of my own posts, surely you will agree with the economics. 90%+ of criminals in jail as we speak are people who found themselves in the justice system, welfare system etc, at a very young age. They may have had limited schooling, social exclusion, multi-generational poverty, addictions, depression, a weak family, poor parenting, and they carry with them an absolute lack of self worth or respect for themselves.

You either put the money in at the start, or you put the money in at the end. That is just the economic fact. Either way, you pay.
And to have a lad with a job and a sense of self worth makes better sense than abandoning that lad and meeting him when he's on heroin and has striped someone. And it is cheaper. It costs over €60k a year to house a prisioner.

I have worked with some fantastic children who were as every bit bright and hopeful for their future when kids, only to grow up to nothing but absolute misery and cronyism. No policing. Houses falling to sh!t. Drug gangs acting in the open. Councils keeping money ringfenced for certain communities and spending it on golf courses. Domestic violence in the open. Non-responsiveness from social workers or the state at any level. Sher they've cut the overtime, sorry kids. 60%+ youth unemployment. Suicide. A big f#ck you to anyone trying to better themselves.

This is not a state issue. It is as much an individual issue. And it is largely through lack of personal efficacy amongst overpaid public service employees; and their unvouched increments despite being useless and delivering no results. There are some people out there at the moment on pensions that should be ashamed of themselves.

myshirt wrote: »

That is very harsh MrsByrne.

Would you be surprised to hear that if I pulled you and your kids out of where you raised them, or any of your family, friends or people you know, and put you into socioeconomic disadvantage- that your children would very much turn out the exact same way as this chap. Because they would. Trust me, they would. Go experience it. Go speak to sociologists and people who know what they are talking about.

If you are making comments like that, you really don't understand the issue. It is an abhorrent attitude and shows no respect for human life. I dare not refer back to Irish attitudes on the Magdalene launderies and cheap-labour state contracts to wash to clothes of the better off.

All children cry the same when they are born, all children, it is what happens after that that shapes and moulds them.
If you were born in a group of headhunters in the Amazon, you would grow up to be a headhunter.
If you were born into Nazi Germany, you'd likely have grown up to be a Nazi. Yes people have to take responsibility for their actions and choices, 100%, but you are asking very impoverished and dysfunctional children to be a hero and beat the system; to overcome disadvantage by themselves while you ride high on the back of an overpaid civil service, pensioned up to your eyeballs for a job you are useless at (not you personally).

Whether you agree with the morality of my own posts, surely you will agree with the economics. 90%+ of criminals in jail as we speak are people who found themselves in the justice system, welfare system etc, at a very young age. They may have had limited schooling, social exclusion, multi-generational poverty, addictions, depression, a weak family, poor parenting, and they carry with them an absolute lack of self worth or respect for themselves.

You either put the money in at the start, or you put the money in at the end. That is just the economic fact. Either way, you pay.
And to have a lad with a job and a sense of self worth makes better sense than abandoning that lad and meeting him when he's on heroin and has striped someone. And it is cheaper. It costs over €60k a year to house a prisioner.

I have worked with some fantastic children who were as every bit bright and hopeful for their future when kids, only to grow up to nothing but absolute misery and cronyism. No policing. Houses falling to sh!t. Drug gangs acting in the open. Councils keeping money ringfenced for certain communities and spending it on golf courses. Domestic violence in the open. Non-responsiveness from social workers or the state at any level. Sher they've cut the overtime, sorry kids. 60%+ youth unemployment. Suicide. A big f#ck you to anyone trying to better themselves.

This is not a state issue. It is as much an individual issue. And it is largely through lack of personal efficacy amongst overpaid public service employees; and their unvouched increments despite being useless and delivering no results. There are some people out there at the moment on pensions that should be ashamed of themselves.

No matter the environment that someone is born into, for the most part people know right from wrong.

The above is just a list of excuses as to why someone should not better themselves if born into disadvantage.

The state provides one of the most generous welfare systems in the world.
There should be little reason for someone to fall into a life of crime where they cause misery to others in society.

myshirt wrote: »

90%+ of criminals in jail as we speak are people who found themselves in the justice system, welfare system etc, at a very young age. They may have had limited schooling, social exclusion, multi-generational poverty, addictions, depression, a weak family, poor parenting, and they carry with them an absolute lack of self worth or respect for themselves.

This is very different from saying 90% of the people born into multi-generational poverty are criminals, which is what you imply when you say my kids would be criminals if born into that environment.

myshirt wrote: »

That is very harsh MrsByrne.

Would you be surprised to hear that if I pulled you and your kids out of where you raised them, or any of your family, friends or people you know, and put you into socioeconomic disadvantage- that your children would very much turn out the exact same way as this chap. Because they would. Trust me, they would. Go experience it. Go speak to sociologists and people who know what they are talking about.

If you are making comments like that, you really don't understand the issue. It is an abhorrent attitude and shows no respect for human life. I dare not refer back to Irish attitudes on the Magdalene launderies and cheap-labour state contracts to wash to clothes of the better off.

All children cry the same when they are born, all children, it is what happens after that that shapes and moulds them.
If you were born in a group of headhunters in the Amazon, you would grow up to be a headhunter.
If you were born into Nazi Germany, you'd likely have grown up to be a Nazi. Yes people have to take responsibility for their actions and choices, 100%, but you are asking very impoverished and dysfunctional children to be a hero and beat the system; to overcome disadvantage by themselves while you ride high on the back of an overpaid civil service, pensioned up to your eyeballs for a job you are useless at (not you personally).

Whether you agree with the morality of my own posts, surely you will agree with the economics. 90%+ of criminals in jail as we speak are people who found themselves in the justice system, welfare system etc, at a very young age. They may have had limited schooling, social exclusion, multi-generational poverty, addictions, depression, a weak family, poor parenting, and they carry with them an absolute lack of self worth or respect for themselves.

You either put the money in at the start, or you put the money in at the end. That is just the economic fact. Either way, you pay.
And to have a lad with a job and a sense of self worth makes better sense than abandoning that lad and meeting him when he's on heroin and has striped someone. And it is cheaper. It costs over €60k a year to house a prisioner.

I have worked with some fantastic children who were as every bit bright and hopeful for their future when kids, only to grow up to nothing but absolute misery and cronyism. No policing. Houses falling to sh!t. Drug gangs acting in the open. Councils keeping money ringfenced for certain communities and spending it on golf courses. Domestic violence in the open. Non-responsiveness from social workers or the state at any level. Sher they've cut the overtime, sorry kids. 60%+ youth unemployment. Suicide. A big f#ck you to anyone trying to better themselves.

This is not a state issue. It is as much an individual issue. And it is largely through lack of personal efficacy amongst overpaid public service employees; and their unvouched increments despite being useless and delivering no results. There are some people out there at the moment on pensions that should be ashamed of themselves.

To address just one of your examples of how people can't escape what they're born into: A whole country of people brought up to be Nazi's did not become Nazi's as you suggest they might have but instead created the dazzlingly successful post-war West Germany.

People can escape circumstance given an opportunity to do so. Criminal elements in working class areas damage such areas at least as much as the other factors you hold responsible. People who terrorise their communities cannot be let off the hook, and by suggesting that they have no alternative you do the majority of people in such areas, who struggle to better themselves, a vast disservice.