Is Windows Phone Dying?

Wcool · 22-07-2014 10:06pm

WP8 is a very usable OS, I've found that put in the hands of a dumbphone user they get to grips with WP very quickly and the updates have been almost quarterly with the GDR updates adding small features at a steady pace.

As to the boot loader being locked, I'm generally in favour of this being restricted to prevent sideloading, the piracy situation on Android is pretty terrible due to phone unlocking making it almost trivial to work around the inbuilt OS security.

I'm also confused by drag and drop over USB, as this was one of the WP8 initial features compared to the WP7 releases.

I guess you must be on Nokia as I got no updates since I bought the phone in October 2013.
WP is a very pleasant UI, no complaints there, but decent notifications only since 8.1 is quite frankly shocking. Also all those small but extremely nice touches to the OS, why not release them when they are ready?

The bootloader has nothing to do with piracy, I just want to install from websites that I trust, at least give me the option. The security situation on Android is actually pretty good. See for instance http://qz.com/131436/contrary-to-what-youve-heard-android-is-almost-impenetrable-to-malware/

Most of my computers are Linux based. It is extremely frustrating to plug in your phone over Universal Serial Bus, and not be able to drag files to it. Now I have to admit that I haven't retried with 8.1. I use my only Windows computer left to get files on it,

Francie Barrett · 22-07-2014 10:41pm

Surface and Nokia lost Microsoft serious money in the previous quarter. The Nokia bit alone reported losses of $700M. Lumia sales when taking into account a shorter quarter were flat. Microsoft report that the majority of Lumia's sold were in the lower price bracket.

You can see why Nadella took such decisive action with Nokia now. I wonder is he thinking that the best thing to do now would be to just write off the whole thing and just let third parties make the devices?

wrt40 · 23-07-2014 8:20am

I'm not sure where all the talk of Microsoft dropping windows phone is coming from. They are clearly improving the situation and you have to remember they have always been playing catchup. I expect them to always be in 3rd place, but 3rd place with more market share than they have now.

They have posted quarterly figures:

http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/130016-microsoft-q4-2014-earnings-4-6b-net-income-23-3b-revenue-and-strong-cloud-sales

Phone revenue is 2 billion

liamog · 23-07-2014 9:11am

Wcool wrote: »

I guess you must be on Nokia as I got no updates since I bought the phone in October 2013.
WP is a very pleasant UI, no complaints there, but decent notifications only since 8.1 is quite frankly shocking. Also all those small but extremely nice touches to the OS, why not release them when they are ready?

The bootloader has nothing to do with piracy, I just want to install from websites that I trust, at least give me the option. The security situation on Android is actually pretty good. See for instance http://qz.com/131436/contrary-to-what-youve-heard-android-is-almost-impenetrable-to-malware/

Most of my computers are Linux based. It is extremely frustrating to plug in your phone over Universal Serial Bus, and not be able to drag files to it. Now I have to admit that I haven't retried with 8.1. I use my only Windows computer left to get files on it,

Oh OK, my understanding was that all the phones got the GDR updates, but then again it could be a case of your carriers blocking them.

WP8+ requires an MTP connection to connect to the phone and transfer files rather than Mass Storage Mode, both use USB as the connection mode, but you do require a Desktop OS that can support this standard.

Note, I said piracy (or at least I hope I did) rather than malware.

Here's an interesting article on the piracy situation http://www.slashgear.com/95-android-game-piracy-experience-highlights-app-theft-challenge-15282064/

Fingleberries · 23-07-2014 10:13am

Wcool wrote: »

The bootloader has nothing to do with piracy, I just want to install from websites that I trust, at least give me the option.

For Corporate, non-commercial or beta apps, can you not sideload them using the Application Deployment Tool which comes as part of the Windows Phone 8.x SDK?

KingOfFairview · 24-07-2014 7:59pm

Think wp9 will be the last roll of the dice?

theothernt · 25-07-2014 1:52pm

KingOfFairview wrote: »

Think wp9 will be the last roll of the dice?

Why on earth would you think that?

Fingleberries · 25-07-2014 2:52pm

theothernt wrote: »

Why on earth would you think that?

Because that's what everyone said for WP8.1

... And WP8

...... And WP7.5

......... And WP7

Red Nissan · 25-07-2014 3:06pm

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

But reading some of the stories over on WPC lately (talk of an Android Lumia, MS prioritising other platforms, delisting of XBox games etc) makes me wonder what the medium-long term future for the platform is..

Windows was never an attractive package on a smart app, it's early applications were in the Toughbook Phone and other industrial environments where a lot of interaction and advanced applications were geared for the professional office user and the field professional returning to his office to share data etc.

It was never liked and MS really thought their dominant position in the Office Market would support them in the general mobile phone market. But whilst Apple were perhaps the last to offer anything, they totally revolutionized the mobile phone and what it should be and users found it was compatible with everything ~ probably the iPhone's most powerful and overlooked asset.

The iPhone and Android clones are where the market is and possibly for the foreseeable future, Windows are so last century on their that they just don;t appeal and have no unique features and don't innovate anything, neither, neither do they copy the best, they have to do it their way.

A few phone developers have gone out of business already in the revolutionary turmoil, if Windows Mobile was its only business, then they'd have joined them years ago.

theothernt · 25-07-2014 4:11pm

Fingleberries wrote: »

Because that's what everyone said for WP8.1

... And WP8

...... And WP7.5

......... And WP7

Ah yes, the old "I heard that somewhere once, I think, maybe" ;-)

I'd really like to see the sources of all the this doom and gloom!

jimmynokia · 25-07-2014 5:58pm

I think the whole BBM thing is rather pointless.

Fingleberries · 25-07-2014 5:59pm

theothernt wrote: »

Ah yes, the old "I heard that somewhere once, I think, maybe" ;-)

I'd really like to see the sources of all the this doom and gloom!

Exactly, but if it's rehashed often enough it'll probably be true one time or other.

Microsoft seem to have hit something positive with 8.1 and Cortana. They are actually getting positive coverage in mainstream media and more people (in Ireland any way) seem to be using windows phone handsets.

If they can build on that momentum, they should see a big uptick in sales. They wont overtake Android in a hurry, though.

MJohnston · 25-07-2014 7:24pm

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Agree with pretty much everything except for that. Nokia smartphone sales were growing for months after Elop took charge, mainly due to the N8 which was a hit. On February 2011, Elop announced that Meego and Symbian were being discontinued. Nokia went from nearly 30 million Symbian shipments to about 5 million Windows Phone shipments in just a year. The vast majority of Nokia customers jumped ship to Android - it was at that point that Nokia were finished. The Windows Phone market was simply far too small to sustain a company of Nokia's size.

I disagree with this, and I think the evidence for my argument is right there in your reply. At the point Elop took over, Nokia was dependent upon Meego and Symbian, which essentially meant they were dependent on themselves. This is well-and-good for a while when you're someone like Microsoft who has bundles of cash reserves, and several other hugely profitable business divisions that can prop up software development on an Operating System that isn't getting the traction it needs.

But for Nokia, it would have been downright disastrous.

In order to argue otherwise, you'd need to believe that Meego would have had a chance against a dominant (at that time) iOS, and an already accelerating in adoption Android, and I don't think that was likely. When Elop made his burning platform memo, it was really quite apparent to the world that Meego was not going to be a success, or at least, enough of a success that it could keep a company like Nokia afloat. At best, Meego would be in the same position as Windows Phone is right now, but lacking all of the relative strengths as WP has (Microsoft's deep pockets, Microsoft's deep conviction that WP must succeed, the wonderful Windows ecosystem integration across desktop, phone, tablet, and Xbox, etc.) which means Nokia would have been losing money on hardware and on software. They might have decided at some point that jumping over to Android was an option, but look at HTC, Sony, etc to see how successful that might have been (of course, no-one really knows how that decision could have gone).

I think Elop made a smart decision to cut Nokia's losses with Meego, and really the debate can only really be over whether the second decision to back Windows Phone was a good one or not. As a long time fan of WP, I'm very, very glad they went with it, but I can accept that this is just a subjective, selfish view.

MJohnston · 25-07-2014 7:40pm

Fingleberries wrote: »

Exactly, but if it's rehashed often enough it'll probably be true one time or other.

Microsoft seem to have hit something positive with 8.1 and Cortana. They are actually getting positive coverage in mainstream media and more people (in Ireland any way) seem to be using windows phone handsets.

If they can build on that momentum, they should see a big uptick in sales. They wont overtake Android in a hurry, though.

They don't need to overtake Android at all, imo. I don't know what the precise boundary is for success/failure, but I suspect they aren't that far off of it. Basically MS just need WP to be profitable in order for it to remain (and they may even be comfortable with a slight loss too). I imagine a good, solid, achievable goal for WP is around about 15% market-share - once you top 10%, mainstream developers *will* start taking notice, because that's a significant audience to ignore. This is especially true when you consider that iOS will probably level out with somewhere between 20-30% of the market, and Android the rest. And when you consider that Apple has been quite content to sit at less than 8% desktop OS marketshare in that segment for years now, you understand that you don't have to be first to be making a profit.

Threshold (the work to make Windows into a single OS across all of desktop, tablet, phone and Xbox) will significantly lower the barrier to app developers wanting to reach large audiences too - in fact, I'm already seeing the fruits of this with a huge amount of Universal apps in WP8.1 - because the combination audience for all the different platforms will be larger than just that of phone, or just of desktop.

This year is the first year I've felt really optimistic about WP as a user and a fan - the flow of apps coming into the store has significantly improved (look at this month alone with Uber, Foursquare Swarm, Facebook app getting that Messenger integration ahead of any other platform, etc.), the Microsoft ecosystem is really starting to pay off (OneDrive just gets better and better and the integration is superb, love seeing the regular updates for Xbox Music, and having an Xbox One really makes it all come together), and the 8.1 updates were the first time I've seen the OS not just play catchup but overtake in some areas (Cortana is easily the best voice assistant yet, and I love how quickly Microsoft have been improving it). There's also a really strong third-party developer ecosystem that has become apparent, at the forefront being that guy Rudy Hayn who is single-handedly making superb apps for services that are leaving WP out, and making them better than the first party apps anyway!

In short, I'm more confident than I've ever been about WP this year, and I'm *really* looking forward to what the Nokia software engineers that have been retained can do for the OS (think of what they've done from the *outside* with Glance, and all their other OS tweaks).

KingOfFairview · 26-07-2014 9:47am

theothernt wrote: »

Why on earth would you think that?

3% market share. At a certain point, even Microsoft will run out of patience. I hope it never happens, but it might

theothernt · 26-07-2014 3:16pm

KingOfFairview wrote: »

3% market share. At a certain point, even Microsoft will run out of patience. I hope it never happens, but it might

I don't see how that indicates anything?

Market share in the U.S. is 3%, which could be better but that is 3% of a huge market. In the UK it's 13%, in Ireland it's around 11%, and Italy it's around 20%.

I just find it very odd that you'd take one fact in isolation, then assume it's all over... did some tech. news site suggest that?

jimmynokia · 26-07-2014 3:22pm

Worldwide market share I gather is the point here, any region could be greater than another, but as a whole vs other operating systems, WP is as is.

theothernt · 26-07-2014 3:38pm

jimmynokia wrote: »

Worldwide market share I gather is the point here, any region could be greater than another, but as a whole vs other operating systems, WP is as is.

I don't think world-wide share matters that much, only market share and sales in the U.S. and China.

For comparison - iOS has approx. 15% market share, but I don't think Apple is worried

jimmynokia · 26-07-2014 3:41pm

theothernt wrote: »

I don't think world-wide share matters that much, only market share and sales in the U.S. and China.

For comparison - iOS has approx. 15% market share, but I don't think Apple is worried

Apple will never be, but market share gets interest, hence why the lack of local apps.
That's the most annoying part.

KingOfFairview · 27-07-2014 8:47am

I wouldn't worry so much about market share if it seemed Microsoft were really behind it, but I'm not sure they are.

jimmynokia · 27-07-2014 11:14am

Irish media is another thing.
Weckless weckler from the indo has another Android, IOS filled article today. Top 50 apps for families.

KingOfFairview · 27-07-2014 1:41pm

jimmynokia wrote: »

Irish media is another thing.
Weckless weckler from the indo has another Android, IOS filled article today. Top 50 apps for families.

Journal gives some coverage, that's about it

jimmynokia · 27-07-2014 1:58pm

KingOfFairview wrote: »

Journal gives some coverage, that's about it

The journal are known to be apple fans but in fairness i had words with them over the non coverage of the windows ecosystem and they have changed,not much but do cover some aspects.

Whereas Mr weckler is known for his favouritism with apple constantly ignores it,always plugging apple or android ,two year ago he did an article covering the top 300 apps,again only the said OSs above.

When doing a story on apps which is a broad spectrum you do not stick to two you cover all this is called been impartial and non biased.

I tackled weckler on this on twitter and he agreed with me and said he would do another article covering windows and never has.

While i have nothing against him and generally think he does write good material his ignorance to windows is down right annoying.

Recently he also done a similar article on travel apps, again just covering apple and android.

harney · 27-07-2014 6:29pm

I just got a Nokia 925 from work either Wednesday or Thursday I have to say that if I hadn't hit the update button to download v8.1 I probably would have launched the phone at somebody. There may have been an easier way, but 5 clicks to get to the wifi settings is a bit ridiculous.

At least now that they have copied the functionality from most other smart phone operating systems, it is a little more bearable. I haven't searched too hard yet, but are there apps from BA and Easyjet for boarding cards?

I've used Symbian, webOS, Android, the old and new Blackberry operating systems over the last few years and they have all had some redeeming quality that stood out from day one. I haven't noticed this yet with Windows. The best that has happened is a finally me too with the notifications pull down menu. I will be switching to only this phone for a while, so that may change, I doubt it, but stranger things have happened.

I'm guessing, at least from googling, that Firefox or Chrome are not on this platform? I think this is the most I have directly used an Internet Explorer browser since circa 2003

KingOfFairview · 02-08-2014 10:52am

Market share now down to 2.7%.

liamog · 02-08-2014 11:52am

KingOfFairview wrote: »

Market share now down to 2.7%.

I've seen that number in a few places but can't seem to find a source.

Netapplications live statistics have Windows Phone at 2.5% of all mobile web traffic (mobiles and tablets) so the 2.7 share seems a little low.

_Kaiser_ · 02-08-2014 1:29pm

liamog wrote: »

I've seen that number in a few places but can't seem to find a source.

Netapplications live statistics have Windows Phone at 2.5% of all mobile web traffic (mobiles and tablets) so the 2.7 share seems a little low.

Source

Doesn't bode well, but the comments suggest the author may be cherry-picking the facts

KingOfFairview · 02-08-2014 1:53pm

Here's my view on the whole situation.

I personally really like WP. There is no question that the OS is improving, I don't think anyone denies that. the problem is, there are still a few things that make it hard to see how sticking with it is worth it. The constant, ongoing problems with xbox music. The lacks of apps (I don't mind that we don't have as many apps as iOS or android overall, but it bugs me to know that when I search for something like RTE player, Hailo, Paddy Power etc, it likely won't be there). Not a huge problem, but why settle for it? Lack of flash player. No major innovation, so you can say "well, iOS and Android don't have this feature".

These are fairly trivial issues, but the thing is, they don't seem to be going away. With market share falling, developers aren't going to start making more apps, they will make less. The MS development team seem unwilling or incapable of fixing the xbox music issues. I can live with any of these problems, but I have to ask myself: why should I? Why not just get an iPhone?

The problem isn't WP, which I like. The problem is that not enough other people like WP, and as a result, it feels like fighting a losing battle to justify sticking with it. I'm on my third WP, I have given it a good chance and may well decide to stay put when my contract is up in March, but honestly, I'm going to need to be convinced, and with WP 9 now apparently not likely to appear until Sept 15, I can't see how that will happen.

PaulieC · 02-08-2014 4:01pm

It seems like the xbox music team are working quite hard to get this sorted - http://www.wpcentral.com/interview-xbox-music-windows-phone-starting-over

Personally, I've noticed a big improvement with the bi-weekly updates.

KingOfFairview · 02-08-2014 4:03pm

PaulieC wrote: »

It seems like the xbox music team are working quite hard to get this sorted - http://www.wpcentral.com/interview-xbox-music-windows-phone-starting-over

Personally, I've noticed a big improvement with the bi-weekly updates.

the thing is, there should have been no problems to get sorted, most of the issues were extremely basic functionality. Like it or not, the music player on WP is worse after 4 years of development than it was when it came out. I want to give them a chance but you have to draw the line somewhere

_Kaiser_ · 02-08-2014 4:03pm

KingOfFairview wrote: »

Here's my view on the whole situation.

I personally really like WP. There is no question that the OS is improving, I don't think anyone denies that. the problem is, there are still a few things that make it hard to see how sticking with it is worth it. The constant, ongoing problems with xbox music. The lacks of apps (I don't mind that we don't have as many apps as iOS or android overall, but it bugs me to know that when I search for something like RTE player, Hailo, Paddy Power etc, it likely won't be there). Not a huge problem, but why settle for it? Lack of flash player. No major innovation, so you can say "well, iOS and Android don't have this feature".

These are fairly trivial issues, but the thing is, they don't seem to be going away. With market share falling, developers aren't going to start making more apps, they will make less. The MS development team seem unwilling or incapable of fixing the xbox music issues. I can live with any of these problems, but I have to ask myself: why should I? Why not just get an iPhone?

The problem isn't WP, which I like. The problem is that not enough other people like WP, and as a result, it feels like fighting a losing battle to justify sticking with it. I'm on my third WP, I have given it a good chance and may well decide to stay put when my contract is up in March, but honestly, I'm going to need to be convinced, and with WP 9 now apparently not likely to appear until Sept 15, I can't see how that will happen.

I'd have to agree..

It's not that WP is a bad platform at all now (even if WP 8.1 is really about bringing features that should have been there from day 1/on par with the competition), and I'm not a big app person (but the lack of local apps is annoying!), but rather that it seems that development and innovation has pretty much stagnated (I don't care about Cortana and even if I did, it's again merely something else the other platforms have had for ages).

Really at this point I'm thinking why SHOULD I put up with the limitations? What is WP offering me that makes it worthwhile? With market share continuing to decline, MS focusing on getting the services out to other platforms, and the general lack of hardware availability in Ireland (upper end I mean, not the 520 end) unless you go SIM-free, I unfortunately don't see it surviving in the medium-long term.

I could just as easily get a Note 2/3, root and flash it with a bloatware-free ROM, and stick on one of the WP8 skins... same interface and Start screen that I love but also all the local apps and dev support. Ok the UI experience won't be as clean/consistent but then a lot of WP apps seem to sacrifice features to achieve that.

For now my 1320 will do, but I can't see myself buying another WP unless things improve dramatically and we get a clear sense of intent/direction from MS as to where they're going with this.

KingOfFairview · 02-08-2014 4:08pm

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I'd have to agree..

It's not that WP is a bad platform at all now (even if WP 8.1 is really about bringing features that should have been there from day 1/on par with the competition), and I'm not a big app person (but the lack of local apps is annoying!), but rather that it seems that development and innovation has pretty much stagnated (I don't care about Cortana and even if I did, it's again merely something else the other platforms have had for ages).

Really at this point I'm thinking why SHOULD I put up with the limitations? What is WP offering me that makes it worthwhile? With market share continuing to decline, MS focusing on getting the services out to other platforms, and the general lack of hardware availability in Ireland (upper end I mean, not the 520 end) unless you go SIM-free, I unfortunately don't see it surviving in the medium-long term.

I could just as easily get a Note 2/3, root and flash it with a bloatware-free ROM, and stick on one of the WP8 skins... same interface and Start screen that I love but also all the local apps and dev support. Ok the UI experience won't be as clean/consistent but then a lot of WP apps seem to sacrifice features to achieve that.

For now my 1320 will do, but I can't see myself buying another WP unless things improve dramatically and we get a clear sense of intent/direction from MS as to where they're going with this.

Indeed. If MS gave us some sort of a rough roadmap as to when and how things would improve, I'd be much happier, but for obvious reasons that's a non-starter.

liamog · 02-08-2014 4:20pm

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I'd have to agree..

It's not that WP is a bad platform at all now (even if WP 8.1 is really about bringing features that should have been there from day 1/on par with the competition), and I'm not a big app person (but the lack of local apps is annoying!), but rather that it seems that development and innovation has pretty much stagnated (I don't care about Cortana and even if I did, it's again merely something else the other platforms have had for ages).

Really at this point I'm thinking why SHOULD I put up with the limitations? What is WP offering me that makes it worthwhile? With market share continuing to decline, MS focusing on getting the services out to other platforms, and the general lack of hardware availability in Ireland (upper end I mean, not the 520 end) unless you go SIM-free, I unfortunately don't see it surviving in the medium-long term.

I could just as easily get a Note 2/3, root and flash it with a bloatware-free ROM, and stick on one of the WP8 skins... same interface and Start screen that I love but also all the local apps and dev support. Ok the UI experience won't be as clean/consistent but then a lot of WP apps seem to sacrifice features to achieve that.

For now my 1320 will do, but I can't see myself buying another WP unless things improve dramatically and we get a clear sense of intent/direction from MS as to where they're going with this.

I've never had a problem getting WP hardware in Ireland,well unless on your 3 which have taken a ridiculous stance.

This was one of the first reports I've seen where WP market share has dropped. I see more and more of them around town on buses. Its getting to the point where devs will start paying attention, I think what really needs to happen is the local dev support in Ireland need to start publishing market share info.

If I'm making an app for a place in Dublin and hear that WP has 3% market share, I probably wouldn't bother, when I hear that it has 10% of the local market then that really changes the value proposition. Quite frankly I don't give a damn that it has 0.6% of the Chinese market as that's not where my language skills are.

jimmynokia · 02-08-2014 6:34pm

For me as a long time WP user and nokia user my stance is quite blunt,if MS do not listen to its customers NOW it wont be doing itself any favours in the long term.
Limitations still exist and especially for me local apps are a huge issue,the bad press some of our irish journalists give it MR WECKLER for example, also does not help.

There is much divide now within the WP community as to what is going to happen and what is happening,change is needed and needed NOW.

The latest saying now is that people have been WINPHOOLED..

I hope down the road things pick up as i really like it but i always a droid with me too so i have the best of both worlds.

Loving the 930 right now and my one plus one so im happy as a pig in sh1TE.:D

jimmynokia · 02-08-2014 6:36pm

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Source

Doesn't bode well, but the comments suggest the author may be cherry-picking the facts

Has to be a pal of the tomi ahonen lad.

KingOfFairview · 02-08-2014 7:01pm

jimmynokia wrote: »

For me as a long time WP user and nokia user my stance is quite blunt,if MS do not listen to its customers NOW it wont be doing itself any favours in the long term.
Limitations still exist and especially for me local apps are a huge issue,the bad press some of our irish journalists give it MR WECKLER for example, also does not help.

There is much divide now within the WP community as to what is going to happen and what is happening,change is needed and needed NOW.

The latest saying now is that people have been WINPHOOLED..

I hope down the road things pick up as i really like it but i always a droid with me too so i have the best of both worlds.

Loving the 930 right now and my one plus one so im happy as a pig in sh1TE.:D

Sounds like we're on the same page on this.

jimmynokia · 02-08-2014 7:38pm

KingOfFairview wrote: »

Sounds like we're on the same page on this.

Reckon we are. Many will agree, some won't. At the end of the day it's reality.

senordingdong · 02-08-2014 7:41pm

I came into this thread with a gloomy outlook for wp but I have to admit it's looking alot better than I thought

Also, any update on the next flagship? I know the 930 is only out, but we all know it's just the icon that was released in Feb.

KingOfFairview · 02-08-2014 7:43pm

senordingdong wrote: »

I came into this thread with a gloomy outlook for wp but I have to admit it's looking alot better than I thought

That's the frustrating thing. the Os is without doubt improving quite a bit at the moment.

liamog · 02-08-2014 7:53pm

I think MS have really turned around in the last 12 months when it comes to listening to user feedback.

I've not seen the WinPhooled tag before and I think its somewhat disingenuous.

Hopefully with the Nokia Devices Purchase we'll start to see some really interesting projects coming out of the MS research division.

jimmynokia · 02-08-2014 7:59pm

Moving on from the 930 there is two reported handset's coming, again them feckers AT&T are said to get exclusive on it, what annoys me about this is the Americans didn't give a toss about WP years ago.

The 530 due soon is no better than the 520 as an all rounder, pointless device, just like X series as a path to Windows eco system.

The 930 is excellent I must say and for me that's use to bigger phone's have found it a joy to use, and will continue to do so until the next device lands on my desk from N/M.

There's good things happening to wp but it's not quick enough by any means.
If MS are to succeed they need to act now rather than later they can do it if they want, focusing on enterprise and cloud is not going to help the WP OS shift which is where the momentum is really needed now.

PaulieC · 02-08-2014 8:32pm

There's two rumoured MS handsets on the way, a high end and midrange. And I'll probably pick up the HTC W8 if it goes on sale here, the hardware is gorgeous.

jimmynokia · 02-08-2014 8:47pm

PaulieC wrote: »

There's two rumoured MS handsets on the way, a high end and midrange. And I'll probably pick up the HTC W8 if it goes on sale here, the hardware is gorgeous.

Yeah looks nice.

bidiots · 03-08-2014 2:11am

jimmynokia wrote: »

Yeah looks nice.

Windows can improve their market share easily enough,imo.
Buy an Android phone for less than 100 and it will cause no end of hassle, in the vast majority of cases.
Buy an Apple phone for less than 100 and it will be at least 4years old.
Buy a Lumia for less than 100 and you'll have an excellent device that will not degrade like an android, have a decent camera and just basically works.

liamog · 03-08-2014 12:33pm

jimmynokia wrote: »

Moving on from the 930 there is two reported handset's coming, again them feckers AT&T are said to get exclusive on it, what annoys me about this is the Americans didn't give a toss about WP years ago.

I'm no great hater of AT&T exclusives, they pretty much all seem to be a country only exclusive. I like the precedent that was set with the 1520, yes you can bork the wireless charging but we're going to release to the rest of the world with it still included.

Overheal · 03-08-2014 5:21pm

Effective commercial out now doing the rounds

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x229zoa_siri-vs-cortana-happy-anniversary-commercial_tech

I can see the market share growing for windows phone over time

Especially since it was revealed samsung phones use Microsoft patents as part of their rabid success

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2460372/microsoft-sues-samsung-for-license-violations-post-nokia.html

jimmynokia · 03-08-2014 6:32pm

Overheal wrote: »

Effective commercial out now doing the rounds

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x229zoa_siri-vs-cortana-happy-anniversary-commercial_tech

I can see the market share growing for windows phone over time

Especially since it was revealed samsung phones use Microsoft patents as part of their rabid success

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2460372/microsoft-sues-samsung-for-license-violations-post-nokia.html

As regards virtual assistants they are for most a gimmick nor a key selling point.

harney · 03-08-2014 8:32pm

Overheal wrote: »

Effective commercial out now doing the rounds

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x229zoa_siri-vs-cortana-happy-anniversary-commercial_tech

I can see the market share growing for windows phone over time

Especially since it was revealed samsung phones use Microsoft patents as part of their rabid success

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2460372/microsoft-sues-samsung-for-license-violations-post-nokia.html

It's not exactly a secret that Microsoft have a large number of Android patents. How much of that is down to innovation, and how much of that is down to a ****ed up patent system is another matter.

*Edit*

A quick search brings up a site claiming 243 patents, some from when they bought Nortel patents. It claims they have a valid case for a licensing agreement. No idea how true or not that is, but it would be hard to argue against hardware patents.

http://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=18461346-c1f4-4d06-b220-44cacd1b4d05

*Edit2*

This site appears to cast some doubt on a number of valid Microsoft patents.

http://www.zdnet.com/m-cam-casts-doubts-on-microsofts-android-patent-portfolio-7000031509/

senordingdong · 04-08-2014 8:48pm

Something I was wondering today.
Should we expect a follow up to the 2520?
Or should we expect MS to kill it off for the sake of the Surface?

jimmynokia · 04-08-2014 8:53pm

senordingdong wrote: »

Something I was wondering today.
Should we expect a follow up to the 2520?
Or should we expect MS to kill it off for the sake of the Surface?

The latter. The 2520 was a fail,been an RT and price, it's availability option's was a fail.
What we probably will see is network's offering it now or sold off cheap.

Nice tablet, too many problems.

Is Windows Phone Dying?

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