Season 4 Episode 6 "The Laws of Gods and Men": HAVENT read the books MOD NOTE POST1

thefa · 12-05-2014 02:44AM #1

Thought that episode was a mixed bag.The iron bank scene in Bravos was required to advance that story but I was glad their representatives only got one scene.It felt like the Salladhor Saan scene was thrown in for the nudity. The Meereen plot didn't really advance but we got to see a dragon.

Enjoyed the stealth attack by Yara to take back Theon. Her escape seemed a bit convenient though. We were really shown how far gone Theon is in terms of submissiveness, childlike in someways. He couldn't even snap out of it when faced with his own sister. Ramsay is the creepiest character that gets semi-regular screen time. Very volatile character. Thought the bathing scene was going to have a nasty twist.

The show trial was good for the most part, especially towards the end where Tyrion came to the fore. Amazing how little actions, quips and threats in the past are being used as evidence against him but it helps to remind what an eventful storyline he's had and how he's always been in the thick of the politics in King's Landing. I'm trying to weigh up whether I'm more disappointed with Shae or Varys. Varys, just like all the rest, tows the party line when the chips are down. Shae plays the woman scorned role and it was a bit of reminder of the story he tells to Shae and Bronn of how he had loved a hooker before and ended up suffering as a result.

MOD Note, Folks it's a small thing but possibly a big thing for others.

Going forward can we please make it a point to spoiler anything relating to stuff in trailers etc. for upcoming episodes. I know the info in the video is out there, but there are some people who actively avoid trialers for upcoming episodes, there has been some discussion along these lines in this weeks thread so in future can we at the very least spoiler those things please.

DL Saint · 12-05-2014 03:28AM

thefa wrote: »

Enjoyed the stealth attack by Yara to take back Theon. Her escape seemed a bit convenient though. We were really shown how far gone Theon is in terms of submissiveness, childlike in someways. He couldn't even snap out of it when faced with his own sister. Ramsay is the creepiest character that gets semi-regular screen time. Very volatile character. Thought the bathing scene was going to have a nasty twist.

The show trial was good for the most part, especially towards the end where Tyrion came to the fore. Amazing how little actions, quips and threats in the past are being used as evidence against him but it helps to remind what an eventful storyline he's had and how he's always been in the thick of the politics in King's Landing. I'm trying to weigh up whether I'm more disappointed with Shae or Varys. Varys, just like all the rest, tows the party line when the chips are down. Shae plays the woman scorned role and it was a bit of reminder of the story he tells to Shae and Bronn of how he had loved a hooker before and ended up suffering as a result.

Yeah I was cringing watching that bath scene because I thought it was going to take a bad turn. Poor Reek, I wonder how his undercover mission will turn out? Will he possibly get reminded of the old Theon and turn. Anyone any idea what castle he is being sent to take? Moat Cailin perhaps?

I found the whole witnesses in the trial a little too convenient. How were all those who were called able to recite word for word what Tyrion had said to them in the past? Seems a bit unrealistic imo. Just on the trial by combat, can he get someone to fight for him like in the Eerie? Will we be seeing Bronn for Tyrion and Jamie for Cersei? That could be one hell of a fight...

RobbingBandit · 12-05-2014 03:30AM

That bath scene was worse than the rape scene a couple of weeks ago, poor Tyrion too.

Kirby · 12-05-2014 04:03AM

Tyrion needs a defence attorney!

DDC1990 · 12-05-2014 10:04AM

I wonder who the crown will pick for the Trial by combat.

- Oberyn is an excelent swordsman, but I can't see him putting himself forward
- Tywin could pick Jamie - who would have to chose between his own life and the life of his brother (might let himself die to save Tyrion)
- Tywin could fight himself to make it personal. Also if Tyrion beat him the foreshadowing at the Bank of Braavos might come to pass, where Kings Landing doesn't have a viable leader to guide Tommen.
- Bronn would be an interesting one as well- but more like something they'd write for a TV show then for a book.
- If its one of the Kings Guard I could imagine Tyrion beating them.

Exciting times.

Kilkenny14 · 12-05-2014 10:05AM

Kirby wrote: »

Tyrion needs a defence attorney!

Better Call Saul!

Also part of me hoped when Tyrion said he wanted to confess, I really hoped he would finish his story of the jackass and the honeycomb.

willmunny1990 · 12-05-2014 10:13AM

I can't imagine a scenario where Tyrion fights for himself.

I think I saw a clip somewhere of what looked like Prince Oberyn fighting the mountain so maybe that's it, Gregor fighting for Twyinn and Oberyn fighting for Tyrion.

It would make sense because who else would Tywinn get to fight? Gregor is one of the most violent and feared warriors in Westeros and we all know Oberyn is dying to get a shot at him for killing his sister so he would have no problem accepting this fight on Tyrion's behalf.

Rubber_Soul · 12-05-2014 11:16AM

With all the build up over the season about him learning to fight again with one hand, surely Tyrion will nominate Jaime to fight for him? Great from a drama point of view as Cersei and Tywin would be completely torn.

Edit: Or can he even nominate someone himself? Can't remember who nominated who at his other trial.

Grimebox · 12-05-2014 11:35AM

What are the rules for trial by combat? Seems like a bit of flawed system. Why have a normal trial at all if he can just demand a trial by combat regardless

Witcher · 12-05-2014 11:38AM

Grimebox wrote: »

What are the rules for trial by combat? Seems like a bit of flawed system. Why have a normal trial at all if he can just demand a trial by combat regardless

If you win you're innocent, lose you're guilty.

Grimebox · 12-05-2014 11:44AM

So if you are found guilty in a normal trial and condemned to death, always demand a trial by combat. In the last trial by combat, Bron had to volunteer himself. I can see Jamie doing the same thing.

cathalio11 · 12-05-2014 11:50AM

Grimebox wrote: »

So if you are found guilty in a normal trial and condemned to death, always demand a trial by combat. In the last trial by combat, Bron had to volunteer himself. I can see Jamie doing the same thing.

Tyrion wasn't declared guilty at that point. He demanded the trial by combat before a verdict was reached.

Grimebox · 12-05-2014 12:04PM

cathalio11 wrote: »

Tyrion wasn't declared guilty at that point. He demanded the trial by combat before a verdict was reached.

I'm aware of that. I'm just pointing how how exploitative that tradition can be.

Pepe LeFrits · 12-05-2014 12:25PM

Presumably it can only be done prior to the verdict being reached.

TimeToShine · 12-05-2014 01:08PM

At any point during a verbal trial you have the option of demanding trial by combat. This is usually only the case when someone is sure he/she is going to lose the trial. Trial by combat in this context essentially puts matters in the hands of the Gods, and if you win it's seen as the God's way of proving your innocence and vice-versa.

TimeToShine · 12-05-2014 01:27PM

DL Saint wrote: »

I found the whole witnesses in the trial a little too convenient. How were all those who were called able to recite word for word what Tyrion had said to them in the past? Seems a bit unrealistic imo.

I would guess that it implies that those "witnesses" were bought by Cersei or someone else and as a result had their story rehearsed.

Baba P · 12-05-2014 01:27PM

Wow. This is gonna be great

Paddy Cow · 12-05-2014 01:48PM

Grimebox wrote: »

So if you are found guilty in a normal trial and condemned to death, always demand a trial by combat. In the last trial by combat, Bron had to volunteer himself. I can see Jamie doing the same thing.

Even if Jamie still had his good hand, he is kingsguard and no way could he defend the person accused of murdering the king.

wp_rathead · 12-05-2014 01:50PM

Wait... so Iron Bank have given a loan to Stanis to build an army?!?! That is pretty big news..

The Greyjoy's trying to free Reek/Theon was fun..

Guessing the Trial by Combat either going to be the Mountain vs Prince from Dorn or be Jamie vs SOMEONE, maybe Bronn as he did teach Jamie fight with one hand so make sense in a story arc sense..

Essien · 12-05-2014 02:38PM

wprathead wrote: »

The Greyjoy's trying to free Reek/Theon was fun..

I didn't like that bit at all, well not that it was bad, it just seemed silly. 6 episodes in, they finally make it to Theon and just run away then after 5 minutes. I know it's leading on to something bigger but it was a lame effort at a rescue.

Deco99 · 12-05-2014 02:44PM

i get why oberyn would jump at the chance to represent tyrion if the mountain was put forward by tywin, i just dont get why tywin would do that, maybe he knows oberyn would froth at the opportunity and he could kill two birds one stone? still where is the mountain? i thought he is way up in the riverlands or further north, raping and pillaging and all other forms of good old fashioned high jinx.

MadYaker · 12-05-2014 03:08PM

Deco99 wrote: »

i get why oberyn would jump at the chance to represent tyrion if the mountain was put forward by tywin, i just dont get why tywin would do that, maybe he knows oberyn would froth at the opportunity and he could kill two birds one stone? still where is the mountain? i thought he is way up in the riverlands or further north, raping and pillaging and all other forms of good old fashioned high jinx.

Theres no way its going to be the mountain, he isn't even in kings landing. Tyrion will will probably choose Bron. Not sure who Tywin will pick. Unlikely he'd choose Jamie considering the little deal they struck. Maybe some member of the Kings guard?

2ndcoming · 12-05-2014 03:40PM

I think the Mountain is the most likely choice as Tywin's champion. He's always been the most feared and fearsome Lannister knight. The likes of Ser Meryn wouldn't have a chance against Bronn, so it would be a bit too easy of a way out for Tyrion.

He would never risk Jaime and it's unlikely Tyrion would risk Jaime either, given his lost sword hand. Bronn would probably be Tyrion's first choice, but I could imagine Oberyn stepping forward to get his chance at vengeance.

I thought Tyrion was great in this episode, as usual. Love when he gets a meaty bit of dialogue to chew up.

TimeToShine · 12-05-2014 03:46PM

2ndcoming wrote: »

I think the Mountain is the most likely choice as Tywin's champion. He's always been the most feared and fearsome Lannister knight. The likes of Ser Meryn wouldn't have a chance against Bronn, so it would be a bit too easy of a way out for Tyrion.

He would never risk Jaime and it's unlikely Tyrion would risk Jaime either, given his lost sword hand. Bronn would probably be Tyrion's first choice, but I could imagine Oberyn stepping forward to get his chance at vengeance.

I thought Tyrion was great in this episode, as usual. Love when he gets a meaty bit of dialogue to chew up.

You make it sound as if Tyrion can just pick whoever he wants from a queue of fighters! If Tyrion asked Bronn he would definitely say no, he says himself that he only fights for gold which he now has. Tyrion needs someone to come forward for him, similar to what happened with Bronn the first time around, except now he's seen as a kingslayer so why would anyone be on his side?

2ndcoming · 12-05-2014 03:51PM

Good point. I guess apart from a maimed Jaime he's left hoping someone will decide to step forward. Jaime might not be too keen on it either considering he told him to keep quiet and go to the wall.

Unless he fights himself, but against any knight he would be seriously up against it.

Excited to see what way this will pan out!

FortuneChip · 12-05-2014 04:01PM

It could be a few weeks before we find out though. There's a gap in the 10 episode run, isn't there?
No Jon, Bran, Ayra & Hound this week and minimal Daenerys as well.

willmunny1990 · 12-05-2014 04:16PM

FortuneChip wrote: »

It could be a few weeks before we find out though. There's a gap in the 10 episode run, isn't there?
No Jon, Bran, Ayra & Hound this week and minimal Daenerys as well.

Ah here tell me this is bull****.

Having a gab in a ten episode series doesn't make sense.

MadYaker · 12-05-2014 04:27PM

Just realised if Tyrion goes to The Wall Jon Snow will probably chop his head off so I can't see that happening. Also with a wildling attack on castle black imminent there might not be a Nightswatch for him to join. It will be a trial by combat and whoever fights for Tyrion will probably win..... does he then get off scot free? Maybe then they can actually try to figure out who actually did it.

wp_rathead · 12-05-2014 04:28PM

willmunny1990 wrote: »

Ah here tell me this is bull****.

Having a gab in a ten episode series doesn't make sense.

yes a weeks gap between episode 7 and 8 I believe - some American holiday is on

ArmaniJeanss · 12-05-2014 04:31PM

willmunny1990 wrote: »

Ah here tell me this is bull****.

Having a gab in a ten episode series doesn't make sense.

It makes a little bit of sense as Season 2 Ep 9* was a ratings fail (relatively) as it was on Memorial Weekend (a 'bank holiday weekend') so they decided to skip this weekend in season 3 and season 4.

* Battle of the Blackwater, the most expensive episode which made the rating thing even harder to swallow for them.

willmunny1990 · 12-05-2014 04:37PM

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

It makes a little bit of sense as Season 2 Ep 9* was a ratings fail (relatively) as it was on Memorial Weekend (a 'bank holiday weekend') so they decided to skip this weekend in season 3 and season 4.

* Battle of the Blackwater, the most expensive episode which made the rating thing even harder to swallow for them.

Didn't no that. I can see their thinking alright if thats the case.

Season 4 Episode 6 "The Laws of Gods and Men": *HAVENT* read the books MOD NOTE POST1

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Season 4 Episode 6 "The Laws of Gods and Men": HAVENT read the books MOD NOTE POST1